Dr. Buni
Member
Online play exists for that reason or so I like to believe. In my whole life I have played no more than 20 or so hours of Smash Bros with other people locally, the rest was either by myself or online in Smash 4.
Smash Wii U & 3DS Downloadable Characters Discussion and Information on Smash Ballot
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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balladofwindfishes
Member
The real secret online mode for Smash is finding a tourney that only has 2 or 3 players active where you can reliably play 1v1s until everyone leaves.
Some of the best multiplayer I've played was 1v1s in Tourney mode on tournament legal stages.
It really makes me hate that 1v1 tournies can't be made...
I have a lot of friends who tell me online works really well for them, so I don't know if they're lying (unlikely, possibly?) or if my internet is just shit (likely, for sure)... but yeah it's unplayable. I can't deal with the half a second delay on inputs. I feel like I wanna say it's better than Brawl was but... not by much.
And yeah I'm using ethernet, not wireless. Neither feels good. ):
So long ago!
I do have some fun doing that, but honestly I'd always rather play multiplayer, so I'll just hop on Dota 2 or TF2 or something instead.
And yeah I'm using ethernet, not wireless. Neither feels good. ):
So long ago!
I do have some fun doing that, but honestly I'd always rather play multiplayer, so I'll just hop on Dota 2 or TF2 or something instead.
I do agree that someone should inherit Snake's moveset. And oddly enough, I think that the Inklings could do that (for the most part).
balladofwindfishes
Member
Inklings being a semi-clone of Snake would be another Ganondorf situation.
It's not like Snake's coming back anytime soon, so I don't see the problem. Obviously the Inklings won't be a 1-1 moveset port of Snake in this scenario, but it would suffice & preserve the moveset of a unique character.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
Mewtwo is grouped with Giga Bowser and Ganondorf in Event 51 in Melee. It's obvious they are playing him as a villain in Smash.Yeah, I don't really believe Pokédex entries. Too much stuff written there contradicts the actual games. Also, the final boss of Red and Green is Blue Oak. Mewtwo is more akin to an ultimate/extra boss. Also, being a final boss doesn't mean the character is evil. But this discussion is pointless, my view on Mewtwo isn't going to stop others from calling it a villain, so whatever
Dr. Buni
Member
Inkling should have a 100% original moveset. No semi-clone or 30% clone of an existing character, please.
I am well aware of that:
That doesn't change my opinion on Mewtwo not being a villain. It is just a Pokémon as any other imo.
Green Mamba
Member
I kind of wonder if we're not going to hear about the next wave of DLC until the day before or something.
balladofwindfishes
Member
And probably on Twitter and people will have to dig through random press sites for information and images like today's info dump!
They really need to go back to Directs. I understand why they're taking a break from them, but the way they're releasing news now is terrible. The Amiibo reveals were ridiculous today and there's a Import VC game coming this week that was dropped in one sentence on Twitter like it's no big deal.
Also, now that the Star Fox series is being rebooted (again), Wolf can go back to being a proper villain and not a wishy washy, anti-hero role he had the last few Star Fox games. Yay!
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
A thought hit me earlier reading all of this...what if Sakurai is choosing DLC based on who he thinks people want to buy as a huge factor?
For example, instead of just finishing a Rhythm Heaven character because they are deserved- he scraps it completely because he doesn't think people would want to buy the character if he made them pay extra. Imagine if Wii Fit Trainer for example was DLC as a newcomer rather than being added to the main game.
This would imply that any newcomers would have to be able to stand on their own, rather than simply being popular in the polls. You won't find a character like Wii Fit Trainer as DLC, but instead need to focus on someone like Ryu who can stand alone.
It really pushes me towards expecting more 3rd party characters and veterans. There's not a lot of Nintendo characters left that can stand alone.
For example, instead of just finishing a Rhythm Heaven character because they are deserved- he scraps it completely because he doesn't think people would want to buy the character if he made them pay extra. Imagine if Wii Fit Trainer for example was DLC as a newcomer rather than being added to the main game.
This would imply that any newcomers would have to be able to stand on their own, rather than simply being popular in the polls. You won't find a character like Wii Fit Trainer as DLC, but instead need to focus on someone like Ryu who can stand alone.
It really pushes me towards expecting more 3rd party characters and veterans. There's not a lot of Nintendo characters left that can stand alone.
*looks at Inkling/Agent 3, King K. Rool, & a number of others*
Dr. Buni
Member
There's also King K. Rool, who would likely sell well... And well, Ridley, but that is not going to happen. And I guess Inkling, too. If Sakurai decide to sell characters that are sure to sell well, who are by definition the most popular/requested characters, who will he use to promote the next game, though? If he's smart, he would save a few popular names to hype Smash 5.
You know, I never seemed to realize the Blue's cannon last name is Oak. I guess I'm so used to calling him Gary Oak, and when ever I call Blue, its only by his first name.
Blue Oak doesn't have the ring that Gary Oak has.
Or he could use new characters that come out between the end of Smash 4 DLC and the beginning of development of this hypothetical sequel. Most of the newcomers revealed in the lead up to Smash 4's launch were characters that didn't even exist at the time Brawl came out.
I'm always gonna lead towards making the current game the best it could possibly be rather than saving stuff for a game that Sakurai might never even make.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Lucas and Roy were gambles on how they would sell imo.
Both were Japanese only characters and were vets of Smash, but not particularly popular when they were actually on the roster.
And even then, I kind of wonder how they sold. A few months later, and Ryu is the only DLC character that gets any consistent tournament play, and even then, it's not much.
Obviously Smash DLC is going to sell well regardless, but it would be interesting to know just how well specific characters were.
I'd guess Mewtwo was the least bought, pretty much entirely because of the promotion. And Ryu being the most bought because he comes with a stage and is an entirely new character, while Roy and Lucas are probably somewhere in the middle.
Both were Japanese only characters and were vets of Smash, but not particularly popular when they were actually on the roster.
And even then, I kind of wonder how they sold. A few months later, and Ryu is the only DLC character that gets any consistent tournament play, and even then, it's not much.
Obviously Smash DLC is going to sell well regardless, but it would be interesting to know just how well specific characters were.
I'd guess Mewtwo was the least bought, pretty much entirely because of the promotion. And Ryu being the most bought because he comes with a stage and is an entirely new character, while Roy and Lucas are probably somewhere in the middle.
Dr. Buni
Member
If you say so. I have no reasons for wanting Sakurai to hold on Inkling (example) until Smash 5 (otherwise I wouldn't have voted on her on the ballot), but if that happens I will not be surprised.
Also I really want my Rhythm Heaven rep.
Gary is the anime character tho D:
It honestly depends on what Sakurai wants to do with the Inklings. As stated before, the Splatoon Mii costumes seem more like a quick way to promote Splatoon than a means to appease Inkling fans from the ballot (which, once again, is basically a glorified suggestion box) judging by when the costumes were announced. Since said announcement, Splatoon became a massive hit (by Wii U standards) & gained a huge following. In theory, Sakurai could strike while the iron is hot. But in all honesty, who knows what he's thinking right now.
As for the Rhythm Heaven rep, it's like I said before. While they aren't as inevitable as the Inklings (in some form as playable), the fact that Sakurai attempted to add a rep for Smash 4 does bode well for him potentially trying again. If that second attempt is as Smash 4 DLC or for Smash 5 remains to be seen.
When I say "Stand alone" here I mean on the level in which you could regard them highly popular, not in the poll but as an overall character/series. K Rool, Ridley, Agent 3 are not on that level. Inkling I can see being argued on that level with the amount of fan art we've seen.
Let's go even farther-- imagine a character made up of Hanafuda cards or an anthropomorphic Game Boy system. In the main game, we can totally believe this might happen as a wtf character out of the blue like we did with Mr. G&W and Wii Fit Trainer.
If you then look at other characters in the game you have some that have fans but are definitely more niche titles (Earthbound, F-Zero). You then have titles that are a step above that (Kirby, Kid Icarus) and finally the A list games like Mario and Pokemon.
Street Fighter having a newcomer is very much in the top spot. What I'm basically saying here is to not expect a character from the niche titles even if we can sit here and argue about them being in the main game. You're not going to see a wtf-character chosen for DLC, you're probably not going to see a niche title character either, or someone who is considered retro.
Which really makes me wonder if Layton is on the same level as Street Fighter...
Let's go even farther-- imagine a character made up of Hanafuda cards or an anthropomorphic Game Boy system. In the main game, we can totally believe this might happen as a wtf character out of the blue like we did with Mr. G&W and Wii Fit Trainer.
If you then look at other characters in the game you have some that have fans but are definitely more niche titles (Earthbound, F-Zero). You then have titles that are a step above that (Kirby, Kid Icarus) and finally the A list games like Mario and Pokemon.
Street Fighter having a newcomer is very much in the top spot. What I'm basically saying here is to not expect a character from the niche titles even if we can sit here and argue about them being in the main game. You're not going to see a wtf-character chosen for DLC, you're probably not going to see a niche title character either, or someone who is considered retro.
Which really makes me wonder if Layton is on the same level as Street Fighter...
Dr. Buni
Member
I think if being on the level of Street Fighter is a requirement for a character to be a DLC newcomer, then we are not getting any DLC newcomers besides Ryu. We could get Snake back (veteran) and that is it. Even the requested by some Simon Belmont isn't on the same level as Ryu, I think. Who else there is?
I think it is also important to have in mind that what is considered a niche title in the west is not necessarily a niche title in Japan. Rhythm Heaven is as niche as it gets here, but quite popular on Japan (according to popularity polls, at least). So while I agree extremely obscure characters have no chance of being DLC (like say, Lip from Panel de Pon or Takamaru), characters like a Rhythm Heaven, Agent 3/Inkling and maybe Wonder Red shouldn't be discarded yet.
I think it is also important to have in mind that what is considered a niche title in the west is not necessarily a niche title in Japan. Rhythm Heaven is as niche as it gets here, but quite popular on Japan (according to popularity polls, at least). So while I agree extremely obscure characters have no chance of being DLC (like say, Lip from Panel de Pon or Takamaru), characters like a Rhythm Heaven, Agent 3/Inkling and maybe Wonder Red shouldn't be discarded yet.
What gives me a little bit of hope is the fact a new Rhythm Heaven game was recently released and the (hopefully) eventual NA/EU release of the game could be seen as a good time to introduce the scrapped Rhythm Heaven rep to Smash 4 by Sakurai. I am probably setting myself up for disappointments (not only because of the RH rep, but also because I am really hoping for Dixie and maybe Inkling), but I can't help myself.
I would say being niche in one region is probably enough to not include them.
I'd also probably take a guess to say we could see newcomers, but from titles already in the game that are of the same level...so prepare for a Mario newcomer.
Whoops. Namco accidentally leaked a TGS Smash Bros surprise.
Hahaha. I forgot about TGS. Wonder if there'll be any Smash news. (If my memory serves me right, we've never gotten Smash news at TGS before, so unlikly)
powerdrain
Member
This is something I thought of recently too, and don't forget amiibo production costs and everything that comes after that like distribution etc. Do they want a product coming out for a niche character that people won't buy, especially as amiibo stock is slowly becoming less scarce now. They already promised Ryu, Lucas and Roy amiibo right? So I'd imagine if anything follows them they'd get one too. Ryu will have no problems but Lucas and Roy I'd imagine won't be mass produced since they're less popular.
It's these things you have to think about when it comes to DLC and stuff. It costs them dev time and money to get the resources and do all the planning involved in creating a single fighting game character, and DLC isn't something they HAVE to do - the game stands on two feet itself already, and anything extra we get is just a bonus, so they'll want it to be special.
It's why me hoping for Krystal or Dixie (to a lesser extent) is a bit of a pipe dream at this point, but whatever they go with I'll support anyway.
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Romanes Eunt Domus
Nintendo doesn't attend TGS.
That's what Space World is for.
When thinking of who Sakurai plans to bring to the game, I come back to this quote often.
You can have fans of a character, but it's way different in a game like this when your favorite character has been cut. Adding back cuts is completely fan service, and I think expecting newcomers that are just popular-at-the-moment to make it in is expecting a lot. As powerdrain mentioned (and I've mentioned before) the costs are a factor in this game too.
You can have fans of a character, but it's way different in a game like this when your favorite character has been cut. Adding back cuts is completely fan service, and I think expecting newcomers that are just popular-at-the-moment to make it in is expecting a lot. As powerdrain mentioned (and I've mentioned before) the costs are a factor in this game too.
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Romanes Eunt Domus
I don't know how you can find lvl 9s in Smash 4 relaxing. The fuckers perfect shield like 95% of my attacks and get perfect spot dodges all the time.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Donkey Kong Jr is in Mario Maker.
His first appearance in awhile (since Mario Tennis 64?).
His first appearance in awhile (since Mario Tennis 64?).
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Romanes Eunt Domus
I can only imagine the K. Rool fans after Donkey Kong Jr. is revealed.
TheDinoman
Member
I think it's also the first time Ness has been playable since Earthbound back in 1994.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Well I was just looking through the list and it's a bunch of well know popular characters, or characters that could conceivably have Amiibo.
And then there's DK Jr.
I don't know. Just figured Nintendo forgot he existed. Maybe he does have a chance...
And then there's DK Jr.
I don't know. Just figured Nintendo forgot he existed. Maybe he does have a chance...
Geminosity
Member
I think I've already stated my thoughts on how reflective polls are of what's likely in the ballot itself (aka not at all), but I'm still quite pleasantly surprised to see some characters like Ashley managed 5 or more votes despite not even having a dedicated option on the poll (you have to choose other and type in the same as a previously voted 'other' entry) 
Green Mamba
Member
Outside of minor cameo appearances his last appearance was NES Remix, or, barring that (as it's kind of cheating), Game & Watch Gallery 4.
Fuck yes! Mario Maker is game of the year!
Dr. Buni
Member
So we are not getting newcomers from new/unrepresented series at all
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
So we are not getting newcomers from new/unrepresented series at all
No one know but Sakurai. Whatever he want to do is fine with me!
TheDinoman
Member
So we are not getting newcomers from new/unrepresented series at all
Outside of Splatoon and Rhythm Heaven, I don't think there's many new series that really warrant a playable character in Smash, at least at the moment.
Dr. Buni
Member
Fine with me too, what other choice do I have but accept his choices? xDNo one know but Sakurai. Whatever he want to do is fine with me!
The Wondeeful 101?
What about third party series?Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
They might as well add the main character from Disaster: Day of Crisis.Fine with me too, what other choice do I have but accept his choices? xD
The Wondeeful 101?
Let's be fair. Although it did flop, The Wonderful 101 has way more cult popularity than Disaster. I honestly don't get why the series gets so much hate in this thread.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Not buying DLC character!
I will buy whatever he release to the public. Yes, even Waluigi (ugh) and Bayonetta (double ugh).
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
That's a massively unequal comparison. At least Captain Rainbow was mentioned once by a (then-)member of NoA at some point in the last two years.
Dr. Buni
Member
Funny of you to say that, because I haven't bought any DLC yet. I only have Mewtwo because I own both versions. I will buy the DLC stages eventually, though and Wolf when he is released.Not buying DLC character!
I will buy whatever he release to the public. Yes, even Waluigi (ugh) and Bayonetta (double ugh).
I don't even like The Wonderful 101 (sorry, NintendoGAF), but I think a character from the series would be a perfect fit for Smash. Much better than freaking Bayonetta, at least.
So we are not getting newcomers from new/unrepresented series at all
Eh, not necessarily. Rhythm Heaven? Probably not.
If we go third party with worldwide knowledge, we could see Sir Arthur from Ghosts 'n Goblins, something like Cactuar or a White/Black mage from Final Fantasy, Banjo Kazooie if they really wanted to go that route, Leon from Resident Evil 4, or a character from Soulcalibur II (like Yoshimitsu who could rep two series.) All of those series/games have been in the highest performers for a Nintendo system sales wise much like Street Fighter II was for the SNES. Not all of these are well known like Ryu however.
First party you still have faves like Captain Toad and uh...to a lesser extent I guess Dixie Kong and Impa maybe.
I really just want them announced at the least at this point...it's like I need just a stage at the least...going through withdrawal.
Dr. Buni
Member
Are you serious about Leon, Yoshimitsu and stuff? Other than Banjo & Kazooie and a Square rep, the characters you mentioned are all bizarre picks for Smash. Yes, even Sir Arthur, which would be a pretty funny/interesting addition to Smash.
I can't agree with the way you are viewing the likeness of DLC newcomers. Impa and Captain Toad being somehow more likely DLC additions than an Inkling, a representative of a popular series on Japan (Rhythm Heaven*) and King K. Rool is bizarre to me. Though it's entirely possible that these characters will be added to Smash instead of characters with more vocal fanbases, I think that would be a weird since the next DLCs are supposed to be fanservice. Also, Smash is pretty much a marketing tool for Nintendo (otherwise I doubt we would have so much new Fire Emblem content), so I think Inkling not being DLC would be weird and a huge missed opportunity.
*Just to clarify, I am not really expecting a RH DLC character, but if there's an unrepresented modern Nintendo series that I could see having a DLC playable representative (Splatoon aside), it's Rhythm Heaven.
I hear W101 talked about a lot from GAF to SmashBoards & even the likes of Reddit, Facebook, & YouTube. The only time I hear about Captain Rainbow is from WiiFolderJosh/Josh Thomas/TheBitBlock & his discussions with RogersBase.
To be fair, Rhythm Heaven is the biggest Nintendo franchise without a playable rep in Smash (baring maybe Splatoon).
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