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[E92 M3]

if they increase the light level just for king's fall challenge mode, there'd need to be some sweet guns to make it worthwhile. otherwise i'm perfectly fine staying at 303.

I am not betting on it, but we'll see.

Well... I thought challenge mode was going to drop 330 gear... maybe?

It would be rather frustrating. Getting players together is already a hassle, and trying to do tougher content will be a pain underleveled. We'll see though!

 

[NastyBook]

Last match in trials. We have used our mercy. The tension is high. And the last group we meets kills themselves in all five rounds.

I have never seen that before.

Saw a group doing that on Krafty's stream the other day. Must be their way of rebelling against Bungie's ToO matchmaking?

 

[MandrakeUK]

Last match in trials. We have used our mercy. The tension is high. And the last group we meets kills themselves in all five rounds.

I have never seen that before.

Why couldnt I get teams like that. Got to 8:1 6 times yesterday, absolutely annoyed beyond belief.

 

[darthbob]

IB helm can only come from the package awarded from reaching rank 5 this week. The package contains a ghost shell (310) and a random IB item drop 310+

It doesn't drop as a post-game reward. People with the helmet got it from their rank 5 package. Only post-game rewards this iron banner are gauntlets, chest piece, ghost, hand cannon, and heavy machine gun.

Ooooooh okay. Thanks!

 

[XenoRaven]

This Light mechanic is so much worse than the old system. I'm amazed they pitched it as an improvement.

 

[TP-DK]

Saw group doing that on Krafty's stream the other day. Must be their way of rebelling against Bungie's ToO matchmaking?

Ha yeah, or perhaps they just want the gold bounty done asap.

 

[Kor of Memory]

This Light mechanic is so much worse than the old system. I'm amazed they pitched it as an improvement.

The light level system is fine, the problem is the loot that goes with it.

The game gives you drops based on your light level up to a certain point. Why this certain point isn't the cap, i have no idea.

The system could work, if the loot system complimented it.

 

[Mindlog]

I am crossing my fingers that Bungie doesn't increase the light level cap again. Getting up-to-par is very frustrating.

I don't need new loot for challenge mode (genuinely in it for the challenge), but if they increase the light level for challenge mode it could be very irritating. I don't want to feel handicapped because I passed on grinding ToO and IB. My dozen plus HM clears should have been enough.

 

[Strider]

This Light mechanic is so much worse than the old system. I'm amazed they pitched it as an improvement.

I disagree when talking about the system at its core. It needs improvements but it's better than every single max level guardian wearing the exact same gear. That was boring as fuck in vanilla.

I think if all HM raid gear dropped at 320 (NM 310) and infusing items wasn't as expensive people would enjoy it way more. Duplicate drops wouldn't be as annoying as Y1 and we'd have much more diversity at high light levels.

Instead we have a raid not worth running and players being unable to infuse all the items they would like to.

The only real positive to the Y1 system to me was all weapons dropped at the max attack.

 

[E92 M3]

This Light mechanic is so much worse than the old system. I'm amazed they pitched it as an improvement.

The light level system is fine, the problem is the loot that goes with it.

The game gives you drops based on your light level up to a certain point. Why this certain point isn't the cap, i have no idea.

The system could work, if the loot system complimented it.

I agree with both points, but would rather have #ETHERICLIGHTmasterrace, nothing was better than maxing out in one click.

 

[Daemul]

The light level system is fine, the problem is the loot that goes with it.

The game gives you drops based on your light level up to a certain point. Why this certain point isn't the cap, i have no idea.

The system could work, if the loot system complimented it.

Yep, the light system would be fine if the items that dropped for you were always based on your characters light level. It worked like that up to around the 280-290 light stage but then it went to shit and became seemingly random. Having 315 light level characters and receiving 270 drops should not be a thing, drops should only ever be over 300 at that point.

 

[WhiskerFrisker]

I agree with both points, but would rather have #ETHERICLIGHTmasterrace, nothing was better than maxing out in one click.

This. It's annoying at higher light levels to keep running the raid hoping for good 320 infusion fodder. Maxing to hit that sweet 365 in one go was great.

 

[Kor of Memory]

I agree with both points, but would rather have #ETHERICLIGHTmasterrace, nothing was better than maxing out in one click.

The game would be perfect if certain end game activities (Raid, Trials and IB) all dropped an item that would increase the Light Level of any certain item by 2-4 points (up to 320).

This way, even if you got shit from Oryx, or from the Mercury chest, you'd still be making progress in some fashion.

 

[JohnOfMars]

Yep, the light system would be fine if the items that dropped for you were always based on your characters light level. It worked like that up to around the 280-290 light stage but then it went to shit and became seemingly random. Having 315 light level characters and receiving 270 drops should not be a thing, drops should be only be over 300 at that point.

Iron Banner is the first time the loot system has felt like it was working. Lots of legendary drops. You can play and get different rolls. Most of the look is at an appropriate level and you have guaranteed high level drops for slots that rarely have drops (ghosts/artifacts).

The rest of the game should be like that.

Hell, I think shards should be re purposed to be etheric light 2.0, either directly to item cap or just bump something up 5 light. That way, raid bosses either drop loot or a consumable to bump up your light. That way it always feels like you're progressing.

 

[MandrakeUK]

Any iron banner trains going?

I aint hit rank 5 with anyone this week when it was actually worth doing it instead of trials.

 

[Daemul]

I disagree when talking about the system at its core. It needs improvements but it's better than every single max level guardian wearing the exact same gear. That was boring as fuck in vanilla.

It should be noted that Bungie fixed this with the addition of Etheric Light in House of Wolves which allowed you to upgrade any piece of gear of legendary gear that had ever been in the game to max light level. Why they changed that I have no idea.

But yeah, otherwise I agree with the rest of your point.

 

[LTWood12]

Iron Banner is the first time the loot system has felt like it was working. Lots of legendary drops. You can play and get different rolls. Most of the look is at an appropriate level and you have guaranteed high level drops for slots that rarely have drops (ghosts/artifacts).

The rest of the game should be like that.

Dat' 316 Gheleon's Demise w/ Smallbore & Reactive Reload tho'

Spoiler

Yes I know it's not Gheleon's Demise, but come on it's Gheleon's Demise.

 

[Strider]

It should be noted that Bungie fixed this with the addition of Etheric Light in House of Wolves which allowed you to upgrade any piece of gear of legendary gear that had ever been in the game to max light level. Why they changed that I have no idea.

But yeah, otherwise I agree with the rest of your point.

ah ok.

Yea I didn't play HoW so I didn't know. I'm sure that system was waaaay better than what we had in vanilla and TDB though based on that alone.

 

[Twilight Gap]

I disagree when talking about the system at its core. It needs improvements but it's better than every single max level guardian wearing the exact same gear. That was boring as fuck in vanilla.

I think if all HM raid gear dropped at 320 (NM 310) and infusing items wasn't as expensive people would enjoy it way more. Duplicate drops wouldn't be as annoying as Y1 and we'd have much more diversity at high light levels.

Instead we have a raid not worth running and players being unable to infuse all the items they would like to.

The only real positive to the Y1 system to me was all weapons dropped at the max attack.

well i mentioned this before

Being max level in Year One meant that you could play the whole game at max level - Dailys, Nightfalls, Weekly Heroics, Iron Banner, Trials of Osiris, Raids and Prison of Elders. Once you hit 300 in Year Two, there's no reason to chase light unless you want to keep raiding. So not only is the gear dropping at a lower level then you'd need it to, there's also the fact that you don't even need it to begin with.

 

[E92 M3]

This. It's annoying at higher light levels to keep running the raid hoping for good 320 infusion fodder. Maxing to hit that sweet 365 in one go was great.

The game would be perfect if certain end game activities (Raid, Trials and IB) all dropped an item that would increase the Light Level of any certain item by 2-4 points (up to 320).

This way, even if you got shit from Oryx, or from the Mercury chest, you'd still be making progress in some fashion.

House of Wolves had the best end-game, but unfortunately there were people that complained about maxing out too fast. Now we have this

 

[LTWood12]

House of Wolves had the best end-game, but unfortunately there were people that complained about maxing out too fast. Now we have this

The real progression was getting gauntlets w/ hand cannon reload speed and a solar Hand Cannon. Still got my solar jewel and six-dreg pride.

 

[Kor of Memory]

well i mentioned this before

Being max level in Year One meant that you could play the whole game at max level - Dailys, Nightfalls, Weekly Heroics, Iron Banner, Trials of Osiris, Raids and Prison of Elders. Once you hit 300 in Year Two, there's no reason to chase light unless you want to keep raiding. So not only is the gear dropping at a lower level then you'd need it to, there's also the fact that you don't even need it to begin with.

Except for Trials and Iron Banner.

Despite the fact that the impact is minimal, it's still a difference. Otherwise why even advertise the modes as "level matters!"

Note that I think that at this point, making IB and Trials care about LL is super dumb, and needs to be removed from the game.

 

[brianjones]

It should be noted that Bungie fixed this with the addition of Etheric Light in House of Wolves which allowed you to upgrade any piece of gear of legendary gear that had ever been in the game to max light level. Why they changed that I have no idea.

But yeah, otherwise I agree with the rest of your point.

they wanted us to move on from year 1 loadouts

everyone would still be using the same exact loadout of fatebringer black hammer and gjallarhorn

 

[BreezyLimbo]

The new light system would be perfect if there was a minimum ger dropped. For NM, 300 is fine because starting out youll be sub-300, so practically everything is better. HM however should have a limit of 315. Ive gotten so many 310 pieces, and it really feels bad when that happens. They need to make doing HM rewarding, getting either shards or a 310 item just blows.

 

[Daemul]

House of Wolves had the best end-game, but unfortunately there were people that complained about maxing out too fast. Now we have this

Who were these people, and why did Bungie listen to them? Not all of us are masochists who love being made to grind ffs, just ignore those crazies Bungies.

they wanted us to move on from year 1 loadouts

everyone would still be using the same exact loadout of fatebringer black hammer and gjallarhorn

They could have just made Y1 stuff un upgradebale and stuck at 170, it's not like it would be hard for them to do tbh

 

[Deku Tree]

The new loot system is fine. Being 310+ allows you to easily do anything in the game, at that point skill is more important than level.

The problem is that KF HM is so punishingly unforgiving if you don't have a full group of six pros. One under leveled inexperienced player can force wipe after wipe for hours. And then after that is done the loot is horrible.

Yeah if you do Trials, IB, and KF HM then you have more loot... but I don't have time for all of that... I like doing KF HM and it should give you enough loot to infuse into your stuff.

I've done it three times a week since launch, and I've never gotten a Harrowed MG. I've gotten probably three primaries from Oryx. No Harrowed Helmet for my Titan or my Warlock yet. The RNG odds are generally terrible, the RNG should be a lot more generous like as in HoW or CE, that's the problem.

We went from decent HoW and CE level RNG, to RNG that is generally even worse than VoG, except that they made it so that bad RNG didn't force you to be Forever 29. Again that's the main problem IMO.

Also having some sense of small but guaranteed light level progression each week would go a long way.

 

[JohnOfMars]

House of Wolves had the best end-game, but unfortunately there were people that complained about maxing out too fast. Now we have this

But that's what's ridiculous. Luke explicitly said they wanted people to get the vertical power climb done faster than before. That they wanted us to progress horizontally.

But the exact opposite is happening. No one is maxing out vertically. And if they are, it's in such a narrow way. They may have a 317 raid set, but they don't have a decent PvP set. Or one that synergizes with the subclass or perks that they like.

This system is so bad, because people don't care about anything but light. How could they when they have so many drops.

Take for instance, artifacts. Does anybody use anything other than the 310 one they got from the quest or from Iron Banner? That's a whopping 2 choices. I have a ton of them, but why would I take the hit to my light, for a slot that doesn't impact my play that much?

If they're going to give us lower iLvl gear, then it should be raining gear. But nope, so stingy. We can only have a good loot system once a month when Lord Saladman visits.

 

[phen0m24]

We're going to 330 and the only point will be for the Challenge mode KF raid being underlevel, the weapons will be re-skins (if we're lucky or just higher power number spec bump), and once your over 320 then exotic engrams can decrypt to 330.

youll get nothing and like it

I want a hamburger. No a cheeseburger. I want a hot dog...

"50 bucks says the Smails kid picks his nose."

 

[darthbob]

But that's what's ridiculous. Luke explicitly said they wanted people to get the vertical power climb done faster than before. That they wanted us to progress horizontally.

But the exact opposite is happening. No one is maxing out vertically. And if they are, it's in such a narrow way. They may have a 317 raid set, but they don't have a decent PvP set. Or one that synergizes with the subclass or perks that they like.

This system is so bad, because people don't care about anything but light. How could they when they have so many drops.

Take for instance, artifacts. Does anybody use anything other than the 310 one they got from the quest or from Iron Banner? That's a whopping 2 choices. I have a ton of them, but why would I take the hit to my light, for a slot that doesn't impact my play that much?

If they're going to give us lower iLvl gear, then it should be raining gear. But nope, so stingy. We can only have a good loot system once a month when Lord Saladman visits.

I think Bungie's intention was to ensure that being at maximum Light was no longer a requirement as the difference between a 315 and a 320 isn't very large.

However what they didn't see coming

Spoiler

or maybe they did idk

was the psychological desire to be max Light level.

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

So what's this refer a friend quest all about?

Before this was announced I had already referred and helped level close to a dozen people, where's mah reward bnugie?

 

[LTWood12]

they wanted us to move on from year 1 loadouts

everyone would still be using the same exact loadout of fatebringer black hammer and gjallarhorn

I wish they would have made weapons that were as fun to use as those. Not even talking about the power of them as much as how good they felt feedback wise. The firefly pop/boom followed by reloading your revolver is just the best fucking thing. The first time you shoot Gjallarhorn after unlocking Wolfpack Rounds elicits that good ol' 'Holy shit!' feeling. The feedback you got from those weapons is just unmatched, and they looked dope.

Shooting a hand cannon that look like it's from the liner notes of a late 90s Tool album that takes as long to reload as a visit to the DMV feels like crap. But boy, it sure does have a high number!

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Requesting Status Update: Has anyone gotten the helmet from Phogoth?

 

[Kor of Memory]

I think Bungie's intention was to ensure that being at maximum Light was no longer a requirement as the difference between a 315 and a 320 isn't very large.

However what they didn't see coming

Spoiler

or maybe they did idk

was the psychological desire to be max Light level.

Well, when you have 2 separate PvP playlists that advertise as "Light level matters!" it's pretty hard to not want to be max LL...

 

[jmvmadeira]

I got helmet, legs and scout.

Helmet at 318 for warlock, boots at 311 for titan, rocket launcher at 317 for hunter (all on rank 5)
A 319 ghost as ramdom drop
Spent all morning trying to get chest and gauntlets on my titan. Nada,zilt, nil, rien.
Play one match on my warlock: gauntlets drop. My 3 ones. Sigh

 

[LTWood12]

Requesting Status Update: Has anyone gotten the helmet from Phogoth?

What's a Phogoth?

Spoiler

Kills Phogoth. Dinklebot, "Well at least it's chained up!"

 

[phen0m24]

Shooting a hand cannon that look like it's from the liner notes of a late 90s Tool album that takes as long to reload as a visit to the DMV feels like crap. But boy, it sure does have a high number!

Lol nice

Spoiler

but who actually goes to the DMV anymore

 

[WhiskerFrisker]

What's a Phogoth?

Hello darkness my old friend.

 

[JohnOfMars]

I think Bungie's intention was to ensure that being at maximum Light was no longer a requirement as the difference between a 315 and a 320 isn't very large.

However what they didn't see coming

Spoiler

or maybe they did idk

was the psychological desire to be max Light level.

Yep. Totally misunderstanding player psychology. Which is why the Crucible Quests wrecked the Crucible. People didn't want to get 25 sword kills naturally. They wanted to get it done with. So people did the painful thing of running around with sword hilts bashing people and getting a 0.1 K/D.

I think they did see it a bit, and that's why the player icon is character level, not light level. But light level dictates everything in this game, so of course we fixate on it.

Also, getting to max level is what Bungie spent a whole year and 2 expansions training us to do. It's a huge sea-change to say, No, sorry, you don't need to be at max level and you'll never get there.

 

[Jest Chillin]

Except for Trials and Iron Banner.

Despite the fact that the impact is minimal, it's still a difference. Otherwise why even advertise the modes as "level matters!"

Note that I think that at this point, making IB and Trials care about LL is super dumb, and needs to be removed from the game.

Removing LL from IB and Trials at this point would hinder it as it would immediatley give advantage to anyone who has/still has Y1 weapons that have better perks and in some case, flat out better stats.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Shooting a hand cannon that look like it's from the liner notes of a late 90s Tool album that takes as long to reload as a visit to the DMV feels like crap. But boy, it sure does have a high number!

If youre talking about the raid hand cannon, the sad part is that it feels good when youre shooting it. It has a beefy sound, it kicks like a mule, the ammo you reload ot looks cool, but because of the reload speed and shitty perks its just so bad. Fuck cocoon on primary weapons. On all the damn weapons. What was Bungie thinking.

What's a Phogoth?

Spoiler

Kills Phogoth. Dinklebot, "Well at least it's chained up!"

Makes me wanna farm Phogoth so Ill be the first with the helmet 😈

 

[Darryl M R]

Titan set. Also with Abydos Trials shader because it's awesome.

Wait is the Abydos shader new to TTK? I need that.

 

[Kor of Memory]

Removing LL from IB and Trials at this point would hinder it as it would immediatley give advantage to anyone who has/still has Y1 weapons that have better perks and in some case, flat out better stats.

No it wouldn't, because you still couldn't equip them. They both still require LL290 to even enter the playlist.

I can't equip my messenger and armamentarium and be over 290. I end up around 284.

 

[E92 M3]

The real progression was getting gauntlets w/ hand cannon reload speed and a solar Hand Cannon. Still got my solar jewel and six-dreg pride.

That's the kind of loot chase I prefer. Eng-game should be all about optimization and chasing aesthetics. Just how you described.

Who were these people, and why did Bungie listen to them? Not all of us are masochists who love being made to grind ffs, just ignore those crazies Bungies.



They could have just made Y1 stuff un upgradebale and stuck at 170, it's not like it would be hard for them to do tbh

Unfortunately, a lot of people hate having everything lol. A popular thing back in the day was to get Gjallarhorn and quit

The new loot system is fine. Being 310+ allows you to easily do anything in the game, at that point skill is more important than level.

The problem is that KF HM is so punishingly unforgiving if you don't have a full group of six pros. One under leveled inexperienced player can force wipe after wipe for hours. And then after that is done the loot is horrible.

Yeah if you do Trials, IB, and KF HM then you have more loot... but I don't have time for all of that... I like doing KF HM and it should give you enough loot to infuse into your stuff.

I've done it three times a week since launch, and I've never gotten a Harrowed MG. I've gotten probably three primaries from Oryx. No Harrowed Helmet for my Titan or my Warlock yet. The RNG odds are generally terrible, the RNG should be a lot more generous like as in HoW or CE, that's the problem.

We went from decent HoW and CE level RNG, to RNG that is generally even worse than VoG, except that they made it so that bad RNG didn't force you to be Forever 29. Again that's the main problem IMO.

Also having some sense of small but guaranteed light level progression each week would go a long way.

The rewards for KF are completely out of whack. There is no reason for a boss to give zero loot. Rather shameful.

But that's what's ridiculous. Luke explicitly said they wanted people to get the vertical power climb done faster than before. That they wanted us to progress horizontally.

But the exact opposite is happening. No one is maxing out vertically. And if they are, it's in such a narrow way. They may have a 317 raid set, but they don't have a decent PvP set. Or one that synergizes with the subclass or perks that they like.

This system is so bad, because people don't care about anything but light. How could they when they have so many drops.

Take for instance, artifacts. Does anybody use anything other than the 310 one they got from the quest or from Iron Banner? That's a whopping 2 choices. I have a ton of them, but why would I take the hit to my light, for a slot that doesn't impact my play that much?

If they're going to give us lower iLvl gear, then it should be raining gear. But nope, so stingy. We can only have a good loot system once a month when Lord Saladman visits.

I agree, but the problem stems from communication within Bungie. The studio is nearly 600 people or so. Luke had a vision for TTK and described his desires, but the investment didn't transcribe it correctly. A lot of our issues fall on the investment team for being stingy.

Remember when Deathsingers had no loot? Everyone thought that was crazy and they "fixed" it. Now we have raid bosses with chances of no loot and for people like me, the warpope, particularly, gives nothing.

 

[LTWood12]

If youre talking about the raid hand cannon, the sad part is that it feels good when youre shooting it. It has a beefy sound, it kicks like a mule, the ammo you reload ot looks cool, but because of the reload speed and shitty perks its just so bad. Fuck cocoon on primary weapons. On all the damn weapons. What was Bungie thinking.

You're right. The shot itself and the sound is nice. I even got a 320 one....with hip-fire accuracy. Pre-2.0 HC nerf it might have been serviceable. But the thing is ugly as sin, and it shouldn't take LONGER to manually reload than to switch to another weapon, shoot other weapon, and switch back.

Infused it into the raid pulse rifle, which is also ugly as sin, but functionally is good at killing things.

 

[PuMa]

I want a hamburger. No a cheeseburger. I want a hot dog...

"50 bucks says the Smails kid picks his nose."

IB scrub action tonight?

 

[JohnOfMars]

You're right. The shot itself and the sound is nice. I even got a 320 one....with hip-fire accuracy. Pre-2.0 HC nerf it might have been serviceable. But the thing is ugly as sin, and it shouldn't take LONGER to manually reload than to switch to another weapon, shoot other weapon, and switch back.

Infused it into the raid pulse rifle, which is also ugly as sin, but functionally is good at killing things.

Here's what the Raid gear should have looked like:

Or if they were so desperate to do a palette swap for Hard mode, they should have made the Hard mode gear be taken like that.

 

[Daemul]

Orys giving no loot slays me, not even Atheon was that stingy. Even if all you got was shards or energy from him at least those shards could go to leveling up your gear or weapons.

 

[brianjones]

cocoon is awesome imo

The rewards for KF are completely out of whack. There is no reason for a boss to give zero loot. Rather shameful.

wasn't this always possible to some extent in every raid?

the only difference is ass shards instead of mouldering shards

 

[Kyoufu]

How do I do this Refer-A-Friend thing? I want the rewards, but I don't know anybody that wants to buy Destiny atm. :|

 

[E92 M3]

Here's what the Raid gear should have looked like:

Or if they were so desperate to do a palette swap for Hard mode, they should have made the Hard mode gear be taken like that.

Haha I saw that laying around as well!

Orys giving no loot slays me, not even Atheon was that stingy. Even if all you got was shards or energy from him at least those shards could go to leveling up your gear or weapons.

I'd rather get no loot, than an Antiquated rune #stillsalty