SFIV is so much more fun than SFV

What is this Bizarro World were Third Strike is considered a bad game?

At this point I'd assume the game gets a bad rep for its hardcore defenders and the pedestal so many put it on.

A lot of people did not like the new cast either, but I also remember when SF4 came out a lot of players, especially some big Japanese ones, decided to just plain skip it in favor of playing more SF3.

It's the Melee of the Street Fighter world...
 
What? Q was bottom tier in 3S

He was, but several prominent players back in the day rep'd him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URTpNCfY5CA

Edit: To elaborate on this low effort post: In a game like SF3 where you can simply knock away incoming attacks with the parry mechanic, fundamentals and character knowledge trumped all. I suppose you could say that for any fighting game, but SF3's universal mechanics really felt like great equalizers in ways that focus attacks did not. Of course, focus attacks did offer more options and were much kinder to charge characters, but I still preferred the all or nothing parry.
 
I believe the issue is, as people have said, that just bc the parry existed didn't mean it put you on even footing. You could parry but you could get less from it with some of the lower tiers than the higher tier characters. Also the higher tier characters cared about parry less than the lower tier characters because they had more ways to bypass it, sometimes without even changing their offense
 
Also, the netcode, which delayed inputs to compensate for latency, made it impossible to react to anything and transformed the game into something different completely. Anything over 100ms ping felt like playing under water.
Rollback can be pretty janky if one of the players has a particularly terrible connection but it provides a more consistent experience since it doesn't impact input delay.

The roll back netcode would be fine if it actually work in SFV. Anything above 100ms would cause the animation to skip. The game try to smooth out the experience but only for the one that has the worse performing internet/PC. And also the character model lags behind with the hitbox. I would see Bison's Physco Axe particles effect ahead of Bison's arm the same with Ken's DP.

It's like dealing with Battlefield 2's lag comp where the hitbox is behind the model.
 
What is this Bizarro World were Third Strike is considered a bad game?

It's where they say the game has no footsies, and that you can parry 100% of the time.

And then it's chun this, ken that. And whiffing to build meter.

And that you can't mash jabs that lead to stupid shit. Or back dash everything.
 
*has flashbacks of Elena and Yun.

the difference being that yun was a character that didn't have to play fundamentals, in a game (SFIV) with a neutral game that allowed classic street fighter (low lag so that reacting was easier; fireballs, mid range normals and anti-airs all actually being good). You can bring up yun, rufus, seth, viper... sure, some characters didn't play by the rules, but most definitely did.

On the other hand, laura is one of the worst offenders, in a game (SFV) with a neutral game that was designed directly against fundamentals. In SFV, nor laura, nor anyone else, has to respect fireballs, or keep in mind that they shouldn't jump because it's supposed to be risky (right...), or respect your oponents normals (crush counter!!), etc..

Honestly, i would be surprised if someone can explain why SFV rewards fundamentals more than SFIV, like some say.
 
the difference being that yun was a character that didn't have to play fundamentals, in a game (SFIV) with a neutral game that allowed classic street fighter (low lag so that reacting was easier; fireballs, mid range normals and anti-airs all actually being good). You can bring up yun, rufus, seth, viper... sure, some characters didn't play by the rules, but most definitely did.

On the other hand, laura is one of the worst offenders, in a game (SFV) with a neutral game that was designed directly against fundamentals. In SFV, nor laura, nor anyone else, has to respect fireballs, or keep in mind that they shouldn't jump because it's supposed to be risky (right...), or respect your oponents normals (crush counter!!), etc..

Honestly, i would be surprised if someone can explain why SFV rewards fundamentals more than SFIV, like some say.

Ways SFV rewards fundamentals more:
Higher advantage for a knockdown, while having less true vortexes. A lack of FADCs and backdash invincibility usually means a knockdown gets you better pressure.

For punishing jumping, about the same as SFIV. Less safe jumps, but anti-airs are more situation specific. Divekicks are less of a problem in V as well with only Cammy's ex and V-trigger divekicks being a problem most of the time.

Outside of a handful of crush counter buttons, usually ones with very limited range, respecting your opponents normals is part of the game. Whiff punishing works well, frame traps are strong and most characters can convert of a whiff punish.

Less DP invincibility makes frame traps stronger.

As far as projectiles go Akuma, Guile, Nash, Ryu, Fang, Urien and to a degree Necali use theres in neutral quite often and to great success.

V-reverals work well as a way to discourage pressure for the most part. Some are too slow, but the majority work. Some like Rashid, Cammy, Ed, Nash, etc. are some of the better defensive options in the game.


For IV over V there's:
Generally safer fireballs, with some characters having incredibly safe ones like Gouken and Guile.

More light hit confirms meant less swinging for the fences in most cases.

Focus attack dash/backdash gave a universal way to escape certain situations or evade fireballs.

More invincibility on some characters dragon punches meant more consistent anti-airs for some of the cast. But, other characters were out of luck against any character that could affect their jump arc/speed.

Rewards for a knockdown were very high with some of the cast. A chance at safe pressure and with a large chunk of the upper tier characters it lead to vortexes that were very hard to escape until delayed wake up in Ultra.




As far as which is classic Street Fighter? Eh, Street Fighter has been loaded with nonsense since the beginning. If people had YouTube and online tutorials in 91 you'd see all types of busted stuff in every arcade back then. Same way ST, the Alpha series, etc. are filled with non-classic Street Fighter stuff now.
 
SFV has some problems that I hope Capcom irons out, but the philosophy itself behind SFIV was awful. The risk/reward is brutally skewed, the revenge mechanic feels cheap, and the inundation of option selects means people who know how to abuse them have the game making decisions for them. I am so very happy that IV is dead.

The roster, on the other hand, did have most of my favorite characters... so that is one thing I miss.
 
Ways SFV rewards fundamentals more:
Higher advantage for a knockdown, while having less true vortexes. A lack of FADCs and backdash invincibility usually means a knockdown gets you better pressure.

For punishing jumping, about the same as SFIV. Less safe jumps, but anti-airs are more situation specific. Divekicks are less of a problem in V as well with only Cammy's ex and V-trigger divekicks being a problem most of the time.

Outside of a handful of crush counter buttons, usually ones with very limited range, respecting your opponents normals is part of the game. Whiff punishing works well, frame traps are strong and most characters can convert of a whiff punish.

Less DP invincibility makes frame traps stronger.

As far as projectiles go Akuma, Guile, Nash, Ryu, Fang, Urien and to a degree Necali use theres in neutral quite often and to great success.

V-reverals work well as a way to discourage pressure for the most part. Some are too slow, but the majority work. Some like Rashid, Cammy, Ed, Nash, etc. are some of the better defensive options in the game.

What the hell is this?

I just made a list of characters that have throw loops in this corner. This game needs invincible backlashes because of this.

Fireballs are a lot worse in this game. Guile is the only one that has a good fireball game because of his fast recovery and the ability to flash kick recovering from the Sonic Boom.

Necalli, Zangief, Rashid, Dhalsim and pretty much everyone has a light anti air jab (For unfortunate Nash players). This game needs better jump ins with the way hurtbox works.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23YUJzeoRFc

DP with less invincibility is fine but it's nowhere near as good as it should be. V-Reversals are suppose to fix but they can be thrown out, some have slow recovery, some puts them into a even worse situation and some doesn't do anything.


V-Trigger is pretty much a buffed up FADC that can now be gained by using V-Skill.
 
Don't even look forward Evo anymore sf5 is boring as shit to watch.

Between that and the other issues with the lineup at Evo this year, it's going to be more low key for me as far as watching.

Zangief players can be exciting to watch in SFV, though. The worst is Karin. That shit is as braindead as I've ever seen in SF. Button, step forward, button, step forward, button IT'S A CRUSH COUNTER!, stun.
 
Between that and the other issues with the lineup at Evo this year, it's going to be more low key for me as far as watching.

Zangief players can be exciting to watch in SFV, though. The worst is Karin. That shit is as braindead as I've ever seen in SF. Button, step forward, button, step forward, button IT'S A CRUSH COUNTER!, stun.

THIS

Gief matches are always fun to watch tho, for sure
 
Between that and the other issues with the lineup at Evo this year, it's going to be more low key for me as far as watching.

Zangief players can be exciting to watch in SFV, though. The worst is Karin. That shit is as braindead as I've ever seen in SF. Button, step forward, button, step forward, button IT'S A CRUSH COUNTER!, stun.

Karin and Laura, no matter who you watch, play the exact same
 
To listen to fighting game players you'd wonder which, if any, fighting games they do like..

In fact it seems to be the games they hate the most are the ones they watch, play and talk about the most.....
 
What the hell is this?

I just made a list of characters that have throw loops in this corner. This game needs invincible backlashes because of this.

Or learn to tech ? Or risk a jump ? Or a reverse special that is throw invincible ?

It's certainly not a easy situation, but you have to wonder how you got to it in the first place. Mika relies on the corner for big damage and her pressure on it should be big.

Fireballs are a lot worse in this game. Guile is the only one that has a good fireball game because of his fast recovery and the ability to flash kick recovering from the Sonic Boom.

Fireball pressure in this game works very differently than in other SF games. Laura/Juri have a small range fireball that allows them to keep the pressure on their opponents using their normal attacks. Dhalsim has a freaking fireball that goes on an arc. Even Guile can make a stronger fireball if he uses his v-skill.

Ryu/Ken and the ones that kept the fireball game as it was and it's still viable. However this is game about reading your opponent, not reacting. If your opponent read your fireball, you will take the jump-in. There will be no time to throw a DP and get out safely. If he reacted to your fireball, then there's plenty of time for a DP. The opponent has to jump before the fireball is out in order to punish it.

I didn't liked in SFIV because you would either use it for combos or allow your opponent to absorb it and get a Ultra earlier.

Necalli, Zangief, Rashid, Dhalsim and pretty much everyone has a light anti air jab (For unfortunate Nash players). This game needs better jump ins with the way hurtbox works.

This I agree and it's a bigger problem with S2. They tried to remove anti-air jabs, but it's clear that they didn't tried hard enough. Characters should have their AA options, but currently a lot of those are unreliable.

V-Trigger is pretty much a buffed up FADC that can now be gained by using V-Skill.

While you gain VT by taking damage, it's use is very, very different from an FADC. Especially depending on the character, where their game completely changes when the VT is on.
 
GAF has such a hate boner for SFV, it never fails.

Hate the launch or the lack of content all you want but you are crazy if you think IV plays better than V.
 
I just started playing Ultra on PS Now for shits and giggles, and I can't believe how well this game aged. It still feels great to play and I find the gameplay of SFIV way more satisfying than SFV's. It's more about the mechanics/combat than the content, for sure.

Anyone else feel a little nostalgic for SFIV after playing SFV?

Yep totally agree, I get bored by sf5, but love sf4.
 
GAF has such a hate boner for SFV, it never fails.

Hate the launch or the lack of content all you want but you are crazy if you think IV plays better than V.

The irony is that most people in this thread actually agree that SFV is better and it has more entrants at EVO than SF4 ever had lol.
 
I am enjoying SFV more then I ever did with SFIV, even though SFIV got better at the end of its cycle. Then again what do I know? considering I loved SxT, especially after the updates.
 
I'm looking forward to Injustice 2 & The King of Fighters XIV at EVO 2017. Street Fighter V, not so much.

Also Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 one last time!
 
you sound as if the hate is unwarranted given the sorry state of Cacpcom

Hate is a simple feeling for simpletons.

Real people are what's called "even-handed". That means you can appreciate the good qualities of a software *and* understand its failures and limitations, as well as the context that gave rise to the particular qualities of the product. With practice, this will give you what's called a "well-rounded perspective" which in the case of SFV would allow you to appreciate the gameplay plus/minuses separate from its marketing, separate from its post-release support, separate from the day-to-day challenges of Capcom, and the higher-level realities of modern fighting game communities.
 
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