Does finding the act of gay sex repulsive, make you prejudiced?

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I thought that the blatant homophobia and waving around Latin terms to "win" like a kid who thinks that Harry Potter is real were embarrassing enough, but the part where he thought that biology is teleological is pretty revealing.


ps: tweren't me what pulled the trigger if you're wondering
 

nomis

Member
but the part where he thought that biology is teleological is pretty revealing.

Ohhh man. The constant referring to being "off the [user's] manual" was NOT subtle.

Yup, I bet their designer would be livid at how some people are inclined to use the toys he gave them.
 
I don't think I find it "Repulsive" I don't know, that just sounds strong. I certainly don't want to sit there and watch sex between two men, but I also don't want to watch 99% of straight couples go at it either.
 
I don't think I find it "Repulsive" I don't know, that just sounds strong. I certainly don't want to sit there and watch sex between two men, but I also don't want to watch 99% of straight couples go at it either.
This was my first thought. Don't like it, but don't have a strong opinion on it. I don't see anything inherently bigoted about that either, and I think it's reaching to accuse such. On that line of thought, aren't you a bigot if you're repulsed by the idea of a foot fetish, or whatever?

There's nothing wrong with having your own opinion and liking or disliking something as long as you aren't an ass about it (which is usually not the case, I'd imagine).

Oh well.
 
Hate to be a stickler, but phrases like "gay sex" are pretty stupid.

You can of course have a dislike for things without being inherently prejudiced and disliking it for what it represents on a symbolic level.

You could seriously just aesthetically dislike the way the act looks.
 

Koomaster

Member
Was catching up on this thread this morning and getting more angry and frustrated as I went along. Then Necromanti's post happened and I am calm and suddenly feel better about the day ahead.
 

Kunan

Member
Some of you guys really have your own heads up your asses when it comes to repulsion. You really think that every straight male that is grossed out by two men kissing/banging is caused purely by society? What's worse is some of you think gay people are incapable of the same reaction.

Plenty of gay men find the idea of having sex with a woman (even watching a woman have sex) repulsive. Being gay does not exempt you from natural reactions based on sexual attractions.
I have no interest in women but I don't go ew or be sickened when I see straight porn or a dude and a woman kiss or two women kiss. In fact other than for jokes I've never had a gay friend be all grossed out by straight sex on anywhere near the same level. They just don't like vagina, which is a big difference compared to reactions like skin crawling from kissing. That's something to wonder about isn't it?

I'm not saying people are hateful just that, despite our level of tolerance today, people are potentially grossed out by this because they spend their entire childhood having people say its icky and compare it to icky things. The reaction to gay sex is generally pretty childlike and reminds me of showing a friend a giant beetle as a kid. The reaction to kissing is interesting because that's the least potentially offensive thing (other than hugging) two dudes can do, and the only thing they will do in public, yet it's still thought of as disgusting by people who claim tolerance. It's a potential topic for conditioning as a kid.

EDIT: damn just caught up with those necromanti posts
 
Not saying you're wrong but man, it's getting impossible to discuss anything if every word is potentially offensive.

I did not mean that I find it stupid and offensive, but logically stupid.

"Gay sex" connotates a whole bunch of things, overly unspecific.

Are we talking anal, female female, male male? ETc...

Obviously though, the term does have some stigma in and of itself.
 
Jesus, I do something silly like sleep and miss out on all the nonsense. Just as well, I have no patience for intellectual dishonesty, concern trolling and derailment tactics ("well I totally agree with you but you're being mean so I'm not so sure!"), or bullshit pseudointellectual philosophical wankery. Just eugh. A whole lot of words to say nothing and to talk around issues in theoretical terms; he certainly lived up to being full of wind at least.

Thanks to whatever mod kept this thread from going off the
user manual
rails, as was surely the intent.

[...]
EDIT: Y'ALL BANNED HIM!?
Just throwing out that this post is wonderful, and I have bookmarked it should
Aristotelean
"natural" arguments come up in another thread.
 

kinggroin

Banned
What the fuck happened to my thread?


Robotic logic vs Human feels



Why was the guy banned? I was really enjoiyng the back and forth between him and Necromanti (thanks for taking the time to reply ernestly). Learned a lot too.
 

Anoregon

The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
Aristotelean is officially the worst word of all time
 
I did not mean that I find it stupid and offensive, but logically stupid.

"Gay sex" connotates a whole bunch of things, overly unspecific.

Are we talking anal, female female, male male? ETc...

Obviously though, the term does have some stigma in and of itself.
I think people answering the question are specifically thinking of male/male anal sex.

And yes I agree that isn't what "gay sex" is, but there you go.
 

Raging Spaniard

If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player
Still, there is some level of immaturity to the disgust and a built-in negative response that seems to be supported by a thinly veiled reason of "because I'm not attracted to it."

The opposite of attraction doesn't have to be complete and utter disgust.

For example, I may freak out a bit if I see a sudden thumbnail of a vagina or what have you. However, I think to myself, "Well, that's something that I don't want to see." Then I move on.

I don't respond with a negative feeling of disgust or think, "Gross!"

Initially, I was a little grossed out by that as a teen accidentally viewing straight stuff, but I moved on quickly. My prejudice, to use the OP's word, didn't last very long.

Today, I don't fight straight or lesbian or some other kind of alternate sex repulsive. It's just not for me.

Vaginas exist; men suck dick, too. Why is anyone freaking out about it?

Everyone just needs to try to relax.

I guess that's my point. :p

There must be some extra significance to the term "grossed out" that Im not aware of, because in my mind you just repeated my point.

Like, all dudes, go ahead and make out all day in front of me, I dont care, its fine. In my head I just go "eh" and thats about it.
 

The Adder

Banned
I just genuinely don't understand this reaction though. I'm not attracted to women, but I don't react to the thought of lesbian sex as not wanting to see it ever. I have no interest in seeing it, but I won't avoid it either when it comes up in shows/movies or whatever.

Meh. Different people are different.

For one thing, on a TV show or movie (unless it's porn) you don't actually see two people having sex. I am very specifically talking about actual coitus.

Do you not have that reaction to old people sex, btw? I used that as an example because it seems pretty universal for people below a certain age.
 

Monocle

Member
I find anal sex in general pretty disgusting. There is something about putting my penis in a hole full of shit that doesn't exactly appeal to me.
What the fuck? Nobody does that. (OK, apart from people on the extreme fringes. The point is that the vast majority of people, gay and straight alike, want nothing to do with poop. It's generally an instant turnoff.)

This is like saying "I find vaginal sex in general pretty disgusting. There's something about putting my penis in a putrid cheesy slimehole that doesn't exactly appeal to me."

Hygiene. Preparation. These things are kind of important unless you have a fetish for filth.
 
I don't think it does. I've no problem with gay people, and I'm all for them doing whatever they want just like everyone else. With that said, I'd be lying if I said seeing two men kiss or engage in homosexual activities doesn't make me uncomfortable. Don't know I'd say I'm repulsed but I do think "gross" when I see it. I still don't think that makes me a terrible person though since I wouldn't hate them or lobby for them to have less rights.

I do have to say though, I'm not as grossed out as I was in the past, so I feel as I get older I'll eventually be able to get over those preconceived notions. It's just all my life I've been taught that it's wrong and unnantrual so it takes a while. No offense to anyone though
 
I don't think it does. I've no problem with gay people, and I'm all for them doing whatever they want just like everyone else. With that said, I'd be lying if I said seeing two men kiss or engage in homosexual activities doesn't make me uncomfortable. Don't know I'd say I'm repulsed but I do think "gross" when I see it. I still don't think that makes me a terrible person though since I wouldn't hate them or lobby for them to have less rights.

I do have to say though, I'm not as grossed out as I was in the past, so I feel as I get older I'll eventually be able to get over those preconceived notions.

It doesn't make you a terrible person, but you do have some growing up to do.
 
Attributing goal-directed behavior is something we tend to avoid doing in biology, though, as we cannot ever empirically deduce what the purpose of a molecule existing or performing a function may be (and indeed, the premise itself assumes that such a purpose exists, which is more in the realm of philosophy or religion rather than science). So from a scientific perspective, at least, we would be asking what role the heart has in a process, or what would functions would change if we changed some aspect of the physiology or chemistry involving the heart, rather than asking what it is for.

Ends are not frustrated, because following the reasoning above, there is no one single end. Diversity is at the heart of biology, for without it, extinction would surely follow. Adaptability helps assimilate and respond to stimuli in the environment, and allow a reaction accordingly. An action performed by a human that has no deleterious effects on the survival and propagation of the species in the long run would not be a target to be selected against (and phased out) by evolution.

Humans in particular are good at adapting to (or changing) their environments and behaviors in response, including the use of tools that we didn't expressly evolve organs to utilize, but it represents the diversity of behavior possible by us that, if not deleterious, would not necessarily be selected against by evolution. But being able to respond to the unseen is part of what makes us successful. A tool like a computer, for example, has multiple potential uses and functions, but to define a strict sense of what its functions should be rather than what they have shown to be capable of (and that has shown to have benefits in some regard) would require an external source of morality applied to it, rather than an intrinsic one.

These "side effects" as you may call them are just part of what makes evolution so fascinating, but it is easy to fall prey to fallacies of forcing biological facts through, as you said yourself, interpretations that may distort facts to serve a philosophy. The penis isn't simply a reproductive organ, but is also, as you know, a path for the body to excrete waste. I see the diversity of function as the ability to respond to a multitude of needs in different environments in the same way that our hunter-gatherer forbears were able to switch between plant and meat-based diets depending on availability.

There are multiple, valid approaches and uses of a single "tool", and culture alone shows that human behavior is full of diversity, encompassing the different ways we eat, grieve, or even perceive and define color in our environment. Masturbation, oral sex, anal sex, vaginal sex, and intercrural sex are all representative of the diversity of behavioral expression possible involving our sex organs, used to relieve stress, used socially, or to procreate, and so on. From a biological perspective, humans fully support the ability to be bisexual without deviating from a set function, as one doesn't exist. Those that make the claim that one does would have a heck of a time trying to support that argument without referring to an external source of morality, and also make the case as to why it should be considered over others. It isn't always as simple as the chicken preceding the egg.

EDIT: Y'ALL BANNED HIM!?
This was brilliant my god.
 
It doesn't make you a terrible person, but you do have some growing up to do.

Yup, it's just when I've been raised all my life being told that stuff like that is wrong, and unnatural, it's kind of hard to get over it.

Still, like I said, as I've gotten older I don't get as grossed out. I think it'll eventually get to a point where I'm able to be unfazed by it. But like I said, I harbor zero ill will, never have. I support equal rights for everyone. It doesn't harm me in any way outside of that little thought popping into my head which is inconsequential
 
Yup, it's just when I've been raised all my life being told that stuff like that is wrong, and unnatural, it's kind of hard to get over it.

Still, like I said, as I've gotten older I don't get as grossed out. I think it'll eventually get to a point where I'm able to be unfazed by it. But like I said, I harbor zero ill will, never have. I support equal rights for everyone. It doesn't harm me in any way outside of that little thought popping into my head which is inconsequential

Yeah it sucks that society is that way, but I think it's good that you realise it. Sounds like you'll get used to it eventually.
 
Do you not have that reaction to old people sex, btw? I used that as an example because it seems pretty universal for people below a certain age.
I've been having trouble putting my thoughts to words on this. Yes, I have that reaction to the thought of geriatric tantrics. But I'm not sure that's a good explanation when it seems to be a very universal reaction due to a lack of normalization -- it likely won't seem strange at that age -- and when, as I noted previously, I don't react like you stated at the thought of lesbian sex, which is the exact equivalent in this case.

With that said, I'd be lying if I said seeing two men kiss or engage in homosexual activities doesn't make me uncomfortable. Don't know I'd say I'm repulsed but I do think "gross" when I see it.
Well that's a bummer.
 

Lum1n3s

Member
Finding a kind of sex unappealing is fine -- it means that you are not, in fact, gay.

Attempting to legislate, hate, or otherwise ruin other people's lives over it is not fine.
This guy gets it (or gal,) whichever one it is lol.
 
:<

I'm still kind of sad whenever I hear things like "I'm not against gay stuff, but if two men are kissing, I do find it gross." Cuz it perpetuates the discomfort for samesex couple to feel at ease displaying affectionate gestures in public, out of fear that we may gross someone out. Not as much due to their 'comfort zone' but mostly because it feels so heartbreaking to know that others find you distasteful. It does hurtful things to your sense of self esteem as a valid member of society, I mean.
 
I absolutely don't find it repulsive but it's still a weird question for me to answer. As an black guy, I'd most certainly be insulted by people who might say that the idea of me with a white girl/boy is disgusting.
 
:<

I'm still kind of sad whenever I hear things like "I'm not against gay stuff, but if two men are kissing, I do find it gross." Cuz it perpetuates the discomfort for samesex couple to feel at ease displaying affectionate gestures in public, out of fear that we may gross someone out. Not as much due to their 'comfort zone' but mostly because it feels so heartbreaking to know that others find you distasteful. It does hurtful things to your sense of self esteem as a valid member of society, I mean.

Exactly, but people just don't care.
 
:<

I'm still kind of sad whenever I hear things like "I'm not against gay stuff, but if two men are kissing, I do find it gross." Cuz it perpetuates the discomfort for samesex couple to feel at ease displaying affectionate gestures in public, out of fear that we may gross someone out. Not as much due to their 'comfort zone' but mostly because it feels so heartbreaking to know that others find you distasteful. It does hurtful things to your sense of self esteem as a valid member of society, I mean.

I'm one of those people but though it does gross me out (though as someone else said perhaps gross is too strong a word, since it's not like it makes me want to puke or anything near that) , I actually think seeing it more and more will make it less uncomfortable. But just to be clear though the act itself may make me unconfortable, I don't think of the people engaging in it as gross or bad.

In my opinion as it becomes more common, people will start to feel normal about it. There's nothing wrong with it. But yea, gross is too strong a word to use I think.
 

Kangi

Member
:<

I'm still kind of sad whenever I hear things like "I'm not against gay stuff, but if two men are kissing, I do find it gross." Cuz it perpetuates the discomfort for samesex couple to feel at ease displaying affectionate gestures in public, out of fear that we may gross someone out. Not as much due to their 'comfort zone' but mostly because it feels so heartbreaking to know that others find you distasteful. It does hurtful things to your sense of self esteem as a valid member of society, I mean.

As I said earlier, it's insulting when you feel unable to kiss your partner in public without practically hearing a bunch of straight guys' sphincters clench. It's dehumanizing enough to have the fear of not being able to be open about having a relationship without spurring on a bigot or being the victim of a violent attack, but to get reactions like this from people who you're supposed to feel safe around is a kick while you're down.

To be having this "skin-crawling" reaction to gay guys kissing isn't the acceptance you think you're capable of just because you support gay rights. It continues to perpetuate the idea that being gay is something so shameful to the point that you have to hide your own relationships. How would you feel, kissing a girl and seeing everyone around you shield their eyes or cringe? This "I support you but I think you're nasty" isn't acceptance, it's tolerance. And I never asked for your bloody tolerance.
 

Monocle

Member
Attributing goal-directed behavior is something we tend to avoid doing in biology, though, as we cannot ever empirically deduce what the purpose of a molecule existing or performing a function may be (and indeed, the premise itself assumes that such a purpose exists, which is more in the realm of philosophy or religion rather than science). So from a scientific perspective, at least, we would be asking what role the heart has in a process, or what would functions would change if we changed some aspect of the physiology or chemistry involving the heart, rather than asking what it is for.

Ends are not frustrated, because following the reasoning above, there is no one single end. Diversity is at the heart of biology, for without it, extinction would surely follow. Adaptability helps assimilate and respond to stimuli in the environment, and allow a reaction accordingly. An action performed by a human that has no deleterious effects on the survival and propagation of the species in the long run would not be a target to be selected against (and phased out) by evolution.

Humans in particular are good at adapting to (or changing) their environments and behaviors in response, including the use of tools that we didn't expressly evolve organs to utilize, but it represents the diversity of behavior possible by us that, if not deleterious, would not necessarily be selected against by evolution. But being able to respond to the unseen is part of what makes us successful. A tool like a computer, for example, has multiple potential uses and functions, but to define a strict sense of what its functions should be rather than what they have shown to be capable of (and that has shown to have benefits in some regard) would require an external source of morality applied to it, rather than an intrinsic one.

These "side effects" as you may call them are just part of what makes evolution so fascinating, but it is easy to fall prey to fallacies of forcing biological facts through, as you said yourself, interpretations that may distort facts to serve a philosophy. The penis isn't simply a reproductive organ, but is also, as you know, a path for the body to excrete waste. I see the diversity of function as the ability to respond to a multitude of needs in different environments in the same way that our hunter-gatherer forbears were able to switch between plant and meat-based diets depending on availability.

There are multiple, valid approaches and uses of a single "tool", and culture alone shows that human behavior is full of diversity, encompassing the different ways we eat, grieve, or even perceive and define color in our environment. Masturbation, oral sex, anal sex, vaginal sex, and intercrural sex are all representative of the diversity of behavioral expression possible involving our sex organs, used to relieve stress, used socially, or to procreate, and so on. From a biological perspective, humans fully support the ability to be bisexual without deviating from a set function, as one doesn't exist. Those that make the claim that one does would have a heck of a time trying to support that argument without referring to an external source of morality, and also make the case as to why it should be considered over others. It isn't always as simple as the chicken preceding the egg.

EDIT: Y'ALL BANNED HIM!?
Damn, I stopped reading this thread at page 9 and didn't see this post until someone mentioned it in another thread. Quality explanation. Well done.

As I said earlier, it's insulting when you feel unable to kiss your partner in public without practically hearing a bunch of straight guys' sphincters clench. It's dehumanizing enough to have the fear of not being able to be open about having a relationship without spurring on a bigot or being the victim of a violent attack, but to get reactions like this from people who you're supposed to feel safe around is a kick while you're down.

To be having this "skin-crawling" reaction to gay guys kissing isn't the acceptance you think you're capable of just because you support gay rights. It continues to perpetuate the idea that being gay is something so shameful to the point that you have to hide your own relationships. How would you feel, kissing a girl and seeing everyone around you shield their eyes or cringe? This "I support you but I think you're nasty" isn't acceptance, it's tolerance. And I never asked for your bloody tolerance.
Wow, nailed it.
 
As I said earlier, it's insulting when you feel unable to kiss your partner in public without practically hearing a bunch of straight guys' sphincters clench. It's dehumanizing enough to have the fear of not being able to be open about having a relationship without spurring on a bigot or being the victim of a violent attack, but to get reactions like this from people who you're supposed to feel safe around is a kick while you're down.

To be having this "skin-crawling" reaction to gay guys kissing isn't the acceptance you think you're capable of just because you support gay rights. It continues to perpetuate the idea that being gay is something so shameful to the point that you have to hide your own relationships. How would you feel, kissing a girl and seeing everyone around you shield their eyes or cringe? This "I support you but I think you're nasty" isn't acceptance, it's tolerance. And I never asked for your bloody tolerance.

Well said! <3
 
I thought that the blatant homophobia and waving around Latin terms to "win" like a kid who thinks that Harry Potter is real were embarrassing enough, but the part where he thought that biology is teleological is pretty revealing.


ps: tweren't me what pulled the trigger if you're wondering

The best part is we see examples in nature of sex being used for purposes other than procreation. In primates. Bonobos especially. Humans have sex for reasons other than procreation all the time, suggesting it may very well be natural.
 
:<

I'm still kind of sad whenever I hear things like "I'm not against gay stuff, but if two men are kissing, I do find it gross." Cuz it perpetuates the discomfort for samesex couple to feel at ease displaying affectionate gestures in public, out of fear that we may gross someone out. Not as much due to their 'comfort zone' but mostly because it feels so heartbreaking to know that others find you distasteful. It does hurtful things to your sense of self esteem as a valid member of society, I mean.

As I said earlier, it's insulting when you feel unable to kiss your partner in public without practically hearing a bunch of straight guys' sphincters clench. It's dehumanizing enough to have the fear of not being able to be open about having a relationship without spurring on a bigot or being the victim of a violent attack, but to get reactions like this from people who you're supposed to feel safe around is a kick while you're down.

To be having this "skin-crawling" reaction to gay guys kissing isn't the acceptance you think you're capable of just because you support gay rights. It continues to perpetuate the idea that being gay is something so shameful to the point that you have to hide your own relationships. How would you feel, kissing a girl and seeing everyone around you shield their eyes or cringe? This "I support you but I think you're nasty" isn't acceptance, it's tolerance. And I never asked for your bloody tolerance.

Love these posts. So fucking true.

I've been given weird and sometimes even mean looks when I'm just holding a guy's HAND in public. Not even kissing or anything, just simply holding his hand. It's ridiculous because eventually, one of us starts feeling uncomfortable and we stop. I really hate that feeling...
 

davepoobond

you can't put a price on sparks
I don't think it's anyone's place to tell what you should and shouldn't be repulsed by. If you take that repulsion and try to act on it, that is entirely something different.
 
I don't think it's anyone's place to tell what you should and shouldn't be repulsed by. If you take that repulsion and try to act on it, that is entirely something different.

I dunno, I think people historically try to make moral judgements about things that repulse them. We do it for things like incest, beastiality, pedophilia. We aren't repulsed by them simply because they are immoral, but also deem them immoral because we find them repulsive. Humans are bad at separating the act from the actor.
 

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
All I can say is that I'm straight and I don't find it repulsive.
 

The Adder

Banned
I've been having trouble putting my thoughts to words on this. Yes, I have that reaction to the thought of geriatric tantrics. But I'm not sure that's a good explanation when it seems to be a very universal reaction due to a lack of normalization -- it likely won't seem strange at that age -- and when, as I noted previously, I don't react like you stated at the thought of lesbian sex, which is the exact equivalent in this case.

I propose, then, that it comes down to you not feeling the same way about the female form as I do the male form and we both do the elderly.

(Also, when you say "the thought of" do you mean the formation of the idea of it occurring with you in the vicinity, or do you mean picturing two men/women/elderly people going at it?)
 
Love these posts. So fucking true.

I've been given weird and sometimes even mean looks when I'm just holding a guy's HAND in public. Not even kissing or anything, just simply holding his hand. It's ridiculous because eventually, one of us starts feeling uncomfortable and we stop. I really hate that feeling...

It's fucking sad that two guys holding hands risk getting beaten up or even killed in this world.

Bah!
 

lemonade

Member
I have a friend that finds it gross that I love women; he's gay mind you. We've been friends for over ten years. Just treat each other respectfully and things should work.
 

Monocle

Member
I wonder how people who get squicked out by gay sex feel when they see animal sex on the Discovery Channel or whatever. Do they have the same kind of "Ugh, this is gross. No thank you." reaction, or are they just like "Meh, this does nothing for me." because it seems so different from human sex?

When the reaction is pure indifference, maybe that says something about the role of social conditioning in people's negative reactions to gay sex. If animal sex is seen as neutral thing but gay sex is gross, it seems to me that relatability might be a factor. That is, sex between humans is easier for a human to identify with, so when you see a type of sex you wouldn't want to experience yourself, you feel repelled. And one of the reasons you feel repelled could be that the people around around you talk trash about gay people and constantly hammer in the idea that men should be men, don't do girly shit, don't do gay shit.
 
I propose, then, that it comes down to you not feeling the same way about the female form as I do the male form and we both do the elderly.

(Also, when you say "the thought of" do you mean the formation of the idea of it occurring with you in the vicinity, or do you mean picturing two men/women/elderly people going at it?)
So that comes back to the question: what accounts for the difference in feeling? Not directed at you, but in general. I truly think a lot of it is in what we're exposed to, how, and in what volume.

As to your question: I mean picturing the act, or visualizing things I've seen in the past.
 
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