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[ShinMaruku]

Counter point. What time do people spend on a fighting game? Their free time, leisure time, the time they could spend doing absolutely anything else. We are ignoring here tournament players that can actually make money from doing something.

So chances are they are looking for an enjoyable activity, to get whatever positive emotional feedback they can get from it. Fighting games most of the time don't offer that return, not until you put in a ton of work into them. So yeah people are going to be upset that they wasted their time, people will obviously refuse to actually work for anything during their free time. It's human nature, it's terrible but it's not changing.


Same to you.

Edit: And no, you don't have to win to have fun. But if there is no fun to be had for that person then they won't be sticking around.

I don't know how it's so shocking that some people would look to games to chill out. However I will add the caveat that if you want something to chill out something like a fighting game is a poor choice.

Only thing we can really get fighting games on is if they made losing fun they could make people think and have a better time.

But really if you want to unwind and you put in street fighter and want to play with your brain off

Spoiler

You pick Yun and Ibuki jk

you got other problems.

 

[Storm Kyleis]

Edit: And no, you don't have to win to have fun. But if there is no fun to be had for that person then they won't be sticking around.

The point is, training is the fun part if you enjoy fighting games.

If you don't, well, it's perfectly fine. But this is what it takes to improve in any form of competition.

 

[ShinMaruku]

The point is, training is the fun part if you enjoy fighting games.

If you don't, well, it's perfectly fine. But this is what it takes to improve in any form of competition.

I think you give the lay person too much credit. Also some games go very far to perpetuate the idea that you can turn your brain off and that's dangerous. People are too delusional as it is. Take any thread here with words people don't get, they get fucking hostile.

 

[Armaly]

You guys mind listing off the hours for your most played steam games? I have 496 hours in Payday 2. With fighting games I went from being complete ass to alright in 149 hours. Yeah, the beginning was a struggle for me. Embarrassingly, it took me 2 months to figure out how to properly ultra on a ps3 controller. But once my hard work started paying off I began to love the genre. Out of curiosity, what's the max amount of time you guys are willing to put into a game before you call it quits?

 

[ShinMaruku]

My hours in sf4 bely nothing because I take long breaks so the added up time means nothing. Also no good practice, in DOA? I probably put in about 300 hours in DOA5.

 

[Rezae]

I thought I was awesome at SF2 back in the day. Nobody in my neighborhood could beat me. Fast forward like 15 years with SSF2HD on PSN... I probably won like 10% of my matches.

Played hundreds of hours of SFIV, could never get timing down for FADC and things like that, never really got over that hump either.

The only fighter I think I know I was "really" good at was Tekken 3. Won a lot of arcade tournaments and would never lose to friends as Paul, although I'm being told he was a rather cheap character to begin with, so who knows. Maybe I sucked at that too.

 

[vg260]

I think a lot of people tend to jump into fighting games without thinking about the basic concept of actions being relatively safe vs unsafe. Even without getting into the frame data, just generally if I do a move if it leaves me too vulnerable after.

It's real easy to jump into a game try to do the cool looking stuff, but you leave yourself open for punishment time and time again without stopping to think about the situation you put yourself in. It's real easy to get carried away without stopping to think about that.

For example, if I jump into MK and keep trying to do Scorpion' spear, life is going to be tough.

 

[Lostconfused]

Only thing we can really get fighting games on is if they made losing fun they could make people think and have a better time.

I played a fanservice game for 3 years, still am. I enjoyed losing because I got to see things I liked and hear funny voice clips. I still hated losing but I kept playing because there was still something entertaining for me in it. Eventually I kind of figured out how to not lose as much, I think I am ok at the game now.

Losing doesn't have to be fun, if someone plays a game long enough they will probably figure out how to be better on their own. Playing against people your own skill level is a huge help, but everyone needs some kind of a motivation to keep playing.

 

[kitzkozan]

I don't know how it's so shocking that some people would look to games to chill out. However I will add the caveat that if you want something to chill out something like a fighting game is a poor choice.

Only thing we can really get fighting games on is if they made losing fun they could make people think and have a better time.

But really if you want to unwind and you put in street fighter and want to play with your brain off

Spoiler

You pick Yun and Ibuki jk

you got other problems.

That's never going to happen, just like it doesn't really happen in sport either. What fighting games need right now are more people playing them so that every skill bracket is well represented, which would allow everyone to win more often at their respective level.

In sport, players are separated based on skill and rate of development regarding technical abilities at a given age. In Canada for example, young kids playing ice hockey at 13 can choose competitive or non competitive leagues. For the competitive side, you have Bantam C, B, A, AA and AAA (elite level).

 

[TacosNSalsa]

The point is, training is the fun part if you enjoy fighting games.

If you don't, well, it's perfectly fine. But this is what it takes to improve in any form of competition.

I agree with this soo much. Nothing like losing to something online and with the combination of replays and recreating it in training mode, figuring out what happened . Oh he OS'd me . Oh that is a legit punish for my move. Oh I was hitting buttons at the wrong time and my favorite oh he/she just fucking did it..lol. But that's just me .

 

[mbmonk]

No, but I also don't study astrophysics. If I did, I could do what he does.

Stephen Hawking, if you have ever watched him talk about himself, has been open about not amounting to much when he was young. It was only after he fell ill that he decided his life needed meaning, and he dedicated his time to ardent study. It wasn't a "gift", it was years of hard work. Ditto for Einstein or any other scientific "genius". We should really remove ourselves from this term. It is largely a myth.


Not all practice is effective practice. You can spend months in training mode and learn nothing. You can play a thousand matches and suck. Learning how to learn is something many people don't know how to do. It isn't natural talent, though. I am a great problem solver because my Dad taught me how to solve problems, and I played competitive chess for years. I honed those skills. I didn't become a great analytic reader until I was 28, but it did happen because I wanted it to. There are some things I still can't do that I will eventually accomplish, like learning a foreign language.

Einstiens brain was abnormally large in the area that deals with spacial aspects. If I remember correctly PBS had an episode of Nova that talked about this.

So I dont know if citing Einstein supports your argument.

 

[Kimosabae]

I'm pretty sure any correlation between Einstein's brain abnormalities and his intelligence/scientific accomplishments were debunked eons ago. Just like every other study that tries to correlate brain size to intelligence.

Counter point. What time do people spend on a fighting game? Their free time, leisure time, the time they could spend doing absolutely anything else. We are ignoring here tournament players that can actually make money from doing something.

So chances are they are looking for an enjoyable activity, to get whatever positive emotional feedback they can get from it. Fighting games most of the time don't offer that return, not until you put in a ton of work into them. So yeah people are going to be upset that they wasted their time, people will obviously refuse to actually work for anything during their free time. It's human nature, it's terrible but it's not changing.

This is scarcely a point, let alone counter point. It's called prioritizing. It's what mature adults do with time being a limited resource. If you don't value being a competent FG player over true leisure time, then prioritize accordingly. Just don't expect to win against people that prioritize the opposite if you choose to spend that leisure time playing FGs leisurely.

"Human Nature"?

Please.

 

[Lostconfused]

You do realize you are talking about a commercial product that companies spend millions on marketing and promoting to the general public and generally sell it as an entertainment product?

 

[Skilletor]

You do realize you are talking about a commercial product that companies spend millions on marketing and promoting to the general public and generally sell it as an entertainment product?

You do realize people find entertainment in different things.

 

[Kimosabae]

Again, what is ur point

 

[Lostconfused]

That people's expectations on average are nowhere near in-line with yours. That they don't understand this:

Just don't expect to win against people that prioritize the opposite if you choose to spend that leisure time playing FGs leisurely.

You do realize people find entertainment in different things.

Yeah and that's a problem when the desires of multiple groups come into conflict.

 

[Kimosabae]

That goes back to what I touched on in my initial post: it's up to developers and publishers of these games to manage people's expectations effectively/convince these people of the value present in competent FG gameplay. You can do this through marketing. Marketing the scenes more specifically, and showing people that they're paritcipating in something larger than themselves if they decide to at least grind out a BnB. That playing FGs competently doesn't mean sacrificing everything to live in your parent's basement. That there's fun and entertainment in the ventures of learning. Like a fitness goal, there's character growth to be found in the journey.

People buy FGs and are blindsided by their experience with them time and time again. But if you set the right expectations from the beginning, the realities of the environment won't be nearly as harsh, I feel.

That, and there needs to be content available to those that are just not interested in having a competitive mindset

 

[Avalt]

Learning to play is similar to throwing someone into a pool (but they can't swim yet) Here is my analogy:

FPS - Person is throw into shallow end of the pool. They may panic at first but most will get their footing. They will probably enjoy their time at the pool even if they can't swim.
Fighting/High APM RTS - Person is throw into the deep end of the pool. Most sink while a few naturally talented or persistent folk will manage. This person will probably become scared or discouraged of swimming in your pool again.
MOBA - Person is thrown into the deep end of the pool. Luckily, 4 others are thrown in as well (and they seem to know how to swim). They carry you about and eventually you too learn how to swim. This person will also probably enjoy their time at the pool, thou their enjoyment depends more on their companions.
RPG - Leisurely walk on the beach with the sun setting in the background. This person is really enjoying their time. Who wants to be in an overcrowded pool anyway?

I really don't know what, but the fighting genre needs to do something about easing new players in. Maybe something like a full beginners campaign where players slowly unlock character moves and are tested along the way? Speaking from experience, I forget everything a tutorial has thought me as soon as I start a real match.

 

[SlickShoes]

Learning to play is similar to throwing someone into a pool (but they can't swim yet) Here is my analogy:

FPS - Person is throw into shallow end of the pool. They may panic at first but most will get their footing. They will probably enjoy their time at the pool even if they can't swim.
Fighting/High APM RTS - Person is throw into the deep end of the pool. Most sink while a few naturally talented or persistent folk will manage. This person will probably become scared or discouraged of swimming in your pool again.
MOBA - Person is thrown into the deep end of the pool. Luckily, 4 others are thrown in as well (and they seem to know how to swim). They carry you about and eventually you too learn how to swim. This person will also probably enjoy their time at the pool, thou their enjoyment depends more on their companions.
RPG - Leisurely walk on the beach with the sun setting in the background. This person is really enjoying their time. Who wants to be in an overcrowded pool anyway?

I really don't know what, but the fighting genre needs to do something about easing new players in. Maybe something like a full beginners campaign where players slowly unlock character moves and are tested along the way? Speaking from experience, I forget everything a tutorial has thought me as soon as I start a real match.

I think you have MOBA a bit wrong, those other four people in the pool turn in to abusive sharks and eat you alive if you are clueless going in. The best thing you can do in a moba if you have just piled in the deep end is to say nothing.

 

[140.85]

Improving my fighting skill was all about changing perspective + gaining knowledge + embracing bitter, frequent loss.

I still lose most of the time but it's been fun to notice small improvements.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I really don't know what, but the fighting genre needs to do something about easing new players in. Maybe something like a full beginners campaign where players slowly unlock character moves and are tested along the way? Speaking from experience, I forget everything a tutorial has thought me as soon as I start a real match.

I think fundamentally, there is nothing about the fighting genre that can be adjusted for players who experience ladder anxiety and do not want to actively put in time to improve and train. Look at your metaphors: the only genres in there which are 1v1—fighting games and competitive RTS—are the ones which are described as the most intimidating. When it comes to a pure 1v1 experience test of skill, which is something I really love, I don't know if something can really be changed to accommodate players in a way that they won't give up when they realize that people are going to be better than them.

A lot of fighting games these days have taken accommodating measures like that. Persona 4 Arena, Guilty Gear Xrd, BlazBlue and Skullgirls are just some of those that have extensive tutorials which cover everything a newcomer would need to know, though I guess there's the part about forgetting everything once one enters a real match, like you mention. Well, Guilty Gear Xrd has a really cool mission mode which is more about active participation than passive, which could help for that.

I just think that no matter how simple a fighting game is, there are significant number of people who will get intimidated by it because, ultimately, it's two people in a single arena where only one comes out the victor. It can be a humiliating, intimidating and frustrating experience at its core, and it would take a drastic change in how the genre works to somehow change that. Look at a game like Divekick. It literally only has two buttons as inputs, but that still made it intimidating for players despite its approachability, and that's because it's still a fighting game, relying on all aspects one would come to expect (neutral game, footsies, etc.).

 

[BiggNife]

In my experience, the best way to get better at fighting games is to play against real people, either online or locally. Playing against the CPU is fine when you're getting the hang of things, but almost every CPU can be cheesed or exploited in a way that real human beings can't. I do think fighting against the CPU is good to practice combos or techniques you've done in training, because applying those things to a real match is very different than just doing them against a bot.

And as others have said, fundamentals trump fancy combos any day of the week. I can't tell you how many times I've won matches in MKX because my opponent didn't know how to approach and and just started wildly jumping in, giving me a free uppercut. SF4 is the same way - unless you're planning to enter tournaments on a regular basis, you really, really don't need to know the complex stuff like one frame links to do well. You just need the basics down, like knowing which normals keep your opponent at a good distance, which attacks work well for zoning, which attacks won't leave you completely vulnerable if they're blocked, etc.

 

[Lostconfused]

Look at a game like Divekick. It literally only has two buttons as inputs, but that still made it intimidating for players despite its approachability, and that's because it's still a fighting game, relying on all aspects one would come to expect (neutral game, footsies, etc.).

Well that and they added a bunch of characters that made everything seem way more complicated than the original design intended.

 

[dem0neyes]

That, and there needs to be content available to those that are just not interested in having a competitive mindset

I think this is a big thing. If the intended end game for people who don't plan on going to tourneys is just to hop online and play, then over time they are going to just run into the better players and get beat on probably discouraged to continue(unless its mkx online for w/e reason lol).

From my personal experience I put in alot of time into back in the day into t5, 3s, and ST so that really helped with my fundamentals. Now i can just play w/e comes out and understand the mechanics of the game and figure it out without having to look stuff up. My combos may not be optimized at first but i've always valued learning how a character is supposed to open you up over combos. If you aren't able to get the hit then whats the point of having the combos in the first place.

Some games are trying to find ways to teach this mindset but I think its hard without someone telling you what you are doing wrong during an actual match for new players. So I would say if you really want to get better at fighting games the best way to go about it is to try to find someone on gaf or something to run sets with you and really explain why you are getting hit, why you can't hit him, normals and stuff you should be looking out for etc.

 

[sniperpon]

Maybe don't set your sights so high? Do you really need to be an elite competitive player just to have fun with the games?

I got into fighters as a kid with Street Fighter 2: Special Champion Edition, on the Genesis. I got good enough to be able to beat the game on four stars (so, "medium" difficulty I guess) with a few characters, without continuing. That was my personal goal, and accomplishing it was enough satisfaction for me.

That positive experience caused me to dabble in and enjoy other fighters (Samurai Shodown [3DO] and One Must Fall: 2097 [DOS] especially). I'm sure in a competitive setting I'd get my butt kicked at any of those games-- but my goal was never to be a competitive tournament-quality player anyway. Just like in platformers, my goal isn't to become a world record setting speed-runner, and so on.

 

[danmaku]

Well that and they added a bunch of characters that made everything seem way more complicated than the original design intended.

I think the development of Divekick is a good example as to why fighting games are the way they are. At first it was simple: two buttons, one move, one hit ko. But then the designers got bored and said "what if we put in another character with another move?"

 

[petran79]

That playing FGs competently doesn't mean sacrificing everything to live in your parent's basement. That there's fun and entertainment in the ventures of learning. Like a fitness goal, there's character growth to be found in the journey.

People buy FGs and are blindsided by their experience with them time and time again. But if you set the right expectations from the beginning, the realities of the environment won't be nearly as harsh, I feel.

That, and there needs to be content available to those that are just not interested in having a competitive mindset

Often competitive gaming is being confused with online play. The OP's issue was the latter, that he had trouble applying the tactics he learned online. This problem does not apply only to fighting games but to any video game with online play. As if when you cant win online, you have to abandon the game. But there are millions of ways to play any game

 

[ShinMaruku]

This is scarcely a point, let alone counter point. It's called prioritizing. It's what mature adults do with time being a limited resource. If you don't value being a competent FG player over true leisure time, then prioritize accordingly. Just don't expect to win against people that prioritize the opposite if you choose to spend that leisure time playing FGs leisurely.

"Human Nature"?

Please.

I think you are giving people in this soceity too much credit. This is place where people jumped into houses with variable morgage rates and did not have the income to go into it. You have people voting against their own intrests, you got people bitching about game prices and season passes and still buy all that shit day one.
You are looking at the ideal but most people are NOT rational actors. Of course that is not meant to justify their crazy people, they should be laughed at for wanting easy things in a game that requires more time.

That's never going to happen, just like it doesn't really happen in sport either. What fighting games need right now are more people playing them so that every skill bracket is well represented, which would allow everyone to win more often at their respective level.

In sport, players are separated based on skill and rate of development regarding technical abilities at a given age. In Canada for example, young kids playing ice hockey at 13 can choose competitive or non competitive leagues. For the competitive side, you have Bantam C, B, A, AA and AAA (elite level).

Of course it will never happen until a game get some rampant growth early and then gets the players to settle into their brackets. However that will never happen.

You do realize people find entertainment in different things.

Tell that to publishers and developers who want one thing for everybody instead of something for everybody.

Also since people with different tastes can lead to conflict. It's up to leaders to head them off.

 

[Freshmaker]

No shit. It's a video game. People want to play it to have fun. Most people don't want to put in work, why is that strange or odd?

When learning the game's what a lot of people consider fun in the first place, you're going to see a gap between people who argue this point and the people who don't think about anything but picking up the controller and funning themselves.

The best players are always the ones that understand how the game works.

 

[SeeNoWeevil]

Fighting game tutorials teach you next to nothing, even the 'good' ones. Fighting game AI is truly awful and does not display an ounce of human behaviour. I also think it's impossible for people well versed in fighting games to explain fighting games.

The only way, imo, to learn to play them is to strip away all the visual noise and understand what's going on underneath, which is actually really simple. This way you can answer all your own questions and be able to actually identify what is happening to you when you play.

 

[The Albatross]

OP, I am worse. I can't even reliably beat a computer opponent.

 

[oneida]

Fighting game tutorials teach you next to nothing, even the 'good' ones. Fighting game AI is truly awful and does not display an ounce of human behaviour.

You are in dire need of VF4EVO.

 

[ShinMaruku]

You are in dire need of VF4EVO.

We are all in dire need of VF4 Evo. I just never had people to play.

 

[ghibli99]

I fell off around the Vampire Savior era, and never really recovered after that. LOL It's sad when I load up SF2T and can't even made it 3 or 4 matches in before I'm having to continue. Like anything, much of it comes down to dedication, practice, and getting involved in the metagame, but I just don't have that kind of time anymore. Either that or I just focus on other games/genres.

 

[Gatzor]

If it's a video game.

Edit: Or more accurately, if it's supposed to be a fun diversion and I'm not having fun.

meh, with that personality there is no way you are gonna be able to jump in on the next SF, it is far more difficult than mortal kombat.

Honestly these games might just not be your cup of tea, I learned far quicker than some of my friends, and one of my friends in particular just hit a hump he could never get over while the rest of us continued on.

Fighting games ARE an incredibly rewarding, one on one competitive experience that are a fun mental exercise and give room for a lot of creative approaches and experimentation once you get good at them though. If you are easily frustrated, not only will it not be fun but it will impede your growth, which will make the negativity cyclical.

 

[vg260]

OP, I am worse. I can't even reliably beat a computer opponent.

Computer opponent AI is notoriously bad at being programmed to read your inputs and react accordingly unlike a normal person could.

 

[Venfayth]

Lose repeatedly while trying to do one thing correctly. You need to make it habit. When you first start out trying to play ''well' in a fighting game, there are 28034 things you need to remember. You need to chip away at that number by turning things from a mental task into a mental reaction. You do that by practicing things until they become habit

It's ok if you lose matches while you do this, you need to have the training mindset.

 

[StoneFox]

I never play fighting games online, I feel like a highly skilled player would find me a waste of time given my skill level since I only fight bots and apparently that can lead to bad habits, but I much prefer treating fighting games as party games. When I was a kid, everyone at a party would crowd around a 15 inch TV screen to play each other in Street Fighter or Mortal Kombat and up through high school I was able to keep enjoying these kinds of get-togethers.

Nowadays I have no IRL friends that want to hang out and play fighting games so I rarely play them either. I was never anywhere amazing at them, but one of my friends about five years ago told me "you certainly have the instinct for fighting games" which I guess he meant that I try to control my space more than other casual players and his comment really boosted my confidence but that was the last time I got to playing fighting games with real people before life got in the way.

Online doesn't give the same experience of people reacting to the action through cheering and "ohhhh!", nor does it allow me to tease the other player in good spirit because I don't know if they'll take it personally. Online is lifeless to me so I just occasinally turn on my games to beat bots and get it out of my system and move on to another game.

 

[Kimosabae]

Often competitive gaming is being confused with online play. The OP's issue was the latter, that he had trouble applying the tactics he learned online. This problem does not apply only to fighting games but to any video game with online play. As if when you cant win online, you have to abandon the game. But there are millions of ways to play any game

You're creating an arbitrary bifurcation. When playing online, the dominant mindset is competitive. The OP's issue is that he couldn't bare the brunt of learning.

I think you are giving people in this soceity too much credit. This is place where people jumped into houses with variable morgage rates and did not have the income to go into it. You have people voting against their own intrests, you got people bitching about game prices and season passes and still buy all that shit day one.
You are looking at the ideal but most people are NOT rational actors. Of course that is not meant to justify their crazy people, they should be laughed at for wanting easy things in a game that requires more time.

The cult of self-responsibility is satisfying to my ego and all - but it doesn't explain a damn thing or provide solutions to any real problems. People don't act in a vacuum. Knowing this, you look at the factors that influence behavior and attempt to control. That's how we learn and advance as a species. I don't have to give society any credit it doesn't deserve: I can just point to its previous history. It's made a lot of progress.

People learned from the housing crisis and now our social structure is more openly criticized today than it ever has been. A new presidential cycle is beginning, and people are more cynical about it than ever. GAF criticizes season passes but doesn't make up the majority of people that purchase these games. That's part of the problem with broad strokes.

Social progress always comes down to education and exposure. It's slow and often non-linear. Taking games seriously is a relatively new phenomenon and is going to require a lot of adjusting for a lot of people. But the more people get exposed and educated on the principles that make the movement tick, the less crazy it will seem and hopefully, people like OP will see getting good at a FG as a challenge worth undertaking, rather than running from.

That or the genre dies, completely. I'll still be playing them either way.

 

[Effigenius]

I would really recommend the Skullgirls Tutorial is really that good.

I can find that just in the regular ps3 version of the game?

 

[joe2187]

I can find that just in the regular ps3 version of the game?

Yep, and download Beowulf while he's still free!

Tutorials have been in the game since the first version.

 

[mbmonk]

I'm pretty sure any correlation between Einstein's brain abnormalities and his intelligence/scientific accomplishments were debunked eons ago. Just like every other study that tries to correlate brain size to intelligence.

Just to be clear, because you seemed to have subtlety changed my statement. I was speaking about specific parts of his brain were larger. I was not speaking about overall brain size being larger. So your statement about "correlating brain size to intelligence" is a modification of my argument. It was an enlargement of a specific area of his brain not his overall brain.

Now there is a question of cause and effect on how that part of his brain was enlarged in those areas. Was it natural or did it grow because he constantly was using it his subject and method of thought.

 

[Kimosabae]

Just to be clear, because you seemed to have subtlety changed my statement. I was speaking about specific parts of his brain were larger. I was not speaking about overall brain size being larger. So your statement about "correlating brain size to intelligence" is a modification of my argument. It was an enlargement of a specific area of his brain not his overall brain.

Now there is a question of cause and effect on how that part of his brain was enlarged in those areas. Was it natural or did it grow because he constantly was using it his subject and method of thought.

I made two statements; the second I made an extrapolation that was directly implied by your original statement - intelligence/brain capacity is directly linked to mass. Whether we're speaking about a specific portion or the entire brain, doesn't matter; studies have shown that the amount of brain matter doesn't necessarily "matter".

If you have something, please produce it.

 

[petran79]

You're creating an arbitrary bifurcation. When playing online, the dominant mindset is competitive. The OP's issue is that he couldn't bare the brunt of learning.

you can learn a game without striving to be competitive. Thats the next step which would require much more time and dedication than the first step.

he was mostly referring to MKX ranked point system, but this is just one part of the online experience and not fit for beginners at all.

Had he played in non-ranked matches with people who stopped mid-match and gave him advice through the mic, it would have been different.
Hence why environments like GGPO and now Fightcade are best suited for fighting games. You can chat while in-game and learn useful advice. No ranking points either to make you nervous
There the other persons guided me and gave me input tips for various moves in 90s fighting games. Eg in Vampire Savior I wasnt pressing attack buttons after a knockdown to evade getting cornered. The other guy had to remind me that this option existed as well!

Fighting games are actually one of the most lax video game genres to play in such an environment. You're one on one. No need to learn complex team strategies, dual analog motions in sports games, Starcraft inputs, Rope jumping in Worms Armageddon etc. Just you and the other person controlling two characters. Unfortunately this aspect gets ignored because newer players are scared away by the wrong choice of random internet matches

 

[Freshmaker]

Social progress always comes down to education and exposure. It's slow and often non-linear. Taking games seriously is a relatively new phenomenon and is going to require a lot of adjusting for a lot of people. But the more people get exposed and educated on the principles that make the movement tick, the less crazy it will seem and hopefully, people like OP will see getting good at a FG as a challenge worth undertaking, rather than running from.

That or the genre dies, completely. I'll still be playing them either way.

Eh. Most of the current SCV players I encounter who are serious are 17-20 years old. Older players like me are a rare breed. It really just boils down to time commitment. If you have it, then you can be decent. If you don't have the time to spend or you don't have that focus to sit down and train (which I find myself completely unmotivated to do), you probably aren't going anywhere competitively.

 

[Kimosabae]

Marg, I feel like that attitude is a bit unintentionally defeatist. As a certified trainer, it's been my experience with dealing people that claim "not to have enough time" for things they claim they value, to simply be poor at managing time. It's a skill in-and-of-itself, that takes time (heh) to and discipline to develop, like any other skill.

you can learn a game without striving to be competitive. Thats the next step which would require much more time and dedication than the first step.

he was mostly referring to MKX ranked point system, but this is just one part of the online experience and not fit for beginners at all.

Had he played in non-ranked matches with people who stopped mid-match and gave him advice through the mic, it would have been different.
Hence why environments like GGPO and now Fightcade are best suited for fighting games. You can chat while in-game and learn useful advice. No ranking points either to make you nervous
There the other persons guided me and gave me input tips for various moves in 90s fighting games. Eg in Vampire Savior I wasnt pressing attack buttons after a knockdown to evade getting cornered. The other guy had to remind me that this option existed as well!

Fighting games are actually one of the most lax video game genres to play in such an environment. You're one on one. No need to learn complex team strategies, dual analog motions in sports games, Starcraft inputs, Rope jumping in Worms Armageddon etc. Just you and the other person controlling two characters. Unfortunately this aspect gets ignored because newer players are scared away by the wrong choice of random internet matches

There's an important distinction I'm making between a competitive mindset and being competitive. You're missing it. You can adopt aspects of the competitive mindset and totally not be a competitive person, holistically (in fact no one is).

OP is/was unwilling to adopt aspects intrinsic to the mindset of competitiveness, a mindset that dominates online play for games in general. Hence, his result.

I already mentioned how playing FGs can be free of stress and easy to learn in the right environment, with the right perspective.

 

[ShinMaruku]

I'd arge that for a sizable chunk of players they don't have the right environment to have a enjoyable experince learning the game. I know I'm in that camp with Tekken therefore I will not even engage in it.

 

[paolo11]

For Pro FG players out there: How many hours do you spend each day to improve?

I mean, let's make an example out of me.

I love to learn USF4. I use Guile. I know his fundamentals. I am below average player.

If I play at least an hour or 2 a day every single day with acecpting the losses and critically thinknig on how to improve my gameplay for a long time (like one year), I won't be a clown when I joining tourneys, yes?

 

[Kimosabae]

Paolo11: It's all about how intelligently you utilize that time how well you establish realistic goals. Just going to a tournament alone will level you up. You might want to try that, first.

I'd arge that for a sizable chunk of players they don't have the right environment to have a enjoyable experince learning the game. I know I'm in that camp with Tekken therefore I will not even engage in it.

As I mentioned to the OP: that part of the onus is on them. First, you establish a goal. "What do I want out of this game? Do I just want to have fun?" If that's the case, play online until you find people of your skill level and just play with them. This is assuming you can't get any friends interested IRL.

If you're not serious or low level, there's people online at your level, you just have to be willing to look. I still run into bad players in Xrd 5 months in, and I'm terrible myself.

 

[paolo11]

Paolo11: It's all about how intelligently you utilize that time how well you establish realistic goals. Just going to a tournament alone will level you up. You might want to try that, first.



As I mentioned to the OP: that part of the onus is on them. First, you establish a goal. "What do I want out of this game? Do I just want to have fun?" If that's the case, play online until you find people of your skill level and just play with them. This is assuming you can't get any friends interested IRL.

If you're not serious or low level, there's people online at your level, you just have to be willing to look. I still run into bad players in Xrd 5 months in, and I'm terrible myself.

My realistic goal actually is to be a top contender in tourneys without the need of flashy combos and make my moves as effective as it can be. Like a fighter with amazing defense.