Support NeoGAF

[SolidSnakex]

I know GT Sport news was teased but was a date given?

Some GT Academy members began receiving emails from Sony/Polyphony inviting them to an event in London that takes place on May 18-20. And on the 19th and 20th they'll be able to play the beta there. The official GT Facebook account also mentioned that we won't have to wait until June to get info.

 

[Sebmugi]

GT6 still holds the comparison and the trees in are much more beautiful XP

 

[Yiazmat]

Some GT Academy members began receiving emails from Sony/Polyphony inviting them to an event in London that takes place on May 18-20. And on the 19th and 20th they'll be able to play the beta there. The official GT Facebook account also mentioned that we won't have to wait until June to get info.

But what if no footage comes out?

 

[EGOMON]

PD magic never seize to amaze me, GT6 from 10 years old console still holds its own against new gen games. I can't wait for PS4 GT these guys gonna blow everyone else of the water.

 

[eso76]

Worth noting that those track also have dynamic tod in GT6, i believe ? SPA at least
GT Sport shall blow our faces

 

[Pepto]

Is this a real photo?

 

[TheAdmiester]

Is this a real photo?

Nope, that's the Forza Apex version.


I know of course there's a large time and generational gap between the games, but good god Forza absolutely blows GT's tracks out of the water. Even just the texture quality of the road alone is a massive difference. Forza has always had much better textures and trackside assets than GT, even on the same generation.

 

[potatohead]

It's quite amazing how GT6 running on 10+ year old hardware even competes here.

In some ways it still even looks more natural than the competition.

I hope they knock it out of the park with GT Sport. I want to see next-gen GT and how it compares to stuff like DriveClub and Assetto/PCars.

 

[drugstore_cowboy]

PD magic never seize to amaze me, GT6 from 10 years old console still holds its own against new gen games. I can't wait for PS4 GT these guys gonna blow everyone else of the water.

Well when you can go balls out with little regard to maintaining a stable framerate very high highs can happen, that's not taking anything away from the visuals and talent, it's still my favourite looking racing game over all.

 

[EGOMON]

Well when you can go balls out with little regard to maintaining a stable framerate very high highs can happen, that's not taking anything away from the visuals and talent, it's still my favourite looking racing game over all.

Yeah PD were pushing 1440x1080 resolution on a freaking PS3 that's an overkill if they went with 1280x1080 it would have been much better for the performance of the game

 

[Yiazmat]

Two more:

 

[TheAdmiester]

Two more:

GT looks to have an inaccurate track here. The kink/straight (known as Graham Hill Bend) is much tigher in GT than Forza and real life:

Could just be FOV but Forza looks a lot closer.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

GT looks to have an inaccurate track here. The kink/straight (known as Graham Hill Bend) is much tigher in GT than Forza and real life:

Could just be FOV but Forza looks a lot closer.

I think Forza has the same laserscan data that is also in Assetto Corsa and Project CARS for Brands Hatch. GT is earlier and not based on laserscan data, but I always thought GT had a great version of the track as well.

When I compared the games half a year ago, my times in the Pagani Huayra were:
GT6: 1:31.994
FM6: 1:31.110
pCARS: 1:31.212 (that was on XB1. on PC I'm sure I could be ~1 second faster)

They all felt very different though... I just wanted to say, it's not a severe difference. In Grid 2 I did a 1:21.410 on Brands Hatch GP in a Hyundai Genesis!

 

[Cobaiye]

This looks like the 80's version of the track.

 

[magawolaz]

GT looks to have an inaccurate track here. The kink/straight (known as Graham Hill Bend) is much tigher in GT than Forza and real life:

---

Could just be FOV but Forza looks a lot closer.

Probably FoV, camera placement is different. Isn't Brands Hatch one of the laser scanned tracks certified by FIA? Can't imagine it being that inaccurate

EDIT: nvm, it's the 80s version, lol

 

[Yiazmat]

This looks like the 80's version of the track.

Oh snap you're right. I didn't even look at the version I picked. lol

Here's the modern layout:

 

[TheAdmiester]

Oh snap you're right. I didn't even look at the version I picked. lol

Here's the modern layout:

That's the one, then. Kerbs are different width across GT and Forza but the track is identical now.

Some more fuel for the thread - Forza's incredible overcast lighting.

 

[Baroquemantic]

Don't have a PS4 anymore and don't wanna bump the last gen console screen thread, so I'll just link these here. I figure you folks would appreciate them.

https://goo.gl/photos/KX56qwkB3nG7JRR76

That's all my old GT5 photomode shots. Starts off bad, but gets better over time.

 

[Apex]

Lighting apart the difference is in the small details. I'm still impressed with the attention of detail of Polyphony, all the environments are accurately scaled and textured true to its real life counterpart. The track in Forza looks rushed and lack of detail in comparisson. Patching everything with a layer of dirt doesn't seem to work and gives a plain grainy appearance to the graphics, certainly far from realistic.

I think Forza has the same laserscan data that is also in Assetto Corsa and Project CARS for Brands Hatch. GT is earlier and not based on laserscan data, but I always thought GT had a great version of the track as well.

PD records its own laser scanned data with their equipment, at track and aerial levels. They started to use this technology very early.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSyG1hQKAPk&feature=youtu.be&t=21m15s
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=118090193&postcount=7062

 

[TheRook]

So what do you think we can expect out of the new trailer of GT Sport?

-In game visuals
-details on GT mode and GT Online?
-Unexpected licensed cars/prototypes?

 

[TheAdmiester]

The track in Forza looks rushed and lack of detail in comparisson.

lol

Patching everything with a layer of dirt doesn't seem to work and gives a plain grainy appearance to the graphics, certainly far from realistic.

There's only one object that looks like it's coated in dirt and that's the white barrier on the Spa image. Other than that I don't see anything like what you're saying. Besides, the GT version looks far too clean with gleaming barriers and only a couple of skidmarks and discolourations on the track. For tracks that have existed for many decades a grimier look is the more appropriate one. As much as the tracks might have maintenance crews on them, they can't look brand new forever.

 

[FootballFan]

GT still keeping up and looking aces
Polyphony are gods

All I want from GT Sport is an even better driving model (and audio)

 

[Apex]

There's only one object that looks like it's coated in dirt and that's the white barrier on the Spa image. Other than that I don't see anything like what you're saying..

Besides, the GT version looks far too clean with gleaming barriers and only a couple of skidmarks and discolourations on the track. For tracks that have existed for many decades a grimier look is the more appropriate one. As much as the tracks might have maintenance crews on them, they can't look brand new forever.

Looks pretty spot-on to me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfD5ccnlxGg

 

[TheAdmiester]

*image*

You highlighted the one thing I already said I agreed with. That area of Spa is too grimy but the rest is accurate.

Also looking closer at the Spa image I realise now that GT has an inaccuracy on the barriers I mentioned. The mesh fences are a lot shorter than real life/Forza and look to be greenish instead of grey metal. Whether this is a seasonal or age thing I don't know, but it doesn't match the other two.

I still don't see the reason behind "Forza looks rushed in comparison" when the tracks are essentially spot-on, especially in terms of environmental details.

 

[Apex]

You highlighted the one thing I already said I agreed with. That area of Spa is too grimy but the rest is accurate.

Also looking closer at the Spa image I realise now that GT has an inaccuracy on the barriers I mentioned. The mesh fences are a lot shorter than real life/Forza and look to be greenish instead of grey metal. Whether this is a seasonal or age thing I don't know, but it doesn't match the other two.

I still don't see the reason behind "Forza looks rushed in comparison" when the tracks are essentially spot-on, especially in terms of environmental details.

Is not only the fence, many things inside the red square looks wrong when compared to the real thing.

The small green GT fence is also present in Forza behind the front tall fence. Probaly the GT track was modeled in a prior stage when the taller fence was not present in the real track. Or maybe they have no more ram available to model a double fence on that track...

Look at the bad scaling of the Coca Cola logo at the tower roof, at the lack of the red paint discoloration, at the inaccurate antena, at the lazy texturing work at the building side wall panels, etc... there are many details that scream "rushed" or lack of love. Forza It does have more elements modeled but that is something expected running in a better hardware, same as with high resolution textures, but the extra care that PD put on their tracks is not there in Forza.

 

[sems4arsenal]

Can anyone with Forza 6 take pictures with the same cars as the latest batch of GTS photos?

 

[Conduit]

Can anyone with Forza 6 take pictures with the same cars as the latest batch of GTS photos?

Let's try this one :

Forza 6 Nurb :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOcd_YFOK3o

GTS Nurb ( streamed ) :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xV1kmrnzEMQ


IMO, environment and cars looks much better in GTS.

 

[icecold1983]

GT sport looks pretty bad. what happened

 

[Sangetsu-II]

GT sport looks pretty bad. what happened

Only 50% complete (old build), has a long way to go and should wait for launch trailer.

 

[Fess]

GT sport looks pretty bad. what happened

No idea, I watched the GTS reveal trailer last night and I can't believe we've seen Forza 5 and Forza 6 during the years PD has worked on this and this is still what we're getting after 3(4?) years. Is it because the PSVR implementation took too much time? Or is it built for PS4 Neo and we're now seeing the scaled back PS4 version? Or maybe they're just stalling to get more time and money for GT7?

 

[jett]

I really wonder what goes on at PD internally. They've been shitting the bed in a multitude of ways the last few several years. I wonder how long will Sony put up with Kaz doing whatever he wants.

Only 50% complete (old build), has a long way to go and should wait for launch trailer.

It's coming out in six months. Maybe it'll get delayed.

 

[Noobcraft]

Yeah I'm not impressed at all with what's been shown about GTS. I understand the game is a work in progress but what they showed in the trailer/live stream didn't look impressive for a current gen game (Photo travel aside, but that's cheating). I've been more impressed by Project Cars despite its shortcomings.

 

[Conduit]

Brands Hatch comparison :

GTS :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgMhbCZEubQ

F6 :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqpwWnj3rro

 

[TheAdmiester]

Brands Hatch comparison :

GTS :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgMhbCZEubQ

F6 :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqpwWnj3rro

GTS has more natural lighting but the materials and general assets look a lot better in F6.

 

[T.O.P]

GTS has more natural lighting but the materials and general assets look a lot better in F6.

Yup

Also

No debris, no tyres marks neither on the road or on dirt? it also looks incredibly unnatural

 

[Conduit]

GTS has more natural lighting but the materials and general assets look a lot better in F6.

Can you be more specific?

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

PD's lighting engine ;___;

 

[Crayon]

Yeah GT Sport isn't exactly ripping my face off (I wanted my face ripped off) but the light and color is still better than... maybe anything else. That goes a long way in a driving sim, too.

 

[ps3ud0]

Yup

Also

No debris, no tyres marks neither on the road or on dirt? it also looks incredibly unnatural

Weirdly the right rear does leave a mark just as its about to spin on the grass verge but nothing else.

Once you consider the qualifier of how long theyve had since GT6 theres very little to show for it and nothing that prompts me to give them any benefit of the doubt when they come up with 50% completion and how PS4s been easier than PS3 mumbo jumbo. I see this very much like SF5 launch if not worse if theres not considerable improvement...

ps3ud0 8)

 

[UpUpDownDown]

Looks pretty spot-on to me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfD5ccnlxGg

Ewww. The proportions are all over the place on the forza version. Straight up bad modeling there....Looks fucking laughable

I mean the coke logo is squashed all to hell.

Funny stuff and screams outsource.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Can you be more specific?

GTS' assets are higher res than they used to be - even in the compressed stream you posted the higher res road textures and normal maps are more noticeable - but it doesn't seem to be using PBR materials like Forza does, everything still has "that look" from GT5 and 6 that I can't quite explain.

In short, GTS has realistic light casting on less realistic materials, while Forza has less realistic light casting on more realistic materials. Not sure which is more important so I'm not sure which balances out to be the "winner".

 

[flipswitch]

Yup

Also

No debris, no tyres marks neither on the road or on dirt? it also looks incredibly unnatural

He drove over a banana peel?

 

[Yiazmat]

 

[TheAdmiester]

Those asphalt textures are so nice.

 

[HTupolev]

In short, GTS has realistic light casting on less realistic materials, while Forza has less realistic light casting on more realistic materials. Not sure which is more important so I'm not sure which balances out to be the "winner".

I'd actually say it's exactly the opposite. GT's historical advantage has primarly been in authoring assets and environment conditions to take on a large-scale natural appearance even with lighting systems of low expressiveness. Even the GT games on the original Playstation have their textures and such carefully tuned to look "real" or "photographic" or whatever.

This is also why GT was able to render at high resolutions on PS3. If they had a very hefty lighting model, there's no way they could have even half-assed 60fps at 1440x1080.

The main perk of the PBR era is that natural material authoring is much easier now, thus throwing a wrench in GT's advantage.

 

[Shambalakan]

I made some comparisons between FM6, GTS and GT6. they're not 100% accurate, but better than nothing.
I think GTS is the most realistic one.

 

[Noobcraft]

I made some comparisons between FM6, GTS and GT6. they're not 100% accurate, but better than nothing.
I think GTS is the most realistic one.

There is something seriously wrong with the quality of the Forza 6 ones, like they were taken from a 720p upload or something. The game has problems with jaggies, but it is nowhere near that blurry, and the livery is pretty poor.

 

[GHG]

There is something seriously wrong with the quality of the Forza 6 ones, like they were taken from a 720p upload or something. The game has problems with jaggies, but it is nowhere near that blurry, and the livery is pretty poor.

There's something wrong with all of them. It's like they are all YouTube captures.

 

[Shambalakan]

There is something seriously wrong with the quality of the Forza 6 ones, like they were taken from a 720p upload or something. The game has problems with jaggies, but it is nowhere near that blurry, and the livery is pretty poor.

Yes. Sadly I couldn't find a 1080p FM6 video in Brands Hatch from that angle and it was the only one I found.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEsTLZM1fdk

 

[Conduit]

GTS' assets are higher res than they used to be - even in the compressed stream you posted the higher res road textures and normal maps are more noticeable - but it doesn't seem to be using PBR materials like Forza does, everything still has "that look" from GT5 and 6 that I can't quite explain.

In short, GTS has realistic light casting on less realistic materials, while Forza has less realistic light casting on more realistic materials. Not sure which is more important so I'm not sure which balances out to be the "winner".

I don't know about GTS, but Forza 6 DOESN'T use PBR on Xbone. And which more realistic materials in Forza 6?