Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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Gediminas said:
i am not even bother to read it. i just posted it. i see every week pieces like that. a lot of usa press is in m$ pocket.
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Tech Radar is a UK publication owned by Future Tech. I don't think Microsoft is a shareholder. Tech Radar also marks their sponsored posts. The article is an opinion piece. I can disagree with it without concocting a conspiracy theory.
 
X-Fighter said:
I didn't hear that he went into management straight away. Also which intern do you know went from programmer to management? Can't imagine that you can skip all those steps in between at a company like Microsoft.
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Feirr is expecting the guy to list his resume. We should be careful not to make him think too hard.
 
X-Fighter said:
You said he wasn't an engineer and went from intern to management. Which isn't true... First of all he's a software engineer, and went from that to a management function, but that takes years.
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I know this is difficult for you that someone doesn't respect your childhood hero but you don't have to resort to lies. I didn't say that. I know the difference between a software and hardware engineer and I can smell a salesman trying to sell me a thing I don't need. Those people don't necessarily come to your door these days because of Internet. I wouldn't trust Spencer to hold my beer and if you have a problem with that, go cry in a corner.
 
FeiRR said:
Probably because they promised many quality games during this ending generation and never delivered. I don't see a reason to be optimistic again but it's always nice to be surprised.
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Agreed, apart from playground games it's been a mixed first party this gen, on paper they have put together some talented studios for next gen, I hope they deliver
 
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JonTheGod said:
What??
PS2 plays PS1 games.
PS3 (launch model) plays PS2 and PS1.
PS Vita plays PSP.
3DS plays DS.
Wii plays GameCube.
Xbox One kinda plays *selected* 360 and OG Xbox.

So........ yeah next gen nevvvverrrrr plays last gen games. Totally. /s
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PS4 doesn't play PS3 games
some of the PS3 models don't have backwards compat (which is the closest to an apples to apples comparison here)
x360 didn't play original xbox games
switch doesn't play wii u games
dreamcast didn't play saturn games
saturn didn't play mega drive/genesis games
gamecuge didn't play n64 games
etc.

Most importantly of all, a digital only console can't play any optical disks, which is the crux of the argument, and that should be obvious to even the most casual of players when he/she picks the "cheaper" version. Figuring out why it's cheaper comes before assumptions of playing old games in optical drives. This was never an issue in the past, why would it be now?
 
Setsuna Mudou said:
PS4 doesn't play PS3 games
some of the PS3 models don't have backwards compat (which is the closest to an apples to apples comparison here)
x360 didn't play original xbox games
switch doesn't play wii u games
dreamcast didn't play saturn games
saturn didn't play mega drive/genesis games
gamecuge didn't play n64 games
etc.

Most importantly of all, a digital only console can't play any optical disks, which is the crux of the argument, and that should be obvious to even the most casual of players when he/she picks the "cheaper" version. Figuring out why it's cheaper comes before assumptions of playing old games in optical drives. This was never an issue in the past, why would it be now?
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Incorrect.
ALL PS3's played PSOne games.
 
Mr Moose said:
Why would the gen matter? BC is BC. Series X will have it with multiple gens, only BC with Xbox One will count? Seems odd.
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It makes sense if you follow the back and forth exchange, otherwise the point will be lost. This all came out of the concern trolling article by gamespot, saying people would buy the ps5 digital edition and be disappointed their old ps4 blu rays can't be played. To which I argued games from a previous generation being playable on a new one was never the rule, so I listed a few examples of that situation.
 
FeiRR said:
I know this is difficult for you that someone doesn't respect your childhood hero but you don't have to resort to lies. I didn't say that. I know the difference between a software and hardware engineer and I can smell a salesman trying to sell me a thing I don't need. Those people don't necessarily come to your door these days because of Internet. I wouldn't trust Spencer to hold my beer and if you have a problem with that, go cry in a corner.
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Don't be a child because you get proven wrong. You thought he was only a software engineer intern and then rolled into management, which isn't the case and simply laughable. I'm wondering if you even know how these type of companies work.
 
Setsuna Mudou said:
It makes sense if you follow the back and forth exchange, otherwise the point will be lost. This all came out of the concern trolling article by gamespot, saying people would buy the ps5 digital edition and be disappointed their old ps4 blu rays can't be played. To which I argued games from a previous generation being playable on a new one was never the rule, so I listed a few examples of that situation.
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I think Nintendo is a good example here. They always cared about BC even to the point of supporting memory cards and other peripherals. With Switch, they had to break that chain because of what Switch is. Now look at sales of Switch and think if people care.
 
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Damn i thought Phil was just a suit but he's OG.

Come to think of it, other than shu, he's probably more og than any of the first gen Sony execs. Shawn, Andrew and kaz are all gone.
 
pasterpl said:
this is extremely subjective, for example I own PS4 pro, and most of Sony exclusives but the whole collection is collecting dust, I found most of Sony exclusives boring myself, I am still sucker for buying these games based on reviews and trailers.
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Inl7grg.png
 
What excites me about this gen is that Sony and Microsoft are diverging in terms of how they see gaming. And that is perfectly fine. I would argue that so far, the different consoles were differentiated by exclusive games they had. Now it's not only games, but strategy/ services. I feel very comfortable investing in a digital library on Microsofts ecosystem for example. On the other side, I can expect Sony to give me feel like a premium customer on a PS5. Exciting times are ahead.
 
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gullideckel said:
Inl7grg.png
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you forgot about forza, forza horizon, halo, gears, halo wars, ori etc and left out some of the PS4 exclusives that Sony published that are not that impressive.

oh, and all of sony exclusives that you listed are very similar 3rd person games, can they release any other type of game that will be of any of interest to people that don't like 3rd person adventures?
 
FeiRR said:
I think Nintendo is a good example here. They always cared about BC even to the point of supporting memory cards and other peripherals. With Switch, they had to break that chain because of what Switch is. Now look at sales of Switch and think if people care.
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I would add that true backwards compatibility can only be achieved if embracing digital. There's no way we can expect physical media to be read by every future console. I do think that the switch is more of a success since they managed to monopolize the handheld market nowadays. But yeah, clean break from previous gens and not only people didn't care, they thanked them for it :D
 
Bo_Hazem said:
Well, just beaten the game an hour ago. A really heavy game, story, gameplay with lots of gore. The story has been masterfully tailored, impressive work. Not sure what the spoilers said, but to me the whole story makes 100% sense and gives amazing/different perspectives to give a bigger idea.

Only had minor issues that the game doesn't support Astro A40 optical audio and only gives 2.0, used the TV 3.5 aux and works perfectly. It breaks the norm, it breaks that layer of predictability in Hollywood movies.

I don't wanna talk a lot about the story, but I advice people to try it and never listen to the noise. You won't regret it. To me it's extremely hard to see Cyberpunk 2077, GoT beating it for 2020 GOTY. My only problem is that at survivor difficulty it's using a cheap method of barely giving you any bullets. Even if you kill 5-6 armed enemies silently and they didn't fire any bullet you might not get a single bullet! Tweaked down resources difficulty to moderate and still feels unrealistic in that regard, it can kill your scavenging joy. I beaten the game and didn't upgrade more than 60-70% overall, it's that hard. Seems like pushing you for new game+.

Anyway, it's a 10/10.
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I'm progressing pretty slow, I'm 17 hours into the game, just starting the aquarium part. But HOLY SHIT everything from world design, animations, gameplay and STORY, it's fucking amazing so far. The leaks are barely telling the full story, you HAVE TO experience the full game before judging it. There's a few scenes that completely took me by surprise, I'll PM you about it.
 
dan_of_orion said:
Anyone watching Coreteks latest video? He's speculating that the upcoming Big Navi GPU will have a "stacked 3D" design to accommodate the NAND and that this will be one of the biggest features on their upcoming flagship GPU. He also speculated that this is why we have not seen the PS5's APU because AMD does not want this feature revealed yet. This is all just speculation from Coreteks but it's based on a few good guesses and if I remember correctly wasn't there a comment from Tim Sweeney that "PS5 brings data closer to where it's needed", here is the time-stamped link although I do recommend watching the whole video.

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I would say the evidence for the PS5's APU using chiplets is pretty good at this point. In the Road to PS5, Cerny mentions cache coherency ('cache scrubbers') which might imply AMD's Infinity Fabric is being used, a key feature for connecting chiplets together while improving performance-per-watt. There is also this Reddit rumor which mentions '4 chiplets':

Sony's Next Generation PS5 contains world's first "chip-let" based APU. This process splits the traditional "monolithic" APU into four (4) tightly components. Resulting in more performance: reticle limit on the silicon package, inverse-exponential reduction in yield with die size, and more flexibility due to silicone configuration.

Proposed specification on the chip-let design:

-10.3 Teraflops (Navi) -40 Compute Units (8 Disabled/ 48 Total) -Clocked at 2Ghz (2010Mhz) due to reduction in yield with die size -16GB GDDR6 + 4GB DDR4 (Background Task) -512GB/s Memory Bandwidth -Hardware based Ray-Tracing & VRS -Hybrid SSD at 5-7GB/s -Price & Launch Date: Unknown
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Clearly, some of that rumor, like the memory configuration, does not square with what has been already revealed, but it is not too far off.

The four components mentioned?

1) CPU
2) GPU
3) I/O
4) L4 cache? NAND? Something else?

Of course, the cooling patent mentions 'stacked memory', but this is not particularly specific. Coreteks speculates that a memory chiplet (aka stacked memory) could be used to accelerate ray tracing performance while saving memory bandwidth, and this seems at least plausible. This memory chiplet could be connected directly to the GPU with vias, or it may connect to Infinity Fabric for more general access. Perhaps someone else more familiar with the relevant patents can carry this speculation further? So far it is hard to say, but I do not think we have seen anything that definitively indicates that the PS5's raytracing performance is exceptional. That could mean that the SDK is not ready, or that this is just wrong.


More on AMD's Infinity Fabric technology (from 2017):

www.nextplatform.com

The Heart Of AMD’s Epyc Comeback Is Infinity Fabric

At AMD’s Epyc launch few weeks ago, Lisa Su, Mark Papermaster, and the rest of the AMD Epyc team hammered home that AMD designed its new Zen processor
www.nextplatform.com www.nextplatform.com

en.wikichip.org

Infinity Fabric (IF) - AMD - WikiChip

Infinity Fabric (IF) is a proprietary system interconnect architecture that facilitates data and control transmission across all linked components. This architecture is utilized by AMD's recent microarchitectures for both CPU (i.e., Zen) and graphics (e.g., Vega), and any other additional...
en.wikichip.org en.wikichip.org
 
pasterpl said:
you forgot about forza, forza horizon, halo, gears, halo wars, ori etc and left out some of the PS4 exclusives that Sony published that are not that impressive.

oh, and all of sony exclusives that you listed are very similar 3rd person games, can they release any other type of game that will be of any of interest to people that don't like 3rd person adventures?
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Persona 5, Final fantasy VII ( for the being time), Dreams, Spiderman, all PSVR games exclusive like Farpoing or Wipeout (this games are one of the best on VR you can play by far), or all Quantic Dream titles, Death Stranding.

I don't think anyone can say that PS4 has not had a variety precisely. I think you better not go down this path, there are great forgotten games on both sides.
 
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pasterpl said:
you forgot about forza, forza horizon, halo, gears, halo wars, ori etc and left out some of the PS4 exclusives that Sony published that are not that impressive.

oh, and all of sony exclusives that you listed are very similar 3rd person games, can they release any other type of game that will be of any of interest to people that don't like 3rd person adventures?
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And Spider Man, Nioh, GT Sport, all the VR games, most japanese games (like persona, yakuza, etc), the last guardian, until dawn (plus rush of blood), etc etc etc
 
pasterpl said:
you forgot about forza, forza horizon, halo, gears, halo wars, ori etc and left out some of the PS4 exclusives that Sony published that are not that impressive.

oh, and all of sony exclusives that you listed are very similar 3rd person games, can they release any other type of game that will be of any of interest to people that don't like 3rd person adventures?
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Dreams.
 
Mr. Infinity

This is where a talented engineer named Jim Keller comes in. He's a mythical sort of figure within AMD. Nearly every person I spoke to cited Keller as one of the primary people behind the success of Zen's design, and importantly behind the design of Infinity Fabric.
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....he mentions a next generation "fabric" that would be found in every CPU from mobile devices up to servers and that would allow AMD to scale performance at an enviable rate. That fabric would be known, by 2017, as Infinity Fabric.

He explains that the fabric would allow AMD to employ a "chiplet" approach to design. Instead of building one processor on a single die AMD could package a series of processors together—connecting them via the Infinity Fabric system bus. This would make the CPUs way cheaper to produce and ideally as fast as a CPU, like AMD's previous CPUs and most of the ones from Intel, that included all the cores on a one die.
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Macri claims Infinity Fabric actually sped up design of the processors across the board. The modular design it gave the Zen architecture meant AMD didn't need to reinvent the wheel for every kind of CPU. "One of the biggest challenges in designing a core is actually validating it," Macri said. And thanks to Infinity Fabric AMD could quickly validate, or confirm the operation of, a whole slew of slightly varied designs ranging across their entire offering of Zen processors.

Think of Infinity Fabric as the little snaps in Lego blocks and all the components of a CPU as the blocks themselves. AMD could take a few blocks to build a desktop CPU, or tack on more to create a big multi-core server processor, or snap on a GPU to make a wicked fast chip intended for laptops.
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https://gizmodo.com/inside-amds-quest-to-build-chips-that-can-beat-intel-1824064984 (from 2018)


Mr. Infinity (aka Jim Keller) talks about the future of computing at UC Berkeley:

 
sircaw said:
I am old and have the reactions of a dead sloth, will end up playing in on normal i imagine.
But its great to have options.
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You can tweak down/up the difficulty as a whole or specifically some parts at anytime during the game, so no worries there. If you panic and lose your shit then you better always scavenge well and use your bullets when necessary. You can miss major upgrades that could make your life easier in action like extra weapon holsters. 💀
 
RicochetBullet said:
Sorry if this was posted already.

These measurements seem plausible to me.
PS5 might be a big boi but if it comes down to small margins it will be easier to place next to the TV.


fU0ATiM.jpg
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Wonderful! This looks good and sensible. I can put my custom, big PC inside my TV bench horizontally or vertically, so a PS5 won't be a problem, all are kinda tiny toys in comparison.
 
pasterpl said:
you forgot about forza, forza horizon, halo, gears, halo wars, ori etc and left out some of the PS4 exclusives that Sony published that are not that impressive.

oh, and all of sony exclusives that you listed are very similar 3rd person games, can they release any other type of game that will be of any of interest to people that don't like 3rd person adventures?
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Astrobots, StreetFighterV, InfamousSecondSon, Tearaway Unfolded, Concrete Genie, UnchartedLostLegacy, gRAVITY RUSH 2, Resogun, NexMachina, DriveClub after Rainpatch, Ninokuni II...
 
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RicochetBullet said:
It's absolutely insane when compared to the official Series X reveal at 13 million views, HALF A YEAR AGO :messenger_tears_of_joy:
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This shouldn't be a surprise. Playstation is a far, far bigger brand world wide than - in my opinion - Xbox ever will be. To "Playstation" is a verb in many country that describes playing games, regardless of what console is being played. That's why I have the conviction that an Xbox console will never outsell its Playstation counterpart, regardless of teraflops or SSD speeds or even price. That's why I think MS have chosen a software service business model.

Additionally, I think it's absolutely fine for Xbox to consolidate around 30% of the market while Playstation has 70%. They both can do well within these metrics and drive the industry forward.
 
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jimbojim said:
Well, you should add another 500k views for RE-uploaded XSX reveal just a day before PS5 reveal. Why MS re-uploaded same video, only boogeyman knows.
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This just confirms that Phil Spencer blatantly lied about them not considering PlayStation their main competitor and it being google and amazon instead. Not that it wasn't obvious before.
 
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Bo_Hazem said:
I regret finishing TLOU2, man what a piece of art! Now I should wait for July.

I hope you don't think I mean xbox event, I'm talking about Ghost of Tsushima.
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I felt that way after GoW. Couldnt touch anything for a while after.

Ive also been following Ghosts since I saw the trailer, and SP knows how to make the gameplay fun. Im sure a lot have already heard this but its based on the mongol invasion of Japan in 1274.
 
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