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Winter of Anime 2013 |OT -4| It's not my fault!

Community's choice! What should the next numbering of the |OT| format be?

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S

Steroyd

Member
Reuenthal said:
If you don't buy that morality is something particularly important since in principle there is not much different then you can't hold the moral highground judging that people retaliating against vampires went to far and using words like witch hunt and saying there was a switcheroo in who are the monsters and using the word monsters. Prey or not, humans are morally worthy.
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Also consider that Vampires were once human to.

The reason why I say there wasn't much difference in the end, was because humans started killing humans looking for vampires, and justifying it to themselves that they were already contaminated and it was the right thing to do (hence "witch hunt"), if the villagers were morally worthy, they would have had a limiter at some point way before then, but they merely deluded themselves and went past the point of no return.

But I also understand how we, act based on instict and circumstances. The instict to be predator does not change the moral tragedy of murder. The instict and need of survival mitigates this somewhat but even if you have an instict to kill at the end of the day the group that can coexist without that and kills for self defense even if does go to far, I can't really see as the same, especially as many of the vampires are murdered humans forced into a bad situation. So there is a double tragedy here. Not only the murders it self but the fact that you increase the tragedy the more you do it. So it is a cursed existence which brings suffering to the world.
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All vampires including the little girl were forced into the situation, like I said before it's all about survival.

Despite disagreement I did enjoy our discussion.
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Me too, it's fun going back on some old series like this. ^_^
 
R

Reuenthal

Banned
Also consider that Vampires were once human to.

The reason why I say there wasn't much difference in the end, was because humans started killing humans looking for vampires, and justifying it to themselves that they were already contaminated and it was the right thing to do (hence "witch hunt"), if the villagers were morally worthy, they would have had a limiter at some point way before then, but they merely deluded themselves and went past the point of no return.
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But you are incorectly generalizing the villagers and are incorectly calling them as morally not worthy because some villagers went too far when we are talking about among others murdered children who did nothing wrong. The villagers were going to be all exterminated before they did anything against the vampires.

Not only is that generalization obviously and certainly very wrong but also in regards to the villagers who went too far, two wrongs also don't make a right. Even the villager who went too far, did not deserve to be murdered before doing anything wrong. You can't start murdering people and once you do say that they deserved it because in their response some also murder inoccents. That way of thinking is just following the same mistake time and time again.

All vampires including the little girl were forced into the situation, like I said before it's all about survival.
Click to expand...

No it isn't, the little girl wanted companionship despite the negative consequences of a vampire village for the murdered humans and the new vampires who become isolated murderers of humans. Being in bad circumstances does not justify the murders commited and the murders of the future that was planned.

It is quite clear that the girl plans that brought so much tragedy was not all about her own survival. And as the cursed existence of vampires increased more, the worse it would be. It was actually opportune that the villagers managed to stop them.

Even when it comes to survival, when it comes to survival through murdering people and creating more murders versus survival through eliminating those who want to murder you, the second has better justification and results in the mass murders eventually stopping. The vampire murderous predatory nature is tragic but nevertheless murder is still murder, self defense is still self defense. Equating the two when the outcomes are different is incorect. In the case of villagers eliminating an enemy that wants to exterminate them and in the case of vampires eliminating humans so they can have their own village and companionship and food and also so they can murder even more humans and after that more and so on.

Am I anywhere close convincing someone on the Internet?

Me too, it's fun going back on some old series like this. ^_^
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It is also that I find the issues interesting as well, series or not.
 
C

Caesnd

Member
Branduil said:
I think the full-size one looks better.
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The design is so so, but what really gets me is how terribly drawn it is. Did they really not have anyone more competent than that to do the promo illustration?
I hope the other aspects of the show, sans the art, will deliver at least.
 
T

Taruranto

Member
Fm0ny.jpg
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I can't stop laughing.
 
Y

yami4ct

Member
New Major is kind of shitty. Odd hair and eyebrows. Still, as has been said, better than being dressed like a cheap cyberpunk hooker.

That being said, yay a new GitS! More cyberpunk is always good. Now, please, please, please be better than Psycho-Pass...........
it will probably suck. Everything I look forward to ends up sucking :(
 
N

Noirulus

Member
yami4ct said:
That being said, yay a new GitS! More cyberpunk is always good. Now, please, please, please be better than Psycho-Pass...........
it will probably suck. Everything I look forward to ends up sucking :(
Click to expand...

So what's the problem with Psycho-Pass? I haven't watched past episode 1, but I thought it'd at least be decent because of Urobuchi. Unless the writing isn't the problem.
 
Y

yami4ct

Member
Noirulus said:
So what's the problem with Psycho-Pass? I haven't watched past episode 1, but I thought it'd at least be decent because of Urobuchi. Unless the writing isn't the problem.
Click to expand...

Honestly. It's just boring. That's why I ended up dropping it. Main character isn't very interesting, yet the side characters aren't really either. It's just not a very interesting show.
 
S

Steroyd

Member
Reuenthal said:
But you are incorectly generalizing the villagers and are incorectly calling them as morally not worthy because some villagers went too far when we are talking about among others murdered children by vampires who did nothing wrong. Two wrongs also don't make a right. Even the villager who went to far, did not deserve to be murdered before doing nothing wrong.
Click to expand...

All I'm saying is that human's killing humans takes points of team human as far as I'm concerned. I think I'll leave it at that.

No it isn't, the little girlwanted companionship despite the negative consequences of a vampire village for the murdered humans and the new vampires who become isolated murderers of humans. Being in bad circumstances does not justify the murders commited and the murders of the future that was planned.

It is quite clear that the girl plans that brought so much tragedy was not all about her own survival.
Click to expand...

True enough the little girl being alive for so long she was looking for something more, but as you mentioned with the nurse there was always the alternative to simply starve to death, which ain't happening.
 
O

OceanBlue

Member
firehawk12 said:
Yeah, honestly, I don't have any real experience to understand the shift in harem pandering completely. Haruka is probably one of the older ones that I've seen, and it's not really all that old.

The idea of the harem must still be a thing though. SAO's success indicates that there is room in most sadlifes for a bland character that is super powerful and surrounded by hapless women who want to ride him to the chapel and the maternity ward, and it seems every season one of those shows hit it big. Well, by big I mean supra-10k sales. lol

I guess I'm just not educated enough to know if there's an actual change or if it really is a simple case of franchise fatigue. If anything, it seems older anime favoured the love triangle whereas now they seem to be in the minority. But again, that's basically an uneducated guess more than anything based on any real research.

I think it is true that most harems are adaptations though... I don't think I can come up with an original harem off the top of my head. In that respect, they all serve as advertisements more than anything else.

If you think it's a question of interest, why do you think people got bored with Haruka? Or is it a case where the porn is in the tropes, not in the literal "climax" of the series? All you need is just a season of some girl being shy, shouting BAKA, being cold, and being older (lol) and that's enough for most people? I suppose if you're just trope shopping, you don't really care what the author wants anyway.
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Well, it's not that I think harem is a barren genre in which nothing will sell. It's just that it's really tied to the light novel market, when before I felt like it was tied more to the manga/visual novel market. Also, I feel like, outside of a few exceptions like Chu2koi and Infinite Stratos, most popular light novel adaptations are based off of popular light novels (this kinda hasn't changed, I guess, if you think about shows like Negima or the Key adaptations). That being said, there are still manga harems and visual novel harems, but they're much less popular than the successful light novel adaptations.

I also don't know too much about this so I can't say for sure. Didn't Nogizaka Haruka decide the winner in the first season? I only watched the first season, but that could be an influential reason. I also think that it doesn't really have to do with harem tropes in particular. I think that kinda successful shows fall victim to poorer sequel sales a lot worse than more popular series like Working (is Milky Holmes a good example?). I think other people here would know more about this than I would though.

Mandoric said:
sell at $15 -> people buy 12k copies
sell at $35 -> people buy 11k copies
sell at $80 -> people buy 10k copies

there's a limited market that wants to act as patrons, and they want to act as patrons up to about eight thousand yen. below that, price cuts just hurt margin. the guys who just want to watch wait for the constant reruns of anything popular and ignore DVDs.
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I definitely agree with this. We only have to look to Anohana to see how price cuts affect disc sales.

Code: 
あの日見た花の名前を僕達はまだ知らない。 【全6巻】
巻数　　　 初動　　　　　　　2週計　　　　　　累計　　　　 発売日
　　　　　　BD(DVD)　　　　 BD(DVD)　　　　BD(DVD)
01巻　31,069(*7,508)　33,972(*8,680)　37,338(*9,136)　11.06.29 ※合計 46,474枚
02巻　23,727(*4,643)　25,711(*5,319)　27,288(**,***)　11.07.27 ※合計 32,607枚
03巻　21,839(*4,192)　23,852(*4,921)　24,943(**,***)　11.08.24 ※合計 29,864枚
04巻　19,796(*3,787)　22,057(*4,554)　23,197(**,***)　11.09.21 ※合計 27,751枚
05巻　19,774(*3,812)　21,403(*4,355)　22,402(**,***)　11.10.26 ※合計 26,757枚
06巻　19,676(*3,819)　21,393(**,***)　21,871(**,***)　11.11.23 ※合計 25,690枚
http://dvdbd.wiki.fc2.com/wiki/&#12...2384;知らない。

Anohana's V1 sold for ￥4,200 while its other volumes sold for ￥7,350 (I think Amazon JP immediately discounts though so they probably sold for less). Let's do basic math on volumes one and two:

46,474 * ￥4,200 = ￥195,190,800
32,607 * ￥7,350 = ￥239,661,450

This is obviously overly simplistic and ignores things like lower sales between subsequent volumes, franchise promotion, and other stuff, but I feel like it's a good illustration for why prices are as high as they are. Basically, I think there are enough people who will pay for higher prices and there aren't enough potential customers who will make up for the lost in revenue from lower prices. And this was for a popular series like Anohana! Think about much less popular series that sell <8,000 or something! The profit difference in those cases might be much larger.

As for the question of why people buy BDs even if they might not rewatch them or whatever, as a person who has bought figurines I can think of a few reasons. One is wanting to own something that was part of something either personally enjoyable or communally exciting. Kinda like memorabilia. I'm doing a poor job describing it, but it has to do with being part of an event.

BluWacky said:
To continue playing at standing in for Articalys, ANN reports another LN adaptation in the works, "I Didn't Become A Hero, So I Reluctantly Looked For A Part-Time Job".

http://cdn02.animenewsnetwork.com/thumbnails/fit400x400/cms/news/58893/sibuyu_top.jpg

ANN summarise the plot as:

Sounds a bit like that Working Demon anime or whatever it's called that's airing next season. Except more moe.
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Sounds cute. Looks cute. Will watch.

Moonlight said:
On that note, is Idolmaster worth a watch?
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I definitely think so! It depends on what you're looking for, but I think it's best described as an energetic anime in which it was obvious that the staff were big fans of the source material. It's a lot of fun to watch and the energy is pretty infectious.
 
M

MCD

Junior Member
New Major face looks so bland, like as if she spawned from some new generic show. Not feeling any personality from the art.

And Major can wear whatever the fuck she wants, she is the fucking major after all.
 
D

Dedication Through Light

Member
Noirulus said:
So what's the problem with Psycho-Pass? I haven't watched past episode 1, but I thought it'd at least be decent because of Urobuchi. Unless the writing isn't the problem.
Click to expand...

I dont have any problem with Psycho Pass beyond how one character acts, but thats probably not that major of issue since that character fortunately gets pushed to the background for the sake of the better characters.

I thought people had went into the anime with not open expectations and overhyped it and are thus saying there are issues with it since they fell victim to hype.
 
C

cajunator

Banned
I did some digging. Is this really how I started posting in animeGaf?

DiGiKerot said:
I adore Xenoglossia. Many, many others do not share my opinion.
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Well, you know me any my opinions. They aren't the most popular or cohesive. I will probably enjoy it since I enjoyed the main Idolm@ster anime.

Noirulus said:
To be honest, I didn't think the sci-fi aspect of Saya no Uta was particularly written well. It was more the horror and atmosphere that made it a great read.
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The sound effects/bgm is what gets me. It is incredibly effective in creating a disorienting, and highly unpleasant atmosphere. right off the bat it feels very alien and discomforting and you know you're about to experience something really fucked up.

MCD said:
New Major face looks so bland, like as if she spawned from some new generic show. Not feeling any personality from the art.

And Major can wear whatever the fuck she wants, she is the fucking major after all.
Click to expand...

Yeah its the face. The body design isn't much to speak of but it isnt bad. Your eyes gravitate towards that face, however, and it is really terribad.
 
A

amishpriest99

Member
Dedication Through Light said:
Unfortunately its a pretty bland design which doesnt get me interested in checking out any part of the franchise(?)
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You should anyway. Both seasons of SAC are fantastic (though I like the first one better).

Confession: I bought the LE Bandai releases for every volume of 2nd Gig. Much as I like the show, that was a dumb decision...they take up so much shelf space.
 
R

Reuenthal

Banned
Steroyd said:
All I'm saying is that human's killing humans takes points of team human as far as I'm concerned. I think I'll leave it at that.

True enough the little girl being alive for so long she was looking for something more, but as you mentioned with the nurse there was always the alternative to simply starve to death, which ain't happening.
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It is clear that the alternative to more companionship and more deaths is less companionship and survival with less deaths.

Even when it comes to just survival maybe there is an alternative that as we saw with that blond vampire is risky.

Considering they can hypnotize humans and how long they managed to drink blood and kill humans before being caught even with many other vampires, the original group could eat from a different human each day or just two days in a row or something instead the same in multiple days, killing them. If the girl wanted to only survive, even with doing some bad stuff, she could with much less tragedy than what eventually unfolded. And with less vampires per humans there would be more available food too. If the vampires cared for minimizing damage and just surviving, they did have a choice to try to do so and see humans less as only prey whose death is not something morally relevant. Maybe some deaths would be caused regardless, but they would be less. Instead we had no reservation fromthe original group and that werewolf vampire encourage new vampires to be murderers, implementing the girl's plan for a vampire village.
 
D

DiGiKerot

Member
cajunator said:
Well, you know me any my opinions. They aren't the most popular or cohesive. I will probably enjoy it since I enjoyed the main Idolm@ster anime.
Click to expand...

Well, that's the thing - how radically different it is from regular iM@S veers is kind of part of the point. Even the character designs are only very superficially similar to the original game ones.

Have you seen My-HiME, My-ZHiME, Code Geass and/or Gundam Seed (Destiny)?
 
A

Articalys

Member
Weekly BD/DVD/CD rankings for January 7-13:

Blu-ray
*1, 7,101 *7,101 Tari Tari vol.5
*2, 3,905 *3,905 K vol.4
*3, 3,590 *3,590 Oda Nobuna no Yabou vol.5
*4, 2,855 *2,855 Minami-ke Blu-ray Box
*5, 2,358 18,713 Girls und Panzer vol.1
*6, 1,332 *1,332 Ixion Saga DT vol.2
*8, *,896 **,896 Tantei Opera Milky Holmes: Alternative
*9, *,881 28,442 Sword Art Online vol.3 Limited Edition
10, *,862 **,862 Moyashimon Returns vol.5

DVD
*1, 6,534 *,**6,534 Initial D Fifth Stage vol.1
*2, 2,164 *,**2,164 One Piece 15th Season vol.2
*3, 1,814 *,**1,814 Ixion Saga DT vol.2
*4, 1,712 *,**1,712 K vol.4
*5, 1,200 *,**1,200 Naruto: Shippuuden Kyubi Shoaku to Inga naru Kaiko no Sho vol.4
*6, 1,021 1,176,535 My Neighbor Totoro
*7, *,836 *,***,836 Himitsukessha Taka no Tsume NEO vol.3
*8, *,815 1,221,656 Howl's Moving Castle
*9, *,791 *,***,791 Oda Nobuna no Yabou vol.5
12, *,716 *,***,716 Moyashimon Returns vol.5
15, *,615 *,**8,779 Pokemon Best Wishes! Season 2: Kyurem vs. Seikenshi
16, *,609 *,*61,642 From Up on Poppy Hill
18, *,570 *,497,159 Kiki's Delivery Service
20, *,514 *,*21,085 One Piece Log Collection "Brook"
22, *,508 *,*21,145 One Piece Log Collection "OHZ"
24, *,462 *,**4,335 Kamisama Hajimemashita vol.1
27, *,446 *,**7,510 Sore Ike! Anpanman
30, *,427 *,***,427 Fairy Tail vol.36

Single CD
*3, 41,923 *41,923 Hunter x Hunter: Phantom Rouge "Reason"
*4, 22,176 *22,176 Tanken Driland "Bunbun Nine9'"
*8, 12,606 276,155 Magi "Yubi Boenkyo"
*9, 11,210 *11,210 Ginga e Kickoff!! "Jinsei Wahaha!"
14, *6,158 **6,158 Puchimas!: Petit iDOLM@STER vol.2 Chihaya
15, *6,105 **6,105 Puchimas!: Petit iDOLM@STER vol.1 Takane
20, *4,014 *52,177 Ao no Exorcist Movie "Reversi"
46, *1,291 *42,112 Ixion Saga DT "DT Suteru" "Let's Go ED"

Tari Tari strong, Initial D outperformed estimates by something like 150%, and Chihaya > Takane confirmed.
 
M

MotionBlue

Member
amishpriest99 said:
It's one of my favorites, despite the ending (and much of the show overall) not making a damn bit of sense. I really love the show's art, and I think that's what kept me into it.
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It makes sense after a couple watches, they just chose to tell the story in a very obtuse way. It likes to name drop philosophers, and lots of people seem to think it pretentious.
 
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