GHG
Member
Excuse me?
So they might force people to pay them a monthly fee to be able to access an external store?
That's insanity. Why would anyone pay for that?
Xbox has announced a multi-year agreement with AMD to co-engineer new silicon chips for the next-generation of Xbox consoles
- Thread starter HeisenbergFX4
- Start date
Excuse me?
So they might force people to pay them a monthly fee to be able to access an external store?
That's insanity. Why would anyone pay for that?
SomeNorseGuy
Gold Member
Good question, and there are many of them (questions that is). Sadly the only ones sitting in the answers are the industry's leaders in obfuscated messaging.
vaibhavpisal
Member
ZehDon
Member
Not really, you're just hand waving here. Binaries are compiled for specific systems and hardware. MacOS, Linux, Windows; in most cases, "PC Games" are compiled with Windows dependencies baked in, requiring specific versions for Linux and MacOS for identical reasons. Take for example XCOM: Enemy Unknown - it has a native Linux version, yet, it's PC version is translated from its Windows compile into a Linux version by Proton. No licences are being voided - it's my legal copy of the game. API intercepts don't breach anything at all.
It doesn't run Linux, it runs a stripped back Windows kernel - which Xbox has been doing since literally the prototype of the original Xbox. If the intended software target is Windows, Microsoft's containerisation layer automatically resolves those look ups, otherwise virtual machines wouldn't function. The software literally wouldn't know the difference - which would be the point of the translation layer.
Because they're not selling a Windows PC.
Not really. Compared to the competition, the value prop is immense: Xbox games, Epic store games, Steam games, GoG games. Microsoft pulls it off, and they'll have a solid proposal on their hands for those who can afford it.
wigsplittin4fun
Neo Member
I saw where Microsoft said that the new system will use Ai which is no suprise but when do you guys think games will take advantage of Ai so that basically npc's can have better conversations with you and remember things that you said or did to them. I know some people are already doing this with mods but Do you guys think this will be a popular feature in the next gen consoles?
Physiognomonics
Member
Gamepass console people will buy a new Xbox but the handheld, not so sure. Why would people buy this instead of a Steam Deck 2?
vaibhavpisal
Member
What type of hardware it will pack in for $999?
If its comparable to 9070xt in rasterisation and Ryzen 5 7600 on cpu side with 24 gb ddr7 / 32 gb ddr 6, I think it will well justify its price point.
If its comparable to 9070xt in rasterisation and Ryzen 5 7600 on cpu side with 24 gb ddr7 / 32 gb ddr 6, I think it will well justify its price point.
Imtjnotu
Member
Sony already has to contend with Nintendo and PC. Stop acting like Xbox is contributing anything to the console space anymore
vaibhavpisal
Member
A lot of current industry follows in xbox lead
-backwards compatibility
-Online focus
-focus on engagement
-multiple skus to give player options
-multiplatform focus to again, give player options.
GHG
Member
The difference is that if a publisher does happen to also have native linux/mac versions of a Windows game then you get all 3 versions in a single package for a single price. Outside of play anywhere, the same cannot be said for console versions of games when purchasing a PC copy.
If publishers would rather sell console games to an audience because of more price control (which they do have when it comes to digital games on consoles especially) then they will simply make it so that the "translation layer" no longer works, both functionally and legally.
Let me flip this on it's head then. If it's all so simple then why are Xbox/Microsoft bothering with play anywhere when based on what you're saying they could simply allow all console versions of games to run on windows PC's via a translation layer?
Wouldn't it make more sense to do that for the upcoming Xbox ROG Ally and their new gaming focused OS instead of telling Xbox customers that unless it's play anywhere they can't access games in their digital libraries?
Your "solution" for this is far more complicated than it needs to be when the internal teams at Microsoft and Windows/Xbox will be looking at all of this and saying "just run Windows". Then it's a question of how much of the OS you expose to the end-user, hence my previous comments on whether or not they allow people to access a "desktop mode" in order to apply tweaks/fixes where necessary.
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DavidGzz
Member
Shit can change quickly in this field, you know that. Xbox 360 vs. PS3 happened after PS2 crushed the Xbox original. The future isn't decided. I'm sure many people laughed about Xboxes chances after that gen too.
SoraNoKuni
Member
Z3 Extreme but with different clocks! Something like this is the most possible scenario.
Imtjnotu
Member
2006-07 is almost 20 years ago. Clinging on to that thinking it will happen again is some serious self gaslighting
Heisenberg007
Gold Journalism
The "competition" here is doing more harm to the industry: raised the game price to $80 and the base console price to $600.
Sony still hasn't.
If Sony does now, they'll be following this "competitor" that was apparently so good for all of us.
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DavidGzz
Member
vaibhavpisal
Member
Its a low selling $1000 console. Not going to expand market or sell 50 million.
Will simply give core gamers an option to get a nice system that plays a very large library of games.
I think its going to be a special system, they are not shackled by mass market requirements.
Will simply give core gamers an option to get a nice system that plays a very large library of games.
I think its going to be a special system, they are not shackled by mass market requirements.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Seems to be quite a bit of concern around this announcement.
djjinx2
Member
I used to think System Wars had the craziest fanboys... I've never seen a place so relentless in going after people that like different things. I guess a dedicated game fan can't just like Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo here, they have to pick sides and synchronize or else.
It's become a huge circle jerk. Like a hive mind where people pile in.
What happened to choices?
Someone asked earlier (not to me)
"Why would you want this and why do you trust MS again" (paraphrasing)
If it's a true next gen console I'm on board price dependent. I like Game pass and the Xbox system.
I don't trust MS they are a huge corporation. I don't trust Sony either but doesn't mean I won't buy PS7.
Stop looking at this the wrong way. PS5 owners have no exclusives of note but doesn't mean they can't enjoy their console
PlayStaytion
Member
I don't get people perceive current AMD consoles aren't the same as Xbox OG technically and philosophically.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
How many people talked about how important GTA VI is to PS5 pro......
If there was an Xbox that played GTA VI at a higher res and say 60FPS vs the PS5 pro (if its 30FPS). How would these people not want it after all the talk of wanting the best experience for GTA VI?
It makes no sense to me.
Eh I was hoping they would embrace Nvidia or Intel like the original Xbox, but they've been with AMD since the 360. I miss the days when consoles had unique hardware, which was reflected in their games. I have nothing against AMD and have liked the graphics cards in the past, but I'm more interested to see what Intel and Nvidia are offering.
DeltaPolarBear
Member
So, it seems the Xbox optimists are interpreting this as just "the next Xbox is coming and it is going to knock PS6pro out of the water yeah!"
Well, you go you. But I don't see this as next gen at all. I see it as simply a hybrid that Xbox can release to keep the old library going until the interest dies. And the PC half of the hybrid would definitely be more expensive than any console gamer is used to while not being that powerful. And $1000 is the minimum price for this thing. Good luck.
Well, you go you. But I don't see this as next gen at all. I see it as simply a hybrid that Xbox can release to keep the old library going until the interest dies. And the PC half of the hybrid would definitely be more expensive than any console gamer is used to while not being that powerful. And $1000 is the minimum price for this thing. Good luck.
djjinx2
Member
Who has said it will knock PS6 out the water yeaaahhhh???
I swear it's full of nutters here, proper basement dwellers plotting to blow shit up.
Are we not allowed discussion of both sides good and bad?
Ar¢tos
Member
The problems with this is that only a small percent of players will buy a new console to play old games, engagement is a meaningless buzzword and while multiple skus give players options, they make devs lives much harder (ex: Xbox Series S).
Black_Stride
do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
If the machine is still windows and runs .exes I dont see how they could implement that.
If it can use other storefront, those storefront arent gonna make xex versions of every game, so i think its safe to assume the thing runs exes.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
What?
People are discussing new hardware. If its good, its good and thats all that should matter.
vaibhavpisal
Member
They are leading industry in these aspects.
Engagement is not meaningless buzzword. Its how they measure success. Extremely important as far as I am concerned.
I don't want to hoard games into my backlog. Games that I cannot stop playing, I want more of them.
Ar¢tos
Member
There are no industry set quantifiable criteria for engagement.
A company can change their criteria each month to what suits them better to say "engagement this month was better than the previous one".
clappedcheeks
Member
Simply because these people already have a library of PlayStation games and don't want to own multiple systems. They want to take their library to the next system they purchase, just like you want access to your Xbox library on the next gen Xbox. PlayStation owners will still get the benefits of better frame rates and resolutions when they finally upgrade to a PS6.
Fess
Member
We know who're talking about jumping ship. It's not Xbox customers.
You don't leave potentially hundreds of Xbox games behind to play 10 or whatever late ports on PlayStation. It's an absurd thought.
You do that jump if you're more interested in PlayStation games than Xbox games.
I doubt they'll pull in new customers but this device is quite possibly what everyone with a big Xbox library wants. A way to keep playing their existing library and a new exciting generation and still a way to have access to Gamepass.
The open nature with access to more stores, like Steam, could be an appealing thing as well, could solve some scenarios where Xbox versions don't exist. But I don't think it'll be a main selling point.
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DeltaPolarBear
Member
You really don't think the expected price of it would be an issue?
People had been making a fuss about Switch 2 and PS5Pro prices. And here you are saying the price of Xbox hardware wouldn't be a concern?
A PC with custom parts and limited run, and had to be sold at a profit, is not going to be affordable for console gamers.
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crackajack
Member
The only other alternatives would have been Intel and ARM with Nvidia. Intel might improve in the coming years but have not really the performance for the high power draw they have, yet and it would have been a bet. ARM would be harder to port everything and Nvidia was in the past rather expensive, more expensive than AMD at least.
So going with AMD like Sony does too is just the risk free choice.
Consoles are anyway just modified PC parts these days with OS that are adapted to those "secret sauce" stuff. Their is no truly unique HW anymore.
AMD is sort of just receiving paychecks for work they anyway do in order to compete with Intel and Nvidia.
So going with AMD like Sony does too is just the risk free choice.
Consoles are anyway just modified PC parts these days with OS that are adapted to those "secret sauce" stuff. Their is no truly unique HW anymore.
AMD is sort of just receiving paychecks for work they anyway do in order to compete with Intel and Nvidia.
But it's not Windows.
DavidGzz
Member
If MS is less concerned about sales it's a good thing for me. I'd rather have more power than be concerned with the price getting closer to $1k. Give me an enthusiast machine. Same goes for the PS6 but I doubt they would do that.
vaibhavpisal
Member
Ar¢tos
Member
Which doesn't translate to higher profits.
For example, more people playing a free mmo can mean less GP subscriptions and less game sales.
DeltaPolarBear
Member
It would be $1k but not next gen. You seem to have the impression that I am saying it would be expensive because it is powerful. I am saying it would be expensive because it would be standard hardware with profit on top. it is not some top range dream console. it would price like one, but that's all it would be.
DavidGzz
Member
Ah, well we can speculate back and forth for days until we see official news. You may be right. If MS wants a profit and Sony eats the cost a bit, it may be a huge gulf in price that shows little to no power advantage. We'll see.
vaibhavpisal
Member
Yes, lower profits.
I would love to play a free MMO thats so good I cannot stop playing. Company profits, I don't care about. At max I will buy a cosmetics to show support, thats all where me thinking about their financials end.
Ar¢tos
Member
All shareholders care about is profits. Player satisfaction is indifferent for them.
It's shareholders influence that lead to big decisions.
Why do you think every game Xbox makes is now multiplatform after MS spent billions on Activision?
bitbydeath
Gold Member
The PC version isn't launching for a few more years yet.
ZehDon
Member
Not at all. Selling MacOS copies separate from Windows copies was standard for a long time. Linux is an open platform with sub-percentile adoption. It's only recently gained steam - no pun intended. If publishers didn't complain when Valve did it with their console-like Steam Deck, they won't complain when Microsoft does it with their console-like Xbox. You're inventing a problem that literally no one thinks exists.
What?
I never said it was simple. I said Microsoft - the creator of the Windows and Xbox APIs - would create a translation layer to enable Windows API games to work on the Xbox APIs. In terms of complexity, I'd imagine it's extremely complex, given how low-level some developers - such as Rockstar - go.
Not really. They'll be looking at it like a normal person would be looking at it: what gets the best gaming devices for the budget on to the market? Trying to ship pre-built Windows PCs for under USD$1000.00 than can compete performance wise with the latest next-gen technology is a laughable proposition. Literally laughable. There's a lot more to a console than just the OS. So, making a bespoke piece of kit is the way to go - and that demands bespoke software. Running a stripped down Windows kernel - which Xbox already does - and running a translation between Windows PC games and the bespoke hardware keeps everything running nice and fast and keeps the cost down. Unless you think Nintendo and Sony should also just ship Windows PCs instead of creating gaming hardware for running games?
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
So, basically they are not interested in the best place to play the game. Which is fine. If they want to wait for the PS6 version....Its just like waiting for the PC version.
If you want the best place to play the game, and are genuine about saying that then you will pay the money to play it that way. Nothing wrong with settling for second best if you dont see the value.
Also, what is the price of this XBox. Can you let me know please?
We don't know when its launching, or the Xbox is launching.
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JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I have no clue what Xbox has planned at this point. It's completely dead to me as a brand and as a console.
The only move they could make that would have me legit excited would be a legit debloated and gaming centric OS being made publicly available.
I'd even consider paying a subscription for it, IF it were ad and telemetry free.
The only move they could make that would have me legit excited would be a legit debloated and gaming centric OS being made publicly available.
I'd even consider paying a subscription for it, IF it were ad and telemetry free.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
Some arent listening
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
What are you actually saying here. How do you know its not next gen? of course it is next gen. If its the next Xbox its next Gen. Standard Hardware? what are you actually talking about?