The state of NeoGAF
- Thread starter EviLore
- Start date
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Same here. I literally just saw it in the Waypoint article. I wonder if hes even still alive. No way that guy survives prison with that charge.
Kacho
Member
And you didn't even mention the sleeper Gamergate and Russian cells who conspired with Trump to take NeoGAF down!
vonStirlitz
Unconfirmed Member
[Redacted as the member no longer wishes to be associated with this website, and the reputational damage and distress caused by association with this website. In addition, the user considers that the action of the management, and the nature of the site and members of its community, renders the original terms and conditions of this site void, and it unconscionable for either side to be bound to them. The user reasserts their IP rights in all content and does not give any authority for its continued usage on this website. Despite requesting that the user's account be deleted, in accordance with data protection rules which apply to this website over multiple jurisdictions, the admin team have failed to delete this account, requiring the user to take its own steps to ensure the valid deletion of data.]
tell yourself.
Member
Please bring back OT Communities for archiving purposes. The music i learned about from j-pop gaf will be lost forever at this rate.
And that's the biggest problem right now, is that this accusation has come forward among many other similar situations in the past and there are so many people defending Tyler. The evidence is so clear yet people are so willing to say "no ignore it think of the games!" when you just can not do that with things like a fucking PEDOPHILE being in your moderator team. I only learnt of it from this whole debacle but jesus fucking christ people don't be so quick to defend because of games.
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
I'll continue to follow the story with interest. Off-topic became increasingly horrendous over the last year or 2 with the swiftest of bans for the mildest of disagreements, so I'm not sure I'll miss it.
As to the allegations :S it all sounds terrible. Everyone should have the opportunity to defend themselves though, this obviously won't be the end of this story.
I only learned of both Amir0x and Opiate when this story broke, but both those guys were demodded and removed from this place. This is the correct action to take in such a situation when you find out human garbage is on your team. Arguably Amir0x should have never been here, the guy was always a fucking idiot regardless of his penchant for wanting to fuck little kids.
As to the allegations :S it all sounds terrible. Everyone should have the opportunity to defend themselves though, this obviously won't be the end of this story.
I only learned of both Amir0x and Opiate when this story broke, but both those guys were demodded and removed from this place. This is the correct action to take in such a situation when you find out human garbage is on your team. Arguably Amir0x should have never been here, the guy was always a fucking idiot regardless of his penchant for wanting to fuck little kids.
I read through your post, and I dunno man. It's too little, too late for me. Thank you for paving the way in the early days and setting the groundwork for this site to grow from, it was my favorite site for many years. I don't know all the facts, obviously, but I just don't think I believe you're telling the total truth either. I'm not going to condemn you because I don't know either of you personally. Just guess I came in to say "see ya guys later". Also killing OT is a terrible idea, that was your bread and butter. If you want to allow any chance for the site to grow again, you'll need that.
Because that's simply how it works. PR is not about facts, it's about reputation management. At best you can say he completely missed a signal, and clearly that made a huge impact on her life. Apologize for that. But don't throw an alleged victim under the bus, that look just doesn't work, especially if you want anyone to support your own cries for victimhood.
BRocknRolla
Member
Just last week after reading something particularly vile about gamer gate, I thought to myself, "The internet is full of some really terrible shit. I'm lucky to have found a corner that isn't like that." And it's almost surreal to have all of this suddenly come out. So many stories from the past that had been buried too coming to light for me.
And all of this just serves to empower those awful people on the internet who can point at NeoGAF now and say that it's just as unsavory as anywhere else. I'm shocked, and appalled, and frankly just sad. This was a special place.
And to see now that apparently secret moderation and "no more politics" is somehow the answer? And all the bans in and out of this thread? It's just wrong. It's the wrong way forward for so many reasons.
All I've ever used NeoGAF for was a place to discuss video games without having to endure the seedy side of gaming culture. With this, and the reactions I'm seeing across various threads, it's clear that dream is dead. Maybe it was naive to think it ever existed in the first place.
As much as I've loved it here, I can't in good moral conscious stick around. Hope we all find a new place to call home.
And all of this just serves to empower those awful people on the internet who can point at NeoGAF now and say that it's just as unsavory as anywhere else. I'm shocked, and appalled, and frankly just sad. This was a special place.
And to see now that apparently secret moderation and "no more politics" is somehow the answer? And all the bans in and out of this thread? It's just wrong. It's the wrong way forward for so many reasons.
All I've ever used NeoGAF for was a place to discuss video games without having to endure the seedy side of gaming culture. With this, and the reactions I'm seeing across various threads, it's clear that dream is dead. Maybe it was naive to think it ever existed in the first place.
As much as I've loved it here, I can't in good moral conscious stick around. Hope we all find a new place to call home.
Zelmardonpoktendo
Banned
Do you understand how bad it is, if he is innocent, how badly this can tarnish him and affect his whole life. what if he is innocent and this is just a crazy ex, and everything he states has happened. the whole gaming industry is basically nailing him to the cross calling him guilty, he is saying he is innocent. There is no harm having faith in people.
However, you don't know me to judge me saying that I consent that sort of behaviour, because whatever my view is, on this situation, UNLESS you have FACTS that he is guilty, has nothing to do with anyone. IF he was guilty and proven, and I sided with him, ok, different story, but theres no proof, no evidence, and he is saying he is innocent, so until he does get proven guilty, which AGAIN has nothing to do with being apart of a gaming community, im going to continue coming to this board and enjoying talking about gaming with other gamers and if that affects you so much, FUCKING BLOCK ME!
peetfeet
Member
Couldn't agree more, political threads were horrible, the left dominating and setting upon anyone who even slightly disagreed with them. Whether they were right, center or even left themselves people were wary of contributing to the thread. No wonder the mods were drawing straws to enter the threads. Good riddance, hopefully the rest of off-topic returns sooner rather than later.
Good luck to the mods out there whoever you are, well done for stepping up to the plate, you're going to be busy for a while, hopefully after the current backlash your job should become a little easier.
Dr.Guru of Peru
played the long game
I'm not sure yet if I'll keep posting here - the large exodus of posters that I enjoyed reading is quite depressing, but I feel what we've witnessed here the last few days is a symptom of a chronic problem on GAF: the user base in general lacks the sophistication to understand the complexities of some issues posted on the OT side. Being generally left leaning it never bothered me too much, but the thoughtless dog piling that went on in some threads really brought down the level of discourse.
pants
Member
Obfuscating moderation further is a bad move, the self appointed infallibility of the mods here was a huge problem before and will develop into one again if you leave it. Would suggest you make mod actions public and create a new 'help' section where people can ask about mod policies and query things with staff to get answers/clarity. If mods really are here for the community there needs to be a two way dialogue my guy, else it's just the same bullshit.
Hashmal_Bringer_of_Order
Member
Well, i don't know anything about PR. But i know that if i was falsely accused of something, i like to think i wouldn't just acquiesce whatever the loudest mob wanted from me.
metalslimer
Member
Wait the new OT will allow no political or social discourse? lmao are you going to ban people who talk about things like the anthem protests in the NFL threads? This is a fucking joke. If you don't think you can create a non-toxic political discussion that's because polticialy discussion is toxic in the world right now and it's your own fault if you can't control that.
It's amazing how cowardly this whole thing is.
It's amazing how cowardly this whole thing is.
Tyler brought this on himself with the way the forum has been moderated over the last couple years and easily one of the worst responses to a sexual assault allegation I have read, especially in the last few weeks.
Own the fucking mess. Stop deflecting. This isn't someone just randomly calling you out. She specifically called out Evilore so it clearly happened. Man the fuck up, accept responsibility that you made a bad fucking decision, and lay out how you were going to help make the community around you better. Sure it's been some time since it happened but it doesn't matter. Deflecting to the OT as the stem of this is disgusting and reflects how moderation has been changing for the worse.
There has been a sense that if you disagree, you will be attacked by the majority and there's a good chance you'll get banned for having a differing opinion.
Certain parts of the community have been fantastic and welcome where as places like some of the political threads we're toxic regardless of your views. The views of the forum from the outside paint a picture of an ultra-progressive forum that isn't tolerant to other views.
To go with that, the forum has been eroding to the point where people will attack devs, attack people that something has come up about and it makes it impossible for more people to want to join the conversation. Sure there was a nice little group of devs on the forum but it's nothing like it should have been with the size of the forum because of the vitriol and the shit slinging that would occur. People don't have common courtesy to have a discussion but would rather lob insults at someone trying to do a job. That isn't something I would want to Wade into knowing an overwhelming amount of people in this community would willing take shots because they didn't like something.
There's a huge opportunity for a place that is first and foremost community focused and friendly for all those that visit. I used to think GAF was that place when I first joined but wading through threads of news on the gaming side and OT posts, I quickly discovered that's not the case.
Something GAF did tremendously well was foster great communities in some OTs for games and some great places in Off Topic. Unfortunately it seems most of the people who engaged in building those communities have been driven out.
I still want to stick around GAF for some of the great people I've met here but I can't see it recovering from this.
Own the fucking mess. Stop deflecting. This isn't someone just randomly calling you out. She specifically called out Evilore so it clearly happened. Man the fuck up, accept responsibility that you made a bad fucking decision, and lay out how you were going to help make the community around you better. Sure it's been some time since it happened but it doesn't matter. Deflecting to the OT as the stem of this is disgusting and reflects how moderation has been changing for the worse.
There has been a sense that if you disagree, you will be attacked by the majority and there's a good chance you'll get banned for having a differing opinion.
Certain parts of the community have been fantastic and welcome where as places like some of the political threads we're toxic regardless of your views. The views of the forum from the outside paint a picture of an ultra-progressive forum that isn't tolerant to other views.
To go with that, the forum has been eroding to the point where people will attack devs, attack people that something has come up about and it makes it impossible for more people to want to join the conversation. Sure there was a nice little group of devs on the forum but it's nothing like it should have been with the size of the forum because of the vitriol and the shit slinging that would occur. People don't have common courtesy to have a discussion but would rather lob insults at someone trying to do a job. That isn't something I would want to Wade into knowing an overwhelming amount of people in this community would willing take shots because they didn't like something.
There's a huge opportunity for a place that is first and foremost community focused and friendly for all those that visit. I used to think GAF was that place when I first joined but wading through threads of news on the gaming side and OT posts, I quickly discovered that's not the case.
Something GAF did tremendously well was foster great communities in some OTs for games and some great places in Off Topic. Unfortunately it seems most of the people who engaged in building those communities have been driven out.
I still want to stick around GAF for some of the great people I've met here but I can't see it recovering from this.
It is better not to side with anyone. Period.
Zelmardonpoktendo
Banned
onadesertedisland
Member
So what have women that post here learned about handling a situation when a man has sexually assaulted someone? That the man can deny it, the woman will be called crazy, and that everyone else will assume that she is a liar or that it wasn't that bad for some reason.
Hashmal_Bringer_of_Order
Member
I'm sure all that will be back when people calm down.
Agent_Carnage
Member
Glad the site is back and will just focus on Video Games. My only concern is the anonymous moderation. From past experience it dident end well.
dallasboy678
Neo Member
Evilore, you rapist fuck. I would like to formally challenge you to a halberd duel. Loser gets banned. From life.
Zelmardonpoktendo
Banned
the whole point is, because I wont leave this forum, I consent to sexual harassment behaviour.
that's the issue.
ShironRedshift
Member
Kinda hard to do that when half the OP is about precisely that and blaming half the site and the communities on it (the OT). If Tyler really didn't want this to turn into a blame game, he really started off the thread on a bad foot by throwing the OT under the bus, as if it has any relevance to this situation whatsoever. =/ That much at least could have easily been avoided. But it wasn't.Can we just get back to being Gaf. People are to quick to play the blame game without hearing both sides. I understand you may not like certain people and this and that but let it play out itself. I have no business judging anyone without them having their say and I would hope if I was ever accused of anything that I would get to tell my side as well.
Let it play itself out and then make a decision after. There's no need for threats or putdowns for either party.
I'm just glad Gaf is back. We have a wonderful community of people and I do honestly think there is no community out there like Gaf. Whether you agree or not let's just get back to gaffing
So it's no surprise to see the "blame game" going on, when that's what so much of the OP is about, one way or another.
My hope is that they are going to get those backup in some form, hopefully soon, and even reinstitute the original threads
So this is the level of discourse we can expect from nu GAF, right.
This shit would've been bannable days ago.
Bdeh, just ban me and get over with it. I've always used an ad blocker anyway.
dolabla
Member
And that's been the problem with this site in the past, especially when it came to politics and things like sexual harassment.
Some of these hardcore political motivated posters on here refuse to see there are always two sides of the story. In their minds no woman could ever lie about sexual harassment even though it's happened plenty of times in the past. In their minds, EvilLore is 100% guilty no matter what and he doesn't deserve the time of day to prove his innocence. It's a lynch mob mentality.
Mushroomer25
Member
Because he's lost the trust of the userbase, and losing their business means the end of the website.
If he's actually innocent, he needs to step down and allow a more respected member of the community to take the reigns. Pursue an actual investigation. Talk with the accuser, and find a way to settle all of this privately. Then, when the time is right, issue a new public statement that addresses the concerns of the community.
Instead of this, EvilLore stayed silent until the mods quit and the majority of the userbase decided the site was a lost cause. And because he never gave up an inch of control, there was nobody to release the reigns to. So now he's stuck at the top, using his limited resources to keep what he can. To shift the narrative, and act like OT and political discussions were the real problem all along.
The problem with NeoGAF is the users are extremely self righteous and they think they know what the absolute best moral thing to do is in every situation, black and white, with zero tolerance for a grey area. This leads to dogpiling and automatic bans for anyone who dares wander away from the comfortable little box they make.
The truth is, every single user on this board, including me, are all immoral in some way and are very far from perfect, and have done at least one terrible thing in their lives.
The truth is, every single user on this board, including me, are all immoral in some way and are very far from perfect, and have done at least one terrible thing in their lives.
eBay Huckster
Member
it'd be blatantly obvious this isn't the case if you bothered reading literally any other active thread on page 1
GarthVaderUK
Banned
Some clarification please - does this ban on political and social discourse include movies, books, TV shows, games etc tackling these subjects?
vonStirlitz
Unconfirmed Member
[Redacted as the member no longer wishes to be associated with this website, and the reputational damage and distress caused by association with this website. In addition, the user considers that the action of the management, and the nature of the site and members of its community, renders the original terms and conditions of this site void, and it unconscionable for either side to be bound to them. The user reasserts their IP rights in all content and does not give any authority for its continued usage on this website. Despite requesting that the user's account be deleted, in accordance with data protection rules which apply to this website over multiple jurisdictions, the admin team have failed to delete this account, requiring the user to take its own steps to ensure the valid deletion of data.]
I was all for believing the allegations, until finding out they had a physical relationship AFTER this event.
1) EL's past comments about asserting dominance in bars are suspect.
2) The OP reads like a diversionary tactic.
3) Why would she get into a relationship with him if she thought that was such a creepy thing to do, though? Stockholm syndrome?
4) Being an ex, tarnishing his reputation could just be a matter of revenge. There CAN be a motive. Even if the initial FB post was private, nothing ever stays private in the internet and most internet-savvy people would know that.
I don't feel like I can definitely lean my opinion one side or the other. It's just suspicious all-around.
DaytimeWhiskey
Banned
It's a 'how much more evidence do we need that this guy is a piece of shit' mentality
How are people caping for this motherfucker
if he is innocent he needs to step down...
WHAT THE FUCK?
so in other words, evilore get fucked both ways?
Nekketsu Kõha
Banned
.
Should have a public viewable mod log so one can see whenever someone gets banned and for why and by who. Also people banned should be allowed to reply to the ban like on steam forums or something.
Basically how I felt this morning...
Zelmardonpoktendo
Banned
becase having thousands of threads opening calling someone a rapist without actual fact, is ok. Bye Felicia!
Hey, that's the community EviLore fostered.
Vicetrailia
Banned
It is sexual assault but we are not talking about a Hollywood exec situation. This is your everyday thing of a guy being aggressive and missing after having some lesser success before. The context is so ripe for it. Sexual assault is so normalized, like racism, etc, and to tip the scales people will react harshly, especially to a second sexual assault situation. But I feel like the right moves weren't made to combat the outrage.
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