Support NeoGAF

[cj_iwakura]

A lot of it has been explained, but in the novels and comics instead of the film.

Which strikes me as really lazy screenwriting, or Disney interference(more likely).

 

[Saucycarpdog]

Nah, the drops ships are really boxy looking. Not like the ship that took off.

Yeah I just based my theory on the fact their both kinda bulky looking ships but doing a bit more research I see a lot of Star Wars ships have bulky designs so that ship isn't unique.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Which strikes me as really lazy screenwriting, or Disney interference(more likely).

Neither, really. Some of the stuff was explained, and then those scenes were cut out for pacing. Lucasfilm didn't go in and pull out stuff so they could sell more comics instead, JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan made calls as to what information was really necessary to keep the movie moving forward, and later Abrams made even more calls as to how much of what was shot was necessary to the storytelling.

It's not lazy screenwriting OR Disney interference, but questionable editing.

 

[Ether_Snake]

The OT dos this well with Vader talking with the generals, or Sheev and Vader discussing politics when arrived on DS2. TFA was missing that scene or speech to work in the political landscape. The Hitler speech would've been a great place to work that in but instead they went for the unearned fire and brimstone-esque speech.

That speech actually has Hux saying that the Republic is secretly backing the resistance while pretending to be in a truce.

In ANH they never discuss politics. It's all about establishing what the Death Star is for: it's so powerful the emperor disolved the senate because this weapon will now be used to rule the galaxy with fear, and how it's impossible to take down (which Vader disagrees with).

 

[WadiumArcadium]

Why would she have it then? In the vision, other than the child part, it's never really her.

I said a few pages back it would be cool if in VIII Luke grabs her staff, asks her she got that from. She says she found it on Jakku years ago and used it since. We hear a psssh sound and both ends start to turn iron-red and then two red-beams come out of each ends: it was an old dark-force user's weapon that could only be force-activated and which had been sealed.

Jakku's a barren wasteland, there's no evidence a Jedi or Sith ever set foot on it. It seems a bit unlikely she'd just bump into an ancient lightsaber there.

I thought her having it when she's younger might have meant that someone purposely left her on Jakku with it. Probably still a load of bollocks but it sounds a bit more likely.

 

[cj_iwakura]

Neither, really. Some of the stuff was explained, and then those scenes were cut out for pacing. Lucasfilm didn't go in and pull out stuff so they could sell more comics instead, JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan made calls as to what information was really necessary to keep the movie moving forward, and later Abrams made even more calls as to how much of what was shot was necessary to the storytelling.

It's not lazy screenwriting OR Disney interference, but questionable editing.

I thought the film felt pretty brisk, I wouldn't have minded a few breathable scenes with exposition.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

Sometimes a stick's just a stick.

The first thing we see her pull out of the ship ALSO looks like the top of her staff.

The idea it's a secret sith weapon doesn't add much to anything beyond "OOOOH COOOOOOL" factor. Which I'm not sure Rian Johnson's going to indulge all that much.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Jakku's a barren wasteland, there's no evidence a Jedi or Sith ever set foot on it. It seems a bit unlikely she'd just bump into an ancient lightsaber there.

I thought her having it when she's younger might have meant that someone purposely left her on Jakku with it. Probably still a load of bollocks but it sounds a bit more likely.

Jakku is the former Fort Knox/Area 51 of the empire. It apparently even held part of the map to the first jedi temple that was erased from other imperial archives. And the script originally had a Jakku also home to various old relics. So it is so far setup as a likely place for old relics to have been stored by Sidious/etc.

Also the staff would be way too big for her to keep as a child.

Sometimes a stick's just a stick.

The first thing we see her pull out of the ship ALSO looks like the top of her staff.

The idea it's a secret sith weapon doesn't add much to anything beyond "OOOOH COOOOOOL" factor. Which I'm not sure Rian Johnson's going to indulge all that much.

If they are going to link her somehow to the dark side of the force, or Snoke, or whatever, it could work. Someone has been calling to her unknowingly, and Luke would be damn weary of the kid.

But yeah, unlikely.

 

[Trurl]

Am I alone in thinking that Qui Gon was pretty cool.

 

[George Oscar Bluth II]

I wonder when Episode VIII details will start leaking. I remember we got some stuff for TFA early on.

 

[Republic of Ezo]

That speech actually has Hux saying that the Republic is secretly backing the resistance while pretending to be in a truce.

In ANH they never discuss politics. It's all about establishing what the Death Star is for: it's so powerful the emperor disolved the senate because this weapon will now be used to rule the galaxy with fear, and how it's impossible to take down (which Vader disagrees with).

The problem is that you're getting a thin explanation in the exact same speech where the stakes need to be high, so the destruction of the Republic feels like an unearned nothing moment (further compounded by the lack of reaction to billions of deaths).

 

[Brakke]

The gaping holes in exposition are especially silly because it's not like this is a super-tight script. It literally begins with an exposition crawl. Just add another paragraph there or make the paragraphs you have way better.

Fix the crawl, cut the Rathtaur scene, clean up redundant dialog (Poe repeats the plan to blast Starkiller once the shields go down, for example), and you can kind find room to make some of the stage-setting less than totally baffling.

 

[Ether_Snake]

The gaping holes in exposition are especially silly because it's not like this is a super-tight script. It literally begins with an exposition crawl. Just add another paragraph there or make the paragraphs you have way better.

Fix the crawl, cut the Rathtaur scene, clean up redundant dialog (Poe repeats the plan to blast Starkiller once the shields go down, for example), and you can kind find room to make some of the stage-setting less than totally baffling.

Yeah it's the same JJA who made Star Trek, it has the same faults really. Movie is far from perfect. SW is just better material

 

[The Librarian]

Neither, really. Some of the stuff was explained, and then those scenes were cut out for pacing. Lucasfilm didn't go in and pull out stuff so they could sell more comics instead, JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan made calls as to what information was really necessary to keep the movie moving forward, and later Abrams made even more calls as to how much of what was shot was necessary to the storytelling.

It's not lazy screenwriting OR Disney interference, but questionable editing.

What id like to see is Rey make a double-bladed lightsaber from her staff. You know, like use the middle part for the handle.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

What id like to see is Rey make a double-bladed lightsaber from her staff. You know, like the middle part for the handle.

A whole bunch of people wanna see her do that. I think it makes more sense than Luke just giving her his old saber.

 

[The Librarian]

A whole bunch of people wanna see her do that. I think it makes more sense than Luke just giving her his old saber.

Same.

 

[cj_iwakura]

I half expected something absolutely insane from the final scene, like Luke igniting a red saber. It felt, like most of the film, kind of rushed.

 

[Ether_Snake]

What id like to see is Rey make a double-bladed lightsaber from her staff. You know, like use the middle part for the handle.

Easy, remove the bandaged part, stick both sticks together.

Also note how there are four "buttons" like on Maul's staff (never understood why).

 

[WadiumArcadium]

Jakku is the former Fort Knox/Area 51 of the empire. It apparently even held part of the map to the first jedi temple that was erased from other imperial archives. And the script originally had a Jakku also home to various old relics. So it is so far setup as a likely place for old relics to have been stored by Sidious/etc.

Also the staff would be way too big for her to keep as a child.

I know the Empire had a base there but Empire != Sith.

If you mean Lor San Tekka having the map info, I assume Luke probably just left it to him. He retired to Jakku but the planet itself had no real significance, apart from the fact it was out of the way.

I doubt Sidious would have kept anything of much importance on Jakku. He didn't leave Coruscant much after naming himself Emperor. He did keep a shedload of dark side relics on his private ship though.

 

[Theodoricos]

As much as I admit I prefer the oldschool lightsaber, a double-bladed one would work well for Rey and it makes more sense for her to have one.

Part of Jedi training is creating your own lightsaber after all, so I imagine that she will do that in Episode VIII. I hope so, anyway.

 

[Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!]

So people wouldn't say 'she's OP and shouldn't have beat Kylo because she's never used a lightsaber'.

that didnt work obviously

 

[Ether_Snake]

I know the Empire had a base there but Empire != Sith.

If you mean Lor San Tekka having the map info, I assume Luke probably just left it to him. He retired to Jakku but the planet itself had no real significance, apart from the fact it was out of the way.

I doubt Sidious would have kept anything of much importance on Jakku. He didn't leave Coruscant much after naming himself Emperor. He did keep a shedload of dark side relics on his private ship though.

The map was found recently, it's a CLUE to where Luke might be and really felt like it was a new find, plus it's useless without the rest of the map.

Leia has sent her most daring
pilot on a secret mission
to Jakku, where an old ally
has discovered a clue to
Luke’s whereabouts . . . .

 

[Scrooged]

I half expected something absolutely insane from the final scene, like Luke igniting a red saber. It felt, like most of the film, kind of rushed.

If anything the final sequence at the Jedi temple went on for a bit too long. The actual final shot was amazing though. So much was said without speaking a word.

 

[sphagnum]

With the way they've turned Anakin's lightsaber into an Arthurian, Excaliburesque Sword of Destiny, I can't see how they would have Rey just switch over to a different lightsaber without something happening to the first one. Perhaps if Kylo - since he recognized the lightsaber during the duel and wanted it - beats her in the duel in Episode VIII and takes it from her, then she'll be forced to build her own for IX and will come back with the double bladed staffsaber.

 

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Oh yeah, I've seen that some toys are labeling Luke's blue lightsaber as Rey's lightsaber.

 

[WadiumArcadium]

Her using it until it gets lost/broken/nicked seems the most likely theory.

 

[Johndoey]

Boyega had a better expression of shock than Ridley during the Han death scene.

 

[Ether_Snake]

With the way they've turned Anakin's lightsaber into an Arthurian, Excaliburesque Sword of Destiny, I can't see how they would have Rey just switch over to a different lightsaber without something happening to the first one. Perhaps if Kylo - since he recognized the lightsaber during the duel and wanted it - beats her in the duel in Episode VIII and takes it from her, then she'll be forced to build her own for IX and will come back with the double bladed staffsaber.

Oh I like that, could see it happen for sure. Although I expect Kylo to have a new one in VIII if they stick to him "completing" his training meaning also that he'll make his own saber, properly this time.

 

[injurai]

If anything the final sequence at the Jedi temple went on for a bit too long. The actual final shot was amazing though. So much was said without speaking a word.

I liked that scene more the second time he saw it. They only cycled twice between their faces.

Luke Sees Rey.
Rey offers Lightsaber.
Luke internalizes all that he's been running from.
Rey knows the story, and looks desperate that he accept the saber.

Pan
End credits.

It's a great shot that I've warmed up to.

 

[Kule]

Calling it now: Rey's staff is either an old light-saber and she doesn't know, or an old ceremonial fake-lightsaber. Why would they design the ends to look exactly like a light saber?

Took another look at it and yeah it's quite detailed and does look a bit like a lightsaber. I could see her crafting her own lightsaber out of it as part of her training

 

[bengraven]

I liked that scene more the second time he saw it. They only cycled twice between their faces.

Luke Sees Rey.
Rey offers Lightsaber.
Luke internalizes all that he's been running from.
Rey knows the story, and looks desperate that he accept the saber.

Pan
End credits.

It's a great shot that I've warmed up to.

The look on her face makes me wonder if she knows he's her father, assuming he is.

He looks torn between the light and the dark. Almost angry, but also nearly smiling. Reflected in his "I'm too old for this shit" look.

 

[Prophet Steve]

This is a small detail, but I love that the lightsaber is found in a small, wooden chest. In such a futuristic setting, having placed in something aged like that adds this mythical, ancient feeling to it.

I'd give them a rematch. ROTJ, while containing some of the best stuff from the OT, doesn't hold up close to as well as the other two.

Well yeah, that's why I'm doubting, I don't think this movie is great either. Return of the Jedi has some better highs.

 

[ginger ninja]

Got my thoughts in order after a good night's sleep getting over Han's death:

-Overall 9/10, probably my second best or even favourite of all the movies in the series.

- I don't get the pandering complain when so much time is spent building new characters who are generally likeable.

-For once, the quips were actually funny. I loved almost all of them, "that's not how you use the force !"

-I actually don't have any problem with Kylo Ren's attitude. The fact that he killed his father already gives him a lot more depth to build upon in the next episode.

- Han


Overall, movie is a worthy successcor to the star wars legacy. Great character, ok-good story and far reaching themes.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Took another look at it and yeah it's quite detailed and does look a bit like a lightsaber. I could see her crafting her own lightsaber out of it as part of her training

If it is an old light saber, Luke could have his own vision touching it

 

[Toxi]

Also note how there are four "buttons" like on Maul's staff (never understood why).

I would assume they do things like control the length of the blades and which blades are out.

Oh, and a wussier Vader too.

They were trying to get those hundreds of millions of Sephiroth fans.

 

[Johndoey]

I wish Ren was a bit more threatening. Was that the first blaster bolt halt in the films? That was a cool effect.

 

[JaseMath]

Guys! Oscar Issac is, in fact, NOT Jake Johnson. The whole time I was watching TFA, I kept thinking, "I can't take that guy seriously. He's the dude from New Girl and Let's Be Cops..."

Oscar Isaac

Jake Johnson

 

[cj_iwakura]

As first I was irritated that Kylo Ren is such a whiner, but it's actually brilliant. I also loved the comedy with the stormtroopers fleeing when they heard his tantrum. Still wished it had more backstory, at least more than that ultra vague Luke 'totally not Jedi Academy trilogy' flashback.

 

[Toxi]

Vader loses in New Hope breh. Han blasts his ass spinning off into space.

Nobody can resist the Power Of Space Friendship.

Actually, that's not what happened. Han shot one of Vader's wingmates and then the other wingmate randomly decided to fly into Vader. The entire first Death Star battle was only won because one of Vader's handpicked squadron apparently was flying while inebriated.

 

[Mashin Haters]

I don't remember exactly but don't Jedi Temples have crystal caves inside them? That would be cool if Rey ventures inside to find her crystal (or crystals) for her new lightsaber.

 

[Nostremitus]

I actually think C3PO *thinks* that R2D2 is in a low power state because he's depressed about Luke BUT I think the real reason is that he was dedicating everything to finding Luke. It seems like he may have been searching for the rest of the map. 3PO thinks it's doubtful that the map would be in R2's back-up data files, so it kinda makes sense that R2 was searching for it. When he wakes up, he even tells 3PO that he found it (it being the rest of the map). In other words, he woke up when he did because that's when he found and had finished getting the other piece of the map to Luke. The First Order had the other part of the map from the Empire's archives, so maybe R2 was searching there? R2 knew that BB-8 had the other piece, but perhaps R2 didn't yet have the piece they needed to complete it yet? It explains why he didn't wake up the first time BB-8 was near him with the one piece of the map.

Except R2D2 had the map since Episode IV.

It's as simple as BB-8 asked if R2 had the map, in low power mode it took R2 a while to process the request, R2 reactivated to respond when BB-8 came back to the Resistance Base.

Kind of dumb, but that's what happened...
http://www.slashfilm.com/j-j-abrams-explains-role-of-r2-d2-in-the-force-awakens/

I'm thinking the galaxy map the Empire had access to was taken from the Jedi following their fall. It makes sense that during their betrayal a Jedi would delete the location of their most important temple(s) to protect them. Luke's ghost pals would have been knowledgeable enough to help him find the hidden back-up of the deleted info. He then left it with the old guy before heading out so it wouldn't be lost forever if he never came back.

Or he left it with him on Jakku so Rey would eventually find him (Luke can see the future, after all...)

 

[Jest Chillin]

I don't remember exactly but don't Jedi Temples have crystal caves inside them? That would be cool if Rey ventures inside to find her crystal (or crystals) for her new lightsaber.

In the old EU, the planet that the old Jedi Temples were on is the only one with the real crystals they used in making Lightsabers. Jedi controlling the access to the crystals is why Sith sabers were red and were considered unstable as the Sith had to manufacture a "fake" crystal for theirs.

I have no idea if any of that still applies though. I'd imagine not because it just makes things messier in terms of characters replacing lost sabers and all that.

 

[Scrooged]

I don't remember exactly but don't Jedi Temples have crystal caves inside them? That would be cool if Rey ventures inside to find her crystal (or crystals) for her new lightsaber.

Sounds like something from the EU or KOTOR. That's not cannon anymore unless it's been mentioned in one of the recent novels.

 

[The Librarian]

The look on her face makes me wonder if she knows he's her father, assuming he is.

He looks torn between the light and the dark. Almost angry, but also nearly smiling. Reflected in his "I'm too old for this shit" look.

The last shot of Luke, from my reading he definitely looked like he was feeling guilty (about Rey? Han's death? Both?). Rey, on the other hand, started off looking extremely nervous the forced herself to be more determined.

 

[WadiumArcadium]

I don't remember exactly but don't Jedi Temples have crystal caves inside them? That would be cool if Rey ventures inside to find her crystal (or crystals) for her new lightsaber.

I don't think it's the temples that have them. In the Clone Wars younglings used to get them from the caves on Ilum. They found a larger kyber crystal on Lothal in Rebels too.

 

[Johndoey]

At first I was wondering why Rey doing so well in the latter half of the fight then I remembered Ren was kinda fucked up and the force is dumb do whatever bullshit anyway.

 

[Ether_Snake]

With the number of dumb ass light sabers there were in the prequels (even kids had some), you'd think that junk would litter the galaxy

edit: Watching ESB now, Yoda knew everything about Luke. Rey must have been watched over, unless she is really a random new sprout.

 

[MMarston]

Guys! Oscar Issac is, in fact, NOT Jake Johnson. The whole time I was watching TFA, I kept thinking, "I can't take that guy seriously. He's the dude from New Girl and Let's Be Cops..."

You need to check your eyes mate.


Or even better - you need more Oscar Isaac goodness in your life.

 

[sphagnum]

In the old EU, the planet that the old Jedi Temples were on is the only one with the real crystals they used in making Lightsabers. Jedi controlling the access to the crystals is why Sith sabers were red and were considered unstable as the Sith had to manufacture a "fake" crystal for theirs.

I have no idea if any of that still applies though. I'd imagine not because it just makes things messier in terms of characters replacing lost sabers and all that.

Nothing has been stated about Sith's lightsabers in canon as far as I'm aware, but the Jedi got their kyber crystals primarily from Ilum, which a lot of people are speculating is what Starkiller Base was turned into because it has the same sort of climate and is in pretty much the same location.

Younglings have to go through a trial that involves Force visions in which they face their fears, and if they succeed they will discover the crystal that calls out to them. This was also done in Rebels, except in a secret chamber on a Jedi Temple on Lothal.

 

[Bubblicious]

Neither, really. Some of the stuff was explained, and then those scenes were cut out for pacing. Lucasfilm didn't go in and pull out stuff so they could sell more comics instead, JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan made calls as to what information was really necessary to keep the movie moving forward, and later Abrams made even more calls as to how much of what was shot was necessary to the storytelling.

It's not lazy screenwriting OR Disney interference, but questionable editing.

Has the Republic been destroyed/ended? This i09 article says it no longer exists but I never got the impression it was completely destroyed:

And, semi-hilariously, semi-horrifically, both iterations of the New Republic don’t even make it one generation before crumbling into dust. At least The Force Awakens lost to a superweapon wielded by the Imperials and not an invading hoard of fanatically religious bug people.

It would be nice if the Star Killer attack kickstarts a new war between the New Republic and the First Order - it is Star Wars after all....