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[Helznicht]

I just meant in general, they're doing surfaces, mobile phones, OS's, business and game software, music & movie services, game and PC hardware, AR equipment (Hololens). At some point they're going to have to contract again and focus on what works best for them.

Its a perfectly viable business model. I work for a multi-threaded conglomerate company. There are 2 main divisions (inside my division, lol) Project sales and Product Sales. Projects drive product sales. Projects execute at very low margins and even near costs, Products sell at very high margins. Standing back I can easily say, why have this huge labor force to do this non-profitable business, cut it out and just stick High margin sales. Look closer, If we don't do projects, our product sales would dwindle and in 5-10 years time we would be half the business we are now.

All these side projects MS does, they do to drive those buyers to their OS, software and Store, where they make more cash. If they don't invest in gathering customers, they loose long term.

has three products: Azure, Windows, and Office. Everything else he called features or parts that have been realigned to support the growth of those three products.

Right on.

 

[W.S.]

If you put it in the context that their CEO has then all of those make perfect sense and you can understand why they won't be getting rid of any of them. He said he has three products: Azure, Windows, and Office. Everything else he called features or parts that have been realigned to support the growth of those three products.

For Windows, he said he moved all hardware, first-party game development and services, and services for music, movies, and TV to support consumer preferences for Windows. He believes there will be a growing number of screens and that people expect their experiences to go with them (mobile) across those screens. He said they will build new hardware anytime they can showcase innovative uses of Windows.

Yes but that doesn't necessarily guarantee success with all of those.

You've got Windows Phone competing with Android/iphone and surfaces competing with tablets and laptops which I'm not sure are really sure bets for them even though surfaces and nokia phones are of good quality. But then again I haven't been following their financials on those sectors to really get a more accurate gauge.

As far as relating this to Microsoft's games division I think they certainly have a better leg up than those who have tried like Amazon and Apple's halfhearted attempts to get into videogames but Sony's doing enormously well and Nintendo's not out yet so I think they have more uphill climbs to go and plans to reveal about where exactly they plan on heading with the Xbox division both to their consumers and devs.

 

[Helznicht]

Yes but that doesn't necessarily guarantee success with all of those.

You've got Windows Phone competing with Android/iphone and surfaces competing with tablets and laptops which I'm not sure are really sure bets for them even though surfaces and nokia phones are of good quality. But then again I haven't been following their financials on those sectors to really get a more accurate gauge.

Yep, we have to compete for projects too. And there are some competitors better suited at doing projects than my company. Doesn't change the fact that we have to do projects, we just need to find ways to get better, quitting projects is NOT AN OPTION.

 

[Salty Hippo]

If one buys an Xbox because of an exclusive, there's a possibility that they will buy other games for it. If they don't buy an Xbox there's 0 chance they will buy games for the system.

The only other games someone with a good PC would buy on an Xbox One are MORE exclusives. If every exclusive is on PC, Microsoft loses nothing.

When will people finally understand that PC gamers don't buy multiplats on consoles?

 

[W.S.]

Yep, we have to compete for projects too. And there are some competitors better suited at doing projects than my company. Doesn't change the fact that we have to do projects, we just need to find ways to get better, quitting projects is NOT AN OPTION.

Well I'm not advocating for people to lose their jobs or anything like that. If they have enough faith in the product to do well then that's cool but they also have to ask themselves why is X product performing better than their product and how they can make it worth the consumer's while.

Windows Phone has really neat Xbox integration and are generally known for having great cameras but their app store is really behind their competitors. Surfaces, while awesome hybrids of tablets and laptops, are in that weird middleground where it perhaps caters more towards a particular type of person (students) than a more casual crowd. Pointing out some of these shortcomings can easily be applied to their Xbox division with regards to less well performing multiplats, less indy's, and less worldwide 3rd party support but I think what holds them up more here is that they have a huge strength in their exclusives and their software engineering.

 

[Sydle]

Yes but that doesn't necessarily guarantee success with all of those.

You've got Windows Phone competing with Android/iphone and surfaces competing with tablets and laptops which I'm not sure are really sure bets for them even though surfaces and nokia phones are of good quality. But then again I haven't been following their financials on those sectors to really get a more accurate gauge.

As far as relating this to Microsoft's games division I think they certainly have a better leg up than those who have tried like Amazon and Apple's halfhearted attempts to get into videogames but Sony's doing enormously well and Nintendo's not out yet so I think they have more uphill climbs to go and plans to reveal about where exactly they plan on heading with the Xbox division both to their consumers and devs.

Nothing is guaranteed in a free market. Their CEO is putting up a fight to keep his OS relevant, so he at least has to try to match what's working for their main rivals. If you can't at least neutralize a competitive offering then how are you going to survive long-term?

He and Spencer already laid out what they're doing with the games division multiple times over the last year. There's really no mystery to their intentions any more, just a matter of when and how well they execute it.

Finally, we will build the best instantiation of this vision through our Windows device platform and our devices, which will serve to delight our customers, increase distribution of our services, drive gross margin, enable fundamentally new product categories, and generate opportunity for the Windows ecosystem more broadly. We will pursue our gaming ambition as part of this broader vision for Windows and increase its appeal to consumers. We will bring together Xbox Live and our first-party gaming efforts across PC, console, mobile and new categories like HoloLens into one integrated play. - Link

Also a year ago Phil Spencer talked at GDC to devs and told them their vision of the Microsoft ecosystem and how they want to enable gamers to play the games they own on any Windows 10 device they want.

Our goal in gaming at Microsoft is to allow people to play games wherever they are and we understand people love to play games on television. And console with its capability around instant on, its robustness as a consumer electronics device, and the role it plays in the household with the big 60" plasma on the wall allowing to play hi-fidelity games with a ton of people in the room is pretty important to millions and millions of people and I think this generation of consoles is showing that.

At the same time we know that there are billions of people that play games across all devices and today the worlds are segmented. You don't have linkage really between the different places where your customers are playing their games, so as we've made this evolution with Windows and as we've thought about our vision for gaming the thing you should keep in your head is I think about our customers as customers on Xbox Live. And I think about those customers moving from screen to screen to screen and what we want to bring to those people is an understanding that the games you own are the games you own and you're able to play those games on any device that you want to play them. You're able to bring your social network of friends together. You want to use the input that you want to use to play the game you want to play. If you want to play on your laptop, if you want to play on your desktop, or if you want to play on your television, if you want to play on your phone, it's a world we want to enable across all Windows 10 devices, including the Xbox. - Link

If you think back to why Microsoft made Xbox in the first place, it was about fighting off the potential threat of Sony's PlayStation on Windows. Windows was the bigger picture and the only reason the Xbox got made. Turned out Sony's not much of a threat on Windows and now they're retooling Xbox based on where the OS fight is now.

There is no scenario here where Xbox acts as its own entity to fight for the console market. Spencer reports to the EVP of Windows. The Xbox hardware has been given to the Windows Hardware team (same team that did Surface and now has everything else). Xbox goes where Windows goes now.

Given how quickly they're moving their 2016 lineup to Windows 10 PC I'd say they're not wasting much time either...

Quantum Break (Xbox One & Windows 10) – April 5, 2016
Halo Wars 2 (Xbox One & Windows 10) – Fall 2016
Fable Legends Open Beta (Xbox One & Windows 10) – Spring 2016
ReCore (Xbox One & Windows 10) – 2016
Sea of Thieves (Xbox One & Windows 10) – 2016
Gigantic (Xbox One & Windows 10) – 2016
Cuphead (Xbox One & Steam) - 2016
Killer Instinct: Season 3 (Xbox One & Windows 10) – March 2016
Gears of War: Ultimate Edition (Windows 10) – Spring 2016
Ori and the Blind Forest: Definitive Edition (Xbox One & Windows 10) – Spring 2016
Cobalt (Xbox One, Xbox 360 & Steam) – Feb. 2, 2016

The only exceptions:
Gears of War 4 (Xbox One & that Gamestop leak tho) – Multiplayer Beta in Spring 2016/Launch in Fall 2016
Crackdown 3 (Xbox One) – Multiplayer in Summer 2016

 

[ViviOggi]

If one buys an Xbox because of an exclusive, there's a possibility that they will buy other games for it. If they don't buy an Xbox there's 0 chance they will buy games for the system.

If a PC gamer is interested in an Xbox exclusive there's a chance they'll buy the proprietary box for it, then there's an even lower chance they'll buy more games on it. But if that game releases on their preferred platform they're going to buy it 100% of the time. I think those odds are a little better.

 

[staticneuron]

If a PC gamer is interested in an Xbox exclusive there's a chance they'll buy the proprietary box for it, then there's an even lower chance they'll buy more games on it. But if that game releases on their preferred platform they're going to buy it 100% of the time. I think those odds are a little better.

Indeed, but this helps microsoft, not you as a gamer. This is the logic which is so twisted. Unless you like cheering for MS without caring what happens on the XB1 then I understand.

But less exclusives give the general masses less of a reason to buy the XB1 for gaming, which leads to less people purchasing the other third party MP games for the one and then to third party it becomes down to returns. The fastest way to bring back the era of a console having alot of exclusives again is for the power gap to remain between current consoles and the NX and the XB1 bases purchasing power becoming low enough to possible ignore over time or be recouped in a deal.

 

[W.S.]

Nothing is guaranteed in a free market. Their CEO is putting up a fight to keep his OS relevant, so he at least has to try to match what's working for their main rivals. If you can't at least neutralize a competitive offering then how are you going to survive long-term?

I understand that but there's also such a thing as stretching themselves too thin. As an example I personally I don't see their phone division lasting much longer against competitors unless they address some key issues with it, otherwise I would have switched from my Android to a Windows Phone.

He and Spencer already laid out what they're doing with the games division multiple times over the last year. There's really no mystery to it any more, just a matter of when and how well they execute it.



Also a year ago Phil Spencer talked at GDC to devs and told them their vision of the Microsoft ecosystem and how they want to enable gamers to play the games they own on any Windows 10 device they want.



If you think back to why Microsoft made Xbox in the first place, it was about fighting off the potential threat of Sony's PlayStation on Windows. Windows was the bigger picture and the only reason the Xbox got made. Turned out Sony's not much of a threat on Windows and now they're retooling Xbox based on where the OS fight is now.

There is no scenario here where Xbox acts as its own entity to fight for the console market. Spencer reports to the EVP of Windows. The Xbox hardware has been given to the Windows Hardware team (same team that did Surface and now has everything else). Xbox goes where Windows goes now.

I'm not expecting Xbox to act as it's own entity and yes I know about the Windows/Xbox integration already but they've not explained the finer details.

Are all exclusives going to the PC? Are they planning to modify the XBL membership or at least address the concern console owners have towards it with the PC crowd getting free online? They plan on having better portability from Windows 10 to Xbox One to get more games on the console but how good will their support be? Will the parity clause still be an ongoing obstacle for developers?

Their broader plan might be clear but there's still a lot of questions to be asked about the details within them and hopefully with regards to where the Xbox stuff goes they're more forthcoming with this stuff.

 

[Sydle]

I understand that but there's also such a thing as stretching themselves too thin. As an example I personally I don't see their phone division lasting much longer against competitors unless they address some key issues with it, otherwise I would have switched from my Android to a Windows Phone.

If they want to keep Windows relevant though they have to compete on every point, or at least be on the lookout for the next big thing. If they can't do that then they should fold, but that's not their intention right now...

If anything, one big mistake we made in our past was to think of the PC as the hub for everything for all time to come. And today, of course, the high volume device is the six-inch phone. I acknowledge that. But to think that that's what the future is for all time to come would be to make the same mistake we made in the past without even having the share position of the past. So that would be madness.

Therefore, we have to be on the hunt for what's the next bend in the curve. That's what, quite frankly, anyone has to do to be relevant in the future. In our case, we are doing that. We're doing that with our innovation in Windows. We're doing that with features like Continuum. Even the phone, I just don't want to build another phone, a copycat phone operating system, even.

So when I think about our Windows Phone, I want it to stand for something like Continuum. When I say, wow, that's an interesting approach where you can have a phone and that same phone, because of our universal platform with Continuum, and can, in fact, be a desktop. That is not something any other phone operating system or device can do. And that's what I want our devices and device innovation to stand for. - Link

I'm not expecting Xbox to act as it's own entity and yes I know about the Windows/Xbox integration already but they've not explained the finer details.

Are all exclusives going to the PC? Are they planning to modify the XBL membership or at least address the concern console owners have towards it with the PC crowd getting free online? They plan on having better portability from Windows 10 to Xbox One to get more games on the console but how good will their support be? Will the parity clause still going to be an obstacle for developers?

The broader picture might be clear but there's still a lot of questions to be asked unless they address them or be more transparent with their plans.

They have not explicitly said all exclusives will be available on the PC, but given Spencer's statements from a year ago and even those tweets he made this week indicate that everything will be available on whichever device you choose...so long as it's a Windows 10 device.

They haven't said anything about Live other than it will be leveraged across all their Windows 10 devices. There have been individual teams like Lionhead and the MS team over KI who said Live will be free for PC gamers, so I imagine there will be a growing resentment from console gamers they'll need to address sooner rather than later.

The other questions you have are good. Hopefully they'll share more at this month's event, Build, GDC, and E3.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

Remedy isn't a first party studio. It makes it more attractive for 2nd/3rd party devs like them to sign up for a Xbox One exclusive if they're also allowed to release it on PC. A straight up 2nd/3rd party exclusive is very hard to swing because of how far behind the PS4 the Xbox One is. A PC release is a way to make up the installed base numbers. I'm pretty certain this won't happen (day one at least) with first party titles.


.

MS owns the QB IP so they are the ones who decide if it goes to PC or not...not Remedy. It is irrelevant in this case that Remedy is not a first party studio.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

Indeed, but this helps microsoft, not you as a gamer. This is the logic which is so twisted. Unless you like cheering for MS without caring what happens on the XB1 then I understand.

But less exclusives give the general masses less of a reason to buy the XB1 for gaming, which leads to less people purchasing the other third party MP games for the one and then to third party it becomes down to returns. The fastest way to bring back the era of a console having alot of exclusives again is for the power gap to remain between current consoles and the NX and the XB1 bases purchasing power becoming low enough to possible ignore over time or be recouped in a deal.

Except that is does help gamers. More money made from software sales, in theory, means more money put back into making new games, as well as maybe even money spent on riskier IP. If you own the Xbox One this helps you...you still get your games.

 

[mrklaw]

Except that is does help gamers. More money made from software sales, in theory, means more money put back into making new games, as well as maybe even money spent on riskier IP. If you own the Xbox One this helps you...you still get your games.

If Ms succeeds in bringing third parties into their windows 10 store and makes 30% off game sales there, and 30% off game sales on a black box which costs hundreds of millions of dollars to launch and support, isn't there a risk that they move away from Xbox in the future and focus more on PC?

 

[gamz]

If Ms succeeds in bringing third parties into their windows 10 store and makes 30% off game sales there, and 30% off game sales on a black box which costs hundreds of millions of dollars to launch and support, isn't there a risk that they move away from Xbox in the future and focus more on PC?

Why can't they do both? It's just another device that plays games.

 

[etta]

If Ms succeeds in bringing third parties into their windows 10 store and makes 30% off game sales there, and 30% off game sales on a black box which costs hundreds of millions of dollars to launch and support, isn't there a risk that they move away from Xbox in the future and focus more on PC?

Xbox is now part of the platform...
If PC versions of their games brings them more profit than the XBO version, then they might consider simplifying the console, but they'll still launch something for the TV.

 

[VincentMatts]

It has to start sometime. This is clearly the future of Xbox. Buy the game, play it anywhere as long as it runs windows. It doesn't change anything for them. Some people can "not want" an Xbox all they want but if wanna play this game, one way or another they'll be giving MS their money.

 

[gamz]

Xbox is now part of the platform...
If PC versions of their games brings them more profit than the XBO version, then they might consider simplifying the console, but they'll still launch something for the TV.

Right. Why discontinue a device that sells well and doesn't lose money.

 

[orochi91]

Unless MS drops the XBL fees, this feels like a raw deal for XB1 owners.

PC gamers will get the same games, but with free online and etc.

 

[Alebrije]

If Ms succeeds in bringing third parties into their windows 10 store and makes 30% off game sales there, and 30% off game sales on a black box which costs hundreds of millions of dollars to launch and support, isn't there a risk that they move away from Xbox in the future and focus more on PC?

Do not think that the all market that uses consoles will move to a PC, in fact very little of the console user will do this.

I think MS will release a console for next gen but not as an stand alone product but as part of a whole ecosystem

 

[gamz]

Unless MS drops the XBL fees, this feels like a raw deal for XB1 owners.

PC gamers will get the same games, but with free online and etc.

This i agree with. They have to drop live price or give xbox owners better deals.

 

[mrklaw]

Right. Why discontinue a device that sells well and doesn't lose money.

Oh sure - this isnt something that would happen quickly, and they won't discontinue xb1. But it could affect their support or desire for an xb2. And for gamers that prefer consoles that would not be ideal

 

[VincentMatts]

Unless MS drops the XBL fees, this feels like a raw deal for XB1 owners.

PC gamers will get the same games, but with free online and etc.

That's assuming things don't change in the future. You don't really know what's going to happen next gen. They can sell a 99$ set top box next gen and have everything stream a la PS Now, only with Windows 10/Xbox.

 

[gamz]

Oh sure - this isnt something that would happen quickly, and they won't discontinue xb1. But it could affect their support or desire for an xb2. And for gamers that prefer consoles that would not be ideal

Nah. You don't discontinue a device that sells well, pushes their software.

 

[etta]

Oh sure - this isnt something that would happen quickly, and they won't discontinue xb1. But it could affect their support or desire for an xb2. And for gamers that prefer consoles that would not be ideal

Xbox is still Microsoft's gaming division, except now it's on the inside sitting at the same table as Windows and Office. I doubt that will lead to less focus. Like another poster said, this can mean that gaming projects get a bigger push/budget now, since they have to make good on Windows 10 as well.

 

[rudieboy77]

If people are up set over this next time you upgrade your system build a PC instead. Its what I did when the Xbone and PS4 were announced. I was tired of the same cycle that consoles offered, so I quit that treadmill. I really do not see this as an issue though. Neither Sony or MS see PC as their competition.

 

[VincentMatts]

If people are up set over this next time you upgrade your system build a PC instead. Its what I did when the Xbone and PS4 were announced. I was tired of the same cycle that consoles offered, so I quit that treadmill. I really do not see this as an issue though. Neither Sony or MS see PC as their competition.

It will be if Xbox and PC merge as they seem to be doing.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

If Ms succeeds in bringing third parties into their windows 10 store and makes 30% off game sales there, and 30% off game sales on a black box which costs hundreds of millions of dollars to launch and support, isn't there a risk that they move away from Xbox in the future and focus more on PC?

They will still support Xbox One in that scenario. If you want to say it diminishes the need for a new box after the XB1 then that's a different topic (one that I also agree with by the way).

 

[peace]

In the later years of a cycle console games run like shit. At the end of last gen almost everything was sub 30 fps and sub 720p. So that won't change, it's already like that.

I don't think the PS4 suffered as it got older, in fact it was clearly the opposite. And the same was true for the 360 (Halo 4 etc). Probably you mean the games that were intended and made primarily for super PCs, which the consoles couldn't keep up with? But those games aren't for everyone, anyway.

 

[Mass Effect]

So I wonder what Microsoft would do if the games end up doing poorly on the Windows store.

Do they give up again like with GFWL, put their games on other storefronts as well to maximize sales, or just keep putting them out on the Windows Store?

Not saying I want to this to happen, but given how their last attempt fared it makes me curious as to what they'd do.

 

[ViviOggi]

Unless MS drops the XBL fees, this feels like a raw deal for XB1 owners.

PC gamers will get the same games, but with free online and etc.

Paying to play full-price games online is a raw deal, apparently this makes more people realize that fact because nothing else changes

 

[rudieboy77]

It will be if Xbox and PC merge as they seem to be doing.

I do not pay close enough attention, but isn't MS trying to use the Win10 market to sell their games? PC gamers already do not like having their game spread out across UPlay, Origin, Steam and GOG. They might see this as GFWL and reject it anyways?

 

[New002]

Except that is does help gamers. More money made from software sales, in theory, means more money put back into making new games, as well as maybe even money spent on riskier IP. If you own the Xbox One this helps you...you still get your games.

I don't disagree with this line of thinking. At the same time though I'm a current Xbox One owner, and if I could do things over I think I'd have built a gaming PC, and I'd probably have a PS4/Wii U combo, or maybe even just PC/Wii U. Sure, not everything on the Xbox has gone to PC, but a lot of what I'm interested in looks like it has, or will.

I imagine MS is going to keep going down this path, which is A-Okay, but come next gen I'll probably be skipping the next console and picking up the games on PC. I can't say that with absolute certainty, but it's where my head is at right now.

I understand what the OP is getting at, but I don't think it's unreasonable that some people might be a bit bummed by this, if only because they might have gone a different route had they know this is how things were going to play it. Overall though I think it's a positive for the various reasons people have laid out in this thread and others.

 

[VincentMatts]

I do not pay close enough attention, but isn't MS trying to use the Win10 market to sell their games? PC gamers already do not like having their game spread out across UPlay, Origin, Steam and GOG. They might see this as GFWL and reject it anyways?

GFWL was a bad copy of Xbox Live. It didn't have 90% of the features Xbox had, that's why it was rejected. It was half assed and it sucked. PC gamers were insulted by it considering steam and even live on consoles were better.

 

[RoslindaleOne]

Unless MS drops the XBL fees, this feels like a raw deal for XB1 owners.

PC gamers will get the same games, but with free online and etc.

PC doesn't have games with gold. Which right now is 4 free games a month for XB1 owners.

 

[Bessy67]

PC doesn't have games with gold. Which right now is 4 free games a month for XB1 owners.

But a lot of people don't really care about that. MS should really just have the subscription be for Games with Gold an Deals with Gold, bring that subscription option to PC, and let multiplayer be free for both PC and Xbox One. Especially with multiplayer games that are going to be cross buy and cross play like Fable and Killer Instinct, it makes no sense for someone to be able to play online on their PC but have to pay to play online on Xbox.

 

[Sydle]

If Ms succeeds in bringing third parties into their windows 10 store and makes 30% off game sales there, and 30% off game sales on a black box which costs hundreds of millions of dollars to launch and support, isn't there a risk that they move away from Xbox in the future and focus more on PC?

Considering the main metric of the Xbox division now is monthly active users I'd wager they'll focus game development and availability wherever they are seeing the most user activity growth, so I suppose moving away from the console all together is a possibility even if unlikely.

In any case, I think the next Xbox is going to be a small-form Windows 10 PC similar the AlienWare machines, which would be much less costly than the seemingly more custom solutions they made for Xbox One in terms of its hardware and OS architecture. I also think they end up partnering with Dell/AlienWare who will provide more models with different levels of performance. Those AlienWare machines are small form Windows 10 PCs with Steam/GoG already, so I assume they already have access to the Windows Store, or it wouldn't be hard to make that happen. Throw in a Xbox One controller and call it a day.

 

[W.S.]

PC doesn't have games with gold. Which right now is 4 free games a month for XB1 owners.

Yeah but that in and of itself isn't a great incentive.

And who knows if PC players don't also get to utilize the BC feature? I think they would have to offer more benefits to XBO owners to make up for paying for multiplayer but I'd really prefer to just have multiplayer be free on console.

 

[Nzyme32]

PC doesn't have games with gold. Which right now is 4 free games a month for XB1 owners.

I think quite a few folk with debate the value of the 4 "free" games as part of a subscription.

 

[staticneuron]

Except that is does help gamers. More money made from software sales, in theory, means more money put back into making new games, as well as maybe even money spent on riskier IP. If you own the Xbox One this helps you...you still get your games.

The money made of of potential extra sales of exclusive won't offset the money by people deciding not to choose the platform. On the XB1 MS takes a licensing fee of of every game released on console. They get a piece of the pie for third party sales. None of that really happens on in other market places on the PC. So if this move deters people from making the XB1 a viable choice it destroys the point of even owning the system. Even if MS sinks money into another exclusive people will assume it will be ported and idea of purchasing XB1 becomes less desirable when weighing options. If I knew this is the path they were going to head down, I wouldn't have purchased an XB1. I have multiple very powerful PC's.

 

[DriftingSpirit]

Indeed, but this helps microsoft, not you as a gamer. This is the logic which is so twisted. Unless you like cheering for MS without caring what happens on the XB1 then I understand.

But less exclusives give the general masses less of a reason to buy the XB1 for gaming, which leads to less people purchasing the other third party MP games for the one and then to third party it becomes down to returns. The fastest way to bring back the era of a console having alot of exclusives again is for the power gap to remain between current consoles and the NX and the XB1 bases purchasing power becoming low enough to possible ignore over time or be recouped in a deal.

Ah, but you said "general masses". The majority who are buying these consoles do not care for exclusives as much as they do third party titles.

Yeah, this will probably cause some of the more core users to be discouraged but they are small relative to the masses you speak of.

 

[LukasTaves]

If Ms succeeds in bringing third parties into their windows 10 store and makes 30% off game sales there, and 30% off game sales on a black box which costs hundreds of millions of dollars to launch and support, isn't there a risk that they move away from Xbox in the future and focus more on PC?

That's not a risk because now xbox run windows, with the same app platform that runs on the desktop. That's actually a bullet point for them to get 3rd party support on the universal app platform: Because Ms made all the dirty work developers now have a platform that is cross platform with minimal effort and that offers a really good performance be it on pc, console or cell phone.

 

[LukasTaves]

The money made of of potential extra sales of exclusive won't offset the money by people deciding not to choose the platform. On the XB1 MS takes a licensing fee of of every game released on console. They get a piece of the pie for third party sales. None of that really happens on in other market places on the PC. So if this move deters people from making the XB1 a viable choice it destroys the point of even owning the system. Even if MS sinks money into another exclusive people will assume it will be ported and idea of purchasing XB1 becomes less desirable when weighing options. If I knew this is the path they were going to head down, I wouldn't have purchased an XB1. I have multiple very powerful PC's.

That happens on steam or any other 3rd party launching a game on a digital platform.

If anything being tied to xbone gives ammunition for Ms to throw incentives like reducing the fee if the game is cross buy, which honestly they would be stupid not to. It would drive sales for their platform (so the extra volume would give them more profits), and for the publishers the smaller cut would more than compensate for the few that won't double dip.

 

[Bgamer90]

Ah, but you said "general masses". The majority who are buying these consoles do not care for exclusives as much as they do third party titles.

Yeah, this will probably cause some of the more core users to be discouraged but they are small relative to the masses you speak of.

And again, the majority of console gamers do not care about PC gaming. Hence why many of them are console gamers in the first place. Hence why many of the top selling console games are titles available on PC.

I can understand being disappointed by this move if you have a solid gaming PC and an Xbox One but I'm surprised by how some here can't see (the pretty clear) evidence that most console gamers don't care about what's happening on PC.

 

[bonkeng]

Even if you do intend on buying it on PC (or more accurately Windows 10) Microsoft is still getting your sale and you're still buying into their ecosystem.

It would be another thing if these games were all on Steam or whatever other service but most of these games seem to be tied into Microsoft's services. I think the only impact of you just sticking to PC for MS games would be the lack of the XBL Gold subscription but that seems to have been factored in already.

Yes I know that MS will get my money no matter what. There's no argument there.

The point I'm making is this move will impact XB1 sale negatively. Whether it's insignificant or not is irrelevant.

Exclusives still will help XB1 sales even though it's also on PC.

For example, if a 100 gamers are planning to buy an XB1 for exclusives such as Scalebound and QB, but 10 of those gamers also have a gaming rig. When they realize they can play it on PC, they will buy it on PC and skip XB1.

That's how XB1 loses some of its sales.

Comparing it to SF5 for PS4 doesn't make sense since SF5 is only 1 game. PS4 first party exclusives are not coming to PC.

 

[Bgamer90]

Unless MS drops the XBL fees, this feels like a raw deal for XB1 owners.

PC gamers will get the same games, but with free online and etc.

While the cost of entry to play these games is still cheaper via buying the Xbox One, I definitely agree that there needs to be some changes made here as this trend progresses.

It's very easy to find XBL for cheap these days anyway ($40 or less for one year). It would be nice if online play became free and Xbox Live turned into a service primariliy for free games every month, deals/discounts on digital titles, and exclusive free crossplay for all supported titles on Windows devices.

 

[Bgamer90]

Yes I know that MS will get my money no matter what. There's no argument there.

The point I'm making is this move will impact XB1 sale negatively. Whether it's insignificant or not is irrelevant.

Exclusives still will help XB1 sales even though it's also on PC.

For example, if a 100 gamers are planning to buy an XB1 for exclusives such as Scalebound and QB, but 10 of those gamers also have a gaming rig. When they realize they can play it on PC, they will buy it on PC and skip XB1.

That's how XB1 loses some of its sales.

Comparing it to SF5 for PS4 doesn't make sense since SF5 is only 1 game. PS4 first party exclusives are not coming to PC.

It isn't this simple though.

If this move causes more new IP "console exclusives", then it will cause more console only gamers (who aren't interested in PC gaming) to be interested in the system's lineup, therefore causing more system sales. The denominator you stated in your example (100 people/gamers) would possibly be bigger -- thus either creating an offset or even an increase.

Nothing about this is going to cause a notably negative impact on console sales in my opinion.

Edit: Also comparing it to Street Fighter V does make sense, since it's a big game that's also coming to PC. The same argument you've said about PC gamers not needing an Xbox could be made for Street Fighter fans not needing a PS4. Outside of this, Street Fighter V definitely isn't the only PS4 "console exclusive" that's also available on PC that has helped PS4 sales.

 

[notaskwid]

And again, the majority of console gamers do not care about PC gaming. Hence why many of them are console gamers in the first place. Hence why many of the top selling console games are titles available on PC.

I can understand being disappointed by this move if you have a solid gaming PC and an Xbox One but I'm surprised by how some here can't see (the pretty clear) evidence that most console gamers don't care about what's happening on PC.

That's not really true when you look at the daily population of games like League of Legends, Crossfire, Dota 2, CSGO, etc. The "masses" do care about pc gaming, more than console gaming even. Now, many of those don't have hardware capable of running something like Quantum Break now, but it's there, on PC. That means that they if they are interested, that's one less reason to buy an Xbox one. When those mass people that play games on PC everyday find that cheap console where they can play games their pc can't run now, they will now be looking now (even more) to the PS4 where they can get games that will never come to their real platform of choice.

 

[Bgamer90]

That's not really true when you look at the daily population of games like League of Legends, Crossfire, Dota 2, CSGO, etc. The "masses" do care about pc gaming, more than console gaming even.

I didn't say masses -- I said console gamers.

Now, many of those don't have hardware capable of running something like Quantum Break now, but it's there, on PC. That means that they if they are interested, that's one less reason to buy an Xbox one. When those mass people that play games on PC everyday find that cheap console where they can play games their pc can't run now, they will now be looking now (even more) to the PS4 where they can get games that will never come to they're real platform of choice.

But current gen sales show that people who care about exclusives to this level are a minority. Again, the top selling current gen games are not exclusives.

Halo 5 got flack for its sales here (due to the series' largedecrease) even though the game was still the top selling 2015 exclusive in the U.S.. The majority of console gamers care about what's going on in the console gaming space. Not the PC space (too).

 

[notaskwid]

I think that xbox one will loose even more mind share this year when compared to the PS4 due to this move. There are many types of Console gamers, people who care about exclusives and people who don't, but it's clearly better for a console to have them than to not have them.
You seem to base your argument on exclusives don't sell anymore because console gamers don't care anymore, they just buy consoles to play COD/FIFA/GTA, all supported in Halo underperfomance. If we see Uncharted 4 sell 8M+ copies would you change your stance? How about Mario Kart 8 that has an attach rate of nearly 50%? And Splatoon, a new IP that sold 4M+ on an install base of 13M~?
Exclusive content is a pilar off the console business, and I believe that by cuting it of you will be basically puting a foot out of that business. But allas, we'll know the result in 2~3 years.

 

[etta]

I think that xbox one will loose even more mind share this year when compared to the PS4 due to this move. There are many types of Console gamers, people who care about exclusives and people who don't, but it's clearly better for a console to have them than to not have them.
You seem to base your argument on exclusives don't sell anymore because console gamers don't care anymore, they just buy consoles to play COD/FIFA/GTA, all supported in Halo underperfomance. If we see Uncharted 4 sell 8M+ copies would you change your stance? How about Mario Kart 8 that has an attach rate of nearly 50%? And Splatoon, a new IP that sold 4M+ on an install base of 13M~?
Exclusive content is a pilar off the console business, and I believe that by cuting it of you will be basically puting a foot out of that business. But allas, we'll know the result in 2~3 years.

You're comparing Halo 5 with Uncharted 4?
If Halo 3 by Bungie was coming out in XBO's third year, it too would sell high numbers.
Uncharted is now entering or already at its peak, Halo 4 pushed Halo way past the climax.