Roman Empire
Member
343I don't have the talent to make a game as polished as we want. Forget about they adding fine details like the warthog interacting with the scenario :/
Xbox forced it. No apologies, no excuses. Sony was smarter about their reveal.
Roman Empire
Member
I blame Ubisoft for this shit still existing. When you just want to show a concept for a game that's not even ready for showing, then I think it's understandable as a PR move to create hype. But never, I repeat, never, call it a gameplay showcase or anything remotely close to the word gameplay/in-game. Now the new tactic is using IN-ENGINE or pre-rendered footage to fool gamers (and the worst part, people tend to fall for it).
Desaccorde
Member
I think saying that cinematics in Sony's first party games are much better than in-game shots and the ones in PS5 event are not real are kind of unrealistic. For the sake of scientific evidence, I will share my raw in-game images that I copied from my PS4 Pro for both Uncharted 4: A Thief's End and God of War. Keep in mind that one of those games released in 2016 on a much much much lower spec'ed device and the other in 2018. So the ones in PS5 Event likely will be the same or better looking when they have come out. #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6, #7, #8, #9.
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xPikYx
Member
The only next gen thing I've seen so far is the UE5 tech demo as per nature itself still need to demonstrate it can actually run on nextgen hardware at that quality level. The second next gen thing I've seen is hellblade2, in this case either it's even more difficult to proof it is feasible to run on actual hardware in real time, all the rest are just nicer and polished current gen games
shenmue mugen
Member
I think the textures were great for a native 4K 60fps.
Ass of Can Whooping
Member
Not for a 12tflop console they aint
Mr. PlayStation
Member
I think they should've not hyped Halo Infinite so much. Those 12tflops meant nothing when you saw a game that looked mediocre even by Xbox one X standards, when you factor in how good Gears of War 5 looks on Xbox One X. Honestly both parties tried to strike when the iron was hot, but Microsoft dropped their iron in the water, while Sony struck the iron when it was hot and got the positive word of mouth and social media trends.
Jigsaah
Gold Member
Maybe...if they knew what they were showing was a months old build especially. I mean you can't even call it a vertical slice, because the history and expectation would suggest that a vertical slice would be downgraded compared to the final release.
Mr. PlayStation
Member
HZFW had gameplay shots from cinematic camera angles, GT7 featured gameplay, kena featured gameplay, so did ratchet and clank and spider-man miles morales featured gameplay shots from cinematic camera angles. You just fail to see what's in front you!
Jigsaah
Gold Member
I don't know if that's confirmed. There was a disclaimer that what was shown was "running on PS5 systems" which is more than what Xbox can say right now, but there was no indication that this was actual gameplay.
Mr. PlayStation
Member
Anyone who has played Horizon Zero Dawn would know HZFW had gameplay snippets in it akin to AC: Valhalla Xbox Series X May event trailer
Jigsaah
Gold Member
I've played Horizon Zero Dawn. I don't follow your logic here. Unless I see a HUD with some human gameplay I'm not convinced. Ratchet and Klank had it. I'm pretty sure Kena had it. HZFW...nah brah.
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iHaunter
Member
Mmmm....the part where she was running on the mount looked in-game to me with no UI... I disagree with that one.
iHaunter
Member
Except for all the other studios that are dealing with COVID and releasing complete games. Blame it on incompetent studio and being rush by ignorant execs.
Kazekage1981
Member
if 343 has acknowledged consumer complaints, and there are only a few months till XsX launch, what *can* be done to fix the visuals? I am thinking they are going to add patches/dlc stuff till the end of time after the game launches. It is impossible for the game to have a complete next gen visual overhaul in the next 4 months.
XsX had all the momentum before this, and its MSFT has only themselves to blame. PS5 console reveal was shit, but they made up for it with decent line up of games (still underwhelming but decent in my opinion). There was some aspect of solidification from Sony's game reveals, because after the tech spec reveal everything felt it was on shaky grounds of whether it was powerful enough to even have next gen content compared to XsX.
XsX on the other hand had everything going for its most powerful tech only to be shackled by the original xbox, bad game design, internal development struggles.
There has to be some sort of XsX exclusive, built from the ground up *only* for XsX 12 TFLOP machine and PC using Direct X 12 ultimate API with great game design, story etc.
Time will tell.
XsX had all the momentum before this, and its MSFT has only themselves to blame. PS5 console reveal was shit, but they made up for it with decent line up of games (still underwhelming but decent in my opinion). There was some aspect of solidification from Sony's game reveals, because after the tech spec reveal everything felt it was on shaky grounds of whether it was powerful enough to even have next gen content compared to XsX.
XsX on the other hand had everything going for its most powerful tech only to be shackled by the original xbox, bad game design, internal development struggles.
There has to be some sort of XsX exclusive, built from the ground up *only* for XsX 12 TFLOP machine and PC using Direct X 12 ultimate API with great game design, story etc.
Time will tell.
MasterCornholio
Member
I think the big thing was the announcement of how those games were captured on the PS5. What I find really weird is the lack of games running on the XSX at that July event. That's the biggest issue that I have with the event. Halo Infinite not looking next gen or even current gen is a close second.
There has to be. But no idea why they haven't shown it at that event yet. Even if all they could do was a short demo it would have done it's job of proving the systems capabilities.
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Zimmy68
Member
Yep. If the game isn't ready to show now, the game isn't ready period.
Vawn
Banned
Downgrade what? They haven't shown any game play.
Peenolia010
Member
I'm not deep into the fanboy debates so I don't have the desire to do research. I'm just a gamer that loves games. I wish fanboys stop turning discussions into arguements. Nothing too crazy
Romulus
Member
My problem is, how is it that Xbox can be so unprepared?
Did they not have unbiased, objective people look at the reveal before it launched? No one in their right mind would ever think that reveal was something that would go toe to toe with Sony, and really, they needed something better than Sony considering the install base comparison. Sony is just by far a bigger brand. Xbox went into this cocky but incredibly unprepared. The whole thing is just embarrassing.
I think this generation will be alot like the last, but for different reasons. Xbox takes a lot of flack from the start, but they start bouncing back 3-4 years later. The problem with that is Sony is running on all cylinders by that point too with 1st party releases. I predict another 2 to 1 sales between the console, possibly closer to 3 to 1.
How dumb are they at Microsoft, you need to come out of the gate swinging against sony. Not sure why they don't get that after 3 generations. They show up with a bunch of CGI trailers and a Halo game that looks like a Halo 4 mod.
Did they not have unbiased, objective people look at the reveal before it launched? No one in their right mind would ever think that reveal was something that would go toe to toe with Sony, and really, they needed something better than Sony considering the install base comparison. Sony is just by far a bigger brand. Xbox went into this cocky but incredibly unprepared. The whole thing is just embarrassing.
I think this generation will be alot like the last, but for different reasons. Xbox takes a lot of flack from the start, but they start bouncing back 3-4 years later. The problem with that is Sony is running on all cylinders by that point too with 1st party releases. I predict another 2 to 1 sales between the console, possibly closer to 3 to 1.
How dumb are they at Microsoft, you need to come out of the gate swinging against sony. Not sure why they don't get that after 3 generations. They show up with a bunch of CGI trailers and a Halo game that looks like a Halo 4 mod.
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Dave_at_Home
Member
Real shame that so many people bought into 12 Tflop hype. The console is more powerful than PS5, but the difference is smaller than PS4 and Xbox One. What the hell do people expect? A monumental world of difference between the two? This has always been Microsoft's modus operand. Which is fine honestly. People that are so caught up in specs they don't understand.
Speaking of which, I have a hard time understanding why someone would say "PS5 console reveal was shit, but they made up for it with decent line up of games." The fuck? How was it shit? Am I missing something here or is the whole point of having a successful console reveal is also showing games that take advantage of new hardware. Granted it wasn't every game, but console launches are typically weak to begin with. Could you imagine if people's perception of the PS4 never changed by only basing its future success on the initial launch lineup! That would be crazy, and I hold that same feeling about Series X as well. Series X will have amazing looking games for it in the future. No doubt about it. With that said, people know Sony can deliver on first-party, that can't be traditionally said for Microsoft. They doubled down on their specs and now have paid the price for not backing all the big talk up. The console will succeed just fine, but people want them to "put up or shut up".
Thirty7ven
Banned
If you look at it as Gamepass with everything else being secondary, it was a good show.
If the point was to sell XSX, then it was horrible.
If the point was to sell XSX, then it was horrible.
BurnCoalMeltPole
Member
It appears that Sony is far more prepared for next gen than Microsoft. How did this happen? So far, I think we only know a part of the story, and some of it was revealed in Mark Cerny's The Road to PS5. The PS5 has been designed to decrease development risk by not only lowering the time it takes to get code working, but to also make it easier to stream in high quality assets without the extremely tedious tuning normally required to keep the game from bogging down. Also, Sony's studios are all pretty much up to speed on the new hardware, many of them having orientated towards next gen since 2017. With some current gen titles in development for more than three years, this must have been a major itch that needed scratching. Even Epic Games, author of the most prevalent game engine in the industry, got on board in a big way. Will this entail many third-party games having a significant performance advantage on this hardware? It seems well within the realm of possibility for a system that leverages exceptional storage throughput to extend main memory. The particulars of the I/O subsystem are very important because of the rather modest memory upgrade for the next generation.
Meanwhile, MS was busy acquiring a bunch of new studios in 2018 & 2019 to fill out their Game Pass portfolio (a risky strategy that could alienate third parties), so they seem to be still trying to get things going. One of their flagship titles appears to have been stuck in development hell. At their recent showcase, MS was seemingly pushed to flaunt a fair number of titles that are not likely to ship until at least 2022. Perhaps poor planning over the past 4-5 years can account for what we are now witnessing? It is just unbelievable that a piece of software, so key to MS's entire strategy, was allowed to put everything at risk. I wonder if they are hemorrhaging customers at this point? I am reminded of what happened back in 2013, which consisted of a combination of poor strategy, relatively weaker hardware, and a higher price. MS sold over 80 million 360 consoles, but less than 50 million Xboxes this time around, which is less than half of the largest competitor. Another grand failure might cut their market share by another 40-60%.
Major new reveals by both companies are expected next month, and it may be possible for the situation to change, either for the better or worse. I can say that the drama of these generational transitions always seems to surprise me.
Meanwhile, MS was busy acquiring a bunch of new studios in 2018 & 2019 to fill out their Game Pass portfolio (a risky strategy that could alienate third parties), so they seem to be still trying to get things going. One of their flagship titles appears to have been stuck in development hell. At their recent showcase, MS was seemingly pushed to flaunt a fair number of titles that are not likely to ship until at least 2022. Perhaps poor planning over the past 4-5 years can account for what we are now witnessing? It is just unbelievable that a piece of software, so key to MS's entire strategy, was allowed to put everything at risk. I wonder if they are hemorrhaging customers at this point? I am reminded of what happened back in 2013, which consisted of a combination of poor strategy, relatively weaker hardware, and a higher price. MS sold over 80 million 360 consoles, but less than 50 million Xboxes this time around, which is less than half of the largest competitor. Another grand failure might cut their market share by another 40-60%.
Major new reveals by both companies are expected next month, and it may be possible for the situation to change, either for the better or worse. I can say that the drama of these generational transitions always seems to surprise me.
Kazekage1981
Member
The console presentation on "road to ps5" with mark cerny having nerd talk to a fake audience was shit. Its been discussed to death in other threads, so i am just expressing my opinion on it.
PS5 IMO, has already won. Sony will have the same success with PS5 compared to PS4 and PS4Pro. They have the potential to have a lot more success with PS5. I was hoping that with XsX, they would come a close second-not the distant second that they are in now. They had everything going right in the beginning, and the build up of hype was going for them. I was willing to forgive them for the first game reveal presentation. The second is just in-excusable (not to mention the constant bland and bleh E3 presentations of the past). They have shot themselves in the foot.
Lets be honest. The only thing that truly screamed next gen was the unreal tech demo at 1440p/30fps with not much going on besides walking, climbing and a fly by.
Horizon Dawn 2 looks great, looks much more polished, but still looks similar to last gen.
Here is the great news:
-The first 1-2 years are learning curves/transition periods to get the feel for the console, so first gen games will not look so different from last gen.
-Developers have to tinker with the hardware, but since Sony and MSFT have updated tools, APIs, and support, the "time to triangle" has been greatly reduced.
-New studio 1st party studio acquisitions from MSFT means they will have less anemic title releases.
-Xbone and Xbone X manufacturing has been discontinued. More installed base of XsX means the transition to XsX and possibly lockhart makes more of an incentive for developers to utilize zen 2 and Rdna 2 hardware instead of the potato jaguar and polaris one to break the shackles of "generations"
-i dont believe in 'diminishing returns' of hi fidelity graphics. When a game looks as detailed and fluid as CGI movies then you can say we have reached the final frontier. Developers have to 'tinker' with what makes zen2 and rdna 2 tick.
-unreal 5.0 engine and its tech demo is taxing on the gpu as much as fortnite-which to me is shocking and amazing. They still have so much more to implement, finish, optimize and polish on the engine, and it is scalable for: PS5, XsX, PC, mobile etc. Great things to come from this.
its not doom and gloom. When the console releases, try out the games for yourselves, and best of all with gamepass you can.
i say give both consoles 1-2 years to transition into next gen with true next gen graphics.
MrFunSocks
Banned
Just like the Uncharted 4 60fps reveal trailer that Naughty Dog later admitted at SIGGRAPH was pre-rendered using the PS4 as a render farm using effects that were literally impossible in their engine.
Another dump on Xbox thread, I am shocked. SHOCKED.
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Dave_at_Home
Member
The "road to PS5" was Sony's GDC talk. It was meant for developers, so if you were disappointed by it, than you should be cause it was never meant to be the reveal.
As for HZD2, I'd say it looks a bit better than just "polished".
Rygeist
Banned
Sure, they have not shown any gameplay. Only misleading trailers.
Endless Fluff
Banned
Yeah, GT7 really looked amazing. It really doesn't have the same problems Halo Infinite does (low quality textures, low poly assets and very visible pop-in).
Gran Turismo 7 was the most disappointing game from the reveal show, because it looks like a current gen game.
killatopak
Member
After watching the NX video on Halo infinite, it just sucks.
It's definitely fixable but not at launch. Think of MCC that's what we're going to get especially with HI being a 10-year game. Wtf does that even mean? You're telling me you're supporting XBO for ten more years? Hopefully, they'll go the FFXIV route and drop the weak platform after x amount of years.
Kazekage1981
Member
HZD2 does look better than just polished. Polished would be PC version of original Horizon Dawn.