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[clubstoic]

I disagree with many of these points. Point 3 is especially important, while most of the rest are overblown or irrelevant.

For example, if a woman buying Call of Duty will be asked if its her boyfriends, it is because women do not typically play violent videogames. Before the 2000's it was rare for women to play any kind of videogames. In fact, by a large margin women discriminate against men who play games. The response to a woman that plays games is a social positive. There are biological differences between men and women that generally effect our choices and interests. While there were always games that marketed to a wide audience, we have to thank Facebook and Apple and Nintendo for expanding the market.

If my opinion was controversial, or I stated inaccurate facts, I didn't mean to.

 

[Chettlar]

Sorry, this is bullshit. You're basing this on the small number of Youtube gamer girls and the like who try to get maximum viewership (they still don't deserve to be shat on as there are plenty of guy gamers doing the same thing). A very large number of women who play games are simply not reaching out to you and saying "hey, im not an attention whore" as you've somehow come to expect.

Completely false. I'm talking about irl experiences. On the internet, I meet dozens of girls who aren't attention whores. I also meet many who are. In real life, I know maybe three girls who regularly game because they actually like gaming. The rest (and I'm talking, in the hundreds, K. I mean, I get out.) either don't care about gaming, or just pretend they do to impress/keep (yeah, the latter is dumb) their boyfriends or just get attention from other gamers.

It's kind of sad I think. I think it's a societal problem why they don't play games. We tell them they can't enjoy them, so they don't (it's not that simple, I know. Just didn't want to get into a paragraph explaining something you probably already know).

The point was that guys have nothing to do with some girls do. They didn't make the girls do all that for attention. The reason the girls who DO enjoy games are suffering is because of what these other, immature girls did.

I mean, I guess you could say that the guys are wrong for continuing the stereotype (which they are, and like all stereotypes we should fix it), but they aren't the ones who started the actual doing it.

I was just saying that men aren't directly to blame for having started that stereotype. They hold it, yes, but they didn't start it. Nobody in this equation is right. Never said they were.

I'm also really tired of the posts that chalk it up to anonymity or those that imply we shouldn't tackle this problem because it's not a gaming-only problem and the world's problems need to be solved first.

I agree. This is kind of how you stop these problems.

You don't say "well murder happens all over the world, so I can't stop it here." No, you stop it here. Now. You start the "stopping."

It happens in the gaming community, so the gaming community should stop it. If it happens in other places. Cool, stop it there too.

Please tell me you can justify what you've just posted?

They do. What of it?

All I'm saying is the stereotype exists for a reason. It's a stereotype, so it's bad, and not representative of all girls, but it didn't come from nowhere.

(also read the rest of this post above)

 

[VanWinkle]

I like how you denounce privilege exists and then go on to literally define privilege.

So privileges are being treated respectfully, the way everybody should be treated? To me, a privilege is playing games, while an intrinsic right is people respecting me for things about me that are out of my control.

 

[mkenyon]

I applaud the general goal, and there's a ton of good points in the article. You can have the finest dish in the world, but if you pile a load of stinking shit on top, then the meal is going to smell like shit.

A lot of that list is reaching pretty fucking heavily.

"I will never be asked to "prove my gaming cred" simply because of my gender."

Bullshit. I question the cred of a lot of people until they've told me they like Q3A, Dota, or Fighting Games. Everyone does this to everyone.

"I can publicly post my username, gamertag or contact information online without having to fear being stalked or sexually harassed because of my gender."

My friend Kudochop was heavily stalked and harassed. He's a streamer with only 100 or so viewers at a time.

"If I enthusiastically express my fondness for video games no one will automatically assume I’m faking my interest just to "get attention" from other gamers."

People actually do this all the time in normal conversation to try and relate.

"I can be sure that my gaming performance (good or bad) won’t be attributed to or reflect on my gender as a whole."

I don't even.

"My gaming ability, attitude, feelings or capability will never be called into question based on unrelated natural biological functions."

This is a repeat.

"I can be relatively sure my thoughts about video games won’t be dismissed or attacked based solely on my tone of voice, even if I speak in an aggressive, obnoxious, crude or flippant manner."

Maybe it's poorly written, but I'll generally dismiss people's thoughts based on their form.

"The vast majority of game studios, past and present, have been led and populated primarily by people of my own gender and as such most of their products have been specifically designed to cater to my demographic."

That's just the truth behind a lot of consumer hobbies, and a tough egg to crack. Placing it on videogames is silly when it's so broad.

"If I am trash-talked or verbally berated while playing online, it will not be because I am male nor will my gender be invoked as an insult."

People will use any perceived weakness, this isn't gender-specific.

"While playing online with people I don’t know I won’t be interrogated about the size and shape of my real-life body parts, nor will I be pressured to share intimate details about my sex life for the pleasure of other players."

This happens with guys too.

 

[PlumCantaloupe]

I think many of these things extend way beyond just gaming and the way people behave within the gaming world, is simply a visible indicator of our gender biased society

I completely agree. Even Hollywood fails many of these often (Google the Bechdel test). That being said "gaming" has an opportunity to change things for the better before other types if older media catch up. Often video games are used as an escape so it would be nice to make that escape also relaxing for those that identify as female.

 

[Squozen]

I think point 3, 6 and 7 are kind of a stretch

Go talk to some women and get back to us.

 

[vcc]

It doesn't matter how different of a situation of a life the average man or woman has to go through though. Men don't have a privilege in that they are immune to these problems women face, and if anything, they face social pressure in other ways in gaming and in life. I feel like I've been repeating myself this whole thread, so just look at my previous posts, and you'll get the gist of where I'm coming from.

I believe you are wrong in thinking it's an even trade off. For race and gender there is a lot of BS which is downright unfair and can't be brushed off with the thought it's a trade off. Being a guy makes a while lot of things easier than a girl in the same situation. Just as being white in the USA and Canada means that you get 100% of your efforts back career and dating wise and your starting point is probably higher. While being Asian means you start a bit lower and get 75% back on your efforts and being black or native is abysmally worse in both return on investment and starting position.

There are statistics, they are legion. It's not deniable. the question is how do you fix that and stuff liek Affirmative Action is a shitty solution.

 

[hellmonkey]

Serious question; Is this an issue outside of the US and maybe the UK. I really have no idea how to fix this problem. Im not sure if its sexism or just the general disrespect the "typical" gamer demographic has towards everyone. The things I hear from our school officer ( I work with local PD) literally shock me. The district administrator has a very lax "Kids will be kids" attitude, so of course the kids act like entitled self absorbed assholes. He said kids will actually say FU to school officials and literally face no punishment or discipline at all. If I did that, I cant even imagine the hell my parents would unleash on me.

I have no idea if this is terrible parenting, societal influence, social media, or a mix of everything, but things are bad and only getting worse. I mean wtf. Where the hell are these parents when their kids are spouting off all this crap on XBL? If my daughters talked like that (console. phone, PC, w/e), I would give them a hammer and force them to smash the damn thing.

 

[Orayn]

Edit: And it gets into the weird zone with things like that bingo chart above, where "Mentally Healthy" is described as a privilege. I don't even know how to respond to that sort of claim. It's just so bizarre.

Returning to the lack-of-bad-things definition, the mentally ill have to deal with a ton of shit. There's a social stigma. It can make it hard to hold down a job. On a statistical level, it makes you more likely to be homeless. All of those are pretty terrible, nasty things that someone with a clean bill of mental health doesn't really think about. They affect a fairly large group of people, but many are lucky enough not to have to worry about them.

 

[Brakke]

You are a white cis-male. Your opinion is invalid.

That interviewer's a patronizing prick.

 

[MR BLACKMAGIK]

I think many of these things extend way beyond just gaming and the way people behave within the gaming world, is simply a visible indicator of our gender biased society

This. A lot of these issue simply stem from a general immature community of guys who encounter a few women now and then.

One thing I don't like in these discussions is when people claim that half of the gaming population is female. While this may be true if you include Facebook games, mobile games, etc. no one is arguing about sexism and discrimination when it comes to those types of games. Usually because they aren't sexist. Games like Farmville and Candy Crush are gender neutral, the debate only lies with console/PC gaming and there I do not believe the gender split is 50/50.

 

[boredandlazy]

For what it's worth (And i know it's anecdotal), some of the women I've encountered online are just as bad as any of the males I've encountered. One woman in particular I encountered in Uncharted 2 online just started calling everyone 'f**king n***ers' after she heard what sounded like some middle-eastern guys talking. After my friend and I called her out for it she sent me a few offensive messages so I just blocked her.
Still, I do understand that as a male I can go online in general without the concern of being harassed etc. But I hardly feel it's something to feel privileged about, it's just how things should be for everyone.

 

[Moneal]

I disagree with many of these points. Point 3 is especially important, while most of the rest are overblown or irrelevant.

For example, if a woman buying Call of Duty will be asked if its her boyfriends, it is because women do not typically play violent videogames. Before the 2000's it was rare for women to play any kind of videogames. In fact, by a large margin women discriminate against men who play games. The response to a woman that plays games is a social positive. There are biological differences between men and women that generally effect our choices and interests. While there were always games that marketed to a wide audience, we have to thank Facebook and Apple and Nintendo for expanding the market.

If my opinion was controversial, or I stated inaccurate facts, I didn't mean to.

the bolded is totally true. and its not even just women that discriminate males who play games. My wife and I were in therapy, and when my wife mentioned i played games alot. the therapist said, "Is he a pot head." being a male who games is seen by many in society as lazy. women that play games are usually considered as a positive, especially by male gamers. The treatment of women in gaming situations that involve trash talk, game forums and online games, is usually about the same as men receive. its seems worse because the fact that its a woman is more the focus.

 

[213372bu]

Huh? But I believe it's very true. Men don't have to deal with a lot of shit women have to. Same with discrepancies of race. There is definitely an immunity to certain scenarios and situations.

But they do face it and in other ways that, on the flipside, women don't have to deal with. There are countless flaws in that much of what is said can apply and does apply to men. Whether or not you feel women have the same issues, men face these very same situations, and, as I said for the nth time, not abstained from such discrepancies. Men commit suicide constantly due to social pressures, once again, they are not magically abstained from having such pressures and exposure to such toxic things because they are men, in fact that assumption is not only hypocritical, but it is one of the very reasons why men suffer from suicide or mental illnesses.

You don't need to be completely immune to something to be dramatically less effected by it.

Some white people experience racism, but it's not something that's widespread and reinforced on a societal level in most places. The fact that you experience a non-zero amount of something doesn't mean everyone is on completely equal footing; the frequency and severity of incidents have to be taken into account as well.

Implying that males, I didn't mention white as I'm not white, don't suffer from such depression on a frequent level enough that it is comparable to women? Please research what you write before making such a bold claim on the topic.

 

[KJRS_1993]

So privileges are being treated respectfully, the way everybody should be treated? To me, a privilege is playing games, while an intrinsic right is people respecting me for things about me that are out of my control.

I applaud this point being made and second it.

 

[stonesak]

So what privileges am I supposed to be most concerned about?

1. Male privilege
2. White privilege
3. Sexuality privilege
4. Socio-economic privilege

I guess, my point instead of making list wars of the privileges a subset of gamers enjoy, maybe we should promote a "treat everyone with respect" attitude. That would be far more productive and wouldn't put so many people on the defensive.

 

[Orayn]

Implying that males, I didn't mention white as I'm not white, don't suffer from such depression on a frequent level enough that it is comparable to women? Please research what you write before making such a bold claim on the topic.

First off, I was just giving an example. I was technically agreeing with you about some things, but trying to emphasize that it's not an all-or-nothing deal.

And again, I'm not sure what your point is here with the rest of this post. I didn't say that privilege was a binary switch that meant your life was perfect and you never had to worry about anything.

 

[blitzcloud]

I believe you are wrong in thinking it's an even trade off. For race and gender there is a lot of BS which is downright unfair and can't be brushed off with the thought it's a trade off. Being a guy makes a while lot of things easier than a girl in the same situation. Just as being white in the USA and Canada means that you get 100% of your efforts back career and dating wise and your starting point is probably higher. While being Asian means you start a bit lower and get 75% back on your efforts and being black or native is abysmally worse in both return on investment and starting position.

There are statistics, they are legion. It's not deniable. the question is how do you fix that and stuff liek Affirmative Action is a shitty solution.

While I agree with your points because equality does not exist in reality... just like everything you're consuming that is "too good to be cheap" probably means the exploitation of some third world country person... Things are unfair, and we can't turn a blind eye (unless for the interest of having cheap clothing, electronic devices, etc).

Before anyone thinks otherwise. I got phone calls for being a gameserver admin, threatening me. I'm a male. Disgruntled people are the reason. Gender, sexuality, race... all those are the weapons they use to try and hurt us. You let it go skin deep and they simply win. More than once i've seen people defending a girl from a disgruntled "sexist".

And that's why, even if I like how broad the online world is, i'll try to gather a group and tag along so I can avoid the chaff around the net.

 

[vcc]

I have no idea if this is terrible parenting, societal influence, social media, or a mix of everything, but things are bad and only getting worse. I mean wtf. Where the hell are these parents when their kids are spouting off all this crap on XBL? If my daughters talked like that (console. phone, PC, w/e), I would give them a hammer and force them to smash the damn thing.

I don't think things are getting that much worse. The older you get the more you notice it but things are getting better.

We have the lowest crime rate in generations.

Being gay is much less life threatening due to insecure assholes wanting to beat you.

Being ethnic is less problematic to your career prospects.

Being a girls is significantly less stifling to all aspects of your life than before.

Our kids can act shitty to each other but it's not getting that much worse, I think we're just more aware of it

 

[DocSeuss]

I believe you are wrong in thinking it's an even trade off. For race and gender there is a lot of BS which is downright unfair and can't be brushed off with the thought it's a trade off. Being a guy makes a while lot of things easier than a girl in the same situation. Just as being white in the USA and Canada means that you get 100% of your efforts back career and dating wise and your starting point is probably higher. While being Asian means you start a bit lower and get 75% back on your efforts and being black or native is abysmally worse in both return on investment and starting position.

There are statistics, they are legion. It's not deniable. the question is how do you fix that and stuff liek Affirmative Action is a shitty solution.

You... really want to bring statistics into it? Look, I don't really want to do this, but if you're going to say "well, yeah, society as a whole is biased towards white dudes..." then say statistics back you up, well, I do feel compelled to link you to this, a compilation of governmental statistics I found a few years ago. Personally, I think it shows a great deal of situations where life is definitely worse for men.

These statistics paint a pretty bad portrait for living in America as a male. Men fare worse in healthcare, education, and courts. But I'm a poor person. Well below the poverty line. My view of life may not match up with the view of someone who lives a life of financial privilege. I'm also disabled, so I know firsthand how the medical profession deprioritizes men, and how society seems less comfortable with disabled men on the whole.

My experience directly contradicts your statements, so... there you go. Have some statistics.

Personally, I think we all have our disadvantages, and the idea of privilege is just people looking at things they don't have and talking about it. Everyone, in some way, is disadvantaged. Too many of us make the mistake of thinking that we have problems, so other people must not.

We all have problems. Keep that in mind. Our goal should be to help everyone overcome their problems, not try to pretend one group has it worse. Everyone's got it bad, 'cept rich people.

 

[MogCakes]

That list isn't a list of privileges, those should be -rights-. In the same vein that the civil rights movement did not call itself the civil privileges movement, I don't think the use of 'privilege' in this context applies very well. Everyone has the right not to be judged or have assumptions made about them based on their gender/sex. That isn't a privilege.

 

[Chettlar]

While playing online with people I don’t know I won’t be interrogated about the size and shape of my real-life body parts, nor will I be pressured to share intimate details about my sex life for the pleasure of other players.

This really, REALLY ought to have been left out of the list, because it is completely false.

You have boobs. I have a penis. I will be asked similar things about my penis, since I don't have boobs. You will be asked similar things about your boobs, since you don't have a penis.

Pressured to share intimate details about my sex life for the pleasure of other players? This is a bit more valid, but it happens to guys too. Very harrassingly, too. It's different (duh), but it happens just as often.

 

[vcc]

Men commit suicide constantly due to social pressures, once again, they are not magically abstained from having such pressures and exposure to such toxic things because they are men, in fact that assumption is not only hypocritical, but it is one of the very reasons why men suffer from suicide or mental illnesses.

If you look at the statistic, men and women attempt suicide in equal numbers but Men are better at it.

 

[Fbh]

Most of those seem to have more in common with sexism in general than gaming.

You can replace most of those examples with another activity commonly linked to males (like, say, american football or construction work) and get the same results.

Same if you change it from a male perspective with stuff linked to a female demographic.

 

[213372bu]

First off, I was just giving an example. I was technically agreeing with you about some things, but trying to emphasize that it's not an all-or-nothing deal.

And again, I'm not sure what your point is here with the rest of this post. I didn't say that privilege was a binary switch that meant your life was perfect and you never had to worry about anything.

Sure, but it isn't that just because you're a male in of itself that you are going to be facing less hardships than that of a woman. Circumstances happen, and you could be at a point where in some entire cities/states/countries that women are put in more or less in a position than that of the average man.

Being a guy makes a while lot of things easier than a girl in the same situation. Just as being white in the USA and Canada means that you get 100% of your efforts back career and dating wise and your starting point is probably higher. While being Asian means you start a bit lower and get 75% back on your efforts and being black or native is abysmally worse in both return on investment and starting position.

There are statistics, they are legion. It's not deniable. the question is how do you fix that and stuff liek Affirmative Action is a shitty solution.

How is it that you're arguing that a small section of women shouldn't be projected as a whole group again? You're doing the same exact thing you're going against, except by using racial and national standards instead of that of sex. If I was a white male I would worry about bettering myself, getting a job, and getting a date just as much. Being white doesn't inherently make you more likely to be rich and have an easy life, there many white people I know are/were poor and live(d) in the projects with, surprise, other races and cultures. Not only that, but they had to live a life that is extremely hard and rigorous on the mind, as anyone living in the projects. In my case, being "white" would be a disadvantage, no? Such projections in general are disgusting.

If you look at the statistic, men and women attempt suicide in equal numbers but Men are better at it.

That's not the point, it goes to show that male suicide does have an equal trade-off of that of women and that such pressures are a major factor that affect quite a large number of men, not just a minority. to say that males have less of a disadvantage in life situations because they are males is just false.

 

[Preemo]

who is the female equivalent to LevelCap/PewDiePie/RadBrad?

 

[ArkkAngel007]

While I can support what the writer is trying to accomplish, I don't see the need to call out one specific gender, race, culture, etc. Most of these things are part of issues that have nothing to do with video games, and quite a bit are things that not exclusive 'privileges' to men.

I don't know, just having worked and lived in several different areas of varying race/economic demographics I dislike seeing people pointing out specific groups instead of focusing on the actual issues.

It's going to take a while to clear this up. Having that barrier between one person and another with grey to nonexistent perceptions of consequence coupled with the fact that likely white, 'middle-class' males and males from collective societies are the majority in the gaming community is going to turn about that image.

One thing the journalists can do is call out this behavior, same with forums. The tech is easily available now. Just start highlighting these people who say and do these things towards other people. And not just the presumed white male, but the kids that spout out whatever they hear on AMC/HBO and on the playground, women who tend to be genuinely nasty, and whomever i spreading that type of behavior.

 

[blitzcloud]

That list isn't a list of privileges, those should be -rights-. In the same vein that the civil rights movement did not call itself the civil privileges movement, I don't think the use of 'privilege' in this context applies very well. Everyone has the right not to be judged or have assumptions made about them based on their gender/sex. That isn't a privilege.

presumably, we males got this privilege.

Despite being called the "cigar" and "happy mood" synonym every here and there

who is the female equivalent to LevelCap/PewDiePie/RadBrad?

Idk, but boxxy won my heart with what I once thought was acting. Seeing the current boxxy makes me think she can't do it anymore. Such a spontaneous explosion of genius monologue.

 

[schaft0620]

Ya'll don't know what it's like being male middle class and white.

 

[Avari]

I feel so terrible for you. I really wish we lived in a world where the plight of white males was recognized more often.

Spreading awarness is one of the ways to combat these things. All articles aren't a call to arms, since not everyone is in a place where they can make a meaningful change within the gaming culture. This article in particular seems more like a social commentary on where we are right now. If you already treat women in gaming with the same respect you treat men then good job, this article isn't really directed at you.

Best stuff I've seen in the thread so far. Privilege is largely invisible to the person holding it. In this context It doesn't mean an easy or simple life. As a white male I've never had my opinion dismissed due to my color or gender. My color and gender tend to be treated as the default or "normal".

In my view pretty much the entire list is largely accurate. Getting generically trash talked while playing online is not the same as being trash talked solely because of your gender or some other characteristic. It's not always simply trash talk either. Look at Anita Sarkeesian as an example- the volume of death and rape threats she has received is stunning. The volume and explicit content of such threats is very different then say Jonathan McIntosh (the articles author) will receive.

With respect to point 7 - the con I'm going to this weekend has made a number of posts specifically addressing issues of sexual harassment and consent.

 

[akidnamededdy]

Still, I do understand that as a male I can go online in general without the concern of being harassed etc. But I hardly feel it's something to feel privileged about.

Yeah, I'm kinda feeling this. Especially now that party chat is the norm (on XBL at least--don't play online much on PSN or PC). Kinda seems like making mountains out of molehills.

Spoiler

Then again that's probably just my privilege talking o no

 

[mkenyon]

That list isn't a list of privileges, those should be -rights-. In the same vein that the civil rights movement did not call itself the civil privileges movement, I don't think the use of 'privilege' in this context applies very well. Everyone has the right not to be judged or have assumptions made about them based on their gender/sex. That isn't a privilege.

I don't think you know what that word means.

You want to make thought crimes or something?

 

[TharpDaddy]

It's really unfortunate that we even have to have a discussion about stuff like this. Treating others kindly and with respect should be a natural thing, we shouldn't have to have someone write an article about it. It can be amazing how little empathy and perspective people can have. Hopefully the raised awareness recently will help combat things like this. Even if it's still rampant, it won't be tolerated as much as it was when it was an issue that was the elephant in the room. Technologies like the Oculus Rift and Morpheus can also help with giving people perspective and having more empathy and respect for others. Stepping into the shoes of someone of the opposite gender or another race, even if only done with something like VR, might have a bit of an impact. Good article even if i think a few of the points are kinda eh.

 

[Conflict NZ]

I'm honestly curious where all of this is taking place. I play at least 10 hours of online gaming a week (Battlefield, NBA 2K14, Occasionally COD, Titanfall) and I don't hear anyone making racist or sexist remarks, even when there are women playing.

 

[Gregorn]

I've been playing video games my whole life and I don't think anyone online has ever known my gender. How and why are all these girls running into issues about being judged?

Yeah, don't try using voice chat with random strangers on a random server, you don't need to be a girl to know that's probably not going to be fun.

 

[mkenyon]

I'm honestly curious where all of this is taking place. I play at least 10 hours of online gaming a week (Battlefield, NBA 2K14, Occasionally COD, Titanfall) and I don't hear anyone making racist or sexist remarks, even when there are women playing.

I can certainly imagine it happening, but my group has a small number of females that play with us (people's significant others mostly), and I never hear any of it. Even in competitive games like Dota.

It's just my anecdote though. I don't mean to imply that it doesn't happen because I don't see it.

 

[Moneal]

Best stuff I've seen in the thread so far. Privilege is largely invisible to the person holding it. In this context It doesn't mean an easy or simple life. As a white male I've never had my opinion dismissed due to my color or gender. My color and gender tend to be treated as the default or "normal".

In my view pretty much the entire list is largely accurate. Getting generically trash talked while playing online is not the same as being trash talked solely because of your gender or some other characteristic. It's not always simply trash talk either. Look at Anita Sarkeesian as an example- the volume of death and rape threats she has received is stunning. The volume and explicit content of such threats is very different then say Jonathan McIntosh (the articles author) will receive.

With respect to point 7 - the con I'm going to this weekend has made a number of posts specifically addressing issues of sexual harassment and consent.

the bolded part isn't really true. its only true to things that are normally done by white males, or in groups with other white males. most white males that like rap, and mention their opinions on rap to blacks will have their opinions questioned based on their race. just ask eminem or other white rappers what they had to deal with. Same for mostly female professions. males have their opinion and in some cases their sexuality/masculinity questioned, for being a hairstylist, nurse, or even a stay at home dad.

 

[flatearthpandas]

I was unclear in my language. People are entitled to feel however they feel. When I said they "shouldn't" feel attacked I meant it like "they shouldn't feel that way because it isn't meant that way" but I was not clear and I apologize.

I understand that, and I don't mean to antagonize. But the way that words are meant vs. the way others take them is clearly an important element in these discussions. Is the distinction between the two of merit?

 

[Conflict NZ]

I can certainly imagine it happening, but my group has a small number of females that play with us (people's significant others mostly), and I never hear any of it. Even in competitive games like Dota.

It's just my anecdote though. I don't mean to imply that it doesn't happen because I don't see it.

Also not saying it doesn't happen, I'm wondering if it's related to a specific type of game or platform.

 

[Gaz_RB]

My dad once tried to describe privilege to me. He said that a whole number of bad things could be thrown at me by life and by society that could lower my quality of life. Then he told me that I would still have a higher quality of life than a black man or woman who had the exact bad things happen to him, and that the difference between the two of us is privilege. He said it's like the white male had a head start and now everyone is trying to catch up.

I think that it's a little more nuanced than that, but I've always used that idea to try to digest the idea of gender and racial inequality in modern times that is very hard to nail down. It's in our peripheral vision, and most the time when people try to look directly at it and point to it, it moves out of focus again. It's always there but it becomes harder to point to something and convince everyone that, hey, this is inequality and it needs to be considered. We don't have something like segregation or voting rights to work against anymore, but that doesn't mean the remnants of those institutions don't currently effect many in a negative way.

 

[thepotatoman]

It's just a damn empathy exercise. You don't need to take it as personal attack or accusation, or turn it into a "who has it worse" exercise, or act like it's telling you you're a horrible person and you need to repent by quitting your job and fighting for women's rights full time. It's certainly, 100% not calling you a bad person for being male.

All you have to do is feel a little bit of empathy for how others experience things differently than you. It's really not that hard.

 

[SJS]

Anyone interested in me going out with a bang? I have a very substantiative response typed up, but I don't know if it's worth the accusations I'll get.

Really, though... articles like this are sickening. I can't deny that there are certain privileges afforded to me, but the grass is always greener on the other side.

 

[MogCakes]

I don't think you know what that word means.

You want to make thought crimes or something?

I don't think you understand what I'm getting at. Being able to play a game without harassment shouldn't be a privilege, it's a right, and one everyone should have. Not sure where you're going with that thought crime remark.

 

[Giever]

I applaud the general goal, and there's a ton of good points in the article. You can have the finest dish in the world, but if you pile a load of stinking shit on top, then the meal is going to smell like shit.

A lot of that list is reaching pretty fucking heavily.

"I will never be asked to "prove my gaming cred" simply because of my gender."

Bullshit. I question the cred of a lot of people until they've told me they like Q3A, Dota, or Fighting Games. Everyone does this to everyone.

"I can publicly post my username, gamertag or contact information online without having to fear being stalked or sexually harassed because of my gender."

My friend Kudochop was heavily stalked and harassed. He's a streamer with only 100 or so viewers at a time.

For these ones, at least, you just seem to be ignoring the "because of my gender" bit.

"I can be sure that my gaming performance (good or bad) won’t be attributed to or reflect on my gender as a whole."

I don't even.

What do you not even? If a guy sucks at a game, the response is more likely "that dude sucks". If a girl sucks at a game, the response is more like "that's understandable, of course she sucks, she's a girl" etc. Furthermore, if a guy sucks, the guy just sucks, but if a girl sucks, it's more likely to be added to the internal anecdotal list of evidence that girls do in fact suck at video games.

I think that's the idea, anyway.

 

[Mxrz]

Bringing in terms like benefits and privileged immediately cast me as either bad or spoiled based on my gender, and apparently skin color. So he can fuck right off with that. Stuff like this doesn't help the issue at all, and is one of the contributing factors why its met with such hostility.

The internet is full of immature cocksores and ill-raised children. They will go in on anything--gender, race, accent, location,sexual orientation, religion, haircolor--anything they can find that will make them feel better. These are the problem. Limiting it to gender is shortsighted. If you really want to see change, and not just run race-baiting clickbait artcles. Start holding parents accountable for their children. Once we get the justice system doing that for, you know actual fucking crimes , then maybe it will trickle down to internet civility.

PSN/Live/LoL/CoD are bad. But the people making it bad give zero fucks what anyone thinks or writes, and in fact they would probably see it as empowering. But clickbait gonna clickbait.

 

[IchigoSharingan]

I'm honestly curious where all of this is taking place. I play at least 10 hours of online gaming a week (Battlefield, NBA 2K14, Occasionally COD, Titanfall) and I don't hear anyone making racist or sexist remarks, even when there are women playing.

Takes place wherever men and women play games online. It's real. I would like for women to be called out on it, not just men.

There was another thread on GAF about sexism in videogame industry, and last I checked, the industry catered to males because that's who ended up buying most stuff and treat it like a hobby. The idea that videogaming is a male biased sport because 'fuck women' and not 'guys even pay for shitty DLC/season passes' is utterly deplorable.

 

[Gregorn]

Anyone interested in me going out with a bang? I have a very substantiative response typed up, but I don't know if it's worth the accusations I'll get.

Post it!

oh...

 

[way more]

It's just a damn empathy exercise. You don't need to take it as personal attack or accusation, or turn it into a "who has it worse" exercise, or act like it's telling you you're a horrible person and you need to repent by quitting your job and fighting for women's rights full time. It's certainly, 100% not calling you a bad person for being male.

All you have to do is feel a little bit of empathy for how others experience things differently than you. It's really not that hard.

But nobody feels empathy for me so why should I do it first?

 

[besada]

Anyone interested in me going out with a bang?.

How about a whimper instead?

 

[kittens]

So what privileges am I supposed to be most concerned about?

1. Male privilege
2. White privilege
3. Sexuality privilege
4. Socio-economic privilege

I guess, my point instead of making list wars of the privileges a subset of gamers enjoy, maybe we should promote a "treat everyone with respect" attitude. That would be far more productive and wouldn't put so many people on the defensive.

Working to understand privilege and oppression is pretty much necessary to treating people with respect. You don't need to know the jargon (privilege, oppression, cisgender, ableism, etc.), though knowing it doesn't hurt. You just need to have basic empathy. Empathy is understanding what other people go through. It's understanding, for example, that people of color face racism, and that white people perpetuate and gain from it. With that understanding, you can then think more deeply about your interactions, and be better equipped to treat people respectfully.

understanding privilege / power --> empathy --> "treating everyone with respect"

With that in mind, go back and read each of the 25 examples listed in McIntosh's article. Think about being cognizant of sexism in gaming spaces / communities can help you treat all the many different, diverse everyones with respect.