small piece of advice for all the people with 2016 OLEDs: turn on the noise reduction when watching anything that is not a UHD BD. It helps eliminate all that terrible noise you see in the dark/black areas of the picture while watching cable or Netflix. I'm a purist that came from an ST60 plasma so it seem unnatural to me to have any of that shit on but its a must on these. I'm absolutely in love with the pq now.
Plasma, LCD, OLED, LED, best tv for next gen
- Thread starter spannicus
- Start date
f@luS
More than a member.
So it sux for sdr game mode we can't have normal it's forced to wide doesn't it ? How did you set up your game mode color settings to get same results as normal gamut ?
On Earth-2 Pioneer is still kicking out the best plasma displays the universe has ever seen!
Thanks. I was thinking on wide saturating colors but I wasn't sure.
Some colors look a bit different to me. Like grass looks more green, for example.
It actually seemed more noticeable on green colors to me (was trying it with Ratchet and Clank).
You can't have HDR in game
mode so there it is fine. The TV switches to a HDR mode when HDR content is detected (and there you can turn on normal).
Can't agree. It strongly depends on the quality of the source material and not if it is HD or UHD.
f@luS
More than a member.
Yeah but even for sdr. Game mode forces wide color gamut
Yes, you're right, I should have elaborated a bit more but I think for cable and Netflix its a must.
Movie has to support it, and more importantly your TV has to support it. One of the reasons I went with my Vizio P50-C1 over the KS8000 is because Vizio had Dolby Vision & HDR10 capability whereas the ks8000 can only do HDR10. And unlike what Vizio did with HDR10, you can't patch Dolby Vision in after the fact either, needs a chip.
Dr_Biscuit
Banned
In what HDR mode are you ? standard, bright or Vivid ?
If I am not mistaken you should be able to change the color gamut in "standard" mode.
f@luS
More than a member.
I'm asking for sdr. There is no game mode for hdr. But game mode (sdr ) locks the color gamut to wide
I just tried and went from 65 color to 40 color in game wide and it looks close to standard normal color gamut
Clockwork
Member
Neither Xbox One S or PS4 Pro support Dolby Vision.
What are you going on about?
Also as far as standards go all UHD Bluray players must support HDR10.
Other than on paper how is Dolby Vision better from a usage/compatibility scenario?
"Earth-2"
It kinda depends on the display.
Think you need to re-read what he wrote.
Dolby Vision is gonna go the way of the do-do or be an afterthought if it doesn't start getting more device and manufacturer support.
Clockwork
Member
DreadfulOmen
Member
If you're lucky microcenter has 55 for 899.
DreadfulOmen
Member
Lots of tvs have a "wide color" option, some tv brands have a different name for it. even my lg from 2012 has it.
Nah, you want Wide for HDR. Sony correctly labels this as Rec. 2020 (for DCI-P3). Normal (or Rec. 709 for Sony) is the regular color space used for SDR. You can measure the behavior of the color gamut options if you have a colorimeter.
f@luS
More than a member.
I'm lost. STEVENSON and 'avsforum are dashing normal. You say wide. How is it
SuperEpicMan
Banned
Don't suppose anyone with partial colour blindness can give their impressions of HDR? Part of me is worried that I won't even see the benefit.
This is the color gamut when it's set to normal (Rec. 709) on my OLED55C6P:
When set to wide (DCI-P3 within a Rec. 2020 container) on the same TV:
Take note of the size of each color gamut, and you can clearly see the boundaries of each color space. Nvidia has a nice graph on page 8 that overlays each color space within the visible spectrum. There's no point of HDR without Wide Color Gamut, so it should be set to Wide for HDR. Now the name of that setting might vary however i.e. the X800D labels the Color Gamut settings as Rec. 709, Adobe RGB (I don't quite remember this one), and Rec. 2020 to avoid the confusion.
DJ Lushious
Member
Huh?! On the same display, with the same content, Dolby Vision beats out HDR10 in every way one can grade video. It's not even something that can be argued.
This is an insane statement to make, ripe with holes.
First, Dolby Vision is the defacto standard implemented in cinemas. If one were to completely ignore the fact that cinema technology drives home theater technology forward, then you'd be correct. Though if you did ignore that huge fact, then you'd also be living in Fantasy Land. This paper-thin argument of yours proves you wrong, technology and after technology, in the home theater space.
Second, some of the world's largest content providers and producers are supporting Dolby Vision. Has anyone heard of Netflix? They're kind of a big deal and they support DV. What about Amazon? I know they've only been around for two decades, but they, too, support Dolby Vision. Wait... Vudu does, too?! And you say they're owned by Wal-Mart, the world's largest retailer? Get. Out.
If you're going to make a prediction, this early, then at least bring it back down to earth. The reality is that Dolby Vision isn't going anywhere. At worst, it's going to coexist with HDR10, just like Dolby TrueHD coexists with DTS-HDMA, and Dolby Atmos with DTS:X.
Clockwork
Member
Netflix: Also supports HDR10
Amazon: Also supports HDR10
UHD Bluray players: HDR10 support mandatory. Dolby Vision optional.
XBOX One S: HDR10 only
PS4 Pro: HDR10 only
PC: HDR10
And as far as your VUDU reference which is Dolby Vision only, these are the devices it works with:
DJ Lushious
Member
What does coexisting with HDR10 have to do with the price of tea in China? As I ended my post with, this is a viable solution and in no way, shape, or form indicates doom for Dolby Vision. So, yeah, what are you even trying to argue?
As for your devices, we are one year into HDR at the forefront of consumer displays. One year! Even after recognizing the infancy of it all, LG and Vizio are two of the top manufacturers of televisions. That's not even getting into streaming devices that support Dolby Vision. You didn't list the nVidia Shield or the Chromecast Ultra, for example.
And this is exclusively looking at the home theater market. As I also was clear in stating, the movie industry is behind Dolby Vision.
Dolby Vision and HDR10 is not a format war like Beta/VHS and HD-DVD/Blu. I don't know how I can make my points any clearer between this post and my previous one.
Hey guys I'm not that tech savvy when it comes to TVs I just want a good set for a decent price, preferably with very minimal lag since it will be used primarily for gaming.
I was thinking of grabbing the Samsung UN40KU6290F at bjs this weekend, was wondering what you guys think of this set. Or if there are better alternatives around the same price and size of this one.
I was thinking of grabbing the Samsung UN40KU6290F at bjs this weekend, was wondering what you guys think of this set. Or if there are better alternatives around the same price and size of this one.
MiamiWesker
Member
Hey guys I am looking for a new 40 inch 1080p TV for black Friday. Under $300. I have an old 2008 HDTV and while it works it just does not look close to as good as modern tvs. So I want something good, prices have come down a ton so I am sure I can get a really high quality one for gaming rather cheap. Not looking for 4K yet, just something to fill the gap till one day I go all in.
What do you recommend? Where are the best deals?
What do you recommend? Where are the best deals?
Joei
Member
There's a Microcenter like 20 min. past the Best Buy, but I'm still going with BBY. I use a BBY credit card and I'm going to get enough points to offset that 40$ difference, plus, I have 385$ between reward dollars and gift cards that I'm going to use. I was damned tempted to go to Micro though.
Clockwork
Member
1) Afaik Nvidia Shield does not support Dolby Vision
2) Afaik Chromecast Ultra does not support Dolby Vision but will via a firmware update
https://forum.vudu.com/showthread.php?947250-VUDU-UHD-Compatible-Devices-List
https://productforums.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/chromecast/oL4yOR01_00
For Vudu in particular it doesn't matter anyway, but you do have to wonder if it is a sign of things to come...
http://www.forbes.com/sites/johnarc...ch-dolby-vision-hdr-exclusivity/#4ca2004f51b6
DJ Lushious
Member
I have no qualms when admitting I am wrong, and I am wrong on this.
That doesn't invalidate any part of this discussion.
The key in word in every part of that news report is "exclusivity." If this is your example of "sign of things to come," then you have agreed upon my point that HDR10 and Dolby Vision are going to co-exist. It's pretty clear that's not the point you were trying to make, though.
So, I ask for a second time, what are you trying to argue?
DJ Lushious
Member
Because I like talking about this, here's an additional component of Dolby Vision that further makes it such a great standard:
All other HDR formats can be derived out of a Dolby Vision master.
Any device that supports Dolby Vision will, by DV's very nature, also support HDR10. Vizio's delayed HDR10 support wasn't a matter of "won't it," but rather a matter of priorities/manpower.
All other HDR formats can be derived out of a Dolby Vision master.
Any device that supports Dolby Vision will, by DV's very nature, also support HDR10. Vizio's delayed HDR10 support wasn't a matter of "won't it," but rather a matter of priorities/manpower.
jstevenson
Sailor Stevenson
I stand corrected then - it was Chad B or someone on AVS that was advocating for Normal for the OLEDs in HDR for accuracy, but that evidence seems pretty strong
Yappadappadu
Member
Wide for HDR? Now I'm confused. 
As for DV devices, the next Mass Effect is supposed to come with DV support for the PC version.
As for DV devices, the next Mass Effect is supposed to come with DV support for the PC version.
Enjoy it...incredible TV
Wide for HDR? Now I'm confused.
As for DV devices, the next Mass Effect is supposed to come with DV support for the PC version.
Can't wait to see how it looks. Maybe we'll have to beg LG for Dolby Vision game mode too.
infinityBCRT
Member
TVs with Dolby apparently cut out detail above 600 nits of brightness in HDR10... And generally have worse input lag.
edit: meant nits, not bits
Just picked up a Sony XBR55X930D 4K HDR TV yesterday. Oh my! It almost feels like I'm experiencing the jump from SD to HD all over again. I upgraded from a 2006 720p rear projection LCD if that give you any indication for how big of a difference it is.
I picked up a PSVR...that led me to a PS4 Pro....which took me to the point of finally upgrading the TV after 10 years. I'm sure that this was all part of Sony's plan...
Edit: And you know what's stupid? One of my favorite things is "seeing the whole UI now". My older TV had some bad overscan and some games it was very apparent that I was missing seeing things along the edges of the screen.
I picked up a PSVR...that led me to a PS4 Pro....which took me to the point of finally upgrading the TV after 10 years. I'm sure that this was all part of Sony's plan...
Edit: And you know what's stupid? One of my favorite things is "seeing the whole UI now". My older TV had some bad overscan and some games it was very apparent that I was missing seeing things along the edges of the screen.
Ah, I don't use Game mode. I use ISF Dark. LG locked many of the Expert Controls out of Game mode, so you can't change them along with the Color Gamut option. It's not ideal, but on my TV in Game mode, if I default Color to 50 from 65, adjust the color temperature down to W44 to roughly get 6500K, and lower OLED Light (the backlight) to 35 to get about 150 nits, the grayscale actually tracks almost perfectly with a dE average of 0.82 while maintaining the saturated look people love about cooler color temperatures. All that fiddling is equivalent to using Cinema or Movie mode, keeping a Warm 2 color temp, and oversaturating your colors by forcing Rec. 2020 while maintaining an accurate grayscale at very least really.
Sad to see how flawed Game mode is honestly because I'm still awaiting my OSSC order to get some PS2 retro gaming done.
my C6 came in yesterday... which is why I haven't posted much since then...lol.
when the UPS Truck driver arrived with it....man the box (not LG box, but the company box who sent it) was beat up. There was a hole on one side... and it was obvious it was opened and taped up again....(still talking about the company box)
I was like WTF? and truck driver looked suspicious as hell, as if he dropped it himself a couple of times or something.
anyway, I recorded it....asked him my options......and just decided to take it upstairs. Opened up the company box, and the LG box on the inside was ok...but there was a ripped hole though.
still nervous as shit, but wishful thinking, set it up... and worked fine...no physical damage....and no damage when turned on. No dead pixels (although I kept mistaking Ronda Rousey's mole as a dead pixel, from the UFC game cover on the cross bar)
mind you, it came from the East Coast, all the way to San Francisco.
anyway....
I LOVE THIS THING!
Also, I'm not usually a gamer who uses Game Mode when he plays.....but game mode on here looks great! I'm coming from a Sony W900a. (still have it)
I'll post more in a day or two..but man. Love it so far.
jstevenson
Sailor Stevenson
No game should ever trigger Dolby vision so not sure what input lag you're talking about is.
And unclear why you think DV clips info? DV works with the TVs capability to try and roll off correctly if the TV is incapable of displaying the full range. HDR10 should do this as well but it doesn't work nearly as well in practice matching to the TV and vice versa (partially due to inconsistency in mastering, partially due to TVs handling it differently) --- no TV is capable of the full range so this is paramount to get as close to accurate as possible
I mean he might not be wrong - I'm not THX/ISF certified after all. Just a hobby here. But from my understanding, HDR in Rec. 709 is just HDR at that point. Without Rec. 2020, you don't have Wide Color Gamut (WCG), which is the reason for all the extra colors you see. HDR and WCG are actually two very different things, but they're used interchangeably for marketing purposes.
jstevenson
Sailor Stevenson
yeah it's definitely one of the more confusing aspects.
In theory you wish the TV would just recognize what it was getting fed and would accomodate from there
Theonik
Member
That's because it's only on LG OLED which is not capable of higher brightness and shitty TVs by Visio.
e: A TV with DV will only use the DV processing on DV sources which are scarce, HDR10 will rely on whatever the manufacturers can come up with on these sets.
But the benefits of DV disappear when you are on higher quality TVs anyway as they have good enough processing of their own. TV manufacturers are not supporting it mostly because of that.
(not only is it expensive and needs proprietary hardware by Dolby, it stops them from using better processing to differentiate their sets which for say Sony is not on the cards)
ZD9 is.
jstevenson
Sailor Stevenson
The ZD9 does hit 100% of brightness, but only hits 90-95% of DCI-P3 based on what I read, and only 66% of rec2020 (vs 75% for the OLEDs).
So it still has to roll off correctly in places when it cannot reproduce the brights or colors demanded by the content
infinityBCRT
Member
From what I understand, Dolby Vision only TVs have been firmware updated to support HDR10... I believe that they are using the existing dolby vision chips in those TVs to process and display HDR10 signals as well... so my own theory is there must be something inherent in the Dolby Vision chip which causes worse input latency in Game + HDR mode than TVs which natively supported HDR10 without Dolby Vision. Just a theory.
jstevenson
Sailor Stevenson
The 2016's LG OLEDs shipped with Dolby Vision and HDR10.
Last year's 2015 LG OLEDs had HDR10 with No Dolby Vision.
So uhhhhh
Theonik
Member
95% DCI-P3 coverage yes. It handles colours outside the range reasonably well too, 2020 isn't really a target for most sets right now expect it to matter in the next 2 years or so.
Visio added it with a FW update but Visio's processing is not very good. Neither is LG's for that matter which is why both makes are suffering with non-DV content relatively speaking. Sony kinda has that area on lock right now.