Are you being intentionally obtuse at this point? That's not the context House meant and you know it.
PS4 Neo presentation might have leaked
- Thread starter Nibel
- Start date
Are you being intentionally obtuse at this point? That's not the context House meant and you know it.
Games have to be on the same disc as the standard PS4 versions so there's no need for it to be in dev kits. MS isn't sending out new kits for the One S.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I'm just frustrated. I don't want to bother with PC gaming again, but it seems I don't have a choice in order to get the experience I want. I'm done venting though.
Backfoggen
Banned
4K (And by that I mean 1600p-2160p) games look better. All the high res assets that have been used for a while now are resolved much better. On standard TV sizes it's going to reduce aliasing too, so we may finally see proper image quality on consoles.
In regards to Neo if nothing has changed regarding their CPU spec, 60 fps is going to be more complicated for devs then just increasing the resolution and using up the extra GPU power. I predict that, along with some extra effects, is going to make up the changes for the majority of the games.
What are you even talking about? I didn't say they will magically make everything 4K I said that they will use uprendering & they are.
Leyasu
Banned
And? Honestly, the fully bc next gen that Microsoft is pretty much proposing is 10x better imo.
Gamezone
Gold Member
I see. Too bad, as many games are getting bigger than 50 GB without getting an extra disc.
I mean, I don't blame you
these iterative steps are great advertising for PC gaming
Leyasu
Banned
No need for dGPU or the cloud, sony will just "uprender" their way to console parity... It's a shame that Microsoft never thought of using that for the xbone.
To be honest, I don't know what's the difference between upscaling and uprendering.
Militaratus
Member
There is kinda a focus on both resolution and framerate. Neo Mode must be run at 1080p at a minimum, but options to upscale to 4K or run natively at 4K exist for that mode as well.
The framerate has to be at least equal to the framerate in Base Mode. So say if a game already runs in 1080p in Base Mode, then the developer can choose to just use the extra power to improve the framerate.
Backfoggen
Banned
There is none. "Uprendering" is more sophisticated upscaling.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
Agreed.
Why do you think that even is? That MS is doing it out of the kindness of their hearts? They are going that route because they would get slaughtered in the media if they came out and said, Here's the Xbox Two!" only 3 years into the generation. Fully BC allows them to placate their current fanbase while restarting the generation. If that's what you want, then wait 17 more months and you'll have it. It's no skin off of Sony's nose.
Who says PS5 won't have BC next gen? Thanks to the simplified architecture this time around, I don't think it'll be hard to implement as long as they have a significant power upgrade (which they will).
I do on the other hand think the forward compability MS is proposing is making is worse (that is what their whole "beyoind generations" + "no one left behind" talk is all about).
Would rather have a PS5 that's not held back by PS4/Neo, instead of a Xbox Two held back by Scorpio/XBO.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I doubt forward compatibility will last long. Give a year or two like most cross-gens.
I don't want an Xbox, but that doesn't mean I can't recognize that they have a better plan. At least it appears that way right now.
I see this competing more with the Xbox One S more than Scorpio. PS5 in fall 2018/19. Basically for those late to the PS4 party or those in need of a new PS4 wait for Neo, everyone else will wait for the next generation.
Kinda like with phones. Every year there's a new iPhone but each phone lasts for 2 years. But with this maybe a 6 year generation with mid gens every 3. Keep everything in the same Eco-system and make each revision backwards compatible. OS upgrades go across the board but eventually some features and titles won't be supported. Eventually you just have a Playstation and know that you have a 2016 model and support will end for it in 10 years. Mac users will probably understand.
Kinda like with phones. Every year there's a new iPhone but each phone lasts for 2 years. But with this maybe a 6 year generation with mid gens every 3. Keep everything in the same Eco-system and make each revision backwards compatible. OS upgrades go across the board but eventually some features and titles won't be supported. Eventually you just have a Playstation and know that you have a 2016 model and support will end for it in 10 years. Mac users will probably understand.
How are people speaking with such authority on Sony's forward plans when all we have is this SDK internal slide set reference that was leaked info months ago, and no actual discussion from them directly?
And how are people comparing this information to Microsoft's Scorpio announcements?
This is a patently ridiculous comparison to make until Sony actually puts their own cards on the table, and people getting emotionally invested in this in advance of that need to take a breath, and just... wait. Because all we have is speculation and no actual verification of any up to date confirmed plan or intent on their part.
Sheesh, guys.
And how are people comparing this information to Microsoft's Scorpio announcements?
This is a patently ridiculous comparison to make until Sony actually puts their own cards on the table, and people getting emotionally invested in this in advance of that need to take a breath, and just... wait. Because all we have is speculation and no actual verification of any up to date confirmed plan or intent on their part.
Sheesh, guys.
TBF to an extent you're the architect of your own frustration .
A combination of wishful thinking and baseless extrapolation of a couple of posts from Osiris on the last big Neo thread and you appear to have convinced yourself that Neo was going to be within shouting distance of Scorpio.
You knew what the leaked specs were from the GB/EG articles, and OB's earlier emails, then there was that whole red pill/blue pill business and suddenly expectations went from what was evidence-based to wish-fulfillment.
I think that will depend on the Dev support & how Xbox Scorpio handle games that are not made from the ground up for it because if it don't hit the ground running it will live & die by Xbox One/UWP games while every PS4 game from now on is gonna have to also take advantage of Neo features.
Uprendering will get you a 4K display buffer using cheap techniques while upscaling will not be a 4K display buffer but a lower res buffer scaled across a 4K display.
You're not new here. You know what's going on.
Why wouldn't it last long? The purpose of it is to be different than cross-gen, to support multiple platforms for multiple years (longer than they've been supported before) and help ease the transition and bring in people at various pricepoints.
And let's say if it is even the same length as a typical cross-gen period, it'll still be worse than what cross-gen is. It'll be mandated. Developers won't be free to make exclusive Xbox Two games for those years. First party exclusives, that were typically some of the only titles that weren't cross-gen at the beginning of the console's lifecycle won't be free of it either and will have resources split in order to accommodate older consoles.
All in all, making it less worth it to own the new console the first couple of years.
Yes but games don't take 100% full capacity of discs, a lot of it is just uncompressed data.
And not all games will have improved textures as a Neo feature.
Hell, I bet some devs are going to get really lazy on the improvements.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
True, except it's not about Scorpio. It's rumored jerry-rigged dollar store CPU that annoys me. Change that and it would be solid. And based on what Osiris said there was/is good reason to believe they will drop it.
Truthfully if those leaked specs are true PS4 Neo is not doing 4k gaming, unless upscaled. I mean yeah if the graphics are fairly simple it can but nothing like GTA6. Developers are better served going for faster frame rate anyway.
I don't think anyone ever thought Neo would be doing native 4K AAA games. hell its not a sure thing for Scorpio
So kinda like Killzone shadowfall multi-player?
So you've swung from getting excited on the basis of a rumour, to being down again on the basis of previously known evidence.
If this was a new-new document I could see why you'd be down, but since all it does is confirm that the Jag was the state-of-play as presented to devs in Feb when its contents were leaked form DevNet.
You're too close to this Dr BlackVine, I'm taking you off the case!
Some fantastic posts in this thread! Basically it's the same info as previously mentioned? And people are losing their mind? Wow! All this VS Scorpio talk is nonsense given one is launching a year before the other and no doubt vastly cheaper...The more I read the more I believe the Neo is here to simply go head to head with XB1S in terms of the UHD media options, and given the cost to manufacture, even with a new GPU Sony will price it aggressively whilst dropping the vanilla price down...I see this purely as a win situation. It will do very well this Holiday season...I then fully expect a "PS5" in 2019 ...First party titles will look nuts and I for for can't wait...as a gamer AND an avid movie buff 8)
The Praiseworthy
Member
If the PS5 is BC then it will support PS4 disc... there isn't PS4 \ PS4 Neo.... just simply PS4.... it it's a cross gen game then a PS4 disc and PS5 disc.
If PS5 comes out around 2020.... yeah.... pretty sure we will still have disc by then, physical isn't going away anytime soon.
2019 is too soon... they already mentioned that Neo and VR might actually extend the life cycle of PS4... so 2020 by earliest.
who is losing their mind?
StrongBlackVine
Banned
I'm not proud of myself! I have intentionally avoided this subject since E3 for the most part, but somehow I got sucked back in. I'm done until Sony makes it official.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
They said that VR may extend PS4's lifecycle, and said Neo will not shorten it.
But honestly, I can defiinitely see them coming out with a ps5 in 2019, especially since this time around it'll likely have PS4 BC (easier transition for people), and that'll be around the time they will be prepping for a version 2 of the PSVR headset if it does well.
It's 4.2TF based off these specs.
Possumowner
Member
Interesting stuff to wake upto,didnt expect this to leak but I guess it's in line with what people had already been saying.
All we need now is for the official leek from Sony themselves to make it concrete
All we need now is for the official leek from Sony themselves to make it concrete
haha.
Depends on what and how you trace and how much memory bandwidth you are willing to use.
In the end the real limiting factor is the amount of work developers can spend for the features.
More sophisticated rendering, would be better way to say it.
We will be seeing multiple ways to render to higher resolution, expect shading rate of most games stay within 1-2x of the 1080p buffer/version.
Cannot wait to read all funky presentations on how developers will do things.
For me biggest change in quality, will be the HDR support for output.
It will make aliasing worse, but if game already uses pre-filtering for speculars and has wide resolve AA, the image will look really incredible. (4k will help the wide resolve to look a lot better, than it currently is.)
There's 17 pages ...it's not difficult to find the ones rather upset...
Sangetsu-II
Member
I don't get all this Scorpio will destroy PS4 talk.
By the time Scorpio launches at the end of 2017, PS4 would have sold over 60 million consoles.
No way would you destroy an install base that high, let alone convert anyone from PS4 to Scorpio when all Xbox "exclusives" are already available on 10TF i7 Titan PC's
By the time Scorpio launches at the end of 2017, PS4 would have sold over 60 million consoles.
No way would you destroy an install base that high, let alone convert anyone from PS4 to Scorpio when all Xbox "exclusives" are already available on 10TF i7 Titan PC's
professor denim
Member
I actually didn't, that why i say "if". On the phone can't bother. Thanks anyway
That's totally not what I mean. 4K gaming is not the standard even in the world of PC gaming yet. Most PC gamers are using 1080p or 1440p and are normally more concerned with 144Hz+ and gsync then 4K. Also, only a small percentage of people even own 4K tvs. Of course a site like NeoGAF will have a much higher percentage of people using or craving 4K, because most gamers on this site fall into a small niche.
I am cool with consoles focusing on 4K when it is actually has market share and is somewhat of a standard.
What is going to end up happening is the PS4 Neo and the Scorpio games will look and run exactly as they do now, but in a 4K resolution and at 30 FPS.
mercenar1e
Member
titles released October 2016 or later should work on both systems but what about the titles before its release? are we going to see 4K remasters or something lol
Possibly, I have done it in the past. But I don't think Microsoft will screw up again on the hardware side of things. I don't think they will ever let Sony have the more powerful console ever again. Maybe the same power, but not more powerful. Microsoft just flat out has more money and has learned from their mistakes, hopefully.
The Praiseworthy
Member
With the time and money the AAA games are taking now I don't see Sony going back to the 6 years cycle and stick with the 7 years.
It passed mid 2016 now and not that long time ago some of the AAA games were still being released cross gen + some of the big developers just released their first game for this gen + others JUST announced it + Some DIDN'T EVEN annouce it yet.
So honestly all the signs are leading to 2020 and forward... Not earlier
