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[KHarvey16]

This is embarrassing.

So they hated E-Trade and TD Ameritrade fees and created an app when you can easily avoid said costs using other firms' resources? AND ON MARGIN ACCOUNTS TOO?!

Oh god...it hurts.

Wait, what?

 

[KHarvey16]

This is nothing more than a couple of kids dipping their hands into entrepreneurship and marketing this as an idea for services that many other wirehouses and regional broker-dealers offer on the market today. Yet they conveniently ignored those firms because they cannot juxtapose said "value" if they didn't shit on what only E-Trade and TD are doing "wrong".

They're essentially distracting you with their left hand while their right hand is still in your pocket.

There are plenty of zero commision/ self-directed platforms out there.

There's plenty of mobile based commission free brokers with no minimum account balances out there? Do you have a link?

 

[KHarvey16]

Why do you need one? Why take on the risk of having your butt dial in some trades that can cost you hundreds, thousands of dollars? Why take the risk of entering an order wrong when you can speed dial back office support to knock it out in less than a minute and have them take the risk of an incorrect order in your stead?

It's a garbo idea.

You said there are plenty of others out there. Don't hurt yourself moving those goalposts.

Clearing firm is Apex, by the way. And you can't get in to make trades unless you sign in with your password or your fingerprint.

 

[KHarvey16]

I said there are plenty of zero commission platforms out there. Why do you keep asking me about apps?! How is that relevant to my points that this may not be a safe tool to use? You read like your are blindly defending this tool.

For your last sentence, a 7 year old can hack that security easily. So that's one bullet you touched on

I am merely posing questions that should be looked into before throwing hard earned dollars into this. I go to weekly tech innovation meetings and these are typical questions that are asked. I am also in the investment field.

Oh, a 7 year old? Interesting. Again those goal posts are quite mobile it seems.

Your first post here was not asking questions. That would have been a good place to start since it's clear you're quite ignorant about what's happening.

 

[KHarvey16]

I am sorry; do you have anything remotely intelligent to add to the topic or is getting defensive, petty and codescending your thing to fill some hole in your life?

I gave you an answer and you blatantly ignored it and responded with another condescending remark about goal posts.

I am not going to moderate my reaction to a poor idea just because it inexplicably gets you off. Nobody directed any negative sentiment your way

Haha, I'm the condescending one? Not the guy who dropped in to let everyone know how stupid it is because of...reasons. First it was because they created an app using...other firm's resources? Or something? Then it wasn't new, then it wasn't secure, etc, etc. You didn't come here wanting to find things out. You came in here with ignorance and nothing to aim it with.

 

[KHarvey16]

Here are the issues:

1) new investors entering trade orders incorrectly

Why is this unique to this particular platform, especially given your criticism of it doing nothing new? New investors are the point. The entire premise is to expose more people to investing. I hope all the plebs aren't too stupid to do it!

2) security risk. Fingerprint tech, username and passwords are not safety measures.

They're not safety measures? What does Fidelity use to log in to their accounts, DNA tests? Please. If it's too much risk for you, you're free to not use it. Plenty of us have all kinds of personal information on our devices.

3) trades can be placed on a call in less than a minute

Ok?

4) these innovators think they'll make money from margin accounts.

Specifically they will charge 5% interest on margin accounts.

schwab, fidelity, merrill lynch are three examples of b/d that have commission free trades

And also have account minimums and no app.

 

[KHarvey16]

About new investors? new investors do not get approved for margin accounts. So right there we have a business failure. So who is trading to make this business money?

Account minimums? How much do you think new investors need for their first lot? What stock can a new investor afford with a company they are familiar with?

None.

Otherwise you are left with penny stocks and new investors: don't get approved for penny stock trading

So it's bad because nothing it does is new, and also bad because it does things differently than how they're done now.

 

[Dhx]

This is embarrassing.

So they hated E-Trade and TD Ameritrade fees and created an app when you can easily avoid said costs using other firms' resources? AND ON MARGIN ACCOUNTS TOO?!

Oh god...it hurts.

Who pissed in your Cheerios this morning? You seem to have a lot of ire for an app that you admittedly know nothing about beyond a few lines and your own assumptions.

 

[StoOgE]

I don't get how this is a big deal.

This is Apex (former Penson) clearance who has been dealing with deep discount introducing brokers doing the exact same business model since the early 2000s.

King Trade, etc.

So, I guess they made an ap?

 

[KHarvey16]

Do you have a response or are you going to continue attacking my posts which were in no way directed to you or you as a person?

You brought up minimum accounts. What are these minimums? With this app, how much would a new investor, your words, need to make a sensible trade without dabbling in penny stocks? And why would they need to do this on an app outside of covenience?

Your hung up on this fucking app and not discussing the services and or features.

Goalpost

The app is one of the features. You prove again and again that you don't have any understanding of what this is, what it sets out to do, why it sets out to do those things and how it's setting out to do those things.

There is no minimum account balance requirement. That's one of the main features, and part of their strategy to target new investors who aren't willing to throw $1000 around right away. I'm sure you can tell me all about how investing anything less is foolish and dumb, but that's what they're setting out to do.

 

[StoOgE]

The app is one of the features. You prove again and again that you don't have any understanding of what this is, what it sets out to do, why it sets out to do those things and how it's setting out to do those things.

There is no minimum account balance requirement. That's one of the main features, and part of their strategy to target new investors who aren't willing to throw $1000 around right away. I'm sure you can tell me all about how investing anything less is foolish and dumb, but that's what they're setting out to do.

Except it's not what you think it is.

Finra has minimum equity requirements for pattern day traders of 25k.

So you are stuck with a buy and hold strategy without a minimum.... Or you'll be frozen from trading.

 

[KHarvey16]

Let me ask you.

I am a new investor. I'm dumb as fuck as an investor.

I have less than $1000. How am I diversifying myself from risk with less than $1000 short of investing in index fund (which I do not need an app or Apex for)? If I am spending $1000 on individual stocks, i am limiting my systematic risk to two -three holdings perhaps

You see how account minimum issue is mute at this point?!

I can take $500 and inest directly with an index fund.

The other side is how are these two guys making money off new investors?

Diversifying yourself from risk when investing <$1000? You really aren't.

You can click on their website to see how they're going to make money. Interest on margin accounts and collecting the interest they make on cash accounts. Later on they'll offer premium services for those who want them.

 

[StoOgE]

Diversifying yourself from risk when investing <$1000? You really aren't.

You can click on their website to see how they're going to make money. Interest on margin accounts and collecting the interest they make on cash accounts. Later on they'll offer premium services for those who want them.

They aren't the clearance company, they will not make the money on margin. There is a zero percent chance they are the ones margining. That would be Apex.

They will also not hold cash, they are fully disclosed introducing broker. So apex will have that cash too.

They are making their money on the per trade costs, they are just super low. So, they are running thin hoping for large volumes to make their cash.

 

[Avid Reading Horse]

I wouldn't mind trying this, but I have no interest doing it through a phone. Is a web interface or desktop version coming?

 

[KHarvey16]

Except it's not what you think it is.

Finra has minimum equity requirements for pattern day traders of 25k.

So you are stuck with a buy and hold strategy without a minimum.... Or you'll be frozen from trading.

Isn't the equity requirement for pattern day traders on margin? I don't know what requirements robinhood has to get a margin account.

They aren't the clearance company, they will not make the money on margin. There is a zero percent chance they are the ones margining. That would be Apex.

They will also not hold cash, they are fully disclosed introducing broker. So apex will have that cash too.

They are making their money on the per trade costs, they are just super low. So, they are running thin hoping for large volumes to make their cash.

If robinhood is not making money by charging interest on margin accounts and collecting interest on cash accounts, they are lying. They state it explicitly in their FAQ. There is no mention of collecting anything per trade.

 

[StoOgE]

I don't know what to tell you.

They don't hold client funds, and they definitely cannot margin accounts themselves legally.

Unless apex is giving them a back-end credit. Not impossible, but Penson didn't operate that way before the take over.

There are also per trade fees no matter what. Apex has fees as do exchanges for clearing and execution.

 

[KHarvey16]

I don't know what to tell you.

They don't hold client funds, and they definitely cannot margin accounts themselves legally.

Unless apex is giving them a back-end credit. Not impossible, but Penson didn't operate that way before the take over.

There are also per trade fees no matter what. Apex has fees as do exchanges for clearing and execution.

In their FAQ they answer "what is Apex" by explaining they handle "trade confirmations, settlement and securities delivery." Their schedule of fees lists the standard FINRA TAF and SEC regulatory fees only.

 

[StoOgE]

In their FAQ they answer "what is Apex" by explaining they handle "trade confirmations, settlement and securities delivery." Their schedule of fees lists the standard FINRA TAF and SEC regulatory fees only.

And clearance, and they hold all client assets.

Robinhood doesn't hold client money, unless the definition of fully disclosed introducing broker changed in the last 24 hours

 

[KHarvey16]

And clearance, and they hold all client assets.

Robinhood doesn't hold client money, unless the definition of fully disclosed introducing broker changed in the last 24 hours

Well through whatever arrangement they have robinhood is making money by charging and collecting interest. Maybe it's shared, I don't know. But I think we can agree that if there are invisible fees not being disclosed in their fee schedule that would be pretty deceptive (and probably illegal?).

For what it's worth, they do also mention that at one point they listed rebates as a source of revenue, but removed it once they went to Apex and wouldn't be receiving those rebates themselves.

 

[adamsappel]

Is there anything wrong if you want to use this to buy one share of something, so you have an investor voice, rather than wanting to specifically make money?

 

[soundahfekz]

nvm

 

[Joe]

Can someone who isn't condescending tell me if this app is good or bad for dipping toes into the water?

 

[fancimus]

I've been using it for about half a year now and overall it's pretty good. I am a total stock novice (and this is my first experience with buying stocks using any platform whatsoever) but bought a few shares and have played around with the app a bit. I haven't sold anything yet, but for buying, it takes 3 days from when you request a deposit for the money to be available for trading. So keep that in mind if you see a stock you want to buy fast.

 

[toxicgonzo]

Can someone who isn't condescending tell me if this app is good or bad for dipping toes into the water?

For the novice, it isn't too bad.

Just be sure to use limit orders because I heard one too many people complain about their fill prices on market orders.