Microsoft / Activision Deal Approval Watch |OT| (MS/ABK close)

Do you believe the deal will be approved?

  • Yes, will be approved without changes.

    Votes: 221 24.9%

  • Yes, will be approved but with structural changes to ABK.

    Votes: 102 11.5%

  • Yes, will be approved but only with behavioral concessions.

    Votes: 262 29.6%

  • No, will not be approved.

    Votes: 301 34.0%
  • Total voters
    886
  • Poll closed .
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Satansblade said:
You'd rather him be Ryan, and not care about gaming at all?
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If it meant we get better products and games then yes.

How is this even a question? The man's job is to make sure the company he oversees is successful and able to make products that the market sees as desirable on a consistent basis, not pretend to be your friend.
 
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DeepEnigma said:
Shows that marketing a persona works above delivering results to some.
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Honestly it boggles my mind. Fatherless behaviour.

I've said this for a while but hero-worshipping to this degree points towards bigger societal issues. It's not isolated to gaming either unfortunately which is why "personalities" are so prevalent.
 
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GHG said:
Honestly it boggles my mind. Fatherless behaviour.

I've said this for a while but hero-worshipping to this degree points towards bigger societal issues. It's not isolated to gaming either unfortunately which is why "personalities" are so prevalent.
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I'm kinda reminded of the great observation from Alexander Fraser Tytler which is about democracy but I think we might be witnessing the tail end of said cycle with western civilization as we know it as well

Alexander Fraser Tytler said:
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years. These nations have progressed through this sequence: From bondage to spiritual faith; From spiritual faith to great courage; From courage to liberty; From liberty to abundance; From abundance to selfishness; From selfishness to apathy; From apathy to dependence; From dependence back into bondage.
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GHG said:
If it meant we get better products and games then yes.

How is this even a question? The man's job is to make sure the company he oversees is successful and able to make products that the market sees as desirable on a consistent basis, not pretend to be your friend.
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except that they have delivered incredible products, this board just ignores them.

MS Flight Sim, Psychonauts 2, Halo 6, Forza Horizon 5, Deathloop (still an xbox studios game, and winner of multiple GotY's) and Hi-Fi Rush have all released in the current gen. This year we're getting Redfall, Starfield, and Motorsport 8. Pretending xbox doesn't release games is getting a bit old. 2022 was bad, we all know it, but overall, the last few years, xbox has released awesome games.
 
Satansblade said:
except that they have delivered incredible products, this board just ignores them.

MS Flight Sim, Psychonauts 2, Halo 6, Forza Horizon 5, Deathloop (still an xbox studios game, and winner of multiple GotY's) and Hi-Fi Rush have all released in the current gen. This year we're getting Redfall, Starfield, and Motorsport 8. Pretending xbox doesn't release games is getting a bit old. 2022 was bad, we all know it, but overall, the last few years, xbox has released awesome games.
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Good games sure and yet those games aren't good enough to push their console.
 
ulantan said:
Good games sure and yet those games aren't good enough to push their console.
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They want to push game pass. MS as a company doesn't care about hardware at all, MS is a software company, and has been since the day it launched. They want game pass everywhere, they don't care if you own an Xbox.

Of course right now, in 2023, most of that comes from Console and PC, but as cloud gaming improves, they will become less and less important. MS is working towards being a platform, not a console. Sony is completely betting on hardware, and that will only work for so long. They don't have the infrastructure to compete elsewhere and they know it, especially since they get their cloud services straight from MS.
 
graywolf323 said:
I'm kinda reminded of the great observation from Alexander Fraser Tytler which is about democracy but I think we might be witnessing the tail end of said cycle with western civilization as we know it as well
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We are at the tail end of abundance to selfishness and into the apathy to dependence stage as a western society it seems.
From abundance to selfishness; From selfishness to apathy; From apathy to dependence;
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But that is a different discussion for a different thread.
 
Satansblade said:
except that they have delivered incredible products, this board just ignores them.

MS Flight Sim, Psychonauts 2, Halo 6, Forza Horizon 5, Deathloop (still an xbox studios game, and winner of multiple GotY's) and Hi-Fi Rush have all released in the current gen. This year we're getting Redfall, Starfield, and Motorsport 8. Pretending xbox doesn't release games is getting a bit old. 2022 was bad, we all know it, but overall, the last few years, xbox has released awesome games.
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Halo Infinite won GOTY on this very board… c'mon dude
 
feynoob said:
Does this have any impact on the deal?
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Interesting but two different sets of people are saying the opposite happened. One group says it was a threat, the other says it was not. Probably something taken out of context. Or not. Who knows?

Also, this little tidbit at the end "Activision was continuing to harass and taunt companies and regulators worldwide." If that part was true, and companies come forward, I think that could have an impact on things. Is it really harassment? Or things being taken out of context? Or a lie? Again, who knows.
 
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Lasha said:
The subsidiaries themselves from a management accounting perspective. Microsoft pays everything from a financial accounting perspective. The question is unclear.
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I don't think is unclear. I jusy ask my waifu Chat-GPT. is this right?

In a subsidiary company, the bills are usually paid by the subsidiary company itself. A subsidiary company is a separate legal entity from its parent company, which means that it has its own finances and is responsible for its own expenses and debts.

However, the parent company may provide financial support to the subsidiary company, such as loans or capital injections, to help it meet its financial obligations. Additionally, the parent company may be responsible for some expenses that are incurred on behalf of the subsidiary company, such as shared services or administrative costs.

Ultimately, the specific arrangements for payment of bills in a subsidiary company will depend on the legal and financial structures of the company, as well as any agreements or contracts between the parent company and the subsidiary
 
ChorizoPicozo said:
I don't think is unclear. I jusy ask my waifu Chat-GPT. is this right?

In a subsidiary company, the bills are usually paid by the subsidiary company itself. A subsidiary company is a separate legal entity from its parent company, which means that it has its own finances and is responsible for its own expenses and debts.

However, the parent company may provide financial support to the subsidiary company, such as loans or capital injections, to help it meet its financial obligations. Additionally, the parent company may be responsible for some expenses that are incurred on behalf of the subsidiary company, such as shared services or administrative costs.

Ultimately, the specific arrangements for payment of bills in a subsidiary company will depend on the legal and financial structures of the company, as well as any agreements or contracts between the parent company and the subsidiary
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The question is unclear because the answer is somewhat meaningless without context. A wholely owned subsidiary paying its own bills is still Microsoft paying its own bills. Divisions like Xbox being profitable on their own operating revenue is still Microsoft paying bills. The only time one would care is for specific financial accounting cases to ensure everything is recorded accurately.
 
Lasha said:
The question is unclear because the answer is somewhat meaningless without context. A wholely owned subsidiary paying its own bills is still Microsoft paying its own bills. Divisions like Xbox being profitable on their own operating revenue is still Microsoft paying bills. The only time one would care is for specific financial accounting cases to ensure everything is recorded accurately.
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it wasn't unclear for the A.I.
 
ChorizoPicozo said:
it wasn't unclear for the A.I.
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If the AI answered your question then great. AI is helpful to learn the basics about things you don't know about. I distilled it to a sentence because I assumed you had a passing familiarity of the subject which is why you asked the question.
 
Lasha said:
If the AI answered your question then great. AI is helpful to learn the basics about things you don't know about. I distilled it to a sentence because I assumed you had a passing familiarity with the subject which is why you asked the question.
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yep. and usually offers nuanced answers.
 
GHG said:
Honestly it boggles my mind. Fatherless behaviour.

I've said this for a while but hero-worshipping to this degree points towards bigger societal issues. It's not isolated to gaming either unfortunately which is why "personalities" are so prevalent.
Click to expand...

Yeah.. look at Andrew tate. Anyone with a drop of decency can see he's a piece of shit, yet he's being idolised by people. Society is fucked.
 
GHG said:
Honestly it boggles my mind. Fatherless behaviour.

I've said this for a while but hero-worshipping to this degree points towards bigger societal issues. It's not isolated to gaming either unfortunately which is why "personalities" are so prevalent.
Click to expand...

Talking serious for a moment it's indicative of a severe failure of institutions. Tearing down traditional values and replacing them with hipster consumerism is doing a number on people. You can't trust infinite growth private sector with this shit.
 
Satansblade said:
Spencer engages with influencers, and the community. Yes, I would be glad if Sony engaged with it's community as well. Who wouldn't?

You'd rather him be Ryan, and not care about gaming at all?
"I am playing the recently released Horizon forbidden west'
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I'd rather they just focus on delivering quality games. That's how they'll ultimately be judged
 
Heisenberg007 said:
Been busy and haven't been able to pop into this thread as frequently. Hope y'all are doing great.

I'm gonna leave everyone with a question here in the meantime:

Console concerns are out of the window. But Cloud concerns are still there for the CMA, and, interestingly, they haven't updated the remedies yet. Although I still believe that this deal will likely pass now, the CMA identified 4 key Cloud players:
  • Nvidia ✅
  • Amazon Luna ❌
  • Microsft xCloud
  • SIE PlayStation Plus ❌
The second category of companies that "are potential entrants or are already active in cloud gaming to some extent" is:
  • Tencent ❌
  • Shadow ❌
  • Meta ❌
  • Nintendo ✅
  • Antstream Arcade ✅
  • Others (5 companies ❌, including Boosteroid ✅)
The green ticks and red crosses indicate the companies that Microsoft has signed deals with. I think if Nvidia hadn't signed, it'd be really tough for Microsoft. But they still haven't signed with 2/3 of the main competitors.

In the secondary category, they have not signed deals with 8 out of 11 companies.

I think this is the reason why the CMA has not updated its suggested remedies because they specifically mentioned that behavioral remedies would be tough to enforce, primarily because of Cloud gaming.

mJweXwX.jpg


Do you all think that -- surprising everyone once again -- the CMA might still stick with divestment or prohibition because there are still concerns in the cloud gaming market and behavioral remedies will be tough to enforce?

After all, xCloud is the leading cloud gaming provider in the UK with a 70% market share. So the same principles that the Japanese FTC used to approve the deal (Sony's high market share in the country) would apply here for Microsoft's xCloud in the UK.

What chance do you think this scenario has or hasn't in terms of percentage?
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I never changed my view on the outcome even when they changed the maths and provisionally took away the console market SLC.

Microsoft and Sony being quiet about that change of maths certainly makes me think everyone is fighting their corner hard behind the scenes, and with Microsoft being uncharacteristically no bullish about that amendment makes me think the CMA are still pushing for divestment on the Cloud SLC, or that a more detailed console market foreclosure model was already on hand for PlayStation (or a 3rd party) to hand to the CMA immediately, and it is back on the table being furiously argued with such little time left.

Your points about cloud certainly convince me the CMA haven't signed off on that SLC, yet. I mean if the CMA are well versed in the 80's gaming boom and the UK jobs it created, I can't see them turning a blind eye and letting an unstoppable $2T company roll the whole domestic cloud market with a $70b acquisition and chalk it up as no UK start-up having any chance to build a monster UK business from the opportunities that exist in that space today.
 
PaintTinJr said:
I never changed my view on the outcome even when they changed the maths and provisionally took away the console market SLC.

Microsoft and Sony being quiet about that change of maths certainly makes me think everyone is fighting their corner hard behind the scenes, and with Microsoft being uncharacteristically no bullish about that amendment makes me think the CMA are still pushing for divestment on the Cloud SLC, or that a more detailed console market foreclosure model was already on hand for PlayStation (or a 3rd party) to hand to the CMA immediately, and it is back on the table being furiously argued with such little time left.

Your points about cloud certainly convince me the CMA haven't signed off on that SLC, yet. I mean if the CMA are well versed in the 80's gaming boom and the UK jobs it created, I can't see them turning a blind eye and letting an unstoppable $2T company roll the whole domestic cloud market with a $70b acquisition and chalk it up as no UK start-up having any chance to build a monster UK business from the opportunities that exist in that space today.
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That is true. You haven't changed your stance.

Before the console stance change, I was at 80% block, 20% passing. Now I think there's an 80% chance the deal will go through, 20% it 'll be blocked.

But it's interesting that the CMA hasn't updated its remedies yet. It'd be good if they still block it because of cloud gaming. But the awful u-turn was surprising.
 
Heisenberg007 said:
That is true. You haven't changed your stance.

Before the console stance change, I was at 80% block, 20% passing. Now I think there's an 80% chance the deal will go through, 20% it 'll be blocked.

But it's interesting that the CMA hasn't updated its remedies yet. It'd be good if they still block it because of cloud gaming. But the awful u-turn was surprising.
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I think in most countries the decision gets made, years pass - when things turn out to be a bad decisions - and people have moved on.

In the UK - particularly post-brexit - it feels like any wrong decisions are just one slow news week away from getting dredged up and publicly attributed to those that made the decisions with reputational damage for those involved - because the blame it on Brussels mantra is gone.

IMHO If you were a regulator looking specifically at the Cloud SLC in the current UK, you might air on the side of caution blocking the deal(insisting on divestment that won't be coming) because once the decision is done, you'd personally be off the hook, less so if you messed up and had a $2T company the public - that care - would have told you not to trust make you look like an idiot.

In a small country like the UK where the long term plan for nuclear power/renewables with electric cars to decouple from oil was the 60's idea of the guy that got a knighthood in the 80's gaming/computing boom and that future is still only just taking shape 50years later, the idea of looking at a market like Cloud and protecting the competition in it for decades ahead, seems more probably than not IMO.
 
Satansblade said:
They want to push game pass. MS as a company doesn't care about hardware at all, MS is a software company, and has been since the day it launched. They want game pass everywhere, they don't care if you own an Xbox.

Of course right now, in 2023, most of that comes from Console and PC, but as cloud gaming improves, they will become less and less important. MS is working towards being a platform, not a console. Sony is completely betting on hardware, and that will only work for so long. They don't have the infrastructure to compete elsewhere and they know it, especially since they get their cloud services straight from MS.
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Half of that list would be xbox games without MS buying bethesda anyway ... so ... you should think about that ... counting bethesda games that would always launch on your system as a victory for phil and co. is ridiculous... might as well throw COD in there already

Xbox division management of their studios is so fucked up that they had to buy bethesda just so they can have what to show as "exclusives" for this and next year... .. is really pathetic coming from a company 20 years in this business ... and now they have the green card to buy hole publishers .... welp... that can only end well im sure
 
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Bernardougf said:
Half of that list would be xbox games without MS buying bethesda anyway ... so ... you should think about that ... counting bethesda games that would always launch on your system as a victory for phil and co. is ridiculous... might as well throw COD in there already
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It is a victory for Phil and his company, just not the millions of gamers that they stripped them from.
 
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Bojanglez said:
I'd rather they just focus on delivering quality games. That's how they'll ultimately be judged
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It is possible to interact with fans AND make games. It's not like Phil Spencer taking time to do an interview or talk to fans means a programmer somewhere stops working. It's not a binary choice. Besides most of the games MS releases rate well. It's largely non-customers complaining about 'no games'.
 
GHG said:
Loop Trump GIF


ArmofjO.jpg


It's so easy to tell when you encounter somebody who is entrenched on twitter. Either that or you're some pathetic alt.

Literally everything you're saying is incorrect.
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I am sorry, but Sony are the ones who brought up Nintendo not being in the market. Just because Xbox tracks Sony more closely in internal documents doesn't mean they are the ones who brought it up to the FTC/CMA.

They only started to roll with it once FTC/CMA agreed with Sony.
 
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