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[Kacho]

No idea what Nvidia would try.

I doubt they care with their GPUs dominating PC gaming, having the superior cloud streaming service and working with Nintendo. Their investors are way more interested in AI.

 

[viveks86]

I doubt they care with their GPUs dominating PC gaming, having the superior cloud streaming service and working with Nintendo. Their investors are way more interested in AI.

True, but staying dominant requires constant vigilance and counter measures to keep the competition from growing. They will think of something to keep AMD at bay outside of just being more performant and popular. Just don't know how. Lol.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

If Playstation still sees Xbox as competition, they will pull out of the PC space altogether. Xbox consoles that can play PC, console and playstation games dramatically undervalues the needs for a Playstation at all. Is anyone even thinking about how others would react? Sure, all this is consumer friendly and it's awesome to be able to play everything on any device. But there are opposing forces that this will exclude, and consequently piss off. Nvidia and Sony, the leaders in their respective fields, aren't just going to sit around and let this takeover happen. If this strategy actually takes hold, there will be countermeasures from the competition in both the console and PC space. For Sony, that would be cutting out PC releases entirely. No idea what Nvidia would try.

This AMD + Xbox partnership wouldn't put a dent on PS + Nvidia leadership.

They would be lucky to sell 50 million units of all xboxes combined. There would be no marketing (realistically, there is nothing marketable here), mainstream crowd might get a whiff about it, that would mean 40-50 million max

 

[viveks86]

This AMD + Xbox partnership wouldn't put a dent on PS + Nvidia leadership.

They would be lucky to sell 50 million units of all xboxes combined. There would be no marketing (realistically, there is nothing marketable here), mainstream crowd might get a whiff about it, that would mean 40-50 million max

Even if that's the likely scenario, this is a game of chess after all. No leader ever maintains status quo until the opponent's failure is guaranteed. Nothing is guaranteed here. Given the ambitious strategy (which is also consumer friendly on the surface), there is a chance that this could actually take hold in the the market. However slim, it isn't 0%.

It's interesting to watch. That's for sure!

 

[Tobimacoss]

This AMD + Xbox partnership wouldn't put a dent on PS + Nvidia leadership.

They would be lucky to sell 50 million units of all xboxes combined. There would be no marketing (realistically, there is nothing marketable here), mainstream crowd might get a whiff about it, that would mean 40-50 million max

You severely underestimate how many windows devices are sold every year. Go to Google, type in:

IDC Windows devices

The devices are going to sell regardless because laptops and pre built PCs already sell. The AMD versions will simply have added Xbox compatibility.

MS wants every windows device to be gaming capable now, since the tech is finally there. And they want every AMD windows device to be Xbox capable.

 

[Celcius]

Because you may not care about PS exclusives while liking the Xbox controller or any other feature or service better?

Sounds like I could just use my windows PC

 

[jm89]

Yep this is it.

Those who think Xbox will die should buckle up and prepare for minimum one generation of Xbox this and Xbox that literally EVERYWHERE.

Happy to laugh at Xbox for another gen.

Nice.

 

[kapshin]

Direct Xactly

 

[viveks86]

If they don't like how MS made GTA available on a handheld because it runs Xbox games, then they will have to be more stringent about the contract for the next game.

Just wanted to add a point here. Unless Take Two and MS have already hashed this out in the background, what's currently on contract is a release for series X and S. Is the handheld a series X or S? May be some PCs (not all) can natively pull off X or S level performance, but I doubt any handheld can for a few years. Even if it magically runs, what version of the game will it try to run as ? X or S? Take Two isn't going to be like "oh well, let just accommodate all this in our next contract because we want to play nice with MS". They will sue for license violation of the current contract first.

I guess MS strategy was clear all along, which is why there are no other games that I'm aware of where the console and PC release strategy is not launch aligned. But publishers would always want to reserve that right until something mutually beneficial is negotiated.

Alternatively, none of what we are speculating is actually happening and we have all fallen prey to PR speak and going in different directions. I just don't know what to believe anymore. Lol.

 

[Det]

Those who think Xbox will die should buckle up and prepare for minimum one generation of Xbox this and Xbox that literally EVERYWHERE.

Now the future is "Xbox everywhere."

You don't have an opinion of your own, just repeat what the Sect Master says is the "glorious future."

 

[Astray]

It might have been Redfall's failure that caused Satya to throw the hammer down, especially because just weeks prior to the release of that game he went and highlighted it as an upcoming catalyst for the division in their earnings call.

Satya Nadella:

"Great content remains the flywheel behind our growth. We have now surpassed 500 million lifetime unique users across our first party titles. And I've never been more excited about our pipeline of games, including the fourth quarter launches of Minecraft Legends and Redfall. In closing, we are focused on continuing to raise the bar on our operational excellence and performance, as we innovate to help our customers maximize the value of their existing technology investments and thrive in the new era of AI."

https://www.stockinsights.ai/us/MSFT/earnings-transcript/fy23-q3-c932
Uncle Phil must have been selling him the dream in order for him to say that. Satya's response:

I remember that (and tried to find it again to no avail lol), They probably sold him on it being a new GAAS hit or something.

Bobby Kotick was right, they really are not a creative company.

 

[Fess]

Now the future is "Xbox everywhere."

You don't have an opinion of your own, just repeat what the Sect Master says is the "glorious future."

If you've seen me talk about it before you know there is nothing glorious about this….
Google what happens if you cut down an aspen tree…
They're about to flood the market. More so than I initially thought, I thought they would just merge it all to PC. Guess HeisenbergFX4 knew what he was talking about

 

[cireza]

Or was that not just for the console?

I would have naturally thought that it was for the console to ensure backward compatibility, not for the PC (no "console games" backward compatibility).

 

[Fess]

The chances of them succeeding is slim to none but I look forward to watching it unfold. The novelty of an easy to use Steam + Xbox/GP box might speak to console-only people that don't want to jump into the PC space.

I swear I heard rumors of an Xbox Surface. That would be cool to see, assuming it plays all of our console games — less bulky than a laptop, bigger screen than a handheld.

They'll go with minimum 4 bigger pillars going by AMD, and they'll probably reach out to more partners like ASUS. They're ramping up for possibly the most aggressive push for a brand during my life time. Not sure what I think about it. Let's just hope it leads to better experiences on PC at least through the push to improve Windows for gaming.

 

[Kataploom]

Sounds like I could just use my windows PC

If some gamers say you should get a PC for whatever reason, you'll see a bunch of console players claiming they prefer comfort, plug and play, cheaper prices whatever, so basically that. Not everyone wants a gaming PC, nor have the money nor want to deal with whatever they think they'll deal with, want to make sure everything just works with a controller from the couch, etc.

Yeah, we can make the PC behave as a console in the living room TV (I do) but there are still other reasons why people prefer consoles, including having their years old libraries in those ecosystems, and they might still prefer Xbox to PS for other reasons.

 

[viveks86]

They'll go with minimum 4 bigger pillars going by AMD, and they'll probably reach out to more partners like ASUS. They're ramping up for possibly the most aggressive push for a brand during my life time. Not sure what I think about it. Let's just hope it leads to better experiences on PC at least through the push to improve Windows for gaming.

It seems like a missed opportunity if MS and AMD aren't talking to Samsung and other television makers too. Why even stop at handhelds, PCs and laptops? The TV is the real mass market. For an additional few hundred bucks worth of hardware, you can embed a Series S level Xbox in every mid-high end TV!

 

[Moses85]

Why is everyone talking next gen already? I'm still waiting for my Series S Pro.

 

[Fess]

It seems like a missed opportunity if MS and AMD aren't talking to Samsung and other television makers too. Why even stop at handhelds, PCs and laptops? The TV is the real mass market. For an additional few hundred bucks worth of hardware, you can embed a Series S level Xbox in every mid-high end TV!

I mean I've always thought that their end game plan is a publisher app available everywhere on TVs, phones, computers, Apple TV, etc, like Netflix. With cloud based computing, not local hardware.
But we're not there yet.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

This is when "Just get a PC" makes sense as all Xbox's going forward will essentially just be Windows powered PCs. The handhelds will be more interesting, but not at the current prices. Who the hell is paying $700 for a handheld?

The only way these Xbox prebuilt PCs can be successful is if the specs to price ratio beats out what one can build themselves for the price.

If I can get 5080 level performance at a $500 - $600 price point I'd buy one.

 

[Rob_27]

The Ally doesn't use a custom chip though.

Which makes me question - is there a different Xbox handheld that we don't know about yet?

I thought there was always going to be a different model that was maybe dropped but was to be released in a year or two?

 

[mayham2199]

If I can get 5080 level performance at a $500 - $600 price point I'd buy one.

You can barely get a Series X for that price. No way they release a much more powerful and expensive console at that price. It's crazy how many people still believe MS is invested in hardware. After the Series X price increase I thought everyone would have get the message but I guess not.

I see all this as nothing more then a way to get everyone onto PC gaming which is much more likely to get them more GP users and that's it.

 

[viveks86]

I mean I've always thought that their end game plan is a publisher app available everywhere on TVs, phones, computers, Apple TV, etc, like Netflix. With cloud based computing, not local hardware.
But we're not there yet.

I'm sure everyone would make another attempt at making cloud gaming mainstream 10 years from now. It's like VR. It will keep happening in waves. Intuitively, it is the future. The issue is intuition and reality not being aligned. Meanwhile, the local hardware option for TVs is up for grabs if MS wants it, imo

 

[Astray]

It might have been Redfall's failure that caused Satya to throw the hammer down, especially because just weeks prior to the release of that game he went and highlighted it as an upcoming catalyst for the division in their earnings call.

Satya Nadella:

"Great content remains the flywheel behind our growth. We have now surpassed 500 million lifetime unique users across our first party titles. And I've never been more excited about our pipeline of games, including the fourth quarter launches of Minecraft Legends and Redfall. In closing, we are focused on continuing to raise the bar on our operational excellence and performance, as we innovate to help our customers maximize the value of their existing technology investments and thrive in the new era of AI."

https://www.stockinsights.ai/us/MSFT/earnings-transcript/fy23-q3-c932
Uncle Phil must have been selling him the dream in order for him to say that. Satya's response:

I was trying to find this again so thank you. Google was absolutely no help lol.

The other thing that might have pushed them to go even faster with the ports is how badly Starfield did as a system seller that Holiday season.

The decision to even start the publisher acquisitions stemmed from Sony potentially getting it as an exclusive, and it flopping was what broke the camel's back. A Starfield making-of documentary will basically encapsulate the entire genes story lol.

 

[Fess]

This is when "Just get a PC" makes sense as all Xbox's going forward will essentially just be Windows powered PCs. The handhelds will be more interesting, but not at the current prices. Who the hell is paying $700 for a handheld?

The only way these Xbox prebuilt PCs can be successful is if the specs to price ratio beats out what one can build themselves for the price.

If I can get 5080 level performance at a $500 - $600 price point I'd buy one.

All handheld are expensive on PC. But maybe you're thinking about a future dedicated Xbox handheld? Then yeah, $700 is too much.

Either way, this here is not some "Just get a PC" turning point. You've been able to play all their current gen games this whole generation. Almost all Sony's too. If you want a PC then you should've already bought one.

But this AMD info says that they're still going to do dedicated consoles. So if you want to play on console you can do that for another generation.

Personally I'm out of console so the interesting thing for me is what they'll do on the PC side. There isn't enough info on that. I don't plan to downgrade from the PC I currently use in the living room. So backwards compatibility and 3rd party games not coming to PC is something I'm hoping they have a solution for, through emulation for example. Don't know if AMD can help with that unless they include some Xbox silicone in their standard desktop hardware. If there would be some "Xbox Compatible" logo serie without downgrades I could see myself jumping in.

 

[mayham2199]

All handheld are expensive on PC. But maybe you're thinking about a future dedicated Xbox handheld? Then yeah, $700 is too much.

Either way, this here is not some "Just get a PC" turning point. You've been able to play all their current gen games this whole generation. Almost all Sony's too. If you want a PC then you should've already bought one.

But this AMD info says that they're still going to do dedicated consoles. So if you want to play on console you can do that for another generation.

Personally I'm out of console so the interesting thing for me is what they'll do on the PC side. There isn't enough info on that. I don't plan to downgrade from the PC I currently use in the living room. So backwards compatibility and 3rd party games not coming to PC is something I'm hoping they have a solution for, through emulation for example. Don't know if AMD can help with that unless they include some Xbox silicone in their standard desktop hardware. If there would be some "Xbox Compatible" logo serie without downgrades I could see myself jumping in.

I think your out of luck if you don't want to upgrade your PC as far backwards compatibility. They wont be able to do emulation since it would violate the contracts they have with third party publishers.

 

[bender]

The road to 12 million lifetime unit sales starts now!

 

[Fess]

I'm sure everyone would make another attempt at making cloud gaming mainstream 10 years from now. It's like VR. It will keep happening in waves. Intuitively, it is the future. The issue is intuition and reality not being aligned. Meanwhile, the local hardware option for TVs is up for grabs if MS wants it, imo

I've been quite open for the cloud future, been trying out every service, still have a founders sub on GeForce Now ticking.

But XCloud has never worked well for me. Latency, framerate dips, crap image quality. It's just bad. Might be because I'm in Sweden and who wants to live here etc, but they have to solve that.

Stadia, everybody hated it, right? Well it worked perfectly here, snappy, perfect image quality, no queues, literally light years ahead of what MS are doing.

And GeForce Now has like 15ms ping, about 1 frame, can use RTX hardware, better visuals than on console.
But there is a queue problem, it can't be used around popular releases. So that needs to be solved there.

But in 10 years, yeah I think there will be several options then.

I don't think including a Series S in a TV is realistic. Would end up bulky and my TV is from 2017 so in my case I would have to upgrade the TV more often just to not end up with crappy gaming hardware.

 

[Brigandier]

I'm really surprised at this, I was totally expecting Intel CPU and Nvidia GPU this time around!!!!!!!!!!

 

[viveks86]

I don't think including a Series S in a TV is realistic. Would end up bulky

I mean, we are already talking about handhelds running GTA 6... Not long before a series S can be flattened and placed around the rear of a TV. And the new ones end up with a separate break out box anyway.

and my TV is from 2017 so in my case I would have to upgrade the TV more often just to not end up with crappy gaming hardware.

That's more $$$ for corporations and less $$$ for you and me. Seems like a no-brainer from their standpoint. My TV is 10 years old too and I still have no plans to upgrade till the PS6. If anything would make me upgrade my TVs quicker, it would be a dependency on game performance! I'll be poorer, but happier for it.

 

[Fess]

I think your out of luck if you don't want to upgrade your PC as far backwards compatibility. They wont be able to do emulation since it would violate the contracts they have with third party publishers.

I have no problem upgrading. I just don't want to downgrade.
For an "Xbox compatible" serie of AMD PC hardware to be interesting they would have to have something in line with 7800-9800X3D on the CPU side and 4090 on the GPU side.

 

[viveks86]

I think your out of luck if you don't want to upgrade your PC as far backwards compatibility. They wont be able to do emulation since it would violate the contracts they have with third party publishers.

It may violate contracts anyway. Honestly, emulation or not, I'm super skeptical about BC being allowed until MS gets all active publishers onboard with their play anywhere strategy. It's just a minefield the moment you dilute the meaning of what the target device even is. Calling a laptop an Xbox won't hold water in court if they get sued, just because they threw a proprietary chip in there and a sticker on it.

 

[Fess]

I mean, we are already talking about handhelds running GTA 6...

That's more $$$ for corporations and less $$$ for you and me. Seems like a no-brainer from their standpoint. My TV is 10 years old too and I still have no plans to upgrade till the PS6. If anything would make me upgrade my TVs quicker, it would be a dependency on game performance! I'll be poorer, but happier for it.

A handheld is thicker than a TV, unless you're thinking they'll include something in a boxier stand?

And think about it, you really don't want to upgrade your TV more often…They're expensive!

But sure in their let's be everywhere plan it would make sense.

 

[viveks86]

A handheld is thicker than a TV, unless you're thinking they'll include something in a boxier stand?

Yeah, anywhere there is real estate. The last I checked, all the super thin TVs have a break out box where the actual processing is handled. They can easily afford to bulk that up a bit, if needed. This is just me pipe dreaming a console-less future. So forgive me if all this sounds ridiculous!

 

[Fess]

Yeah, anywhere there is real estate. The last I checked, all the super thin TVs have a berak out box where the actual processing is handled. They can easily afford to bulk that up a bit, if needed. This is just me pipe dreaming a console-less future. So forgive me if all this sounds ridiculous!

Huh I've been sleeping on that break out box thing. Sounds great tbh, especially if it's something you can unplug and potentially swap out/upgrade.
Why isn't Sony including a PS5 with every Sony TV through a breakout box??

 

[viveks86]

Huh I've been sleeping on that break out box thing. Sounds great tbh, especially if it's something you can unplug and potentially swap out/upgrade.
Why isn't Sony including a PS5 with every Sony TV through a breakout box??

Right now? Because the break out box would become the size of a PS5 console

The only way is for all this stuff to hit hand held form factors. Then suddenly dedicated devices under your TV become obsolete for entry level gaming. And Sony is probably incentivized to not go down this path as that means earlier obsolescence of their console division (they will get absorbed into the TV group). MS though? They have nothing to lose.

But I think really long term, everything will either converge to local processing on the display itself (TV, VR etc) or remote processing on the cloud. The middle men are like oil. Not extinct anytime soon, but will eventually become irrelevant. I'll probably have limited motor skills and bad vision by then, but I hope I live to see it.

 

[FireFly]

This is when "Just get a PC" makes sense as all Xbox's going forward will essentially just be Windows powered PCs. The handhelds will be more interesting, but not at the current prices. Who the hell is paying $700 for a handheld?

The only way these Xbox prebuilt PCs can be successful is if the specs to price ratio beats out what one can build themselves for the price.

If I can get 5080 level performance at a $500 - $600 price point I'd buy one.

The 5080 costs $999 on its own. The 6070 will probably launch in late 2026 and deliver comparable performance for $749. The price for that level of performance isn't dropping below $500 until Nvidia can get there on their budget '06 class chips, via clock speed increases. You could be waiting another 4-5 years for that.

 

[Fess]

Right now? Because the break out box would become the size of a PS5 console

The only way is for all this stuff to hit hand held form factors. Then suddenly dedicated devices under your TV become obsolete for entry level gaming. And Sony is probably incentivized to not go down this path as that means earlier obsolescence of their console division (they will get absorbed into the TV group). MS though? They have nothing to lose.

But I think really long term, everything will either converge to local processing on the display itself (TV, VR etc) or remote processing on the cloud. The middle men are like oil. Not extinct anytime soon, but will eventually become irrelevant. I'll probably have limited motor skills and bad vision by then, but I hope I live to see it.

Well now you've convinced me! hah
Sounds like a logical step to get mass market reach. What are they waiting for?