Atraveller
Banned
Most trading places have reputation systems, which makes avoiding scammers a lot easier.
Why haven't you bought a PC yet?
- Thread starter Gipsy Danger
- Start date
captainnapalm
Member
For me, literally the only advantage to console gaming are the exclusives, the games that don't come to PC.
To be fair, that's a compelling reason to at least have a console, but otherwise I'm super happy being a PC gamer. It's what I grew up with. Love my mouse and keyboard. Will always be the method that gives me the greatest feeling of control.
To be fair, that's a compelling reason to at least have a console, but otherwise I'm super happy being a PC gamer. It's what I grew up with. Love my mouse and keyboard. Will always be the method that gives me the greatest feeling of control.
Sentenza
Member
I'm not really sure what you are trying to argue there.
Beside, the difference between this and you attempting a private transaction online for a console game is that we aren't talking about limited, isolated deals that you need to track down... This is a persistent market where these games are consistently available in unlimited quantities.
Xion_Stellar
People should stop referencing data that makes me feel uncomfortable because games get ported to platforms I don't like
Not fond of gaming on PCs period and I'm currently saving to get myself a gaming laptop instead but the one's I want run from $1k-$1.5k so it's not happening any time soon.
I'm hoping GOG Galaxy really takes off because I'm not fond of DRM and therefore I'm not fond of Steam regardless of how non intrusive Steam DRM is because to me DRM is DRM.
I'm hoping GOG Galaxy really takes off because I'm not fond of DRM and therefore I'm not fond of Steam regardless of how non intrusive Steam DRM is because to me DRM is DRM.
Sentenza
Member
Why?
Serious question. Unless you have some strong reason to make a laptop extremely more advantageous for you, I would generally say it's a terrible idea.
Even given a 1500 bucks budget, in most scenarios I would rather advise to go with 1000$ desktop and buy an extremely cheap laptop for the rest.
is there a black console with a Skull on the casing in atx Formfactor that I can play Hearts of Iron on today?
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
The reality of the market is that major publishers will not release titles without DRM, and Steam is the least intrusive possible DRM possible, offset by major "value adds" to make Steam a desirable service rather than solely a punishment to legitimate customers.
EDIT:
P.S: FYI, consoles are DRM by their very nature, so I guess your gaming options are pretty heavily restricted.
Seems like a lot of people on GAF are trying to get into PC gaming by investing in a "gaming" laptop. You're doing it wrong guys.
Why do people think they need laptops these days? If you're a developer, sure get a MacBook Air, otherwise a phone or tablet will cover your mobility and a tower will allow you the power and flexibility you need to build a proper gaming rig.
Why do people think they need laptops these days? If you're a developer, sure get a MacBook Air, otherwise a phone or tablet will cover your mobility and a tower will allow you the power and flexibility you need to build a proper gaming rig.
Except when we but the game from a legitimate key seller, the developers ARE getting a cut and we get the game cheaper, your used game can be bought from person to person but the developers get nada, that's kind of shitty?
The pre-owned market gives nothing back to the roots where it came from, and if someone else wants the game on PC, I can't just give them a loan/sell, they have to buy the game and more money goes to where it should.
The Red Wizard
Member
What's your take on people from Europe who use the American PSN Store to buy games at nearly 50% off at launch?
Exactly what ive been thinking reading these posts about buying from Russians.
Also just because he/she is Russian doesnt make them untrustworthy. There are protocols in place to keep it safe.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Thats what you WANT us to think, Ivan
fluffydelusions
Member
A phone or tablet won't let me play Dota, Diablo 3, or whatever else I want on the go tho.
Well that basically counts all consoles in recent history out.. I think one of the few places you can play quite a few games DRM free is on a PC.
Why would a developer want a macbook? To pay more for a logo on the back of the SAME hardware?
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Well I guess if you're developing for IOS / OSX and need an AppleId and Xcode you might go that route.
Xion_Stellar
People should stop referencing data that makes me feel uncomfortable because games get ported to platforms I don't like
I'm know it's more expensive,less reliable, and less powerful than a PC but you have no idea how much value I put into portability with my current life style. Portability goes a long way with me and it's the reason why I'm enjoying my PS Vita more than my PS3 right now.
My personal idea of DRM is needing anything close to an Online check or having always Online connection weather it's from Steam or a 3rd Party Publisher.
If your referring to Console DRM as being force to play a specific title on a specific console than that's not DRM to me. Want to play a PC game? than I'm most likely need to use a PC. As far as I'm concerned on Consoles all I do is pop the disc in and play no internet connection required unless I choose to download the game patch or attempt to play some form of multiplayer mode but otherwise I don't get what you mean by your comment on consoles.
GOG Galaxy has a really hard uphill to fight but I still hope it eventually succeeds with it's grand ambition.
I'm not interested in getting into a Win vs Mac war. A lot of developers favor OSX for it's Unix core. Your mileage may vary.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Steam has a one off verification check, not a required persistent online connection.
The fact it brings so much to the table that people want to always leave it online is very different to a mandatory check.
Hardware dongle / disk check is a form of DRM / copy protection.
It was one that was less popular on PC than a one off CD Key verification check, because it turns your PC disk drive into a hardware dongle, despite there being no need for the program you are running to use the CD as all data was stored on your hard drive.
EDIT:
Also Steam in and of itself is not DRM, it is a storefront client.
There are games purchased through Steam that do not even require the client to load, let alone any check whatsoever.
He can travel or change living space quite frequently.
I know few people, who really want a desktop, but the way they work just doesnt allow them for that.
Sad reality really, going how overpriced laptops can be ;\
It's a desktop computer, not a coffin. You just pick it up and carry it where you need to go. Minimal upper body strength required.
ThePlayerofGames
Banned
And if you travel for work?
Are you supposed to take it as a carry on (impractical) or put it in a suitcase with a monitor and forego taking a change of clothes?
Yeah, good luck going with stuff for few months + PC and monitor via plane or bus.
Melchiah
Member
I had 9700 Pro powered PC in 2003-2006, and I was thinking about buying a new one in 2012. Eventhough the last time left a sour taste in my mouth, due to the 400 GPU getting dated in a couple of years, and everything above medium settings being unplayable from then on. Luckily the PS4 made the purchase unnecessary, as I can now play the games that used to be only on PC on top of the console exclusives, like Frictional's SOMA, The Vanishing of Ethan Carter, and many other indies that my 2008 laptop wouldn't have been able to run properly.
He said he changes living space frequently. If that's the case then you'll be moving furniture and everything else too so what's the difference. If you're always on planes and buses then I understand.
Sentenza
Member
Sure, traveling was a possibility. That's why I asked instead of saying just "you are doing it wrong" or something.
About what people want, I learned over the years that what people think they want and what they need arrn't necessarily two matching things. I've seen far too many going for a laptop because it sounded somewhat more glamour to them... Just to use it for years as a crippled and overpriced desktop.
ViolentP
Member
You build a desktop PC for performance, not to play on a plane or bus.
Xion_Stellar
People should stop referencing data that makes me feel uncomfortable because games get ported to platforms I don't like
I'm well aware of Steam offline mode thought when I tried it it was a shot in thr dark if it would work for me.I already stated my view on DRM and a physical medium doesn't count as DRM to me. Didn't know they added DRM free titles to the Steam store since I haven't touched Steam since very early 2009.
Maybe I will change my tune if I ever decided to try Steam again but for now I will keep my distance.
People do not move furniture when they are moving to other country to work for a few months.
What?
ViolentP
Member
Read your previous post.
ViolentP
Member
Then I misunderstood. I think that statement is a bit short on verbs.
There are many reasons why people need/prefer a laptop. I'm not a developer, but I still need a laptop for my job. I also travel a lot for my job, sometimes weeks at a time, and I need a fully-fledged OS for coding and data analysis. For these things, Linux is the best choice. I didn't get a gaming laptop though, because that was just not a priority and I wanted something small for portability (currently 12" screen).
That being said, I have played a number of games on my laptop with lowly integrated Intel HD 3000 graphics. Many of the games on GOG will run on any current laptop. I have a number of Infinity Engine RPGs on my laptop (now I just need the time to play them), they'll run on just about anything. Deus Ex and System Shock 2 run well. I even ran The Witcher under wine; on lowest settings with everything turned off I got about ~25fps with occasional drops to single digits. But it was enough to give me an idea of what the game is about and give me a reason to build a PC (that and improved Linux support by steam and gog, which I want to support).
PC gaming doesn't have to be all or nothing; if you have any recent laptop with whatever OS and a mouse, you can get a GOG/steam account and get your feet wet, either catching up on older games or playing indies with lower system requirements. If someone already has a console for all their AAA multiplat needs (or is just not interested in those), they don't need to jump in at the deep end right of the bat, even a very modest PC or laptop can hugely expand your gaming options.
AdventureRacing
Member
I still find it interesting how different the responses are in a thread like this to basically all the other threads on gaming side. This is a forum where you see so many people who own multiple, if not all of the consoles (and possibly handhelds too). People who buy tons of games even buying them new. As soon as PC gaming is mentioned though all of a sudden everyone is simply unable to afford to do it (even when they're shown that it really isn't much more expensive if any).
There's also the threads about IOS gaming or casual games. These types of games get so much hate for being way too simple, this is a hardcore gaming forum afterall. Yet seemingly no one is willing to put in the slightest bit of effort to set up a gaming PC. It's not even hard, i know fuck all about computers and i had no problem doing it (you can easily get help after all) and once it's set up you don't have to worry anymore. I really don't think it's any harder than console gaming but seemingly this small barrier is enough to instantly turn off supposed hardcore gamers from giving it a go.
Then there is the whole hating the 'PC crowd'. This supposed master race that sits around on their high horse insulting everyone else. Yet no body seems to give a shit about the constant console wars and the looking down on other people for their platform choices. How many times have you seen people insulting the wii, wii U, DS, 3DS and much more commonly smarthphones? Even the xbone which is pretty damn close to the PS4 cops constant shit. You see far more of this shit from console gamers than you do from PC gamers.
Another one that i don't understand is this all the people who simply don't like 'PC games'. What does that even mean? The PC has a huge library that dwarfs any of the consoles. Not only that but it receives a lot of the same games that consoles do and can be used to emulate most old consoles. I just don't see how anyone can make a statement like they don't PC games. It's such a wide reaching statement that really just shows a persons ignorance of what the PC has to offer in terms of library (which i can admit i am guilty of this as well).
I can totally understand preferring what consoles have to offer. For me most of my favourite games are exclusive to nintendo and some of my other favourite games are console exclusive (like halo or gears). I also love local co-op/splitscreen gaming which is much better and more common on consoles. Saying that is very different to saying you don't like anything PC has to offer.
In general most of the reasons people post basically boil down to not being willing to put in a small amount of effort into a hobby we all spend heaps of time with. I understand that, personally i hate fiddling with graphics settings and making PC's and all that bullshit. It's why i've always enjoyed my consoles, being able to pick up and play is awesome. Nowadays though having a gaming PC (or laptop) really isn't much of a hassle and if anything consoles have slowly been getting more and more clunky to use imo.
I probably sound condescending but i'm not trying to be. I too put very little effort into my set-ups and i understand not wanting to put in any time or effort if i don't have to. I will never have an optimal PC set-up or home theatre or anything else of that nature. I am willing to admit exactly why that's the case. It's not because it's too expensive or too hard. I'm just way too casual and admittedly lazy when it comes to this type of stuff.
Well that was a whole bunch of rambling and random thoughts. Just before anyone says it i realise that GAF isn't a hivemind and that likely it's different people posting in these different threads.
Laptops are just so easy and convenient to use. If i'm traveling i can just pick it up and take it with me, it takes up minimal space and requires no set up. Even if i just want to move to another room in my house it's so much easier. I don't want another device to cover for my mobility when i can have one that does all of those things. Frankly if you don't really care about graphics isn't there anything that a proper gaming rig offers that a laptop doesn't? I know most of my friends have now went down this route.
Having said all that i'm considering finally going all in and getting an awesome set-up but it's by no means necessary.
There's also the threads about IOS gaming or casual games. These types of games get so much hate for being way too simple, this is a hardcore gaming forum afterall. Yet seemingly no one is willing to put in the slightest bit of effort to set up a gaming PC. It's not even hard, i know fuck all about computers and i had no problem doing it (you can easily get help after all) and once it's set up you don't have to worry anymore. I really don't think it's any harder than console gaming but seemingly this small barrier is enough to instantly turn off supposed hardcore gamers from giving it a go.
Then there is the whole hating the 'PC crowd'. This supposed master race that sits around on their high horse insulting everyone else. Yet no body seems to give a shit about the constant console wars and the looking down on other people for their platform choices. How many times have you seen people insulting the wii, wii U, DS, 3DS and much more commonly smarthphones? Even the xbone which is pretty damn close to the PS4 cops constant shit. You see far more of this shit from console gamers than you do from PC gamers.
Another one that i don't understand is this all the people who simply don't like 'PC games'. What does that even mean? The PC has a huge library that dwarfs any of the consoles. Not only that but it receives a lot of the same games that consoles do and can be used to emulate most old consoles. I just don't see how anyone can make a statement like they don't PC games. It's such a wide reaching statement that really just shows a persons ignorance of what the PC has to offer in terms of library (which i can admit i am guilty of this as well).
I can totally understand preferring what consoles have to offer. For me most of my favourite games are exclusive to nintendo and some of my other favourite games are console exclusive (like halo or gears). I also love local co-op/splitscreen gaming which is much better and more common on consoles. Saying that is very different to saying you don't like anything PC has to offer.
In general most of the reasons people post basically boil down to not being willing to put in a small amount of effort into a hobby we all spend heaps of time with. I understand that, personally i hate fiddling with graphics settings and making PC's and all that bullshit. It's why i've always enjoyed my consoles, being able to pick up and play is awesome. Nowadays though having a gaming PC (or laptop) really isn't much of a hassle and if anything consoles have slowly been getting more and more clunky to use imo.
I probably sound condescending but i'm not trying to be. I too put very little effort into my set-ups and i understand not wanting to put in any time or effort if i don't have to. I will never have an optimal PC set-up or home theatre or anything else of that nature. I am willing to admit exactly why that's the case. It's not because it's too expensive or too hard. I'm just way too casual and admittedly lazy when it comes to this type of stuff.
Well that was a whole bunch of rambling and random thoughts. Just before anyone says it i realise that GAF isn't a hivemind and that likely it's different people posting in these different threads.
Laptops are just so easy and convenient to use. If i'm traveling i can just pick it up and take it with me, it takes up minimal space and requires no set up. Even if i just want to move to another room in my house it's so much easier. I don't want another device to cover for my mobility when i can have one that does all of those things. Frankly if you don't really care about graphics isn't there anything that a proper gaming rig offers that a laptop doesn't? I know most of my friends have now went down this route.
Having said all that i'm considering finally going all in and getting an awesome set-up but it's by no means necessary.
Melchiah
Member
I've personally owned two gamings systems only once, when I had PS2 and PC. I barely have time for one system's offerings, and now that the indies have come to the PS4, the sole reason for getting a new PC is gone for me.
Mass Effect
Member
Ha, I think this thread is a prime example of more people complaining about "PC elitists!" than there actually are from what I've seen. It's pretty amazing.
Bananajama
Banned
Did a gaming laptop
Thought it was fantastic at the time and I'd never go back to a desktop.
Little further down the line I've changed my mind.
Thought it was fantastic at the time and I'd never go back to a desktop.
Little further down the line I've changed my mind.
Just from personal experience, I just did a rough count, and in the last 15 or so years I have lived in about 11 apartments/dorms/rooms in 8 cities in 6 countries on 2 continents. Only during the most recent move did I ship any furniture. Mostly, I moved with a suitcase and a large backpack. The only computer I had for most of the time was a laptop, mostly some thinkpad x series because they are small and lightweight.
I know that I'm probably not a typical case here, but it just shows that you can't make blanket statements about what other people have or do or need without knowing anything about them.
...developers of what?
Funkyhamster
Member
Software? Any programming using Unix tools is much easier on Mac OS due to the aforementioned Unix core. When you fire up the terminal, a Mac is indistinguishable from any other Unix system. Heck, even ssh'ing into a Unix server is less painful on Mac. The one downside of programming on Mac OS compared to Linux that I've noticed is that Mac OS doesn't have a good native package manager, so you have to use weird things like Macports to install some libraries.
Saucycarpdog
Member
Most indies on PC will never see the light of day on consoles or, if they do, will be ported to them long after being released on PC.
The vast, vast majority of game development is not done on unix machines. Visual Studio is still the industry standard.
Melchiah
Member
Those that I've wanted to play are already coming, which are mostly horror-themed games. I was also thrilled to see Frictional Games and The Chinese Room opening their doors to consoles. The only ones missing that come to mind are the two Amnesia games (EDIT: Dear Esther as well), and sadly they'll probably never be released on consoles.
I have no problem with waiting, especially when in the other end of the scale is a hefty pricetag for another system.
Funkyhamster
Member
Oh, we're talking about game development? Sure, then a Mac might be useless. I know a lot of other types of software are developed on Unix though (almost every research project I've seen has been developed on Unix, and most of my web developer friends use Unix as well).
If you don't NEED, like YOU NEED IT, the portability of a laptop, after a while the framedrops will get to you and you start seeing super high spec machines go for less than what you bought your laptop for and it hurts you...as you sit in the same location like you would with a desktop, getting but a fraction of the framerate and smooth experience.
Seriously, the PC has a huge up front cost once you include a monitor, mouse and keyboard, and the hardware that makes it a better experience on PC versus ps4 over the whole generation. It also discourages local coop, is much more finicky to use and lacks console exclusives. If you are a very heavy gamer of a certain type then PC is for you. If you are less hardcore or prefer console games or the console experience which is much less clunky then tere is nothing wrong with that.
There are a lot of great games on PC that console gamers never get to experience, and they do miss out though. 4x games, most indie games, rts, moba, mmorpg, etc. I might get a cheap laptop someday to take advantage.
There are a lot of great games on PC that console gamers never get to experience, and they do miss out though. 4x games, most indie games, rts, moba, mmorpg, etc. I might get a cheap laptop someday to take advantage.
Joseph Merrick
Member
you'd be surprised. lol
Im not sure what sort of development we were talking about, hence my question. The guy only mentioned vague development, and that requires clarification.
That said, im actually a proponent of linux game development and im not a normal developer as I prefer to develop on linux. Steam dev days was basically a seminar emploring devs to give linux development a try, lol.
I dont think macs, by nature, are useless for game development, but I recognize at least that most wont develop on not-windows. Its more about familiarity than anything. Plus, windows has a lot of really nice and handy debugging tools. Debugging on linux is kind of a pain.