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[mrklaw]

Just came back from seeing it with my family. Generally enjoyed it, but some parts seemed clumsy. I thought the Tarkin CG was obvious and distracting, but nobody else noticed so maybe it's because I knew he was dead so I was looking for it to be fake?

I thought when the plot decided it was time for the rag tag bunch of heroes to die it was badly done - timing and editing just felt weird. They spend a long time farting about with hooking up some random cable for the comms, then a storm trooper just walks past and lobs a grenade in and the pilot guy is dead, swiftly followed by the others.

Also the shield take-down was just poor. 'Get this message to the fleet to take down the sheild' - but they are trying, so what is that message actually going to accomplish? And that while pice takes a lot of time and exposition which is pointless. Then the ramming scene just looks terrible. How come that rebel ship can crash into the star destroyer fast, but that's fine and then turns into a tugboat, but the star destroyer crashing into the other one slices it like butter? Wasn't even going that fast. And generally another SD crashing into a SD felt lazy.

Quite a lot in the first half felt unnecessary too - the entire trip to Edoo they basically did nothing except watch things happen.


Most of all though - I thought in episode IV the plans came from some 'rebel spies' and when the alliance sees the first they've heard about it. But based on this movie everyone knew about it all along.

It was fun, but just felt a little bloaty

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

Also points for keeping the death start weapon within the range of a planet killer without having to blow up the planets at once like they were made out of dynamite. It's like the antithesis of Starkiller which design philosophy must have been "we have to make obviously bigger in every way, no matter how dumb it looks"

 

[Skilletor]

Just came back from seeing it with my family. Generally enjoyed it, but some parts seemed clumsy. I thought the Tarkin CG was obvious and distracting, but nobody else noticed so maybe it's because I knew he was dead so I was looking for it to be fake?

Nah, I've never seen the originals and knew that dude was CG. Asked my wife if it was a character in the originals.

 

[Suzushiiro]

As someone whose favorite bit of Star Wars story is probably TOR's Imperial Agent storyline, which is about an intelligence agent doing their best to serve a nation run by space wizards who have their heads so far up their own asses with their god complexes that they've completely lost touch with reality, I really loved that for once they made a Star Wars movie that wasn't entirely about space wizards and their friends/relatives. It's nice that we got a movie about (relatively) normal people in that universe.

I also liked how they subverted a lot of Star Wars traditions, such as not doing the opening title crawl and K-2 getting cut off before he can finish saying The Line That They Say In Every Star Wars Movie (though I guess it still counts as saying it?)

 

[Metalmarc]

Some other thoughts after watching it.


-I need to see it again (only saw it once so far )

-Who was that astromech droid who was silver and orange in one of the ships?

-What happened to C2B5? The imperial black droid did anyone spot him?

-I didn't catch chopper, but reading since i think i know when to look on next viewing

-That first ship in the movie sounded like the first ship from Attack of the Clones

-Wow if i was a kid i'd sure want a Toy Darth Vader Castle to play with.

-maybe i should have bought and read that prequel book to this movie, (i now have the audio version for free through amazon audible trial, hope it's good)

-I need the Artbook to this Movie

-If i can learn how to edit movies, i'd try to trim the only little parts out that i didnt like when i buy the Bluray, my own fan edit for myself (my dad used to do this a lot years ago he'd borrow my vhs recorder and hook it up to his recorder, play the film on one and record on the other and pause out the bits of films he didnt like, course it looked a bit jarring /wonky editing but it was good fun watching my dads edits)

- i hope we get a good making of documentary of this film when the bluray comes out.

 

[AntraxSuicide]

Then the ramming scene just looks terrible. How come that rebel ship can crash into the star destroyer fast, but that's fine and then turns into a tugboat, but the star destroyer crashing into the other one slices it like butter? Wasn't even going that fast. And generally another SD crashing into a SD felt lazy.

That would totally hold up with actual physics. They don't ram the SD at full speed with the Corvette, they just get smashed into it. Since it's disabled, we're talking basic Newton's laws here (i.e. it's just a floating hunk of metal), so they can push it as fast as they want to. It smashes into the other SD much harder than they hit it with the Corvette.

 

[mrklaw]

Also way too many scenes of 'hero powerless and held at gunpoint by bad guy, bad guy shot from off screen by random person'. That is lazy after the first couple of times.

 

[btrboyev]

New actress for mothma.

Same from Episode 3

 

[Afrodium]

The dismissal of character arcs here is odd. Every competent movie you've seen has character arcs for its main characters. It's a pillar of screenwriting, and establishing one doesn't require lengthy tangents into each character's back story. Hell, Rogue One does have character arcs for the main cast, even the dude with the big gun.

I think the main flaw was that I didn't care at all about any of these characters or their motivations. This doesn't mean the characters had no motivations, just that the film did a poor job of establishing them and presenting them in a way that made the viewer give a shit. I care more about Poe Dameron, who was barely in TFA, than I do about anyone in this movie. Hell, I still remember Poe's name and know I won't even remember Jyn's name in a week.

 

[The Driver]

The problem with killing off Jyn and Co was that the story climaxed with Jyn dying and then you had this extra bit with Vader then Leia.
It just fell into a narrative mess.

I don't think the movie was a mess because of this but it definitely felt like a missed opportunity. Outside of not wanting to really twist the blade by showing the rebels we followed the whole movie get brutalized by Vader (or worse, piss off Vader stans by having him job to the Rebels) I see no reason why they didn't have him kill at least some of the group instead of a bunch of faceless rebels. That scene could have had way more oomph had Vader been cleaving K2 in half, force choking Cassian, etc.

 

[ExVicis]

The dismissal of character arcs here is odd. Every competent movie you've seen has character arcs for its main characters. It's a pillar of screenwriting, and establishing one doesn't require lengthy tangents into each character's back story. Hell, Rogue One does have character arcs for the main cast, even the dude with the big gun.

I think the main flaw was that I didn't care at all about any of these characters or their motivations. This doesn't mean the characters had no motivations, just that the film did a poor job of establishing them and presenting them in a way that made the viewer give a shit. I care more about Poe Dameron, who was barely in TFA, than I do about anyone in this movie. Hell, I still remember Poe's name and know I won't even remember Jyn's name in a week.

But even without the backstory bits there still was a notable lack of an arc for half the main cast still. I'm struggling to think what Cassian's arc was really because he didn't really have any epiphany or change really. Bodhi, the Pilot, and Chirrut, the Blind Warrior, had no arc, their most defining moments are plugging in some cables then dying or flipping a switch then dying. You introduce a character by having him take out a street full of Stormtroopers single-handedly then write him out of the movie by having him calmly walk to a switch, activating it, then blowing up?

Characters in this movie were really clumsily handled.

 

[Sulik2]

I don't think the movie was a mess because of this but it definitely felt like a missed opportunity. Outside of not wanting to really twist the blade by showing the rebels we followed the whole movie get brutalized by Vader (or worse, piss off Vader stans by having him job to the Rebels) I see no reason why they didn't have him kill at least some of the group instead of a bunch of faceless rebels. That scene could have had way more oomph had Vader been cleaving K2 in half, force choking Cassian, etc.

My guess is that was the original story idea, but it ended up being way too dark for a family film so it was changed to what we got.

 

[BronsonLee]

My guess is that was the original story idea, but it ended up being way too dark for a family film so it was changed to what we got.

Ya I'm surprised Vader didn't just fucking murder everyone in a hallway tbh but I think the way they handled it was better

 

[Toa TAK]

My guess is that was the original story idea, but it ended up being way too dark for a family film so it was changed to what we got.

Ya I'm surprised Vader didn't just fucking murder everyone in a hallway tbh but I think the way they handled it was better

Hot damn.

 

[soldat7]

All due respect to James Earl Jones, but Vader sounded more like Grandpa Vader to me. It was really distracting listening to just how old he sounded. Should have done some sort of post-processing on his voice, IMO.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

I think this got lost in the sauce a few pages back in that weird argument over the integrity of Leia's baldfaced lie to Darth Vader but:

The "For Your Consideration" version of the Soundtrack is now up on Disney's awards site. It's about 15-20 min longer, and features cues from the score that are not on the soundtrack, and I believe alternate versions of some cues that are.

http://www.waltdisneystudiosawards.com/#/rogue-one/music

 

[Dorsal Axe]

Just came back from seeing it with my family. Generally enjoyed it, but some parts seemed clumsy. I thought the Tarkin CG was obvious and distracting, but nobody else noticed so maybe it's because I knew he was dead so I was looking for it to be fake?

Personally Tarkin stood out to me because he looked waxy next to the other human actors, and moved in a very unnatural way.

The silly thing about it all is that they had already recast Tarkin for Revenge of the Sith, and that worked much better than what they tried to do here. Nobody would have batted an eyelid about another actor playing the role, but using CGI has turned it into a huge sticking point that everyone will keep debating from now on.

 

[jelly]

All due respect to James Earl Jones, but Vader sounded more like Grandpa Vader to me. It was really distracting listening to just how old he sounded. Should have done some sort of post-processing on his voice, IMO.

A few words here and there for sure but it was mostly okay. I had more of a problem with Vader not being very imposing casually like OT Vader. The suit still looks odd and along with how he moved except the end didn't work too well.

 

[bigwinnerx]

I think this got lost in the sauce a few pages back in that weird argument over the integrity of Leia's baldfaced lie to Darth Vader but:

The "For Your Consideration" version of the Soundtrack is now up on Disney's awards site. It's about 15-20 min longer, and features cues from the score that are not on the soundtrack, and I believe alternate versions of some cues that are.

http://www.waltdisneystudiosawards.com/#/rogue-one/music

File name for the last track is pretty funny:

"7m50RogueOneEndCredits-FilmVersion(noJW)"

I'm not telling anyone to do this, but, you can inspect the elements and get the direct URL listings to download the mp3s. Which I may have done.

Total runtime on this one is 29 tracks over 1:15:43

 

[Bobby Roberts]

File name for the last track is pretty funny:

"7m50RogueOneEndCredits-FilmVersion(noJW)"

Yeah, I think you'll need to take "Hope" from the Soundtrack, track in the closing credits fanfare from one of the previous films, and then edit in that track at the proper point to get the film's end titles.

 

[Toa TAK]

I think this got lost in the sauce a few pages back in that weird argument over the integrity of Leia's baldfaced lie to Darth Vader but:

The "For Your Consideration" version of the Soundtrack is now up on Disney's awards site. It's about 15-20 min longer, and features cues from the score that are not on the soundtrack, and I believe alternate versions of some cues that are.

http://www.waltdisneystudiosawards.com/#/rogue-one/music

YES

I hope they continue to do this for each film release. Though, I wonder why they just don't release this as the soundtrack beforehand instead of having two different versions? They can put two different of the same track or cue on the same album, can't they? It's been done before?

 

[keltickennedy]

There was just something off about Tarkin's eyes and some of the movements of his face looking unnatural. Of course, knowing that Peter Cushing is dead I immediately knew it wasn't real, so there was no way I wouldn't be distracted. If someone wasn't aware of who he was I guess they might not have noticed. But the whole reason for doing it was for people who remembered the character, so all of those people will automatically start scrutinizing what they are seeing.

I also don't remember the original actor being that tall. Some of the shots he was in with other characters, he looked like a giant.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

YES

I hope they continue to do this for each film release. Though, I wonder why they just don't release this as the soundtrack beforehand instead of having two different versions? They can put two different of the same track or cue on the same album, can't they? It's been done before?

It's a matter of time, I think. You can only fit so much music on a single CD. Plus composers sometimes don't want just a bunch of raw cues on the soundtrack, they wanna finesse em a little and edit stuff together for listenability.

This FYC version doesn't have the suites like the Soundtrack does, it's missing the music from the Vader & Leia sequence at the very least, not sure what other major differences there are.

 

[jelly]

Personally Tarkin stood out to me because he looked waxy next to the other human actors, and moved in a very unnatural way.

The silly thing about it all is that they had already recast Tarkin for Revenge of the Sith, and that worked much better than what they tried to do here. Nobody would have batted an eyelid about it, but the CGI has turned it into a huge sticking point that everyone will keep debating from now on.

I thought Tarkin was obvious but very good for CGI. What killed it was his lips and talking, wasn't quite right.

Don't agree on Revenge of the Sith. That guy looked so weird and plastic.

I think CGI was the right choice to bridge the very small gap in time between the OT and Rogue One.

Not sure if Disney ever fix anything for retail releases but they should fix the lips and reading at least if they do which would help a lot. Leia was so short that I couldn't tell much beyond the lips again.

 

[Toa TAK]

It's a matter of time, I think. You can only fit so much music on a single CD. Plus composers sometimes don't want just a bunch of raw cues on the soundtrack, they wanna finesse em a little and edit stuff together for listenability.

This FYC version doesn't have the suites like the Soundtrack does, it's missing the music from the Vader & Leia sequence at the very least, not sure what other major differences there are.

Well, I want all the music, god damn it.

 

[Prisoner]

Just got back from seeing this. Cool movie but CGI Peter Cushing was distracting and in poor taste.

 

[Escape Goat]

What about Rogue 2: Bothan Boogaloo?

 

[ghostwritingduck]

I don't recall the Rogue One crew talking to each other during the movie. Did they? I know Jyn and Cassian talk to each other, and they briefly talk to the other characters, but I don't recall any conversations between team members.

 

[Surfinn]

Saw it again in Imax. Fuck those space battles look incredible on that screen.

One thing I will say..

Those of you saying the score sucked.. I think are dead wrong. Loved it even more in the second viewing. Some issues with transitioning but that was pretty minor. The only part that stuck out to me was the chime use when the star destroyers collided. That was a little off. Aside from that I fucking loved the score and it felt different but within the SW universe.

Another thing I'm gunna say is that they've done a FANTASTIC job incorporating prequel material and making them retroactively a little better.

But this film still didn't do much for me in an emotional level with its characters. TFA accomplished much more in that regard.

Still, the future looks bright for spin-off films. I welcome the potential they have.. Possibilities are limitless in the SW universe.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

This was a fucking masterpiece. Every character was immaculately illustrated and I was just wrecked when they all made the ultimate sacrifice. So I already just a mess before the end.

But when the Blockade Runner detaches, I actually gasped. Every single thing that ever made a difference in the entire fucking galaxy came down to a tiny crack in the doorway.

I'd like to see some motherfucker try and walk around in a Stormtrooper outfit after this.

Ready to disable the shield on January 20, America.

 

[Tookay]

The dismissal of character arcs here is odd. Every competent movie you've seen has character arcs for its main characters. It's a pillar of screenwriting, and establishing one doesn't require lengthy tangents into each character's back story. Hell, Rogue One does have character arcs for the main cast, even the dude with the big gun.

I think the main flaw was that I didn't care at all about any of these characters or their motivations. This doesn't mean the characters had no motivations, just that the film did a poor job of establishing them and presenting them in a way that made the viewer give a shit. I care more about Poe Dameron, who was barely in TFA, than I do about anyone in this movie. Hell, I still remember Poe's name and know I won't even remember Jyn's name in a week.

The leads in TFA were thinly-conceived characters with poor arcs; it's just people confused their likability/amiability for good characterization...

There's near absence of conflict amongst the TFA protragonists - so much so that it feels deliberate. Even things that should divide them are brushed away, resulting in character interactions/motivations that makes no damn sense. Poe kills Finn's buddy, causing him to defect, but somehow they're best friends by the next scene. Finn is a brainwashed soldier, trained from birth, but acts like a goofball throughout the entirety of the film, begging the question of how the First Order didn't pick up on this kind of behavior during 20+ years of training. But even though there's basically no reason for Finn to be ashamed about his past, he withholds it from Rey... which you would think might be a source of tension, but they're over it the next time they meet. None of the protagonists really disagree with each other; rather, they're always complimenting one another because the writers want you to like them so much.

The main heroes in the OT bickered, they fought with each other, and clashed because they had different goals/personalities. Rogue One mirrored that more than TFA ever did.

 

[Count Dookkake]

I suspect there is a lot of overlap between the people who demand character arcs and memorable names and the people who 'ship.

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

I suspect there is a lot of overlap between the people who demand character arcs and memorable names and the people who 'ship.

Ayy

 

[Lifejumper]

Is the rogue callsign in ANH a tribute to the Rogue One team?

 

[Escape Goat]

Is the rogue callsign in ANH a tribute to the Rogue One team?

Do you want it to be?

 

[Lifejumper]

Do you want it to be?

Gives more meaning to it I guess?

 

[Escape Goat]

Gives more meaning to it I guess?

Then sure. It is!

 

[StrangeRoboMemory]

I strongly disagree with everyone who says that character arcs are unnecessary or that they are some newfangled modern convention that is only expected by people who have been spoiled by prestige serial television. This stuff has been part and parcel of men on a mission/WW2 action movies since the beginning. When you have a bunch of guys on a squad, each one has their own little story or motivation. One guy wants to kill this specific Nazi, another guy wants to get back home to help his parents on the farm, one guy has a thing for the war correspondent embedded in their unit, but she won't give him the time of day. One of the classic cliches is Eddie from company C, who shows the squad a picture of his best gal back home. Then when Eddie dies, the audience thinks, "Oh no, now he'll never get to meet his best gal again". It's overly telegraphed and has become something of a joke, but characters are supposed to have these little things about them that connect us to their story. This is especially essential in a war movie, where many characters will die and sacrifice themselves.

Even more importantly, the characters on the squad have a network of relationships. We know how Lee Marvin feels about Steve McQueen, how Ernest Borgnine feels about Charles Bronson, how Tom Sizemore feels about Adam Goldberg, etc. One guy on the squad is racist and is constantly badgering the one Jewish soldier. All the rest of the squad backs up the Jewish soldier and it's a bonding moment. Two characters are rivals but they eventually form a begrudging respect. One guy is loyal to the captain to a fault and the other soldiers resent him.

Rogue One has almost zero character relationships. There's no network that connects these people.

How does Bodhi feel about K-2? No idea.
How does K-2 feel about Chirrut? No idea.
How does Baze feel about Cassian? Other than some vague disappointment that Cassian was going to kill Jyn's dad, no idea.
How does Cassian feel about Bodhi? No idea.
How does Jyn feel about Baze? No idea.
How does Baze feel about Chirrut? They are friends and used to be guardians together. That's all we know. Almost literally nothing else.
How does Jyn feel about Chirrut? Other than the fact that Chirrut seems to respect Jyn for an entirely unknown reason, no idea.

It's easy to establish these things. It's not the special arena of prestige TV. Disney has shown that they are capable of this. One of the strengths of the Marvel films is that we get these little character moments where people interact in little ways. That was one of the reasons that the first Avengers was so great. That could have been done here so easily. I'm not asking for complex relationship dramas, just those little moments and small connections. I want to know how Baze feels about Bodhi or K-2. I want them to be connected in some way, even if it's extremely small, even if they only share a joke. There are only six main heroes here. It's a relatively small group. Even The Dirty Dozen, where we have the 12 main soldiers + Lee Marvin, Ernest Borgnine, Robert Ryan, and George Kennedy, manages to give us these character networks without a problem. It's a foundation to any war movie, and Rogue One entirely lacks it.

 

[Davide]

I thought Tarkin didn't look exactly like him but as CGI it was perfectly realistic enough. Other people I went with thought it was just an actor.

The performance though, wasn't quite right.

 

[Killer Queen]

I honestly was fine with CG Tarkin, Vader's voice and the one liner.
Actually quite liked the later two.

 

[BlastProcessing]

I strongly disagree with everyone who says that character arcs are unnecessary or that they are some newfangled modern convention that is only expected by people who have been spoiled by prestige serial television. This stuff has been part and parcel of men on a mission/WW2 action movies since the beginning. When you have a bunch of guys on a squad, each one has their own little story or motivation. One guy wants to kill this specific Nazi, another guy wants to get back home to help his parents on the farm, one guy has a thing for the war correspondent embedded in their unit, but she won't give him the time of day. One of the classic cliches is Eddie from company C, who shows the squad a picture of his best gal back home. Then when Eddie dies, the audience thinks, "Oh no, now he'll never get to meet his best gal again". It's overly telegraphed and has become something of a joke, but characters are supposed to have these little things about them that connect us to their story. This is especially essential in a war movie, where many characters will die and sacrifice themselves.

Even more importantly, the characters on the squad have a network of relationships. We know how Lee Marvin feels about Steve McQueen, how Ernest Borgnine feels about Charles Bronson, how Tom Sizemore feels about Adam Goldberg, etc. One guy on the squad is racist and is constantly badgering the one Jewish soldier. All the rest of the squad backs up the Jewish soldier and it's a bonding moment. Two characters are rivals but they eventually form a begrudging respect. One guy is loyal to the captain to a fault and the other soldiers resent him.

Rogue One has almost zero character relationships. There's no network that connects these people.

How does Bodhi feel about K-2? No idea.
How does K-2 feel about Chirrut? No idea.
How does Baze feel about Cassian? Other than some vague disappointment that Cassian was going to kill Jyn's dad, no idea.
How does Cassian feel about Bodhi? No idea.
How does Jyn feel about Baze? No idea.
How does Baze feel about Chirrut? They are friends and used to be guardians together. That's all we know. Almost literally nothing else.
How does Jyn feel about Chirrut? Other than the fact that Chirrut seems to respect Jyn for an entirely unknown reason, no idea.

It's easy to establish these things. It's not the special arena of prestige TV. Disney has shown that they are capable of this. One of the strengths of the Marvel films is that we get these little character moments where people interact in little ways. That was one of the reasons that the first Avengers was so great. That could have been done here so easily. I'm not asking for complex relationship dramas, just those little moments and small connections. I want to know how Baze feels about Bodhi or K-2. I want them to be connected in some way, even if it's extremely small, even if they only share a joke. There are only six main heroes here. It's a relatively small group. Even The Dirty Dozen, where we have the 12 main soldiers + Lee Marvin, Ernest Borgnine, Robert Ryan, and George Kennedy, manages to give us these character networks without a problem. It's a foundation to any war movie, and Rogue One entirely lacks it.

I think this is a nice bit of critique that helped me clarify my own feelings.

 

[Creamium]

-I didn't catch chopper, but reading since i think i know when to look on next viewing

wow what? Is there a screencap of this somewhere?

 

[WadiumArcadium]

wow what? Is there a screencap of this somewhere?

I doubt we're allowed to post leaked screens, I'll send you a PM.

 

[Spikematic]

Just watched it. Amazing movie! I don't think anyone in the audience was ready for Vader wrecking shit up like that in the end. That was an unbelievable scene.

I see some people complaining about Vader's voice. I honestly didn't notice anything wrong with it. Was perfectly badass to me. And Tarkin's CG was really well done too, IMO.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

Wait y'all didn't like all these new characs??? They were fucking amazing. I want trilogies for all of them. I guess that's what EU is for I guess.

 

[Sulik2]

Ya I'm surprised Vader didn't just fucking murder everyone in a hallway tbh but I think the way they handled it was better

The scene we got was dark and violent, but you have to admit that Vader picking off the main characters one by one who we had gotten to know over a two hour movie would have been just a bit darker then a bunch of no name soldiers getting demolished.

 

[Metalmarc]

I thought Tarkin was obvious but very good for CGI. What killed it was his lips and talking, wasn't quite right.

Don't agree on Revenge of the Sith. That guy looked so weird and plastic.

They could have taken that actor and superimposed Peter Cushions face over him, at least we would have had Human movement, i dont know how that would have looked, but they should have tried it.

 

[ghostwritingduck]

Wait y'all didn't like all these new characs??? They were fucking amazing. I want trilogies for all of them. I guess that's what EU is for I guess.

The characters had potential, but they never really talk to each other or say anything interesting.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

The scene we got was dark and violent, but you have to admit that Vader picking off the main characters one by one who we had gotten to know over a two hour movie would have been just a bit darker then a bunch of no name soldiers getting demolished.

I would have literally flipped every fucking table in the Drafthouse. That would have been nonsense. Every charac got an incredible, fitting, heroic death, and the movie paid it off by showing the collective value of sacrifice.

If it was just about Vader omegaing on everyone and then whoops missed one there would have been no tension, no resonating message of rebellion and sacrifice and the greater good. Just some dumbass boss fight.

God fuck that how could anyone want that.

 

[ghostwritingduck]

They could have taken that actor and superimposed Peter Cushions face over him, at least we would have had Human movement, i dont know how that would have looked, but they should have tried it.

If they had used Tarkin in stationary shots, wide shots, and holograms the whole thing would have been more convincing. The technology just isn't quite there yet.