vaibhavpisal
Member
Doesn't make too much sense.
I imagine this soc will go into windows pcs as well. So thats why it is there.
[MLiD] AMD Magnus APU Full Leak: RDNA 5, Zen 6, 110 TOPS NPU = XBOX Next-Gen Console!
- Thread starter Lunatic_Gamer
- Start date
- News Rumor Hardware
I imagine this soc will go into windows pcs as well. So thats why it is there.
HerjansEagleFeeder
Member
PS5 launched with ballpark 3060 performance. In late 2027, 7000 series will be close to launch (?), so a 5080 would be roughly 7060 equivalent, which seems to fall in line with the previous observation. Makes sense to me. It will look impressive on launch until 4-6 months later when Nvidia launches the 7000 series cards.
Apollo Helios
Member
How do you know CPU and GPU frequencies especially when those are definitely not 'finalized', I call bullshit there just like this MLID person. It's also quite curious how you get both sides 'finalized' specs and confidently speak on it like your the authority when in the past leaks were one sided. Is this another GitHub leak and you have access to it or something? The more you talk and speak definitely on these matter the less you are believable and produce yourself someone with an agenda. This smells very fishy and feels more and more similar to last generation's astroturf GitHub FUD campaign!
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Higher CPU clocks can be inferred simply by them using the regular Zen6 rather than Zen6c. There would be no reason to spend the extra die area for Zen6 if there wasn't an expectation that they'd have higher clocks.
winjer
Member
Zen normal cores and ZenC cores have different clock speeds.
The ZenC cores are made to be denser, to save die space, but as a result, they clock lower.
They also use less power because of that. And they also have half the L3 cache, of the full Zen core.
Apollo Helios
Member
That's not how an inferred opinion is presented and I don't believe him.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I still think the 160W and 250W figures are being confused here. If they're anything at all they are referring to the APU TDP alone. Why would AMD care or know the consoles total at wall power consumption?
Going back to PS4 wasn't the APU there around 75W-80W "TDP" with total at wall consumption of ~150W and PS5 APU Around 100W-120W "TDP" with ~200W-230W at wall consumption.
So I'm thinking 160W would translate to ~260W-290W for PS6 and 350W+ for Xbox Magnus.
I also have doubts about the odd size buses and RAM right now too but maybe this time they have no choice to get creative but that often means more expensive too.
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Ronin_7
Member
As they should as Xbox hardware has been rejected by the market.
Radical_3d
Member
How come we even know the number of hairs in the nose of the presenter of the next Xbox reveal two years prior to its release and we don't know Jack shit about the PS6 other than its target watt (that seems very unrealistic)?
Leak Sony, leak!
Leak Sony, leak!
Apollo Helios
Member
The big portion of both 'leaked' CPU spec which currently I don't believe in purported to be the same with only minimal difference in small parts, that's not enough to infer anything about frequencies especially when there's nothing known in terms of cooling, there's nothing in the 'leaks' about cooling 'metrics'. What's next, PS6 is heavily over clocked to compensate and thus is overheating!!! Lol where have I heard that before? Another FUD campaign that's trying to obfuscate and misrepresent another set of incomplete spec leaks.
Apollo Helios
Member
Hahahaah you are so funnyHow come we even know the number of hairs in the nose of the presenter of the next Xbox reveal two years prior to its release and we don't know Jack shit about the PS6 other than its target watt (that seems very unrealistic)?
Leak Sony, leak!
winjer
Member
What part don't you understand that AMD "C" cores are meant to save die space and power, thus they clock lower?
This is not some secret tech. AMD has been making these since Zen4.
On Zen5 the c-core is -1.8GHz on a mobile chip, on a desktop part the Zen4 the c-core is -1.3GHz. Who knows what the difference will be with Zen6 on 3nm, but there will definitely be one, if they clocked about the same the regular core just wouldn't exist at all.
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Apollo Helios
Member
I don't believe the leaked specs, not worth getting hang up on the made up or inferred details. Certainly not after this MLID person admitting to name drop PS to get more interaction and traffic for 'leaked specs'
Bojji
Member
If PS6 specs were better than Xbox I bet you wouldn't call it FUD
GitHub leak was accurate by the way. 2018:
2019:
PS5 and Xbox Series X GPU and Memory Specs Leak, Report Says - IGN
A new report from Digital Foundry (via Eurogamer) has shed some new light on what may be the GPU and memory specs of both next-gen consoles.
Only thing that changed between 2019 and 2020 was GPU clock.
winjer
Member
MLID is not trustworthy, but kepler_L2 is.
Apollo Helios
Member
Well only MS pays for these astroturf campaigns that's one reason and only Xbox fans are committed crazy enough to wage FUD wars without even getting paid beyond tote bags and Heinz beans, that's another reason why it wouldn't happen otherwise and sides would never reverse.If PS6 specs were better than Xbox I bet you wouldn't call it FUD
GitHub leak was accurate by the way. 2018:
2019:
PS5 and Xbox Series X GPU and Memory Specs Leak, Report Says - IGN
A new report from Digital Foundry (via Eurogamer) has shed some new light on what may be the GPU and memory specs of both next-gen consoles.www.ign.com
Only thing that changed between 2019 and 2020 was GPU clock.
TFLOPs was the FUD and that depended completely on partial test and misrepresented in terms of frequencies, so when there's a will there's a way. FUD is giving partial correct info with made up parts to demoralize fans and it's always targeting PS fans when it's these 'spec leaks'
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
trust me, copilot is everything to MS. For better or worse, it will be included in the next console
Radical_3d
Member
Someone who thinks MS is trying to bite even a tiny share of the PS market hasn't been paying attention to what's been going in the past year of has completely lost it. I'm leaning towards the later.
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Apollo Helios
Member
Maybe so, maybe not I'd rather wait for the official thing and decide on things then. But currently the way these specs are presented, including both sides and with epic precision and authority makes me not believe either.
The most damning evidence to me is that it's almost impossible to know both sides 'finalized' specifications with this much certainty. If that doesn't smell fishy to you, then believe what you will.
Then there's Mark Cerny saying everything is in simulation phase right now, and also saying next gen is a few years away, that's coming right from the horse's mouth that they are ways away from finalization.
winjer
Member
You might not know this, but for more than 3 decades, maybe more, there are tools that can run and simulate a hardware design.
This is very useful, as it allows to detect bugs and performance bottlenecks. Tapping out a chip design is very expensive, so testing it in a simulation is very important.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Denial.
Anger.
Bargaining.
Almost there. We're here to support you in those trying times.
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Apollo Helios
Member
OK guys take care, I'm not going to get pulled into this FUD campaign or flame out against these empty and unsubstantiated posts. Good effort though.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I always wanted Xbox to cost more and have considerably more power, yeah. Thats why I jumped onboard with the OG Xbox. More expensive than PS2 and I played all my third party on it due to the 800 x 640 resolution.
Radical_3d
Member
More Icarus than Apollo.>I don't care about Xbox or if it's more powerful
>Complete crashout on the next page
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
you dont need paid astroturf campaigns with fans like this
it sounds like you have 0 idea how TDPs work and how it affects components. Theres no amount of secret sauce to beat science
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I don't think it's impossible if the leak was from AMD. Also while final clocks won't be known yet, target TDPs should be.
TheRedRiders
Member
I'm sure in one if his more recent podcasts he mentioned that that CU count on the PS6 had changed, originally it was between 40 and 48, and now it's between 50 and 54.
I'll try digging up the exact video but he was being vague.
EDIT : found it, so either 52 or 54 CU, link.
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vaibhavpisal
Member
My understanding is Xbox has stopped trying to sell its hardware. If they continue being unavailable/ overpriced come next gen, it will meet same fate.
It needs to offer more if they are pricing it higher.
I can see some people choosing it due to higher performance and open market place over ps6. Its at least something to consider.
pacman4000
Member
Well, hopefully the game creators have more imagination than you then...
Seriously, if you think ML is only useful for graphics you have a very limited mindset.
Besides, the "neural cores" are already part of the CPU design. It would probably cost more to remove then. The idea here is to use dies used for PC, you know.
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RetroGamingUK
Member
With there also be a 24GB low end home console to match hardware specs?
As devs will need to target the handheld, surely it makes sense to do so.
Ronin_7
Member
We are not in the PlayStation 2 era.
This Console won't touch OG Xbox LT sales, selling 10M would be a massive victory at this point.
Bojji
Member
I'm sure in one if his more recent podcasts he mentioned that that CU count on the PS6 had changed, originally it was between 40 and 48, and now it's between 50 and 54.
I'll try digging up the exact video but he was being vague.
EDIT : found it, so either 52 or 54 CU, link.
First specs were from 2023 so that correction is entirely possible.
That 160W TDP still looks bad...
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
luckily for me, i couldnt care what a consoles lifetime sales are. I didnt think about it then and i dont now. As long as its an awesome product and worth the money to me, I will buy it and enjoy it.
From these leaks, the XBox is so much more capable than the next PS that if you still want to own consoles and have the best third party experience it will be on the Xbox by the looks of things. That, with steam rumoured to run on it. If they can sort those things, it would be a perfect bedroom device for me.
I bought a rog ally day one because i played on one and thought it was cool as fuck. Probably sold half the amount of units as my steamdeck did but I really enjoyed it. Ill get the rog xbox ally x next year if the AI gets switched on and it can run FSR 4.
I like to buy stuff that I think is cool.
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vaibhavpisal
Member
That weak ass cpu in ps6 means even the ps6 pro will be a joke compared to magnus.
Not to mention ps6 portable. (I will likely buy ps6 portable, if not ps6).
Bernardougf
Member
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TrebleShot
Member
Thats how i think it works
Loxus
Member
The handheld is most likely using lower resolution textures among other lower scaled stuff.
Bojji
Member
No. Even 2x PS5 SSD will still be a fraction of memory speed. We are talking about 10GB/s vs. more than 600GB/s.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
You think wrong. Storage would have to be 2 orders of magnitude faster to be helpful in real time scenarios.
PS6 bandwidth: 640GB/s.
PS6 SSD R/W: ~10GB/s
Imagine the storage speed required to alleviate this. It doesn't exist. RAM can actually be used as a fast temporary storage if you make a RAM disk. The opposite is page filing and that's useless for games.
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twilo99
Member
I think this particular case is back compatibility with older Xbox titles
Bojji
Member
This is the intention. Rockstar wants millions sold on PS5, then millions sold on PS6 and then millions sold on PC (PC and PS6 may be reversed in order).
That's entirely a software problem now.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
When those things are talked about, they are always referring to the APU TDP.
Those odd-sized buses are actually to allow them to make the chip cheaper.
In an APU, at any given process node, the worst scaling component of said APU is the MEM PHY controllers or buses. The smaller the process node, the more space it takes up on a die compared to the actual processing components. Having a larger capacity Memory chip, so say 4GB (vs 2GB) means that even while having only a bus size that is 75% of what was in the PS4/PS5, they can still end up with significantly more RAM (24GB vs 12GB) but more importantly, a lot more bandwidth. Depending on which GDDR7 module they use, 28/32/36Gbs, they can have bandwidth of around 670/760/860GB/s, respectively.
Another thing that I think people seem to forget is that mem bandwidth basically scales with framerate+rez. How much bandwidth do you need if your optimal target is running games at 60fps with an internal rez of 1080p - 1440p? A console, will never be designed to run games at 240fps or something like that.
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winjer
Member
And that isn't even the biggest difference in performance.
GDDR7 has an access time of 140 nano seconds. While an SSD access time is in the range of 0.1 mili seconds.
So even GDDR7 will be 714 times faster at responding to a data request.
MisterXDTV
Member
If MS put price beyond 1000$ for console........
The mistake is calling it "a console" in the first place
It's a mini-pc
Astray
Gold Member
The real lede here is the console project slipping into 2027. We already knew this would be an uber-powerful, uber-expensive machine, that part is not news.
2026 was the targeted date a lot of leakers mentioned prior, including our own
HeisenbergFX4
iirc. Launching with GTA6 was a big goal too iirc.
2026 was the targeted date a lot of leakers mentioned prior, including our own
HeisenbergFX4
iirc. Launching with GTA6 was a big goal too iirc.
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