Support NeoGAF

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Everyone else will be playing great games

And I'll just be sitting here playing the old Harry Potter games because nostalgia.

 

[autoduelist]

I really don't think there will be disc support. There are patched ps2 isos out in the wild that have circumvented the ps2 security.

We can't have nice things because, pirates.

Yeah. Unless they're willing to create whitelists, I guess. Which then means going full circle as not everything will likely work since there will be reasons (known or unknown) why some things aren't whitelisted.

 

[GIANKRATOS]

old?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_sOOVV7e8s

 

[Vashetti]

great games

old Harry Potter games

I see no contradiction here. The first few HP games are awesome adventure games with lots of collectables and secret areas.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

I see no contradiction here. The first few HP games are awesome adventure games with lots of collectables and secret areas.

You should watch people replaying the first few harry potter games, especially the PS1 ones. They were so bland and emotionless, I can't believe how much I liked them when I was a kid.

Though the xbox/ps2 one, with the flying gryffin part, that one was awesome.

 

[androvsky]

Yeah. Unless they're willing to create whitelists, I guess. Which then means going full circle as not everything will likely work since there will be reasons (known or unknown) why some things aren't whitelisted.

I'm sure Sony can figure out a decent whitelist. They had to do it after the grand root key screwup on the PS3, so now every PS3 game released before that is whitelisted on current firmwares iirc.

As allergic as Sony is to updating the PS4's firmware, any disc support would happen in a downloadable app so it'll be easy to update frequently.

 

[Gaffi]

That compatibility list is referring to hardware-based BC (or partial hardware in the case of later PS3 revisions), which is almost always more reliable than software-based emulation.

Ah ok, didn't realize that the PS3 was hardware BC. Hmmm I don't have any experience with PS2 software emulation on PC but if you just dump the rom is there a way to run it without any enhancements? I guess the main difference would be that it's using your machine's power which is wildly different than PS2's by default so there's no real way to make it run exactly like on a PS2. If you force the frame rate to whatever the game had by default and don't add any enhancements is it still possible to have issues?

Also to anyone who thinks disk BC is unlikely due to Sony losing out on money. Wouldn't it be possible for Sony to charge a one time fee for unlocking disk BC as an app of somesort. That way everyone is (mostly) happy (I'd rather it be free but I'd pay for the feature if it worked on most games) and Sony would probably make a decent amount while keeping the their older hard core fans from getting angry about rebuying copies.

 

[Muchi Muchi Pink]

old?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_sOOVV7e8s

I'm curios if old titles running 30fps can be unlocked to run 60 on the ps4. God Hand with 60 would be incredible.

 

[nded]

old?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_sOOVV7e8s

Interesting. Improved frame rates may be dependent on whether or not the game has a hard 30fps cap.

Ah ok, didn't realize that the PS3 was hardware BC. Hmmm I don't have any experience with PS2 software emulation on PC but if you just dump the rom is there a way to run it without any enhancements? I guess the main difference would be that it's using your machine's power which is wildly different than PS2's by default so there's no real way to make it run exactly like on a PS2. If you force the frame rate to whatever the game had by default and don't add any enhancements is it still possible to have issues?

I know PCSX2 has a software mode which renders at what I assume to be the original resolution and is usually better able to reproduce certain effects that don't show up properly using the DirectX renderer. Increased framerate usually requires a bit of hackery though, if it's even possible.

 

[Vashetti]

You should watch people replaying the first few harry potter games, especially the PS1 ones. They were so bland and emotionless, I can't believe how much I liked them when I was a kid.

Though the xbox/ps2 one, with the flying gryffin part, that one was awesome.

I played the 2nd and 3rd game on my PS2 only 2-3 years ago for fun, still really enjoy them.

 

[Agent X]

Also to anyone who thinks disk BC is unlikely due to Sony losing out on money. Wouldn't it be possible for Sony to charge a one time fee for unlocking disk BC as an app of somesort. That way everyone is (mostly) happy (I'd rather it be free but I'd pay for the feature if it worked on most games) and Sony would probably make a decent amount while keeping the their older hard core fans from getting angry about rebuying copies.

It's technically possible. However, I don't believe Sony would do this, because it would play right into one of Microsoft's recent marketing ploys which proclaims "we don't make you pay to play your old games".

If Sony does offer disc compatibility, they won't charge an additional fee for it.

 

[Silent Chief]

Odin Sphere

There's an enhanced version coming out on PS4/vita in April.
It's supposed to include classic gameplay as well.

 

[DieH@rd]

Does Siren currently have a PS2 Classic release?

Yes. Here is the full list
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_PlayStation_2_Classics

 

[FinalStageBoss]

Sony asking on twitter which ps2 games we want to see on ps4 pretty much confirms to me it won't be disc based tbh

 

[DaciaJC]

Yes. Here is the full list
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_PlayStation_2_Classics

I just realized Mercenaries is available as a PS2 Classic in the EU store. How should I go about purchasing it if I live in the United States and want to play it on my main account?

 

[shiyrley]

Sony asking on twitter which ps2 games we want to see on ps4 pretty much confirms to me it won't be disc based tbh

It can be like 360 -> One BC. It's disc based, but it requires Sony to make the game compatible (because it's emulation and all that)

 

[Elios83]

Sony asking on twitter which ps2 games we want to see on ps4 pretty much confirms to me it won't be disc based tbh

Realistically it won't be disc based.
This is not PS2 BC but expanding the PS4 digital library with improved PS2 Classics.
A really different concept.
Anyway, even if it was (disc based) there would still be a compatibility list and a selection of titles so I don't think we can take this as a confirmed fact.

 

[Zakkath]

I'm gonna make a thread about this cause i'm absolutely baffled by it. How is PS2 games coming to PS4 in higher res, with better performance and trophies worthless in the least without disk support!?

What about those people who dont have PS2 disks, or god willing, never owned a PS2 before and would like to play those games? Is that such a farfetched concept to immediately dismiss?

I should rephrase then : it will be worthless to me. I have already bought those games and I have the discs still. I will not buy them again. At the very least, the disc should be used as an authentification method for a digital download (like XB1).

Also, this is the statement that Sony released about the subject : "We are working on utilizing PS2 emulation technology to bring PS2 games forward to the current generation". Unless I am mistaken (or have missed new information on the matter), the trophy support and higher res are pure speculation.

 

[onQ123]

Although the SPEs were very good at parallel computation and that's exactly what a lot of the tasks that were executed on them essentially did, the programs were still in sequential form. Unless you solved that problem (ayy lmao), your translated threads are going to run extremely slowly with almost zero GPU utilization even before we start worrying about things like how the characteristics of Cell's internal memory architecture would carry over.

As far as what could realistically be achieved, I'd imagine you'd get many times better performance running a translated Cell instruction stream on a Jaguar core than a GCN CU.

Ok recompile it to AVX , SSE4.

Yes Cell was good for it's time but I find it hard to believe that a APU made 7 years later couldn't match it running recompiled code.

it might take a lot of work but I still don't think it's impossible.

 

[Vashetti]

Ok recompile it to AVX , SSE4.

Yes Cell was good for it's time but I find it hard to believe that a APU made 7 years later couldn't match it running recompiled code.

it might take a lot of work but I still don't think it's impossible.

I don't think we'll see Sony make an attempt at PS3 emulation until PS5 at least.

The Cell really is a complex beast, there's a reason devs hated it.

 

[DieH@rd]

I just realized Mercenaries is available as a PS2 Classic in the EU store. How should I go about purchasing it if I live in the United States and want to play it on my main account?

~

Create UK account
purchase UK PSN wallet topup card [cdkeys.com, amazon.co.uk or others]
add funds & purchase game
load UK account on PS3, activate account [so that it's software is shared with all other accounts on your console] & download game
go back to you main account, the game should be listed there

Sony allows one PS3 account to be "activated" on two consoles [just one for PS4], so you can share that purchase with another friend/family member who has PS3.

 

[Nocturno999]

It's technically possible. However, I don't believe Sony would do this, because it would play right into one of Microsoft's recent marketing ploys which proclaims
"we don't make you pay to play your old games".

If Sony does offer disc compatibility, they won't charge an additional fee for it.

Good point. That quote was a serious kick in the balls to Sony.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I should rephrase then : it will be worthless to me. I have already bought those games and I have the discs still. I will not buy them again. At the very least, the disc should be used as an authentification method for a digital download (like XB1).

Then you should make it clear that its for you only. If your not one who will buy them, others will.

Also, this is the statement that Sony released about the subject : "We are working on utilizing PS2 emulation technology to bring PS2 games forward to the current generation". Unless I am mistaken (or have missed new information on the matter), the trophy support and higher res are pure speculation.

The entire point of this emulation conversation is that the games we do know have been emulated feature support for higher res(4x infact) and trophies

 

[Muchi Muchi Pink]

It can be like 360 -> One BC. It's disk based, but it requires Sony to make the game compatible (because it's emulation and all that)

Sry I don't want to sound like an asshole (again), but it's disc not disk in this case

 

[REDSLATE]

I really don't think there will be disc support. There are patched ps2 isos out in the wild that have circumvented the ps2 security.

We can't have nice things because, pirates.

That's not entirely true. We have several nice things that wouldn't otherwise be possible without piracy. In fact, significant strides in preservation have been made due to less than legal developments.

 

[shiyrley]

Sry I don't want to sound like an asshole (again), but it's disc not disk in this case

Thanks, English is not my native language.

 

[CentralScrutinizer]

Good point. That quote was a serious kick in the balls to Sony.

Depends on how you look at it. I own ten ps2 classics on PS3, if they transfer for free then I still get to play the games I already own at no extra charge. Can easily still be a positive PR move even without disc based emulation.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Depends on how you look at it. I own ten ps2 classics on PS3, if they transfer for free then I still get to play the games I already own at no extra charge. Can easily still be a positive PR move even without disc based emulation.

I can only hope this happens. I own like 25+ PS2 classics on PS3 and like 30 PS1 classics...just having them transfer to PS4 with res upgrades and the like for free would be just amazing...and hopefully then PSP at some point

Then they'd have a super functioning classics ecosystem between Vita, PS3 and PS4...

 

[Newtype-001]

I hope we get a wide screen option...

 

[Kenzodielocke]

Interesting. Improved frame rates may be dependent on whether or not the game has a hard 30fps cap.

I mean, you can also improve capped 30fps games by having a more steady 30fps.

 

[meanspartan]

I'm gonna make a thread about this cause i'm absolutely baffled by it. How is PS2 games coming to PS4 in higher res, with better performance and trophies worthless in the least without disk support!?

What about those people who dont have PS2 disks, or god willing, never owned a PS2 before and would like to play those games? Is that such a farfetched concept to immediately dismiss?

Im not buying my big ps2 library again. This is only meaningful if it works basically like a simpler pcsx2 on ps4, upscaling the games just like pcsx2 does even playing off a disc.

If you wanna buy digital classics cool for you I guess. Useless to me.

 

[meanspartan]

What if the extra chip in psvr's box can combine with ps4 to give it enough power to emulate ps3?

/pulledoutofmyass

 

[IAmRandom31]

Forcing people to rebuy PS2 games for awesome emulation just sounds " smart " to me by Sony.

This is all a business. Get that money Sony!

 

[Danlord]

What if the extra chip in psvr's box can combine with ps4 to give it enough power to emulate ps3?

/pulledoutofmyass

No. The chip inside of the Processing Unit for PlayStation VR will not offer any additional rendering power to the PS4. It only handles 3D Audio, Unwarping the VR image to TV and splitting it to both TV and HDMI and processing sensor input data.

 

[labx]

Nocturne... YES!

 

[IrishNinja]

The Warriors, and to a slightly lesser extent, The Thing, are two early movie adaptions that are actually great. The Warriors is also available via PSP for Vita and is just as good. If you've seen the film, play the game. If you haven't seen the film, see the film too.

oh yeah, The Thing is definitely a gem! sucks that i saved like right before 2 of my teammates turned & have to start all over, haha...so very low on supplies

 

[Inuhanyou]

Im not buying my big ps2 library again. This is only meaningful if it works basically like a simpler pcsx2 on ps4, upscaling the games just like pcsx2 does even playing off a disc.

If you wanna buy digital classics cool for you I guess. Useless to me.

I'm just saying, if people wanna say that, put it in the personal tense. Not everybody thinks that, much less is asking why it is worth anything

 

[Hades Hotgun]

I can only hope this happens. I own like 25+ PS2 classics on PS3 and like 30 PS1 classics...just having them transfer to PS4 with res upgrades and the like for free would be just amazing...and hopefully then PSP at some point

Then they'd have a super functioning classics ecosystem between Vita, PS3 and PS4...

I'm in the same boat, I have close to 100 classics between ps1 and ps2, so even just support for classics would be huge for me. The leaked pegi ratings make me think we will see more robust effort to get releases for classics on ps4.

 

[Finalow]

that's a start.

next step should be disc emulation and then (finally^) PS1 games.

 

[DaciaJC]

~

Create UK account
purchase UK PSN wallet topup card [cdkeys.com, amazon.co.uk or others]
add funds & purchase game
load UK account on PS3, activate account [so that it's software is shared with all other accounts on your console] & download game
go back to you main account, the game should be listed there

Sony allows one PS3 account to be "activated" on two consoles [just one for PS4], so you can share that purchase with another friend/family member who has PS3.

Awesome, thanks mate!

 

[Ivan Amiibo]

Forcing people to rebuy PS2 games for awesome emulation just sounds " smart " to me by Sony.

This is all a business. Get that money Sony!

Its like they just want to make money off of us. Sometimes i question sony's committment to us gamers.

Theyre really risking their good will and gamer culture wont look on them fondly in the future.

 

[leroidys]

Fantastic news.

I have to wonder if part of the reason that they've been holding off on PS1 support for so long is to try and push the vita and vita TV as solutions for that. The announcement of PS2 BC but not PS1 seems to add some credence to that theory...

 

[RadarScope1]

Also, this is the statement that Sony released about the subject : "We are working on utilizing PS2 emulation technology to bring PS2 games forward to the current generation". Unless I am mistaken (or have missed new information on the matter), the trophy support and higher res are pure speculation.

Two years ago before the PS4 even came out, I said here on GAF that I'd be willing to pay such a one-time fee for this option.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I don't see the "meltdown", if at all the other way around that would be huge. It's amazing how people wanted this, now we get it with better image quality, framerate and trophies (All this is based on the Star Wars game right now). Yet people are already crybabies, because it might not be disc-based. Hilarious.

Yeah, I do not get it either. People still having access to their discs are very small in comparison to the general gaming population that eats these up (and also has the original consoles if so as well). Nintendo's Virtual Console, as well as the games that sell very well on the PS3/Vita prove this.

Truly vocal minority. Not saying they do not have a valid complaint if they are being truly genuine, but indeed are the minority. Especially as younger gamers get older, and more than likely no longer have that stuff either.

old?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_sOOVV7e8s

Nice. It is like playing a PC version/port of the time. I am down to revisit some of my favorites if they all do this.

Thanks, English is not my native language.

Do not worry, it is my native language, and I still think some of the words are straight up bullshit and can see the confusion. It is such a bastardized language, lol.

There, Their, They're <--- *click, boom*

 

[Hades Hotgun]

Fantastic news.

I have to wonder if part of the reason that they've been holding off on PS1 support for so long is to try and push the vita and vita TV as solutions for that. The announcement of PS2 BC but not PS1 seems to add some credence to that theory...

The mysterious disappearance of the FF7 pc port makes me think PS1 support is coming along with PS2.

 

[DeepEnigma]

The mysterious disappearance of the FF7 pc port makes me think PS1 support is coming along with PS2.

I do not ever thing that was a "thing". I think he trolled us on purpose. Then announced the remake months later at E3.

 

[FranXico]

I do not ever thing that was a "thing". I think he trolled us on purpose. Then announced the remake months later at E3.

Boyes mentioned in interviews that it really was a thing and then Square caught him by surprise when they contacted Sony about going ahead and making the remake.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Boyes mentioned in interviews that it really was a thing and then Square caught him by surprise when they contacted Sony about going ahead and making the remake.

So they trolled everyone! Even Sony/Boyes!

 

[Son Of D]

I do not ever thing that was a "thing". I think he trolled us on purpose. Then announced the remake months later at E3.

It was mentioned at E3 as releasing this winter. I'm expecting SE to show something for the remake at PSX before saying "The PS4 port of FFVII is available after this show!".

 

[Shin-chan]

So they trolled everyone! Even Sony/Boyes!

I really doubt this is true. They were the penultimate showing last year. It was a big deal. They had to be in on the troll, or at least someone at Sony had to be. In the hindsight of the remake announcement that troll is one of the greatest events in a video game conference. Before the remake announcement it was one of the worst.