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Dota 2 Beta Thread: [Brewmaster]

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Sorry Raxus/Haly for last night. I was completely out of it and couldn't really concentrate. And then the game where I was venomancer my internet went out -_-
It's okay man, the other guys had AM.

Should've just afked from the start.

Autobans in GAF IH:
Pudge
AM
Furion
 
wow ppl actually do think that AM and pudge and furion are op

:lol
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I don't want to ban AM or Furi because they're OP. I want to ban them because their presence heavily deforms the flow of the game. Against a team with AM, you basically have to commit half your resources and manpower to ganking him constantly. Ditto with Furion, although to a lesser extent.

AM is crazy with a lot of farm, and Furi can farm crazy fast. Both of them are hard to handle when the majority of the GAF community consists of newbies. Not to mention they both excel at picking off stragglers (which, obviously, is something else newbies tend to do).

Banning them creates an environment that encourages fun and learning, which is better than watching them steamroll by feeding off of newer players.

But hey if you get off on stomping newbies, more power to you.

(Ban pudge to make milkman rage :3)
 
They actually do think at least one of those things, yes (Prophet can be fearsome, but he's nothing like Antimage). Apparently Icefrog agrees, being that AM received nothing save minor nerfs in the recent Dota 1 balance patch. An AM that snowballs a little slower and is a little less fearsome in the face of so many buffed heroes is a good thing.
 
The problem is you need to try and balance the teams out, but at the end of the day the good players are always going to feed on the newer players regardless of the hero they go.

AM is OP and looking at the competitive scene it's pretty obvious.
 
After losing a practice match to bots (using Lich) I decided to try AM. I got some farm and good items. Then I just started destroying towers and barracks left and right. I ended up with only two kills and the enemy had about 15 kills more in total. If I can do something like that (even with bots), it must mean that he's overpowered.
 
Antimage and Furion are both ridiculous in an all-pick setting because it's difficult to properly counter them, especially when they're picked late. It's also incredibly annoying having to devote 2-3 picks just to counter them. They also excel in games with low to medium amounts of coordination, and newer players are going to struggle taking them down.
 
I still don't know how to feel about giving your lane partner all the farm from minute 0 when you are a support, it just doesn't feel helpful to the team if it takes a solid 40 minutes to get enough money to get a mek, and not having enough money at times to even get wards. I just think early game gold is just good on a support, since after that they are likely going to not be in lane farming and instead helping with ganking and pushing/defending.
 
Kirby, I've never taken forty minutes to get a Mek. Ever. And you know I play Dazzle all the time, and you know I never steal farm from the carries.
 
I still don't know how to feel about giving your lane partner all the farm from minute 0 when you are a support, it just doesn't feel helpful to the team if it takes a solid 40 minutes to get enough money to get a mek, and not having enough money at times to even get wards. I just think early game gold is just good on a support, since after that they are likely going to not be in lane farming and instead helping with ganking and pushing/defending.

Part of the reason they are support is that they can gank your ass without farm.
 
Hard carry gets free farm for the first 10 minutes: Has Vanguard/Perseverance and can accelerate farm due to sustainablity. Support can go off and do other things.

Hard carry has to split farm with support for first 10 minutes: Doesn't have any sort of sustainability item, slower farm, more likely to die in ganks, but hey at least Crystal Maiden has a Bracer!
 
So when do gaffers usually play? I want to bring you guys down with my Lich play (and by bringing you down, I mean my team).
 
Kirby, I've never taken forty minutes to get a Mek. Ever. And you know I play Dazzle all the time, and you know I never steal farm from the carries.

There are those games where your team has 2 T1 towers down 30 minutes in and the only assists you get are 5 way splits or happen after you died (You don't get any gold from assists if you die). A support in those cases is only going to get money from pushing down towers and ganking, if those don't happen they will continue to be dirt poor. 1 gold for .875 seconds means it takes 30 minutes to generate 2300 gold, and that bit of gold from the towers you pushed likely went straight to wards.

Also with Dazzle, you kill a decent number of creeps just by using your heal.
 
Also with Dazzle, you kill a decent number of creeps just by using your heal.

Only if I'm actively pushing, which only very rarely happens during the laning phase. And it only reliably kills creeps at levels 3 and 4, and I usually try to get level 3 poison touch ASAP unless we're being super-harassed because it makes ganking easier. And if we're being super-harassed, I won't be pushing.

NEXT

edit: oh and i also explicitly avoid using shadow wave if the creeps are attacking each other (unless my partner is in immediate danger) just so i won't steal farm from the carry :3
 
Maybe I should play Dazzle. But then you will cry saying that you never get to play Dazzle because I play him, like you did with Lich (Then I don't play him for 20 games and you never pick him once)
 
Its more complex than supports dont need items, carry needs all the farm, you can only get farm from ganks. However in the laning phase its more important for the carry to ramp up than support.
 
I was painfully laggy :/ There was a point where Haly arrowed you and my delay made me take forever to walk over and hook you, and several times where I had to watch HugoBoss walk right up to me while my hero wouldn't move. GGs though, doesn't take away from your good team clashes.
 
Poor Milk, couldn't carry both Haly and Botolf, too heavy.
Shit I was worse, so sorry about that to my team. I'm not new to DOTA, just haven't played in 4 to 5 years, and I forgot it wasn't -ap so literally the only heroes I could even remember were AM and Lich and AM was taken. So I didn't remember shit about items or skill builds but yeah I'm still fucking retarded for standing beside people during sk ultis and stupid stuff like that.
 
Haly why didn't you go Manta -> MKB?
I'm was using your Mirana build, you explain to me why Diffusal is there.

Diffusal would've been useful, were it not for Mirana's MOLASSES SLOW turning speed.
 
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