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Canadian General Election (OT) - #elxn42: October 19, 2015

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I saw this on my twitter feed, and it's true. They won me over from the NDP (but everyone should still vote strategically) with their updated progressive platform. That's why I would really love an NDP supporter that says they don't like the Liberal platform to explain why with any language except "I don't trust them" (which is a fair criticism against a party but not a platform).
 
TheRealTalker said:
screw the Senate

man I hope the Liberals also get the nerve to boot them out
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What, the whole Senate? That's not how our system works. Anyone
NDP
that tells you otherwise is knowingly lying to you.

Azih said:
I am completely not sure about this but I heard somewhere that the Senate doesn't have authority over how Parliament conducts it's affairs just as the House of Commons doesn't have much authority over how the Senate acts. So it may be that the Senate can't really block electoral reform and it's just a matter for Parliament. I will find out more about that.

In any case if the Cons win the most seats but fall a fair bit short of a majority then Trudeau and Mulcair are on record as saying they will refuse to work with Haper and I see no reason why they wouldn't hold to that. So either Harper would go away leaving all possibilities open or there will be some sort of Liberal/NDP agreement and electoral reform would almost certainly be one of the major items on the negotiating table for the resulting government.

I can't see the Senate blocking something like this in any case as they are struggling with poor public opinion and blocking elected representatives from reforming their own level of government would reflect really badly on them.
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Azih said:
Yeah but the house of commons can't pass legislation on how The Senate works at all without opening up the Constitution so there's some extra complication there on how each level can interfere with the other. Like I said I know some people who know way more than I do about what Constitutional protection each level has from the other because there are obviously some.

In any case Trudeau has committed to ending FPTP and replacing it with something else. The optics of unelected Senators blocking elected MPs from cleaning up their own house is really bad in and of itself and I really don't think the Senate wants that kind of a fight.
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They'd have to pass a new system through legislation, so it would have to pass through both the House and the Senate, but I don't see why the Senate would block it -- the Conservative Senators might try, but there are enough vacancies that they could fill them all and just get legislation pushed through. (As a bonus, it would also give Trudeau a chance to show that he's sticking to his non-partisan Senate appointment proposal.)

As far as constitutional powers, the House can't defund the Senate, and its members can only show up in the Senate if invited...I know there are others, but I don't remember what they are.
 
Kinitari said:
I don't know about that. I think Justin brought it up during one debate, where Mulclair mentioned Pierre in some way, and he replied, and the reply he gave garnered a lot of support and Mulclair had his comments seen pretty negatively. I think at that point Mulclair dropped mentioning Pierre.
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Don't forget that Mulcair is a former Quebec Liberal MNA just like Minister Pierre Laporte was (R.I.P.) but Mulcair doesn't care about Laporte's family when he attacks Pierre Trudeau's decision to act when Premier Bourassa was too slow to do anything.
 
BigJonsson said:
New ekos has libs at 35.6,cons 31.1,ndp 20
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Bah, you beat me to it!

Looking through the regionals:
- I can't believe the NDP has fallen to third in Atlantic Canada. Obviously, neither they nor the Conservatives stand much chance against the Liberals out there, but coming in behind a party where the leader is despised would have to hurt.
- Ontario: LPC 43, CPC 31. If that holds up, the Liberals would have a very, very strong minority.
- those NDP numbers in Manitoba...yikes. I take back what I said a few days ago about Blaikie having a shot in his dad's old riding.
- BC and Quebec might both be crazy on election night, if those numbers hold.

Simon Belmont said:
Whoa. Ekos has had the Cons ahead in every poll until this one, right?
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Just before the weekend, the Conservatives and the Liberals traded places briefly. This represents a pretty major shift for Ekos.
 
The Conservative MP for Oakville went to an all-candidates debate and said that the Liberals are going to mandate brothels and legalize human trafficking.

If their polls keep getting worse, I'm curious how extreme the language from the Conservatives will get.

Buba Big Guns said:
Some great new Ottawa numbers as well if true.

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...lingly-high-liberal-numbers-in-ottawa-suburbs

Nepean - 47 Lib/ 40 Con

Kanata - 50 Lib/ 39 Con

These would be huge wins, essentially shutting out the CPC from Ottawa.
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!!!

Not that I don't want this to happen, but I'll believe the Conservatives lose Kanata-Carleton when I see McCrimmon seated in the House of Commons. That would be insane.
 
Azih said:
Tabris: Voting reform.
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That's a trust thing though, because on paper the Liberals are saying they have committed to voting reform and will investigate, speak to the provinces, and poll Canadians for the right decision on what format.

Sure that may mean no PR due to Liberal politics, but on paper it doesn't mean it won't be.

NetMapel said:
Seems like the gutter_trash guarantee(tm) is working better than the Tabris' guarantee(tm) in the NHL ha.
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Which NHL team is first in the west? ;)
 
Tabris said:
That's a trust thing though
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It would be if they said they supported PR. I'm kinda all about PR.I can trust them that they'll abolish FPTP. They've adamnetly refused to commit to PR despite being pushed on the issue though and that's a (disturbing) fact.
 
Tabris said:
CRNzHTSUYAA5TNT.png


I saw this on my twitter feed, and it's true. They won me over from the NDP (but everyone should still vote strategically) with their updated progressive platform. That's why I would really love an NDP supporter that says they don't like the Liberal platform to explain why with any language except "I don't trust them" (which is a fair criticism against a party but not a platform).
Click to expand...

It’s a great outcome for progressives in general that the Liberals are only in the position they are now due to adopting an unabashedly left wing platform. The gap between the Liberals and NDP is now smaller than ever.

Given the Liberal party’s mixed history of fulfilling left wing election promises however it is not unreasonable at all to temper enthusiasm with some skepticism.

The NDP and Liberals are similarly positioned on a great deal of policy areas, but there remain a few differentiators between the NDP and Liberal party.

Some good promises from the NDP platform that may move a voter to choose NDP over Liberal include:
* $15 a day childcare.
* Crystal clear position in favour of PR.
* Ending interest on student loans.
 
Tabris said:
That's a trust thing though, because on paper the Liberals are saying they have committed to voting reform and will investigate, speak to the provinces, and poll Canadians for the right decision on what format.

Sure that may mean no PR due to Liberal politics, but on paper it doesn't mean it won't be.
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I don't think Canadians should be involved in decisions like that. That sort of thing should be left to researches and political scientists (i.e. people who have knowledge on the subject).
 
S-Wind said:
Did you like Harper? He was a young Prime Minister - Harper was only 3 years older than Trudeau is now
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I wonder, Who is the youngest Prime Minister in Canadian History?

Edit:
Stet said:
Clark?
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Looks like it.

"Charles Joseph Clark (Progressive Conservative Party of Canada) was sworn in as Prime Minister of Canada on June 4, 1979, the day before his 40th birthday, making him the youngest Prime Minister in Canadian history." http://pm.gc.ca/eng/prime-minister/charles-joseph-clark
 
killer rin said:
Its amazing how we started off this thread beliddling Nanos for their polling style, but now everyone is starting to follow them


Hey everyone, remember this.
I-aint even mad... WOOOOO
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I like mine better

Because i posted it last year and because the only reason trudeau has a foothold is because of the NDP

DopeyFish said:
as long as NDP keeps screwing up everywhere, trudeau has the federal election in the bag
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Simon Belmont said:
Hang on, is one of those ridings Pierre?
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Nah, he was Nepean-Carleton, but he took the more rural part when they split it up.

The good news: the Conservative candidate in Nepean, Andy Wang, was a former aide to Poilievre, so him losing is almost as nice. I'm proud to say that when Wang spoke at a charitable event I went to, I booed him.

jstripes said:
The only thing I can't believe is that Harper let him go to an all-candidates debate.
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Now we see why the Conservatives have been avoiding them as much as possible.
 
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