Yeah, I have a link handy - you get Raynor/Sylvanas free. https://battle.net/recruit/WNX6HZ6MFF
edit: beaten.
(I don't really care about the mount, its all good.)
Heroes of the Storm |OT| Pretty sure that Abathur is AFK
- Thread starter Nirolak
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edit: beaten.
(I don't really care about the mount, its all good.)Turdburger
Member
This game needs a patch so bad
Lunara crap, Artanis still crap, god tier heroes. I think we've had enough time with the scaling changes to see what needs changed. Hopefully they bring a big balance patch out with Greymane.
Also I love how reddit collectively bitched about Lunara not getting released when they thought she would, then Blizzard releases her in an undertuned state a week later and people bitch even more. Can't win if you're the dev team. She clearly was not ready for release.
Lunara crap, Artanis still crap, god tier heroes. I think we've had enough time with the scaling changes to see what needs changed. Hopefully they bring a big balance patch out with Greymane.
Also I love how reddit collectively bitched about Lunara not getting released when they thought she would, then Blizzard releases her in an undertuned state a week later and people bitch even more. Can't win if you're the dev team. She clearly was not ready for release.
At least they have a LOT of constructive feedback on her. But yeah, so, so, so much wrong - bugged attack animation in melee range, ridiculously small HP pool, no damage.
The fact that wisp has a longer cooldown than Kael's Phoenix isjust mind boggling. How did that get out of the door? In a game where one character comes with built in, invisible wards and it's considered "nice" but by no means essential, did they undertune Wisp so insanely?
You could literally give it every talent effect at level 4, halve the cooldown and it still wouldn't be broken.
And I don't think we're getting a big patch with Greymane, he's already in the game files after all. It feels like it's been a long time since we had a proper balance patch now? I really don't want another month of "oh, they picked Tyrande and Kael. We lose".
You could literally give it every talent effect at level 4, halve the cooldown and it still wouldn't be broken.
And I don't think we're getting a big patch with Greymane, he's already in the game files after all. It feels like it's been a long time since we had a proper balance patch now? I really don't want another month of "oh, they picked Tyrande and Kael. We lose".
Here we go with the bi-weekly "we need patch" posts. A good suggestion (if you're actually playing the game), would to hop into some arams. It's a ton of fun and you don't have to worry about "oh they have KT and tyrande, GG" (although that's not even 100% a loss, lol).
Brian, are you gonna be on tonight?
Brian, are you gonna be on tonight?
I'm not sure what prompted that pleasant little passive aggressive jab, but the last major balance patch was the 7th October. Since then we had the scaling patch which also had a small amount of balance changes in it at the start of November, and the likelihood is we won't get a proper balance patch until February unless one lands with greymane. That will make it three months since the last changes, and 4 months since the last big balance pass. Given the current state of the game and how clearly broken it is (and yes, I play in some form every single day as well as watching streams daily) I'm fairly sure it's not out of bounds to be a bit pissed off given how utterly fucking broken the meta is right now.
The game is currently, balance wise, in its worse state since Kaels crazy launch. Certain heroes are flat out broken in what they bring(Tyrande, Kael), cc and burst has rendered a large number of heroes unplayable, and right now walking more than 2 foot outside of your gate means you die if the enemy team plays properly. It is not fun. I know it, my group knows it, and every streamer currently casting is saying exactly the same thing. Even if I'm a moron, when you watch Dread, Chris, Grubby and everyone else comment repeatedly how broken the game currently is balance wise there must be something in it,
So no, I don't think it unreasonable to want blizzard to at least indicate they are working on fixing this because right now it's a bloody mess and seems to have undone a huge amount of the great balancing work they have done over the past year.
I don't think the game is crazy unbalanced by any means. It feels just as balanced as it has been the past 6ish months post Rehgar + Illidan domination this spring.
Every month we could point out a Tyrande or KT that is OP and needs to be reigned in or a Tychus and Lunara who need buffs.
I don't personally find Tyrande obnoxious to play with or against. No doubt she's powerful, but Battle Momentum or a Hunter's Mark fix will correct that.
To me ETC is the bigger problem, but again with a lot of these heroes like ETC/Tyrande/KT/BW who have CC plus a huge impact in another area...it's basically all or nothing. ETC was dead forever and came back with no direct changes to him, for example. It's a fine line between shit tier and OP with a few of these.
I get the clamoring for a patch, I guess, but as soon as one comes everyone will be clamoring for another. As soon as these heroes get nerfed a new set will rise and a new strain of QQ will awaken in the force.
Of all the super OP shit we've seen throughout almost two years of this game now, this is pretty tame stuff by my reckoning.
EDIT: and like Milly said, join the ARAM hype train. It's a fun change of pace and 99.99999% of the people we've met have been very cool.
Every month we could point out a Tyrande or KT that is OP and needs to be reigned in or a Tychus and Lunara who need buffs.
I don't personally find Tyrande obnoxious to play with or against. No doubt she's powerful, but Battle Momentum or a Hunter's Mark fix will correct that.
To me ETC is the bigger problem, but again with a lot of these heroes like ETC/Tyrande/KT/BW who have CC plus a huge impact in another area...it's basically all or nothing. ETC was dead forever and came back with no direct changes to him, for example. It's a fine line between shit tier and OP with a few of these.
I get the clamoring for a patch, I guess, but as soon as one comes everyone will be clamoring for another. As soon as these heroes get nerfed a new set will rise and a new strain of QQ will awaken in the force.
Of all the super OP shit we've seen throughout almost two years of this game now, this is pretty tame stuff by my reckoning.
EDIT: and like Milly said, join the ARAM hype train. It's a fun change of pace and 99.99999% of the people we've met have been very cool.
Haha I liked those times.
The amount of times I queued into a rehgar + Illidan + Abathur combo.... Many losses occurred lol
When Milly first started was when Rehgar + Illidan was heating up in February. We averaged 60-62% winrate running just those two heroes from level 1-10 (swapping off who was Illidan and who was Rehgar every now and then). It was good times. And then very bad times once it didn't work anymore and we had to go back to being regular winrate plebs.
Only time I've had that much success since has been the Brightwing OP days. I've done better than that with monk since his release, but I guess that was more me clicking with the hero than him being OP.
Also seems like every second or third patch we hit a wall where we can barely break 50% winrate for two or three weeks. That sucks more than anything.
Only time I've had that much success since has been the Brightwing OP days. I've done better than that with monk since his release, but I guess that was more me clicking with the hero than him being OP.
Also seems like every second or third patch we hit a wall where we can barely break 50% winrate for two or three weeks. That sucks more than anything.
RumblingRosco
Member
My highest winrate days were when Abathur could recklessly backdoor. So many stolen victories. So much salt in whispers after the games.
Cooby, is that you?
I take back my earlier statement.
The other insane OP thing I can think of in the past 6 months = Leoric + Abathur cheese.
It was stupid dumb.
I guess my POV on this stuff may be weird though. I mainly just dislike stuff with minimal counterplay, or in the case of Sylv on HM, Leoric + Abathur cheese, etc. no counterplay at all except hoping they fuck up.
RumblingRosco
Member
I never actually combo'd with Leo, I'd just sneak backdoor drop locusts and bail the fuck out. The counter play was to have Tyrande on your team or Nova or anyone with a global spell to interrupt my ability to Hearth. They still had to figure out where I was though, so it was cheese as all hell.
Yeah twas not fun. Not even sure it was fun for the people doing it. It was kind of like original recipe Murky in that way.
Just Abathur by himself backdooring never really bothered to me. Think we only lost to it one or two times, usually they'd get to core but it was just too little too late for their team.
Just Abathur by himself backdooring never really bothered to me. Think we only lost to it one or two times, usually they'd get to core but it was just too little too late for their team.
Turdburger
Member
why are you so fucking sensitive and passive aggressive about everything? no one in this thread is "constantly bitching" about anything. they haven't patched the balance of the game since the Morales patch
Games should not be opening like this- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U71fbXrHM0o
This scaling clearly wasn't ready, but Cho'Gall had to launch, hence the oddball scheduling where everyone's getting a lot of time to farm gold, a 50% off sale, free stimpacks, etc., instead of a hero release. They went 5-6 weeks without making people pay for a hero and instead gave them gold during a really rough gameplay period. That can't be an accident.
This scaling clearly wasn't ready, but Cho'Gall had to launch, hence the oddball scheduling where everyone's getting a lot of time to farm gold, a 50% off sale, free stimpacks, etc., instead of a hero release. They went 5-6 weeks without making people pay for a hero and instead gave them gold during a really rough gameplay period. That can't be an accident.
Lol. I'm not sensitive about anything. I literally have not ever seen Maledict say a positive thing about the game, ever. And whenever you pop up it's generally... Bitching.
Or it was the holidays and despite saying it wouldn't affect their development, it did. /shrug
I think you're reading too much into it there.
And I maintain the gameplay now is no more rough than it was at any time in the past six months. The heroes released were undertuned or in general bad for your team, but beyond them the game is no worse than any other time. I just don't buy the majority of players (bronze/silver) feeling about Tyrande + ETC the way they did about OP Zera or the KT + Jaina mage meta.
I've also seen no pro players/streamers really complaining about early walls/forts being taken either due to the scaling since like the first week. You're more or less the only person I've seen on that train and you've been on it hard. I think it's awesome as you can overcome a gank bottom with your push top and vice versa. Ultimately shit still evens out by the end anyway so it's much ado about nothing from my POV.
EDIT: I agree we are due for a big balance patch. But I'd rather see shitters like Tychus and Gazlowe and the like be messed with than Tyrande (who simply needs Mark nerfed slightly or BM removed) or the others changed in any meaningful way. In general Blizzard's balancing has veered into the overbearing at times, and then months later it turns out that whatever they did would probably be just fine if it could be un-done. And if BM is removed from Tyrande she will definitely no longer be solo healing anything in any meaningful way.
That's not how you spell pro team gossipmongering
edit: There was a LOT of feedback on twitter/reddit about forts/towers being too weak. It's not healthy because it pretty much obliterates traditional laning/soaking as the main goal. Maintaining that part of the early game is important.
There was for like a week, yeah, but I haven't seen much since from anybody.
I haven't noticed it being a problem at all, at least not to any degree to be concerned about. I certainly don't see people just abandoning lane to go wander about randomly. They might go gank, but they return just like they did on the patches before this.
I haven't noticed it being a problem at all, at least not to any degree to be concerned about. I certainly don't see people just abandoning lane to go wander about randomly. They might go gank, but they return just like they did on the patches before this.
Snuggies with Macintyre.
If by BM you mean Battle Momentum, that's not even taken by her in the healing build a lot of the time nowadays. She just runs with owls and the range on stun.
I'm really sorry you aren't capable of reading my posts, and feel the need to moderate the thread tone yourself. Is that passive aggressive enough back at you? ;-)
The game is currently in a lull, with no tournaments or news from blizzard, which leaves people lots of time to play and think - all of which is building up frustration right now. Once the tournie scene gets going again things will be better, although hopefully we'll have a broader meta than the one we were seeing picked & banned pre Christmas which was incredibly restricted.
Alur, re the backdoor stuff - you are of course right, that was ultimately more toxic for the game. Fortunately it never seemed to become that wide spread, whereas my issue really is that Tyrande / Kael is in almost every match, and the amount of counter play you get against the stun / burn combo is very limited. As A carry you can literally be killed stood next to your gate from 100% which doesn't feel right - structures just aren't a threat anymore. When structures don't offer a defense it makes for very uninteresting gameplay I'm finding.
I just need to play Falstad more really, I have a much better win rate with him, but giving up Kael to the enemy team feels like too much of a freebie currently.
Edit: on a more serious note, I will try to tone down the negativity if it's coming across too loud. It's a shame because this is the only place I know of where you can chat about the meta and balancing of the game with decently skilled and aware people, and the pro scene. PA is nice but far more casual orientated, reddit is reddit and this pointless, and the blizzard forums are the usual hive of scum and villainy.
It looks like Battle Momentum has been taken about 5,000 less times overall than Empower + Pierce so there isn't a huge difference in usage. Whichever option you choose to get more heals, the other choices at 1 and 7 are taken far more often for her "standard" build.
Pierce is the normal pick regardless so it throws those numbers off...I suspect Battle Momentum is actually taken more for the purpose of CD reduction than the Owl build by your general player. It's far more reliable through the majority of the game, particularly when you can just find a creep wave or standing section of a wall and reset Shadowstalk. Though you can also do it with Empower, you are also easily dodged or only hitting one point blank unless you are in that creep wave or team fight shit storm where you don't wanna be. And that CD reduction at one is just too valuable.
Either or, though, those two talents (or just Battle Momentum) allow her to heal to a level approaching the "good" healers. Personally I never see her topping the healing charts (or myself topping them) if the other healer is any good. The numbers are simply viable. It's the host of other stuff she does that makes it OP.
This was my argument, though. I suspect from your posts that we play in the same MMR bracket (~3k MMR) which is the sweet spot.
I don't encounter people disregarding structure damage early game unless they are Chen...and he always disregarded structure damage. I've not had people ganking me or my team and just yoloing into turrets without recourse. Most heroes who can do the ganking still get ate up by them early, so even if they do yolo they also die or they are severely injured and will be at a disadvantage after the short respawn.
I do see people disregard it hardcore at 14+, but I don't mind that.
Arcane Wizard from Diablo would complete the set and give us another caster, and they could do some really cool stuff with a Diablo wizard (either make it arcane and give it Time bubble etc, or make it all elements and play off the interplay between skills).
Alternatively, more demons and angels from Diablo would also be welcome.
In general, more diablo, less Warcraft!
Alternatively, more demons and angels from Diablo would also be welcome.
In general, more diablo, less Warcraft!
I don't think I was passive aggressive at all. It was clearly aimed at you and Turd. I don't mind reading negativity every now and then, but when it's a constant "we want more/this game is so imba because of X" it gets old.
The game as it stands right now is pretty ok, I feel. Does it need some tweaks? Sure. But from a purely casual perspective, it's the best it's been at since I started playing last March.
Sure, Tyrande and KT need some sort of changes. Lunara needs to be buffed. Tychus and Gazlowe are dick tier. I understand that, and I'm not denying it. Like I said, it just gets old reading it. I see enough BS on Reddit that when I come here I wish I saw some more positive posts about the game.
I think everyone should be happy that we get updates as frequently as we do.
/flame shield on
I sort of kind of detest the bursty nature of things (which is IMO a direct parallel with the OP healing; an arms race as some of you have said)...but if we're gonna go down this bursty route, there needs to be more bursty heroes than Jaina and KT at range.
There's several melee heroes who can drop you like a rock, but melee is a true crapshoot in QM/solo HL based on your tank and heals and their competence. It'd be nice to see a few more mages or something that can spread the pick rate a little bit there.
And I want my necromancer plz kthx blizz plz.
I sort of kind of detest the bursty nature of things (which is IMO a direct parallel with the OP healing; an arms race as some of you have said)...but if we're gonna go down this bursty route, there needs to be more bursty heroes than Jaina and KT at range.
There's several melee heroes who can drop you like a rock, but melee is a true crapshoot in QM/solo HL based on your tank and heals and their competence. It'd be nice to see a few more mages or something that can spread the pick rate a little bit there.
And I want my necromancer plz kthx blizz plz.
hopefully he wont be super weak when he comes out like the rest of the latest batch. hopefully hes at least viable
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
i played him a little bit at blizzcon, he's not too bad. his ult is pretty good and the metamorphosis is pretty fun to go back and forth with. he essentially has 5 basic skills.
This should've been the other store skin after Pajamathur instead of Skelethur. Would be great.
On the topic of the current meta and burst, is it possible the issue currently is not with the meta as a whole, but rather just a few specific heroes? I'm thinking in particular how the heroes with the best stuns to enable kills are also the heroes with the highest dos in the game for their role. You aren't giving anything up by picking Kael / Tyrande / Diablo / muradin to unlock their stuns, becusse even if they didn't have them they would still excel at their role.
If all the CC was on lower damage heroes so that you had to make a choice between burst and cc it might make things a lot different. Right now the characters with stuns are also the characters with the highest damage which seems to make for a bad combo.
If they shifted things around, so that if you wanted CC heroes like Gazlowe / Tychus / Chen / Johanna were taken, and you had to accept you had lower damage in return for that CC, would things look better? Or is it a more fundamental issue with the lack of counterplay to CC at the moment?
If all the CC was on lower damage heroes so that you had to make a choice between burst and cc it might make things a lot different. Right now the characters with stuns are also the characters with the highest damage which seems to make for a bad combo.
If they shifted things around, so that if you wanted CC heroes like Gazlowe / Tychus / Chen / Johanna were taken, and you had to accept you had lower damage in return for that CC, would things look better? Or is it a more fundamental issue with the lack of counterplay to CC at the moment?
Arcane Wizard from Diablo would complete the set and give us another caster, and they could do some really cool stuff with a Diablo wizard (either make it arcane and give it Time bubble etc, or make it all elements and play off the interplay between skills).
Alternatively, more demons and angels from Diablo would also be welcome.
In general, more diablo, less Warcraft!
I'm hoping they go the arcane route for the Wizard, if only to leave better room for a Diablo 2 sorceress down the road.
But yes, more Diablo pls.
Although, with Legion coming up, and Gul'dan being confirmed as in the works at Blizzcon, I'm expecting a few more Warcraft people before we switch back to either of the other three properties.
Yeah I'd be down with that. Also down with Maledict's idea 110%. Would make more sense for CC heroes to be strictly utility...instead of being utility plus amazing burst damage. I suspect we may get there in the future...but probably not any time soon. The hero pool growing another 15-17 heroes this year will help a lot too.
SEL streaming again boys. Arthelon and Glaurung got streams going, among others.
EDIT: Also holy fuck at this Vorpal Blade Zeratul build Glaurung is running. Looks fun as hell and he's undefeated with it in SEL so far.
SEL streaming again boys. Arthelon and Glaurung got streams going, among others.
EDIT: Also holy fuck at this Vorpal Blade Zeratul build Glaurung is running. Looks fun as hell and he's undefeated with it in SEL so far.
Jeez, always the bitching when you pop up in the thread.I'm not a huge fan of all the stuns flying around myself. I would be content if all the stuns in the game got some % knocked off their stun time. Stuns are sadly always king.
You really shouldn't make it that easy.
Jeez, always the bitching when you pop up in the thread.
You really shouldn't make it that easy.
huehue, I almost did this myself.
The issue is, you can't have a low damage fire Mage. It just doesn't work as a concept. Which means either Kael is going to have to have his stun changed, or he'll always remain top.
I wonder if they will reverse the previous buff they gave his stun, to lower its power as a long range ganking tool. If they did that and removed the bonus damage from the level 7 talent it would probably fix him.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
some guy went off on all of us in the game in portuguese, calling us idiots, and no one doing camps, no one knows how to play etc.
he said our murky was "mierda imposible"
kind of hilarious.
he said our murky was "mierda imposible"
kind of hilarious.
Wasn't the fire tree in WoW severely underpowered damage wise (and more CC oriented) compared to arcane and frost for a good bit there? Seems like it was, but I can't remember the dates/expansions.
I don't see why it can't be excepting KT's own personal lore. I don't think they'd do that, either, I'm just saying it doesn't seem unreasonable.
What would make the most sense is more mages period. Two of each would allow them to split all of that shit up into a more control/utility hero with some damage and a burst hero for each "tree".
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