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[E the Shaggy]

I'd give anything for a somewhat decent Nightcrawler costume.

 

[GAMEPROFF]

Not speaking of her costume, but Mystique looks awful in First Class.

 

[Future Foundation]

that scene was indeed co, but Magneto's escape from X2>>>any Magneto scene ever

and I say it as a long time Singer hater

"Too much iron in your blood..."

 

[Eggbok]

Not speaking of her costume, but Mystique looks awful in First Class.

My only complaints is that her face was a little chubby and the hair style is wrong.
It's amazing how Mystique only has the shitty hairstyle when she's blue.
When she's in her human appearance her hair is much better.

Give me this in red instead of that pulled back crap.

 

[GAMEPROFF]

My only complaints is that her face was a little chubby and the hair style is wrong.

Yeah, thats basicly, what I think, too.

 

[Ahasverus]

My only complaints is that her face was a little chubby and the hair style is wrong.
It's amazing how Mystique only has the shitty hairstyle when she's blue.
When she's in her human appearance her hair is much better.

Give me this in red instead of that pulled back crap.

It's sad because og mystique has great hair

 

[broncobuster]

I'd give anything for a somewhat decent Nightcrawler costume.

He's rocking the thriller jacket in scenes.

Thinking on it, I'm looking forward to swashbuckling Nightcrawler the most in Apocalypse.

 

[Blader]

I think Magneto's red suit in this movie looks pretty sick.

I can see why some might be tired of the black leather look for everyone else but it's never really bothered me.

 

[dh4niel]

So they're not having Jennifer Lawrence blue anymore? What happened to 'mutant and proud?'

 

[George Oscar Bluth II]

I like X2 and DoFP but they have shit costumes and DoFP has a shit performance by Jennifer Lawrence. Nothing wrong with pointing it out.

It's sad because og mystique has great hair

And no ugly scales.

 

[Pachimari]

My only complaints is that her face was a little chubby and the hair style is wrong.

You hit it on the nail!

 

[Eggbok]

So they're not having Jennifer Lawrence blue anymore? What happened to 'mutant and proud?'

I miss Rebecca's Mystique, I love how her voice was multi-toned from experimentation and how she believed that she didn't have to hide her true self. She gave no fucks and kicked ass. She wasnt the greatest character but is a step up from what we have now.

Jenn's Mystique is all over the place. I think it's hilarious that she spends First Class preaching about being mutant and proud, and not being ashamed of who you really are then starts spendng 90% of her time looking like everyone else.
Then she spends Days of Future Past hunting Trask for experimenting on mutants because it's wrong and messed up but then we are led to believe she is/will be the reason why Logan is captured and experimented on for Adamantium injections.
I guess in Apocalypse she will spend the movie talking about team work and sticking together then abandon the X-Men she is supposedly "leading" and turn on them? Amazing!

 

[Discotheque]

Man it's like this before every Singer releases every X-Men film. Do you guys ever get sick of complaining about something you know isn't going to change with him at the helm?

The dude makes good X-Men films. Try to look past the lack of stupid Vaughn-style Magneto helmets and just have a good time.

Yeah it's pretty corny. None of the complaints ever have much substance either aside from "black leather?!! Not mah comic books"

Dudes killing it. Came back to the series after a 10 year hiatus and redeemed it

 

[Blader]

Yeah it's pretty corny. None of the complaints ever have much substance either aside from "black leather?!! Not mah comic books"

Dudes killing it. Came back to the series after a 10 year hiatus and redeemed it

Too bad he can't spread that around to his non-X-Men movies. Kinda kills my hype a bit about his 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea.

 

[Loxley]

Funny that after the first X-film came out and made fun of the spandex costumes, Marvel were all like "Uhh...*nervous laughter*...tell me about it right?? All that spandex is so lame! Leather. That's what real superheroes wear. This late-90's leather-fetish will surely not look ridiculous in ten years."

 

[Discotheque]

Too bad he can't spread that around to his non-X-Men movies. Kinda kills my hype a bit about his 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea.

Yeah other than usual suspects his non x-men movies have been a dud

Going from Fincher to him on 20,000 leagues is the worst kind of downgrade

 

[IndoAssassin]

Man it's like this before every Singer releases every X-Men film. Do you guys ever get sick of complaining about something you know isn't going to change with him at the helm?

The dude makes good X-Men films. Try to look past the lack of stupid Vaughn-style Magneto helmets and just have a good time.

Correction, he makes good mutant movies.

 

[SCULLIBUNDO]

Correction, he makes good mutant movies.

*groan*

 

[Blader]

Funny that after the first X-film came out and made fun of the spandex costumes, Marvel were all like "Uhh...*nervous laughter*...tell me about it right?? All that spandex is so lame! Leather. That's what real superheroes wear. This late-90's leather-fetish will surely not look ridiculous in ten years."

I mean, it was a deliberate choice by Morrison to capitalize on the movie's success and inject life back into the comics.

 

[gerg]

Correction, he makes good mutant movies.

I've never understood this conservatism about niche or "nerdy" properties. I appreciate that people enjoy the elements of the comic books that aren't featured in the films, and that there might be some disappointment in not seeing those translated to such media, but it seems ridiculous to then disavow the films as not being "proper" X-Men films. Who gets to decide what is and isn't sufficiently authentic? Is this all part of some concern with having a person's tastes validated by the mainstream (and therefore only a film that closely matches the original material can be recognised)?

 

[Bold One]

First Class will forever have the superior X-Men movie suits.

Spoiler

(Until Deadpool drops next week)

+1 for Blue and Yellow
+1 for Blue Mystique
+1 for no black leather

yuup,

this was the happy medium between the wacky but iconic colourful comic costumes and the practicality of the modern costumes while still keeping the bright colours without looking like circus clowns

 

[Platy]

Correction, he makes good mutant movies.

That suspects movie was fun

 

[cLOUDo]

I wonder how much Lawrence complained to avoid have to use the paint / blue suit

 

[Glass Rebel]

Over 2.5 years later still complaining about how other people don't like aspects of Singer's X-Men movies.

sensational

 

[itwasTuesday]

I wonder how much Lawrence complained to avoid have to use the paint / blue suit

73%.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

but it seems ridiculous to then disavow the films as not being "proper" X-Men films. Who gets to decide what is and isn't sufficiently authentic?

People who are familiar with the characters as written/characterized in the comics?

Almost none of the X-Men as featured in any of the X-Men movies actually ACT like the X-Men they're supposed to be. Bryan Singer's made two very, very good superhero movies (X2, Days of Future Past) but at no point in either of those films did the characters within them really resemble their comics (or cartoon) counterparts from a characterization standpoint. They basically only share powersets, and that's it.

If anything, Singer's been allowed to skate relatively scot-free considering his interpretation of all these Superheroes makes what Snyder's doing on Man of Steel (or to a lesser extent, Nolan w/ Batman) look like Chris Columbus adapting Harry Potter.

Again, I really like the two films he made, and consider them top-tier superhero filmmaking. But that's basically why people don't consider them "proper" X-Men films. Whether such an assessement is worth all that much is something else, though.

 

[Discotheque]

I've never understood this conservatism about niche or "nerdy" properties. I appreciate that people enjoy the elements of the comic books that aren't featured in the films, and that there might be some disappointment in not seeing those translated to such media, but it seems ridiculous to then disavow the films as not being "proper" X-Men films. Who gets to decide what is and isn't sufficiently authentic? Is this all part of some concern with having a person's tastes validated by the mainstream (and therefore only a film that closely matches the original material can be recognised)?

it's pretty corny in the nolan batman threads too when you get the occasional clueless "it's a good movie but not a good batman movie" lmao.

like what constitutes it being 'proper'. it's a sense of entitlement that veers dangerously close to being obnoxious.

disagree with bobby too. arguably the films are a pretty solid adaptation of the cartoon characterizations. particularly beast, cyclops, xavier, wolverine. the only one who really veered far from it all was rogue and i see why he did that considering what kind of story he was trying to tell with her in the first two.

but then again their complaints are valid too in the sense that they don't enjoy how he adapted the characters. so i'm just arguing with myself at this point....personally though i think complaints about wardrobe choice or 'not my xmen' hold no merit to me. it's fine if you have problems with the acting, directing, plot etc. but just being mad about the lack of yellow in their costumes or the choice of focal characters....nah.

 

[Glass Rebel]

I mean, the costumes are garbo period, yellow or not. Like some knock off Ryu Hayabusa suit. And it's not as if Singer's X-Men movies are the only ones to get shat on for ugly costumes. See Cap's costume in the first Avengers.

 

[elfboy]

I'd give anything for a somewhat decent Nightcrawler costume.

plz

 

[The Kree]

This Magneto scene from First Class >>> every Magneto scene in any Singer movie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY2eW2cXcNg

I wish Matthew Vaughn came back to the franchise

I wanted a whole movie of Magneto hunting Nazis after seeing that scene. They can still do it.

 

[Sub_Level]

The costumes are consistent from a story perspective. They have black leather 15 years later in the timeline when X1 happens.

Just saying.

 

[DoctorFling]

My only complaints is that her face was a little chubby and the hair style is wrong.
It's amazing how Mystique only has the shitty hairstyle when she's blue.
When she's in her human appearance her hair is much better.

Give me this in red instead of that pulled back crap.

I thought that was Eisenberg's Lex behind her for a second.

 

[gerg]

People who are familiar with the characters as written/characterized in the comics?

I think the fallacy this makes is in considering the comics as a single, coherent, authoritative source, when, in fact (as many comic fans will know), the X-Men franchise is one that has been developed over its 50-year history by a multitude of competing voices, often on a very ad hoc (if not outwardly contradictory) manner.

I very much grew up on the X-Men as they were in the 90s (or at least as they were distilled into the cartoon show at the time). But it would be foolish for me to argue that the X-Men are only singularly their 90s incarnation, and that anything prior to or since that isn't "really" the X-Men.

Almost none of the X-Men as featured in any of the X-Men movies actually ACT like the X-Men they're supposed to be. Bryan Singer's made two very, very good superhero movies (X2, Days of Future Past) but at no point in either of those films did the characters within them really resemble their comics (or cartoon) counterparts from a characterization standpoint. They basically only share powersets, and that's it.

Arguably the Cyclops of today doesn't bare much resemblance to the Cyclops of the 1960s, either.

 

[G-Fex]

regardless of criticisms, it'll still be better than Civil War probably. Who really buys into that Cap and Bucky friendship crap.

After all, DoFP was so much better than Age of Ultron

 

[Bobby Roberts]

I think the fallacy this makes is in considering the comics as a single, coherent, authoritative source, when, in fact (as many comic fans will know), the X-Men franchise is one that has been developed over its 50-year history by a multitude of competing voices, often on a very ad hoc (if not outwardly contradictory) manner.

It doesn't "make a fallacy" at all, though. The characterizations have shifted and changed throughout their tumultuous soap opera of an existence, but that doesn't mean the characters bearing their names in the films really resemble any of those characters at any point in their progression, either.

Because they don't, really. The only one that comes kinda close is Wolverine. Otherwise, you'd have to dive into What-ifs and weird one-shots to find parallels that kinda stick between the comics version of these characters and the versions onscreen.

Again - I've already said this particular aspect of the criticism maybe doesn't matter that much in the face of the quality of the films overall. But I think it works as an answer to the question that was initially posed: These X-Men have never really felt, or looked, or behaved like their comics counterparts at any point under Singer's direction. Some fans are probably reacting to that when they say shitty things online.

 

[RS4-]

After all, DoFP was so much better than Age of Ultron

x3 is better than aou

 

[G-Fex]

x3 is better than aou

......

Yeah. Yeah, I'll agree to that.

 

[gerg]

It doesn't "make a fallacy" at all, though. The characterizations have shifted and changed throughout their tumultuous soap opera of an existence, but that doesn't mean the characters bearing their names in the films really resemble any of those characters at any point in their progression, either.

My point though is that the standard by which the change in characterisation is considered as overly drastic is arbitrary. The X-Men films are about characters with genetically-imbued superpowers headed by a singular leader named Charles Xavier. However they're characterised, that sounds like the X-Men to me! I guess my argument can be more succinctly phrased as a question: What does it matter whether or not the film versions of the X-Men "really" resemble their comic-book counterparts, and what is lost when they don't?

 

[Magwik]

x3 is better than aou

 

[Bobby Roberts]

My point though is that the standard by which the change in characterisation is considered as overly drastic is arbitrary.

No, I understand your point, I just disagree with it. It's not arbitrary. These characters don't behave like most (almost all) versions of Scott, Jean, Charles, Erik, etc. ever have, especially not in the stories that Singer & Co. are loosely adapting from, either. So even if you take the long view or the short - these versions of the characters basically only have powersets and names in common, and that's about it.

But for the third time: That doesn't necessarily matter when compared to the quality of the films being made. It's just a reason why some fans might be loud about it online. They feel there's a measure of fidelity being ignored, and they value that more than others who just want a good story to play out, regardless who has what name/powerset.

I guess my argument can be more succinctly phrased as a question: What does it matter whether or not the film versions of the X-Men "really" resemble their comic-book counterparts, and what is lost when they don't?

I mean

Again - I've already said this particular aspect of the criticism maybe doesn't matter that much in the face of the quality of the films overall..

and

Again, I really like the two films he made, and consider them top-tier superhero filmmaking. But that's basically why people don't consider them "proper" X-Men films. Whether such an assessement is worth all that much is something else, though.

C'mon.

 

[gerg]

So even if you take the long view or the short - these versions of the characters basically only have powersets and names in common, and that's about it.

Well, sure, but I didn't really deny that.

But for the third time: That doesn't necessarily matter when compared to the quality of the films being made. It's just a reason why some fans might be loud about it online. They feel there's a measure of fidelity being ignored, and they value that more than others who just want a good story to play out, regardless who has what name/powerset.

[...]

C'mon.

While I appreciate the humility I think that line of arguing just begs the question. We both seem agreed that the frustration some fans have with the X-Men films relates to feelings of authenticity, but why then is authenticity considered so important? (I think an argument towards "fidelity" invariably leads back to these tricky concepts of "authenticity", and so swapping the terminology in that manner isn't so helpful.)

I think authenticity is invoked because people want their choice of preferred media to be validated. I wonder if people may feel threatened when their preferred media isn't widely acclaimed, and disappointed (if not slightly insulted) that something that's similar (but not exactly it) is.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

While I appreciate the humility I'm not sure I see the point in putting forward an argument with "But this might not all make sense" as some form of proviso. At least stick to your guns!.

Giving the same answer three times to a question you only just now thought of asking is pretty much "sticking to your guns" gerg.

it's all on the same page, too. it's not hard to follow. Are you confusing the answer I gave with my personal agreement? Dunno why you'd do that. I never said as much, and the fact I've said three times now that it doesn't really matter is a pretty decent sign that the fidelity to the characterization from the comics isn't so important to me, personally. This entire line of conversation was in response to your question as to why people would suggest these films aren't "real X-men" to certain fans, and I've tried to answer why those certain fans would say as much.

And seeing as your most recent response to that is

Well, sure, but I didn't really deny that.

Then I don't know why we just did this dance for a full page.

 

[gerg]

Giving the same answer three times to a question you only just now thought of asking is pretty much "sticking to your guns" gerg.

it's all on the same page, too. it's not hard to follow. Are you confusing the answer I gave with my personal agreement? Dunno why you'd do that. I never said as much, and the fact I've said three times now that it doesn't really matter is a pretty decent sign that the fidelity to the characterization from the comics isn't so important to me, personally. This entire line of conversation was in response to your question as to why people would suggest these films aren't "real X-men" to certain fans, and I've tried to answer why those certain fans would say as much.

And seeing as your most recent response to that is

Then I don't know why we just did this dance for a full page.

I think we've probably been arguing at cross purposes (if that's the right word).

You've given a very sufficient account of why people feel the X-Men films are inauthentic. My question (which I may have phrased ambiguously) has always meant to be as to why that authenticity is so important.

Edit: Ultimately though I can't claim to be half as big an X-Men fan as a lot of people in this thread, so I'm happy to drop the issue.

 

[George Oscar Bluth II]

I feel like the X-Men movies should just be like "Fuck canon" and be standalone but with the same characters and actors. Just cover different storylines from the comics regardless of timeline. "Here's that time they travelled to the Savage Land."

Dunno if that would work out but whatever.

 

[RS4-]

I think we've probably been arguing at cross purposes (if that's the right word).

You've given a very sufficient account of why people feel the X-Men films are inauthentic. My question (which I may have phrased ambiguously) has always meant to be as to why that authenticity is so important.

Part of me thinks its because they're just not THE same characters fans have been reading about for years, and years.

And just the way they've treated Cyclops, the focus on Wolverine and...Mystique.

Sure, some of that is important to me, but I haven't actively read the comics since the mid 90s.

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

It's sad because og mystique has great hair

This is my mystique.

 

[catashtrophe]

Storm's Origins explored In "X-Men: Apocalypse"

"[You] see me in Cairo, and he's speaking whatever ancient language because he's just woken up and I'm speaking Arabic. I'm trying to communicate with him, and then he has this moment where he figures out where he is, what's happened, what date it is, and he… Apocalypse doesn't need to say much.

All he has to do is just be like, 'I'm here, I'm what you've been looking for'. And you just feel it right in your gut, and you're like, "Right, you are exactly what I've been looking for. You are exactly what I need right now." I think that he can see that, and he could also see the power. I feel like when you're the most powerful, you're also the most self-conscious about it. We kind of find each other. Like though the crowd, it all parts and I see his blue face. Then we kind of just like, "Ah". There is a moment."

"For me specifically, well like, what he does is he has the power to enhance your power. So while you're around him, he's got all these mega level mutants. He's able to turn them into crazy-baboom level mutants. For me, he is like, what you can control everything, almost, kind of, sort of. I'm not the Phoenix, but you know what I mean. She's got so many powers, and he's like, but he doesn't even know what her powers are when he meets her. He can just sense the level and that's what attracts him to them.

So what he is attracted to is their level and their magnitude of power. I think that his plan for her in the movie is to protect him. Protect him with fog. Protect him with lightning. Blow away a missile. Blow away a plane. There is so much that she can do, and what he's looking for is protection because he just woke up after thousands and thousand years. He's weak and he's alone, and he's been betrayed, you know. He's kind of like a girlfriend who just got cheated on, who wants to date the nerdy guy who can take care of her."

More at the link

http://collider.com/x-men-apocalypse-alexandra-shipp-storm-interview-black-panther/

This film is going to be amazing

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Crazy baboom level mutants.

Yeah, this is going to be great.

 

[neorej]

He's kind of like a girlfriend who just got cheated on, who wants to date the nerdy guy who can take care of her.

The Apocalypse, ladies and gentlemen. Please be careful with him, he's weak like a girlfriend who just got cheated on.

Edit: God jezus, the number of "like"-s in that article is like, off the like, charts, like, she has no other means of like, communication, like talking, you know?

 

[scarlet]

The Apocalypse, ladies and gentlemen. Please be careful with him, he's weak like a girlfriend who just got cheated on.

You have no idea