Word.
The state of NeoGAF
- Thread starter EviLore
- Start date
- Status
Eternal Gamer
Member
Really disappointing to see Evilore using O.T. as a scapegoat.
You mean a night of the long knives, amirite?
(GAF, I'm so sorry it ended like this. I hope everything works out for all the sane and cool people who are gone. "Happiness for everybody, free, and let no one be left behind!")
funroll-loops
Member
I still think sexual assault is wrong. I'm just thankful I've always used adblock when visiting this place!
Zelmardonpoktendo
Banned
You are wrong. So wrong.
David Ricardo
Member
I think most of us here will agree that his account of the events is hard to believe, and her story is quite believable.
If she wanted to hurt him or destroy his public image, she would have accused him of something worse. Blackmailing her into sex, raping her or whatever.
Her accusation isnt so bad in the first place. Two friends go together on a trip, both get drunk, he tries to get physical by showing naked while shes showering, she says thats not ok and thats mostly it. He misread the situation, he is a little bit of an asshole and behaved like an asshole for the rest of the trip. I dont know, I dont see how thats sexual assault.
What he did its not ok, but I dont see it as such a horrible act. He should just man up, accept his guilt, say he is sorry he misread the situation at that point in time and go back to work.
I would have accepted that. But he is handling the situation reaaaally badly and he is coming out as even more of a selfish asshole.
Croatoan
They/Them A-10 Warthog
Ehh, screw Trump honestly. Dude is a bad pres.
Have you read these 'decent users' ban posts? If that is what you call decent then I have news for you..
ghostofsparta
Member
they had consensual sex at a later date, but somehow (according to some people) Evilore assaulted her ?_?
I appreciate what you said about enjoying my input.
I don't plan on suiciding my account because it's just not something I would do, so if by any chance I end up being wrong, I'll gladly be back. But I just can't be part of something I don't believe in anymore. The Amir0x thing was already hard to overcome, and now this... I'd rather just look elsewhere - and I hope we'll all find ourselves there together once more, eventually.
Stay safe
It's not so much scapegoating as it is overcorrecting.
Killing the OT because of shortcomings in moderation, transparency and civility is like killing mice with frag grenades.
It's overkill and sends the message to the community that the right lessons are not being learned.
This all the way, I got so bored with this forum after I got banned for a stupid reason, and made another account. Why did I get bored? Because I worried way too much about what I would say would be misconstrued as worth banning. This forum got real old fast when you realized there was a list of separate unwritten rules. Evillore also acted extremely poorly on this issue even if every word he said is entirely true. I am fucking done. Ban me or don't I am logging out for good.
ComputerBlue
Member
OT needs a time out, it's best just to keep this forum to gaming for a little while until things settle.
Hopefully it comes back as a entertainment section for movies, shows, books, board games etc etc.
Depths of Orion
Member
That clearly it wasn't as big a deal as she's making it out to be? If you were so distraught over this then why carry on a relationship with someone?
I'm just pointing out that calling him a sexual predator and rapist is going too far.
Wolfe
Member
Fuck. Thor: Ragnarok was coming out and I wanted to discuss it on GAF.
Well thank god I don't have to sit through that lol.
In all seriousness, I personally am still sitting back and observing how this whole thing goes. With OT being gone for the moment I will be spending less time here as I always spent more time in OT than Gaming but there are still threads I've kept up with for certain games, but that's prolly a good thing atm with the circumstances. Also I'm not willing to condemn someone when I only have bits of info on the whole story.
It's like someone is trying to make the controversy about inflamed attitudes and not sexual assault allegations.
It won't be the same as long as the toxic sleeper alt right members still hang around. Let this outrage fizzle out and common sense return with some moderation and things will return to status quo.
Xplatformer
Member
Happy you are back.
Here to stay.
Here to stay.
DaytimeWhiskey
Banned
What else do you call someone that grabs a woman's ass to show how manly a man he is?
prag16
Banned
That was a lot of text devoted to repeating yourself several times. I said from the beginning I'm not a huge fan of the guy. But I'm willing to consider that he was somewhat blind to the hideous monster he had created until it turned on him. No that obviously doesn't cast him in a positive light at all. A lot of this has to do with self preservation. But if he didn't in fact commit any actual assault in 2015 as alleged, then he has every right to try to salvage his reputation and his site.
You can leave if you don't like it. Many already have. It sounds like you were happy with the status quo. You can always find another echo chamber that suits you.
This is the type of shit that is the problem. Always dealing in absolutes. Everybody is always Hitler. Everybody is always a rapist. No, that does not make him a sexual predator. There is plenty of middle ground such as "somewhat of an asshole" and "immature" and other things. Not everybody is rapey Hitler. Stop it.
Mahadev
Member
Other than him being naked she didn't allege that he touched her or did anything other inappropriate with her. Nothing. The ridiculous scenario you concocted that she would be attached to him like some rape victims do makes absolutely no sense.
Mushroomer25
Member
Compelling counterargument.
You are exposing yourself so hard.
PleaseDontBanMe
Banned
is possible to create a sub form dedicated to films, comics and movies?
dlbeast
Member
Here is an example why we must use caution until all facts come out.
This guy lost his job, because the employer had to insure they were not part of any of this, taking the high road. what gets missed is, the guy did nothing wrong once more facts came out.
My point is, i hope people are more careful, and collective when being judge and jury.
article is here:
http://www.metronews.ca/news/calgary/2017/10/14/cbe-trustee-candidate-subject-of-racist-threats-withdraws-complaint.html
This guy lost his job, because the employer had to insure they were not part of any of this, taking the high road. what gets missed is, the guy did nothing wrong once more facts came out.
My point is, i hope people are more careful, and collective when being judge and jury.
article is here:
http://www.metronews.ca/news/calgary/2017/10/14/cbe-trustee-candidate-subject-of-racist-threats-withdraws-complaint.html
Kamina
Golden Boy
Right? Those were the kind of people calling you out in threads when you expressed doubt for wild accusations over twitter and co., claiming you are victim blaming, even though you were only trying to keep a cool head and look at the sitation from an unprejudiced viewpoint and avoid mobbing the accused, like so many do.
Its fine to have an opinion and freedom of speech, but ones freedom stops where it impaires another-ones freedom.
It really depends on your definition of sexual assault. If I think a female postal worker who delivers mail to my home is cute that doesn't mean I can answer the door with my penis swaying in the breeze. That's still sexual assault, even if I apologize and cover up.
It's heavily context dependent sure - there is a possibility that exposing myself to a mailwoman will be received well, but there's also the distinct possibility it won't be. Whether or not it's sexual assault is all in how the event is perceived.
It seems like Evilore is saying the shower story is a fabrication, so this only matters in the event that it was an actual occurrence, but someone feeling they can expose themselves to you without your consent is an example of sexual assault. It can be completely unintentional and still be received that way. It isn't something you have to be cool about experiencing, nor something that should be done with the idea that a "Oops, I'm sorry" 'get out of jail free' card can absolve you of the consequences of deciding someone needs to see you naked even when they haven't asked.
encephalon
Member
Meanwhile, elements of Persona 5 cannot be discussed because they are political in nature.
Nekketsu Kõha
Banned
Initial reaction of course was that it was horrible. Then you learn they were into each other beforehand. She was in an open relationship. They shared room. He did leave. They had relations afterwards and she supposedly was assaulted 4 times on the same street the day she told the story. Not exactly Cosby here.
Unfortunately some people like attention and want their own. Same happened now in my country where we now have legit serious scandals but also a few false accusations debunked. Be supportive but also sceptical.
That doesn't mean evilore shouldn't learn a lesson or 2 and starting with being humble and less confrontational as he has been in the past would be a good start.
Evilore wants no political discussion in OT?
Dude, YOU steered the site to being as politically focused as it was. If you gave a shit about it being too social-issues focused or whatever before there were sexual harassment allegations against you, wouldn't you have pulled the mods into line earlier? It's pretty clear it was encouraged from the top down.
Remember when the Neogaf logo was rainbow to celebrate gay marriage but there was no recognition of Iwata's death because Tyler was upset that people asked him to do something?
But no, it's all about the games. It was always all about the games!
This attempt to restart is just sad. You need to step down, Evilore. Go out and reevaluate your life. Learn to conduct yourself with some fucking dignity.
In its current incarnation, with its current owner, the only appropriate response is to say, fuck this site.
Dude, YOU steered the site to being as politically focused as it was. If you gave a shit about it being too social-issues focused or whatever before there were sexual harassment allegations against you, wouldn't you have pulled the mods into line earlier? It's pretty clear it was encouraged from the top down.
Remember when the Neogaf logo was rainbow to celebrate gay marriage but there was no recognition of Iwata's death because Tyler was upset that people asked him to do something?
But no, it's all about the games. It was always all about the games!
This attempt to restart is just sad. You need to step down, Evilore. Go out and reevaluate your life. Learn to conduct yourself with some fucking dignity.
In its current incarnation, with its current owner, the only appropriate response is to say, fuck this site.
Pretty much this.
Doubling down on the MH accusations, the wall-of-text self-justifications...that kind of deflection is usually something done when you know you're in the wrong but for whatever reason don't want to admit it.The MH accusations are also pretty shitty.
Fuck...Any idea where they are heading?
I appreciate what you said about enjoying my input.
I don't plan on suiciding my account because it's just not something I would do, so if by any chance I end up being wrong, I'll gladly be back. But I just can't be part of something I don't believe in anymore. The Amir0x thing was already hard to overcome, and now this... I'd rather just look elsewhere - and I hope we'll all find ourselves there together once more, eventually.
Stay safe
Yeah I can understand that. Maybe it's just that my principles aren't that strong and I just want to stay where a lot of awsome folks hanged around. I'll keep my eyes and ears open where people are heading now. If you know something let me know.
And thanks, you too.
You are worthy of rhat name and avatar.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
I did forget that word, but I have no reason not to believe her. Plus, some of Harvey Weinstein's victims kept a relationship with him, business-wise or otherwise. Imagine how normalized and ingrained this culture of harassment is in our society that even victims keep in contact with their harassers.
TLZ
Banned
So they had a relationship? Then what on God's earth is all this shit about?
It'snothing.gif ?
onadesertedisland
Member
Could it be perhaps a financial decision? Catering to a new market so to speak?
The accusations weren't the worst in the world but the reaction to them and the coverup of anything that looks bad on evilore means I cannot support the site.
After reading evilore's comments to waypoint and the language he used to describe the woman involved nobody should want to continue funding this guy's lifestyle.
After reading evilore's comments to waypoint and the language he used to describe the woman involved nobody should want to continue funding this guy's lifestyle.
Yep!
Defective14
Neo Member
Oh god, dude. No, don't do that. Reach out and talk to someone before making that terrible leap again.
Uno Venova
Banned
But she was clearly still negatively affected by the incident to reveal it to her friends and family on Facebook.
EviLore. There's some great posts in here, I hope you read them (especially the Albatross). Regardless of what you felt happened your handling of the situation has given no one any reason to believe or respect you.
This is not the gaming fan site you started. It's been bigger than that for a very long time. It's a business and in many ways you failed to correctly run it like one. You aren't the first one to do this, many startups have had this happen. You should have hired a community manager to help you, some one to run the day to day or cover your ass or the mods asses. You needed at least someone for PR because crises do happen. Amirox was an early warning. Your statement lacks any sense that you have the capability to lead and your decision to hand down policy simply doesn't work for such a community driven endeavour especially not if your credibility is shaken. Remember, users make the content, not you.
Since you don't have that PR person I'll tell you what they would have said. Don't make it about you, don't attack the other party, make yourself seem sorry, leave with some tokens of goodwill. You missed all of those and you read as defensive and neurotic. You'll want to power through this and put on a brave face, but it unfortunately doesn't work like that. The community was looking for a sorry face.
This is not the gaming fan site you started. It's been bigger than that for a very long time. It's a business and in many ways you failed to correctly run it like one. You aren't the first one to do this, many startups have had this happen. You should have hired a community manager to help you, some one to run the day to day or cover your ass or the mods asses. You needed at least someone for PR because crises do happen. Amirox was an early warning. Your statement lacks any sense that you have the capability to lead and your decision to hand down policy simply doesn't work for such a community driven endeavour especially not if your credibility is shaken. Remember, users make the content, not you.
Since you don't have that PR person I'll tell you what they would have said. Don't make it about you, don't attack the other party, make yourself seem sorry, leave with some tokens of goodwill. You missed all of those and you read as defensive and neurotic. You'll want to power through this and put on a brave face, but it unfortunately doesn't work like that. The community was looking for a sorry face.
Zelmardonpoktendo
Banned
I am not going to argue, and be a keyboard nazi, over someone who is judging me, without even fucking knowing me.
I BELIEVE HE IS INNOCENT!!!!
THAT DOES NOT CONSENT HIS ACCUSATIONS!!!!
Use your fucking brain.
- Status