Oh, I agree. It's Street Fighter. Mika is unquestionably Japanese, but she has (bleached) blonde hair and is ostensibly wearing blue contacts. This is FAR from a stretch in showy Japanese pro wrestling, which goes far to obfuscate or even integrate its participants' ethnicities into its kayfabe narratives (see Aja Kong etc...)
Street Fighter V Roster Discussion: P-P-P-P-PATTERN BREAKER
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
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Oh, I agree. It's Street Fighter. Mika is unquestionably Japanese, but she has (bleached) blonde hair and is ostensibly wearing blue contacts. This is FAR from a stretch in showy Japanese pro wrestling, which goes far to obfuscate or even integrate its participants' ethnicities into its kayfabe narratives (see Aja Kong etc...)
KhalilSyncere
Member
British is his nationality (i.e. where he's born/from/resides). Black is his race. He's a black british boxer. His ethnicity isn't addressed in canon probably the same as most of the obvious characters races weren't addressed in the first place, due to it being point blank obvious (until Neogaf now) what he was, lol! And he wouldn't be the first dark skin, black guy to have blue eyes.
DryEyeRelief
Member
Remy, Adon, do you want to keep playing this game?
KhalilSyncere
Member
Wasn't so much about his look there, but his credentials (black british, heavyweight boxer with "gentlemen" sensibilities). They weren't trying to make someone so obviously looking like their real life counterpart after the Tyson/Bison/Balrog legal fiascos. If anything, he's an amalgam of boxers around at the time (all of which have been named and all of which have been black), as far as fighting style, personality and looks goes. What Indian boxers does Dudley remind ya'll off? Yeah...not a gotdamn one, LOL!
Dudley's race has been debated since Street Fighter III first came out.
yurinka
Member
Mid September: 2 for TGS (Karin and Zen, new Indian character)
Early October: 1 for NYCC (Alex)
Early/mid October: 1 at the Brazil Game Show (Laura, Brazilian new character)
Early November: 1 for the Dubai World Game Expo (Rachid, new African muslim character)
Early December: if there is a new boss and isn't Rachid, they would announce it in PSX/Capcom Cup finals in addition to Akuma and maybe an additional secret character more, probably Ingrid.
I miss another event before December to announce Urien.
Early October: 1 for NYCC (Alex)
Early/mid October: 1 at the Brazil Game Show (Laura, Brazilian new character)
Early November: 1 for the Dubai World Game Expo (Rachid, new African muslim character)
Early December: if there is a new boss and isn't Rachid, they would announce it in PSX/Capcom Cup finals in addition to Akuma and maybe an additional secret character more, probably Ingrid.
I miss another event before December to announce Urien.
Dudley always has been black, like Evander Holyfield. Imagine Dudley as Holyfield cosplaying Freddy Mercury.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
Yes, they made a joke about him being white during Street Fighter 1. Their explantation is he was very sick so that's why he was pale as white.
DryEyeRelief
Member
And yet there are no debates about Birdie because...
Uh, there are. There were tons of "is Birdie supposed to be white or black?" posts when he was revealed for this game.
DryEyeRelief
Member
He could be Indian
KhalilSyncere
Member
I thought of that too, or some other latin american country, considering that a lot of latin americans have been dominating boxing for a long while now. Perhaps a middle-weight boxer of sorts with some different techniques than the usual sf boxers.
Shadoken
Member
You are free to debate on that if you want too. I dont see what Birdie has to do with Dudley.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I'm not sure there was actually any "fiasco" though. It's one of the dumber chapters in Street Fighter history, really:
They created a Mike Tyson lookalike, and named him Mike Bison. This was the 2nd time they'd done this, actually. They never actually got hit with a lawsuit, or so far as I can tell, were even threatened with one. They swapped the names on their own in America as a "preventative" measure even though legally, the name swapping wouldn't have prevented anything, as the character's name was still M. Bison in Japan. It's not as if the infringement they were hoping to avoid would have actually been avoided with that move, especially once that move made it clearly obvious what they were doing, so obvious that everyone with more than a passing interest in the game knows this story.
And all of that wouldn't have mattered anyway because they probably could have claimed parody usage and been okay.
Basically: Their legal defense was always bullshit, and was implemented pre-emptively to fend off a suit that was likely never even coming in the first place.
KhalilSyncere
Member
Yeah sure...whatever helps you sleep a night.
http://www.polygon.com/a/street-fighter-2-oral-history/chapter-2
IAN ROSE (GENERAL COUNSEL, CAPCOM USA):
There was the concern that M. Bison was way too close to Mike Tyson. The original M. Bison [in Japan became] Balrog [in the U.S.].
ScottsmithSCOTT SMITH:
The concern was Mike Tyson was still big at that time and Nintendo had Punch-Out!!, and so they just didn't want to get into it.
TOM SHIRAIWA:
[Capcom USA executives] believed they could get sued. But at that time, all the name graphics had already been done, so there was no way to create another graphic just to replace it. ... So whatever fit with the character graphics was OK. I mean, it was not the best choice. There was a lot of argument that "Vega" — that doesn't fit with the character, with the clothes. But there was no other choice. It was a reluctant decision, but getting sued is a much bigger problem.
Stone Ocean
Member
I don't think we'll get 2 characters at TGS since it's a week apart from Dubai Expo, more likely we'll get Rachid there and just Karin or Urien at TGS
What oil wrestler does Hakan remind you of? What Taekwondo practitioner does Juri remind you of? What yoga master does Dhalsim remind you of? What ninja does Vega remind you of? What Brazilian does Blanka remind you of? Not every Street Fighter character is an homage. In fact, very few are. Dudley doesn't have to be inspired by a real life boxer.
Tizoc
Member
I think you mean month apart, since TGS is in Sept. (Month 9) and Nov. is when Dubai Game Expo is held (Month 11).
Puerto Rico and Mexico especially, but Mexico got reps! Give us one. But yea I was thinking a lightweight boxer.
They could take some stuff they gave Steve in SFxT
DryEyeRelief
Member
Because everything being said about Dudley could be applied to Birdie?
Shadoken
Member
What parameters? Do people argue about Elena,Raven..etc who aren't overly exaggerated like Balrog or Birdie?
Just because its dudley doesnt mean theres some big conspiracy that all black characters need to be stereotypes.
And how many Indian characters are even there in Fighters? Fkin Dhalsim , and he is stereotypical as hell.
Stone Ocean
Member
notworksafe
Member
It's a stupid debate but he is right, people have been wondering if Dudley is black or indian for years
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
I guess I missed all those boxing matches that were won by tornado punches.
How is Dudley's fighting style based in any way on a specific boxer's style? I get the argument that his gentlemanly style might be related to a real person, but his actual fighting?
I know right
Hey guys is Elena black
Hey guys is Balrog black, I mean was it ever confirmed
Hey guys is DeeJay black, do you have a source
Has Capcom ever provided definitive proof that Guile is not in fact an extraterrestrial
Hey guys is Balrog black, I mean was it ever confirmed
Hey guys is DeeJay black, do you have a source
Has Capcom ever provided definitive proof that Guile is not in fact an extraterrestrial
Chun Li hasn't looked Chinese since SSF2T. I miss my Chinese warrior.
There is no conspiracy theory it show a bunch of people think. And it isn't just dudley is a bunch of black character's in video games. Ask folks about the bijillion page thread on the girl from the walking dead, or how iris from pokemon isn't black she's south asian and bunch of game characters when they don't fall under people preconceived notions of blackness, and they like that character. They are quick to claim they aren't black.
It isn't a conspiracy theory, its a thing that happens often.
Maybe the Karin reveal + a short teaser for a newcomer, like they did with Necalli?
KhalilSyncere
Member
In that he's more of a boxer's boxer (Lewis/Dudley), than a brawler boxer (Tyson/Balrog). And don't be dense man, of course there's going to be some exaggerated moves, this is a game about people throwing fireballs from their plams and jumping 15 ft. in the air.
Yep!
SolidSnakex
Member
The next big event is Game15, which takes place on September 11th. It's in Dubai and Ono has been hyping it quite a bit on Twitter. He's going to be there.
Shadoken
Member
It could , and am not even actually denying that Dudley isn't black. Almost everything points to him being black.
I just find it weird that people are getting way too upset over people believing that Dudley could be Indian and as if other races aren't stereotyped as hell.
Tizoc just said the Dubai event is in Nov. Which is it?
Shadoken
Member
This is exactly what I am trying to say.
Its as if people want to "claim" dudley to a particular race because hes awesome or something. Its down right annoying.
If Capcom were to come tomorrow and say Dudley is African or Indian. I wouldnt really care , but it seems many people here are overly trying to make him a particular race and get upset if people say otherwise.
DryEyeRelief
Member
No one is trying to own anyone.Dudley is black, that is ok. It is ok to acknowledge and discuss race in fiction or real life. Your comment is meant to squash discussion and that is not ok. " i dont see race " is bullshit.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I know. This is what I essentially just said. Legally, that decision didn't actually cover their ass at all, and they didn't actually know whether or not they were going to get sued. Hell, Mike Tyson could sue them RIGHT NOW and it'd be just as valid as it was in the early 90s. Their measure didn't prevent any lawsuit at all. Still hasn't.
lol @ me analyzing anything
I already knew of that SRK guy so I could call you out on your BS of using him as a source. No analysis needed for that. I just wanted to point that out for any readers so that there's no misleading going on about validity.
Poison actually has had official written information regarding what she's packing downstairs, BTW.
Dudley is a character where the default bias for his race is not universal (as opposed to someone like Balrog). I never even heard of him possibly being black until I went on the internet. All my buddies thought he was some kind of south asian british guy and never thought twice about it. I'm just pointing out that there is nothing concrete about his race.
I can go on all day pointing out coincidences and correlations that make him to be Indian via confirmation bias, too, but I'm being rational enough to realize he's objectively just a darker-skinned British guy. Race debates on Dudley will go nowhere. That's all I'll say on the subject.
yurinka
Member
Many SF2 character whose motivation to enter the tournament started apparently there, also appeared later in SFA, placed before in the timeline.
Some of them saw their motivation fullfilled in both SFA or SF2 games, but appeared also in SFIV.
Obviously Alex can appear in SFV if they want, doesn't matter if it's placed before or after SFIII. And btw, we don't know where SFV is placed but is likely to be between SFIV and SFIII, or after SFIII.
I think what's bothersome about isn't that people don't accept Dudley as black but that being part Indian somehow is just apparently way more likely than for there to be a part black British boxer. Maybe that's not what people are necessarily saying, but it certainly feels that way that everyone just assumed Indian as if it couldn't be anything else including black.
Whatever the case is though, trying to determine what ethnicity a Capcom character is by face is bad way to go about it.
Whatever the case is though, trying to determine what ethnicity a Capcom character is by face is bad way to go about it.
SolidSnakex
Member
He's talking about a different event. Game15 takes place between September 10-12. Ono will do whatever he's going to do on the 11th
https://www.facebook.com/PlayStatio...98762585049/10153549237780050/?type=1&theater
sixteen-bit
Member
Tom was in his Alex's ending. Are you sure he was killed?
Yeah this is a really frustrating aspect of discussion about fictional characters. Someone, somewhere will always come out to say some obviously/likely Black character "clearly isn't Black but _______" and its super frustrating. You almost never see these sorts of gymnastics for characters of other races. I especially like (and by like I mean hate) the good old "they can't be Black because they are nationality X" as if ethnicity and nationality are mutually exclusive.
Colorblindness has always been bullshit and always will be. You don't ignore color, you just treat everybody well regardless of what it is.
DryEyeRelief
Member
It's like the story of dbz fans thinking goku is white because they lived in middle america I guess.
Alright. Ill add my two cents then, Dudley neither look black or indian, i mean sure he can be one but personaly to me he looks like a mix race character. Maybe his parents were indian and black? Though one of them are probably white.
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