Words of truth.
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Xenoblade |OT| Sorry I Kept You Waiting!
- Thread starter SecretMoblin
- Start date
Words of truth.
Karsticles
Member
Yeah! All of we frequent posters here snagged another one! Now you must join us in suckering people with bad taste to buy this excellent game.
Yes I am serious. I heard nothing but praise for this game but when it seems to have some pretty dumb choices with its' systems baffles me. That I have to topple bosses to do damage to them every time wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for the fact that I need to do so by chain attack which only happens after I fill three bars completely. So in the meanwhile I have to sit by taking pointless damage keeping busy with the constantly respawning henchmen so I can fill up the damn thing to attack the boss with something that would actually damage it. And I only get that attack once. Not to mention the fact that there are only like what three active battlers on your party at once? So having one healer is incredibly frustrating especially when the AI is an idiot and that damn AI is the only one with helpful debuffs and buffs. Which doesn't help considering if you get toppled or something you have to sit and wait for the AI to help or somehow get up on your own through sheer luck or something. As for the levels, I am one level below the boss, it doesn't change anything in any way whatsoever, well except for it seeming that I can't beat the boss.
So somebody please tell me, who thought excluding mid-battle items in their entirety was a good idea, because I seriously doubt that person was sane. Now it may be a case of me just plain sucking at the game, but I feel that after 10 hours of playing it I would have gotten accustomed to whatever pointlessly complicated battle system the game has but that doesn't seem to be the case. Either way, I find the boss battle
I'm fighitng Xord, I bet he isn't even one of the more difficult ones
SecretMoblin
Member
Ah, that battle can certainly be frustrating, especially since you're required to fight it the way you described. It's the only battle that needs to be fought that way, though, and virtually all future boss battles are much more open-ended. If you can, try grinding another level or two - it shouldn't take long - and try again. Also, make sure you have the latest equipment on your characters, have equipped any gems you have at this point, and make sure you have spent all your AP to level up your characters' arts—it can make a big difference, actually.
Despite what the game leads you to believe in the early "tutorial" sections, you really don't need a healer in your party at all. With proper skill linking, gems, arts, and strategy you can get through most fights more quickly and easily without one. In fact, many of the insane battles done by experts at the game (like chaosblade) are accomplished without a dedicated healer.
Keep at it if you can, the game improves after that particular fight.
I used Melia with poison+ and flame+ gems. Basically I try to keep poison on the main boss while constantly spamming AOE fire to take care of the henchmen. I never really used topple-locking throughout the game, or even topple at all really.
For this fight remember that you can control your guys to group near you or attack a specific enemy, important so they don't run into the damaging surrounding areas like morons.
Smiles and Cries
Member
Melia's topple is awesome I cannot wait to get to her again... I like NG+ but I hate my gems for
colony 6 are level II
Extra Sauce
Member
Has any console ever upscaled backward compatible games?
Didn't the PS2 upscale PS1 games? Plus you had the option of applying texture filtering.
Also, the N64 games on Wii Virtual Console are in a higher resolution than the N64 originals.
Smiles and Cries
Member
I would want a remake upscale will not really fix textures will it?
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Nope. But there is no way Nintendo would give this game the attention it would need for a "proper" HD version. The game is just too big to go back and fix all the low-res textures. Not that I think they would bother with it anyway, it didn't sell well enough to be even a "low priority" title for an HD re-release, assuming Nintendo decides to do something like that.
This is only applicable for a couple fights -
Metal Face at the beginning of the game, and Xord
And I'm kind of going to throw a lot of info out there in this post, a lot of it isn't do-or-die type stuff, just general "how it works" stuff and some tips.
Leveling up Reyn's Wild Down art early on in the game is definitely a good investment, even if you're kind of ignoring his other arts. That reduces the cooldown time so you can topple the enemy more quickly. Most of his better ones don't show up until later anyway. And both Shulk and Sharla should have break arts (Shulk should have two by that point? Don't remember).
Someone else already said it, but you don't need Sharla in your party. It's not a bad thing to have her around while you're still getting a feel for the game since she kind of acts as an insurance policy, but you can work through battles a lot faster without her since she deals awful damage and spends a lot of time healing/buffing/curing.
I think a lot of people agree battles are easier when she's not around, but if you don't have a decent feel for the battle system yet it might not be a good idea to drop her as soon as you get another party member.
Topples - your own and the enemy's - are time based. When you topple the enemy it will always last three seconds unless you have something to extend that. Enemy topples have some variety, some of them only last a couple seconds, and others last like 5 or 6. There's not any sort of random factor to it though. And obviously you can get up early through assistance.
Also remember you can add daze on top of the toppled enemy and that will slightly extend the time the enemy is down. Sharla should have a daze art, so having your party as Shulk->Reyn->Sharla means you can break->topple->daze in the chain attack. These statuses can also be stacked, so using topple on a toppled enemy will extend the length to a total of 6 seconds. If Wild Down and Head Shaker are available the AI should use them immediately after the chain attack.
There are even more details to topple, but that at least covers the basics.
Oh, and regarding the party gauge, using Shulk's direction attacks from the correct direction helps build the gauge a lot. Also, timing the b-button QTE in battle properly can add a lot as well (a whole bar if you get the timing perfect, nothing if you hit it early and a smaller bonus if you hit it late). High tension increases your critical hit rate, and critical hits also raise the gauge, but that's probably not very helpful yet.
Regarding level difference:
In this game, damage and accuracy are penalized/boosted based on the level difference between you and the enemy (and it affects the enemy as well). Even being one level lower will reduce your agility slightly and cut your defense and damage output by 5% or so. And the difference only gets bigger as the level difference increases.
Don't let that scare you into thinking you need to be the same level or higher though. As long as you're within a few levels of the enemy the penalties/bonuses aren't significant enough to impact the outcome of the fight.
When it comes down to it, the further you get into the game the more your setup matters than level. For right now, make sure to take advantage of skills/skill links as you go through the game. I'm sure a lot of the people who end up getting stuck or frustrated by a boss are ignoring those (though this battle is kind of an exception). You can get all kinds of stat boosts and other good effects through skills/links. Skills get more expensive to unlock as you go down the tree, so you'll want to switch trees regularly to unlock the cheaper ones to get more skills more quickly (rather than going one tree at a time, bad idea!)
But at the point you're at, level is the primary factor. In general, as I've recommended lately to everybody, fighting Unique Monsters is the best way to level up and get new equipment. They drop the best stuff available at any given point, always drop gold chests, and give you affinity coins so you can link more skills. If you're struggling with bosses you'll probably also struggle with UMs though, but it's worth trying since there's not really any penalty for dying, and it kind of tests your mettle.
Also, know that agility is more important than defense. You're better off dodging attacks than taking slightly less damage. So light or medium armor is the best bet for most characters. Reyn is kind of the exception, his agility is bad anyway and he has the defense and HP to take hits well.
Always go for slotted armor when possible, even if you have something that's unslotted (or unique that has a lame gem in it) with slightly better stats. The benefits you can get with gems definitely outweigh the the slightly better defense you might get with other armor.
It takes some time for everything to come together, but once everything clicks into place you'll probably enjoy the game more. There's a lot of systems and subsystems to learn, but when it comes down to it, it's really not that complicated.
And I liked that there was no item/inventory management during battle.
Karsticles
Member
1) You don't need a healer in this game.
2) You don't need items in this game.
3) The boss you are fighting takes 1 topple to kill, and it's the only fight in the game where you are this limited. It's a test to see if you understand the game mechanics.
I thought he was too easy.
No clue, it just makes me sad. :-(
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
I thought it was half HP, maybe I'm remembering wrong.
Karsticles
Member
Maybe it was, and it took 2 topples.
Also, all of my characters are hearted now and level 99 - yay!
I have all the gems I need except for Arts Heal, Talent Boost, Heat Sink, and Bind.
Glory gauntlets are definitely the thing I'm lacking most - I still need 3 of them! :-/
Still a few miscellaneous quests to clear out.
I'm missing 20 affinity coins. I'll have to hunt through the world and see what's up.
I think that's it...not much to look at. :-(
Edit: Oh, and I'm moving 7th up my tier list. Goddamn she is amazing. So many criticals to build the bar fast, and giving her full debuff gems just makes her an amazing party support character that does great damage. I recently slapped AgiDown, Slow, and Paralysis on her weapons, and my team barely takes damage. Plus she basically topples whatever the heck she wants, whenever she wants.
Edit2: Question: if I put a "team bonus" skill on multiple characters, does it stack? I.e. 7th has the skill that gives everyone Haste off of a Burst Affinity. If I pop that on Dunban, do I get double the value? My guess is no.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Yes, you get two haste buffs in that case. It even pops up with two separate "Haste" notifications when it activates.
Karsticles
Member
Well I wonder, because even though it pops up twice, the way the game usually works is disallowing debuffs to stack. So, Worldly Slash will stack with a PhysDefDown gem, but Worldly Slash does not stack with itself, and PhysDefDown does not stack with itself, even if done between multiple characters. Now, if you've ever equipped a PhysDefDown gem on 7th, you know that your screen is filled with an endless stream of "Physical Defense Down" popups that are annoying as hell, but it's just one debuff getting refreshed, it's not stacking.
So, how are you sure that is not the case with the Haste buff? Certainly, a Haste buff from skill X will stack with one from skill Y, but it's not clear to me that skill X on character A will stack with skill X on character B.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Well obviously there's no way to make absolute sure without somehow checking the RAM, but I've been under the impression that buffs(/debuffs) stack from different characters. If that's not the case I probably could have made my team more efficient.
Smiles and Cries
Member
at what point does
Colony 6 refugee camp timed quests get cut off?
When you
tell them to go to Colony 6 after clearing it out.
Smiles and Cries
Member
I missed that the first time I played... I am walking with
Dickson/Juju through the mash I know at the end Juju goes back
Ok I beat the asshole and I'm at the
That boss was annoying, seriously. I got a better hang of things now and I admit I kind of flew off the handle with the earlier posts. One thing I do have to say I love about the game is exploring maps and finding landmarks. Oh and another is that apparently you dying has no negative consequences, I thought that was interesting. Anyway, I kind of spoiled myself with some party members and skills. Interesting things are coming up ahead I guess, I'm amazed that I couldn't find a way to climb where I am. I looked it up online and feel like a dumbass. Sadly I'll only get a chance to play the game again this friday, so I get all week to torture myself reading about it and trying not to spoil myself.
soroal statues.
Smiles and Cries
Member
I feel so lucky to have had a good stretch of free weeks to play this
I like the exploring, just when I thought I found all the secret areas I find something to climb
many pages back someone talked of an area spoiler
I watched a video of it last time I need to find that video again
Edit: After looking at this again. I will have to hack my Wii to patch this when I am done with this game.
I am also wondering if Official DLC/patch could be something
I like the exploring, just when I thought I found all the secret areas I find something to climb
many pages back someone talked of an area spoiler
The huge Shoulder Area that was dropped from the game - I found myself wondering where would the path to this area be - it would be a dead end but I wondered where it would be what direction
I watched a video of it last time I need to find that video again
Edit: After looking at this again. I will have to hack my Wii to patch this when I am done with this game.
I am also wondering if Official DLC/patch could be something
Karsticles
Member
Dying can have one negative consequence: I've had UMs despawn on me after dying. At Distant Fingertip, if anyone is wondering.
Hey,
I have a question, I missed some people in Alcamoth,
I have a question, I missed some people in Alcamoth,
I'm past the part of Mekonis destruction so I can't access to that area anymore, am I able to complete the game 100% (ignoring achievements), or I did need invite that Alcamoth people to colony-6 before Mekonis incident?
Karsticles
Member
You cannot miss Colony 6 invitees.
I don't know if maybe it's just me or what, but...wow I really struggle going through Sword Valley. I hadn't had much difficulty with the game up to this point, but it feels like every unique enemy I come across here kicks my ass at least once, and I can't seem to beat any of them period without having Sharla in my party to provide constant healing. I actually put the game down for a couple of months because I didn't feel like going through that, finally gave it another shot today and made minimal progress but still died a bunch. My party isn't horribly underleveled or anything, so why I'm suddenly banging my head into the wall here, I'm really not sure.
SecretMoblin
Member
You have to change your strategy to account for the mechon in the area, if you haven't already. Ether attacks work wonders, or have Shulk use enchant. Don't bother with the anti-mechon weapons Dickson is selling, you won't need them. You'll get serviceable ones eventually anyway.
Focus on toppling/dazing the enemies. Also, spike damage starts becoming an issue in this area. Make sure you have some anti-spike gems and/or have Shulk use Purge.
Karsticles
Member
Are you talking about the big four-legged dudes? Those aren't reasonably defeatable at your point unless you're amazing at the game and very well equipped.
SecretMoblin
Member
But where is the Alcamoth people now?
Karsticles
Member
The only thing mentioned among these that I hadn't taken into account already is the new emphasis on spiking. There's always so much shit going on in the middle of a battle that I don't always notice when an enemy is doing it. Plus, the occasions where I don't have Sharla in the party I've been trying to use Melia instead, but her summon aqua in conjunction with Shulk's light heal doesn't seem to offer enough health recovery to last these lengthier UM fights. And she has her Mind Blast which, IIRC, is meant to seal off auras and spikes in the way that Purge does anyway. Basically as soon as any member of my party goes down, I'm screwed, because I don't have the health recovery to get them lasting long after a revival and the party gauge is quickly depleted.
Red techs aren't talent arts, so the shield won't do much good. You can apply Monado Speed (if you have it) onto the person being targeted, get the enemy to switch targets to someone it won't affect so much by drawing aggro, or you can throw it out of using that attack altogether by inflicting daze on it.
Karsticles
Member
Karsticles
Member
I'm not a "should" kind of person, but the facts are that this game is exceptional, it almost didn't make it over here, and the team behind it got this as its first opportunity to really stretch its wings and prove itself to Nintendo. I bought it new because I want to support that kind of developer.
Don't get me wrong, I only ever buy used as a last resort. But I have to think in this case new or used the developers are getting the same $. Its in gamestops best interest to sell it used. Surely NOA foresaw that, especially with it being exclusive. Gotta think they're getting their cut either way. Or already got all the $$ they're going to.
Karsticles
Member
Nope. New sales always give more to the developer. Any number is higher than 0. For every unsold copy, Gamestop can mail it back to Nintendo for a refund.
Thanks! =)
In every other case this is true, but this is the only retail exclusive ge that I'm aware of. You don't think their deal was structured differently than a normal release?
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Gamestop helped cover manufacturing and marketing costs for the game, in return it was (temporarily) retailer-exclusive. Nintendo still doesn't gain anything from someone buying it used.
Thanks for concise explanation. That makes sense. New it is then.
This won't be the last time you say that. But yes. That area is nice looking at night.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
My favorite view in the game is probably a weird one since it's in an ugly area that a lot of people probably don't like.
Sword Valley, after you get out of the canyon. Pretty much the whole area after you fight Metal Face. The "flying fortress" theme that section has is really awesome.
Karsticles
Member
Chaosblade answered you already, but I just thought I'd emphasize that the exclusivity was limited. Best Buy now has the game, as well (at least).
I think Bionis Leg is mine, simply because it's the moment that I said "This is what Final Fantasy XII wanted to be, and what XIII should have gone toward".
My favorite view is incredibly spoilery, but...
It's the from pinkie of the Fallen Arm looking back towards the Hidden Village with Bionis right there behind it. Then I set the time to night. Then a level 100+ monster spawned... I quicky set the time back again.
Awesome. I need more games like this, I already have Skies of Arcadia is there anything else with this level of exploration?