JackAubrey
Member
Sounds a bit like the Grid games, they used sponsorships like that and rivals.
Forza Motorsport 6 has "wet weather, 3D puddles and night races" + more
- Thread starter Steverulez
- Start date
Sounds a bit like the Grid games, they used sponsorships like that and rivals.
drugstore_cowboy
Member
I only played the first GRID for a half an hour.
The original TOCA was pretty interesting, thought it was a bit goofy at first but came to like a bit of personality.
The original TOCA was pretty interesting, thought it was a bit goofy at first but came to like a bit of personality.
JackAubrey
Member
But what I still don't understand is why so many of you don't even like seeing something you don't have to use. What spoils the game for you in something being on screen that you don't ever intend to interact with?
Really enjoyed the demo. For some reason thought I wouldn't after reading some of the posts. Mods feel out of place and should only be for extra cash, not things like extra grip which is odd. During the night race, less grip was very noticeable, was driving similar to how I was in the day race, but was missing turns like crazy.
CrudeDiatribe
Member
The Indy cars in FM5 weren't butt clenching in that way either, it's changes in FM6.
I am not. I didn't even talk about cars and tracks. That's a good thing, I like that, I just find the idea of a progression mechanic usually tied to free to play games worrying in a $60 game. I can't judge the final game because I don't have it yet. I'm not saying the game is F2P or fully structured like one. In fact, I wouldn't have a problem with that system at all if it WAS a free to play game. I have no issue with that. The mods system and priza wheel stuff is very much the kind of stuff you find in F2P games though. Hell, I only assumed you could buy those because it instantly reminded me of that.
I don't know, maybe the sense of the serious sim aspects being 'dumbed down' purely by association with power-ups and whatnot. From a purely personal standpoint it's frustrating, because with relatively little work (relative, that is, to the production of the game as a whole) Forza could embrace serious motorsport simulation, and maybe even be a class leader. Most of the elements are already there (cars, tracks, licenses, tuning, physics, audio, graphics) it's just that a select few critical ones (quali, pit stops, structure) are conspicuous by their absense. And it's baffling. Forza wouldn't need to compromise its broad appeal at all as the 'fun, arcadey' bits could still be on the disc, but with just a little more work the serious sim crowd could be dragged on board too.
Thing is Forza is all sorts to all people. I used to run a league back in FM 3 days and we had qualifying etc. used to spend all week setting up my car, tuning and running practise laps. To me it was great. Never bothered with football and such.
I had an accident which enabled me to have a lot of time off work but unable to use my wheel. I started getting into the painting scene and enjoyed that too.
Dan has spoken multiple times about the broad appeal. It's not about identity crisis, it wants to be all things to all people.
Maybe the serious sim crowd are too much of a niche market to warrant spending any time on?.
I am sure that a team as experienced as T10 know their market, and have done the business models to decide where to pitch it.
All people except authentic motorsport people, it seems.
And isn't being 'all things to all people' another way of saying 'jack of all trades'? And we know the ending to that little ditty...
It's been an interesting discussion.
I'm sure they have. But why the pretense? Why even bother with any authenticity? Why get so close to simulating motorsport, then shy away from it? Why not offer that as an option when you're so close to having it?
Because it makes little Johnny feel like he's a real race car driver without all the really stuffy sim nonsense?
If I were drilling down into putting labels on things, I'd say it's a pseudo-sim more than anything, it's as good a name as "sim-cade" or any other nonsense.
JackAubrey
Member
I think there's plenty of people into "authentic" motorsport than can enjoy this and similar games.
The game just doesn't cater for people into "authentic" motorsport who don't want the game to cater to anyone else.
You might be right, but at least have the sim stuff hidden behind a secret door that only adults can access..!
Elitist..... Lol.
I'm with you, but I would imagine they don't want to (can't afford to?) divert away the dev team to focus on something that 90% of their demographic won't touch.
JackAubrey
Member
I'd hate that the games industry got so up itself it created games my children couldn't get into and enjoy, with a scalable experience to cope with their abilities.
My kids (all under ten) really love Forza Motorsport.
My kids (all under ten) really love Forza Motorsport.
Are you kidding me? It's called aspirational brands. It's a standard marketing thing, you don't offer a perfect sim, because that's not what most people want. They want to feel like they are playing a sim.
I whole-heartedly agree that there should be a third Forza pillar that goes that direction. But to suddenly think that every game should be at least as, or more, hardcore than Project CARS is idiotic.
How much of a commercial success was Project CARS? What if there were five games exactly like that coming out in the same year, how successful would each one be?
JackAubrey
Member
I agree with this.
And the truth is if you want an elitist "hardcore" motorsport game there are loads of them on PC. And for a supposed rare experience you can get it on Xbox and PS4 in the form of Pcars (though personally I don't think it is one of those games but many of you do).
Meanwhile games like Forza are rare. Heck you can't even get one at all on PlayStation 4.
So trying to push Forza into being an elitist "authentic" motorsport game seems a bit unfair for those who enjoy the type of game it already is. Because the experience you want can be had from many sources, but we don't have as much choice.
There are lots of things I'd change about Forza, but its focus is not one of them.
DirtyLarry
Member
I personally think as time has gone on they have made it more accessible to the casual player. But they also have left in the things for the people who enjoy the simulation side more.
I would say give credit where credit is due. They have done their best to try and make a game and series that appeals to the widest audience possible. As a result, you are going to always have people on both sides who feel they have not done enough to appeal to their side, but I do think Forza especially has found a pretty good balance of making it arcade enough so people like myself, who struggled when it was more simulation, can enjoy it and play it now, while doing their best to retain the more simulation elements so people who enjoy that can still go ahead and do those things.
It's not an easy thing to accomplish by any means, but I think they do a pretty decent job at it. Then again, my perspective is no doubt of someone who enjoys the more non simulation side of things.
FTR, It was not until Forza 4 I was actually able to play and more importantly enjoy playing the series. I tried to enjoy them, but the first 3 games were too simulation for me, and I just could not get into them. I had neither the patience, nor the skill. In fact I remember in 3 hitting a very specific wall as I just could not get into tuning my car, and for where I was at in the game, tuning was mandatory to make any real progression. They lost me at that specific point, and I was done.
4 was the game that finally hooked me, and I have loved the series ever since.
It is also the same exact story with Gran Turismo. I did not enjoy it myself until the release of 5.
So I think it is a pretty tough position they are in. Remain loyal to their original fan base while broadening the appeal of the series. I personally think they have done a great job of doing just that, but as I admitted, I was not a big fan or player when it was more simulation like.
I would say give credit where credit is due. They have done their best to try and make a game and series that appeals to the widest audience possible. As a result, you are going to always have people on both sides who feel they have not done enough to appeal to their side, but I do think Forza especially has found a pretty good balance of making it arcade enough so people like myself, who struggled when it was more simulation, can enjoy it and play it now, while doing their best to retain the more simulation elements so people who enjoy that can still go ahead and do those things.
It's not an easy thing to accomplish by any means, but I think they do a pretty decent job at it. Then again, my perspective is no doubt of someone who enjoys the more non simulation side of things.
FTR, It was not until Forza 4 I was actually able to play and more importantly enjoy playing the series. I tried to enjoy them, but the first 3 games were too simulation for me, and I just could not get into them. I had neither the patience, nor the skill. In fact I remember in 3 hitting a very specific wall as I just could not get into tuning my car, and for where I was at in the game, tuning was mandatory to make any real progression. They lost me at that specific point, and I was done.
4 was the game that finally hooked me, and I have loved the series ever since.
It is also the same exact story with Gran Turismo. I did not enjoy it myself until the release of 5.
So I think it is a pretty tough position they are in. Remain loyal to their original fan base while broadening the appeal of the series. I personally think they have done a great job of doing just that, but as I admitted, I was not a big fan or player when it was more simulation like.
Kleegamefan
K. LEE GAIDEN
Where the fuck is the Forza 6 demo? I went to the store and it has "the Forza fuel challenge " which is some kind of sweepstakes I have to register for
. So I go deeper in the store under "games" then "Forza 6" and it has all the game information and add ons but no demo. What am I doing wrong?
fuck that
JackAubrey
Member
I used to play all the Papyrus games. Had a PC wheel setup. It was even part of my job writing about this stuff.
I've got kids now, other interests, a wife. I just don't have the time, patience or the inclination to get spend hours tuning a car for a practice session. My thrills need to be a bit more immediate. Forza strikes a good balance for me.
Diablohead
Member
rain racing with no assists and manual transmission is really fun, shame the challenges after you beat the demo the first time are all single laps.
I'd say you're at least getting close; it might simply be an unfeasible investment for them to produce something that isn't within their core values and to make sure that it's done with the quality and attention to detail T10 is known for and use as a baseline for anything in the game. They probably wouldn't be the developers to create a half-assed attempt nor are they ones that usually allow for maximum game customisability.
I'm with Mascot though, it's certainly the reason why Forza isn't quite the title for me, even when it's certainly one of the system sellers for me. I'm actually more excited to be able to play Horizon eventually, just because it satisfies my need for a open-world racer better than FM does my need for a motorsport game. Still, there's no doubt that FM6 will be a fantastic game.
Unless I just got a nice glitch when I played you should be able to lap as many times as you want in the Ford GT rivals event.
soundscream
Member
Hydroplaning with a wheel is a exhilarating feeling.
Cept for the last one with the ford GT in brazil.
That one is unlimited laps.
Which is why i think we should do that one for a time trial event, for those interested.
The course/challenge makes me think back to the forza motorsport 3 demo where you got to run the GT3 flying lizard Porsche on Camino Viejo.
I got a 1:36.442 there at the moment.
Diablohead
Member
The F3 demo is the one which sticks with me the most, even more so then the original forza motorsport 1 demo, I honestly think it's because of the lizard porsche hotlaps.
Driving in the rain is truly an experience that needs to be uh...experienced...
Turn 10 have worked magic in this regard.
Overall handling feels much better than previous games. Feels a lot more tighter, focused. I also noticed that rumble strips and various other surfaces actually interact with your vehicle in more realistic ways than before. A lot more dynamic.
Sound is again, great as always. The environmental ambiance, reverb..etc sounds so much more realistic, natural. They have done very well in capturing what it feels/sounds like to have a Ferrari's V8 engine and exhaust notes bounce off different surfaces and spaces.
Disappointed however that again, trans effects, physical loading..etc is still not there.
Raceroom is king in this regard and the benchmark for racing games imo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5SMi6FfyyI
These mods things though. I mean what the fuck?
Get more grip mod?
What the fuck?
Seriously, Forza Horizon would be a much better game to implement these sort of ideas.
I don't know, FM6's attitude seems soft in ways. Seems light hearted.
Forza Motorsport to me, resembles a camp site full of teenagers holding hands and singing kumbaya. It's like the U.N of racing games hosting a diplomatic conference of some kind.
Pcars in contrast.....yeah, that's all I'm going to say.
Oh Dan Beardawalt. You want to appeal to every Tom, Dick and Harry. You want to appeal to that 8 year old kid with the Lamborghini poster on the wall. To that 80 year old grandpa who sits playing Xbox in his uniquely constructed rocking chair cockpit. To those French women who, if I heard correctly, seem to make up the majority of Forza fans or something.
What about me Dan?
What about ol' Sal.?
I thought we had something special mate.
That 'true authentic motorsport racing experience' is what I'm after Mr. Beardawalt and it seems you don't want to make me happy.
You broke my heart, Beardy...you broke my heart...
Turn 10 have worked magic in this regard.
Overall handling feels much better than previous games. Feels a lot more tighter, focused. I also noticed that rumble strips and various other surfaces actually interact with your vehicle in more realistic ways than before. A lot more dynamic.
Sound is again, great as always. The environmental ambiance, reverb..etc sounds so much more realistic, natural. They have done very well in capturing what it feels/sounds like to have a Ferrari's V8 engine and exhaust notes bounce off different surfaces and spaces.
Disappointed however that again, trans effects, physical loading..etc is still not there.
Raceroom is king in this regard and the benchmark for racing games imo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5SMi6FfyyI
These mods things though. I mean what the fuck?
Get more grip mod?
What the fuck?
Seriously, Forza Horizon would be a much better game to implement these sort of ideas.
I don't know, FM6's attitude seems soft in ways. Seems light hearted.
Forza Motorsport to me, resembles a camp site full of teenagers holding hands and singing kumbaya. It's like the U.N of racing games hosting a diplomatic conference of some kind.
Pcars in contrast.....yeah, that's all I'm going to say.
Oh Dan Beardawalt. You want to appeal to every Tom, Dick and Harry. You want to appeal to that 8 year old kid with the Lamborghini poster on the wall. To that 80 year old grandpa who sits playing Xbox in his uniquely constructed rocking chair cockpit. To those French women who, if I heard correctly, seem to make up the majority of Forza fans or something.
What about me Dan?
What about ol' Sal.?
I thought we had something special mate.
That 'true authentic motorsport racing experience' is what I'm after Mr. Beardawalt and it seems you don't want to make me happy.
You broke my heart, Beardy...you broke my heart...
All would be forgiven if I see my classic Aussie cars though....
Bobnob
Member
Pcars screams sim, and then you play it.......... lol, enougth said
Just finished my second play through of the demo. This time with my TX wheel. Graphics looks good its just that Turn 10 hasn't figured out (or aren't trying to) how to get realistic lighting. The color pallet is just too cartoonish to me. Driveclub and the new Need for Speed game seems to have gotten the color and lighting right.
The good, for me was the rain. The wet driving physics are the best I've ever experienced in a game. Unfortunately, the rain driving is so good that it makes the daytime and night driving so anticlimactic.
After playing through the demo I put on FH2 so I could get a quick back 2 back feel of the two games. What was immediately present was how alive FH2 feels. The music the environment was just a breath of fresh air. What was also apparent was the intensity of the actual races. You are dealing with the other cars, the different road surfaces, elevation changes, weather changes, interactive obstacles (tress, tables, bikes, etcs.). All with groovy toons blasting just makes for a funnier game to play to me. That being said the Forza 6 demo was good, but it just made me appreciate just how awesome FH2 is. Can't wait to see the weather enhancements Playground brings to FH3. 3D mud puddles, maybe 3D snow? Can't wait.
The good, for me was the rain. The wet driving physics are the best I've ever experienced in a game. Unfortunately, the rain driving is so good that it makes the daytime and night driving so anticlimactic.
After playing through the demo I put on FH2 so I could get a quick back 2 back feel of the two games. What was immediately present was how alive FH2 feels. The music the environment was just a breath of fresh air. What was also apparent was the intensity of the actual races. You are dealing with the other cars, the different road surfaces, elevation changes, weather changes, interactive obstacles (tress, tables, bikes, etcs.). All with groovy toons blasting just makes for a funnier game to play to me. That being said the Forza 6 demo was good, but it just made me appreciate just how awesome FH2 is. Can't wait to see the weather enhancements Playground brings to FH3. 3D mud puddles, maybe 3D snow? Can't wait.
1: The sound effect when a puddle of water is driven through is cheap and REALLY takes away from the experience.
2: Looking at the leaderboards, doesn't look like we'll be able to hide where we've got our tunes from. Haha! (about fucking time, I always guide people where I get mine from)
3: Remove the low-resolution assets from the sides of the courses. I understand it creates atmosphere, but it ALSO takes away from the overall visual presentation. And with the IQ looking leagues above Forza 5, decisions need to be made.
That is all, for now.
2: Looking at the leaderboards, doesn't look like we'll be able to hide where we've got our tunes from. Haha! (about fucking time, I always guide people where I get mine from)
3: Remove the low-resolution assets from the sides of the courses. I understand it creates atmosphere, but it ALSO takes away from the overall visual presentation. And with the IQ looking leagues above Forza 5, decisions need to be made.
That is all, for now.
I am actually curious, what are most people's thoughts on pcars in terms of how "sim" it is. I see many people in here putting it into the hardcore sim bracket yet I always remember hearing people say it was more arcade while it was still be developed. Having never played the game myself I cannot say one way or another.
Not to say it does not look nice, but I always find it odd when people say Driveclub has a realistic color palette when they released technical stuff saying they intentionally desaturate the image to create a more cinematic feel.
yea pcars surprisingly feels more planted to me
agreed really pissed they didn't improve on OPTIONS that some of us would choose to use to make the game more fun for us.
they even still limit settings and options on the most basic level. the same preset controller choices f5, fh2 had instead of allowing a simple button remap? seat adjustments? HUD remap? please gtfo it's 2015 t10.
Or what about if they opened up more "motorsport" career settings for people automatically if they choose to play with a certain percentage of higher difficulty.
that's my only beef... quit with the compulsion to dictate to us exactly how we are allowed to enjoy the tools they have provided here and lock them behind their personal vision.
PCars was unplayable for me on XBONE. I've played the Forza demo and I really love it and I'm not a fan of the other games in the series (love FH though) as they always seem so soul-less.
The demo has convinced me to buy a FM game for the first time ever. I'll probably trade in PCars to get it, which says everything about the two games - in my opinion.
Shortt Sirket
Member
1. Seriously, it is awful. The sound effects for when cars hit is also equally awful.
2. I saw that too! I do pretty much all my own tuning, so no big deal there. Plus, you know, I am slow as fuck. lol
3. I agree. The crowd is worthless and just gives something for people who don't play the game to bitch about. I mean, who gives a shit?
I seriously regret buying that game. It was just pure shit on the XB1, never played a racing game with such awful controller controls.
I wish i could tune because, and I'm fucking serious, I will go through 100 tunes just to find the right one....for one car.....for one track. You can see where this gets nuts. I started to tune one time, but when i got to ride height and how it affects turning i got discouraged about it.
IlSignorCornetto
Member
So... i can't beat my record of 1,37.844 on rio with the gt 2017. Any advice? i think that in the gallery i lose too many second because i can't control the car properly.
I won't set up a quote train but it appears I haven't made myself clear. I'm not saying FM should abandon the Chuckle Brothers fluff that gives it mass appeal, I'm saying it's a shame that the authentic sim side of things has been taken 90% of the way and then left hanging. There's room for both in the game, whether they are seperate or merged. Little Timmy Tompkins could turn off the pit stops and the qualifying if it leads to bedwetting, and his older brother could avoid the power-ups. This is even MORE in line with our perception of FM trying to be everything to everybody.
CrudeDiatribe
Member
Have you played Titanfall? The mods are pretty much identical to that game's burn cards except that you can't use them outside of single player in FM6. As someone who's played a bunch of that and no F2P games, that's what it instantly reminded me of.
The prize wheel is from Horizon and replaces the fixed credit reward schedule of FM5 which replaced the 'choose one of these few cars' in 4, etc.
FM5 created a terrible impression with its micro-transactions, even though to many long time players the income progression in the game felt similar to previous games. It really felt like a money grab, so I can forgive anyone who's weary of micro-transactions in this game because of 5.
Being that we all live in the real world. You know something looks realistic when you see it. Forza looks good don't get wrong, but I've never looked at and said "Wow, that looks real" like I did when I first saw the new NeedforSpeed trailer. Driveclub is more inconsistent with it, but when the colors and conditions are right it leaves a more realistic impression too.
Amen. Unplayable hunk of trash. Was looking forward to it so much and was so dissapointed.
exactly
i don't see how allowing that would somehow ruin their vision or limit their appeal
would do just the opposite imo.
Diablohead
Member
If they use DLC to pump out more wet tracks in the future I hope they look into damp settings, some tracks could work well with a wet but not full of puddles variant.