"Here have a 200+ hours game. Oh shit, sorry, the menus look bad. We can't charge you 60 bucks because of this, even though we have created a game stuffed with content that will take you days to fully complete."
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Kingdoms of Amalur demo impressions thread [Up On 360/Origin/Steam/U.S. PSN]
- Thread starter CrunchinJelly
- Start date
"Here have a 200+ hours game. Oh shit, sorry, the menus look bad. We can't charge you 60 bucks because of this, even though we have created a game stuffed with content that will take you days to fully complete."
Part two of IGN's review in progress -- this one has a lot of Q&A from readers about the final build of the game. It seems extremely positive:
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/121/1216517p1.html
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/121/1216517p1.html
Ninja Scooter
Member
played a bit of the demo. My only concern would be that the menus/presentation will be too cumbersome coming from how nice and streamlined everything in Skyrim is. That's the new bar. Aside from that, I don't care too much for the art style. Reminds me too much of either Fable, or those shitty non-movie licensed Lord of the Ring games for the original Xbox.
And if he doesn't like the menus and as such the presentation of this '200+ hour game' (where did you get this number, just make it up?), that seems like it would become more and more of a negative the longer he has to look and deal with them, right?
Number comes from the devs, and can also be extrapolated from the IGN preview/review of the game.
They're guessing the speed run (skipping all text) of the main quest to be 9+ hours. The main quest for the average gamer to be 25-30 hours. The speed run of the entire game content to be 200+ hours. Q&A had a contest to do that, and that's where the time is coming from.
Could be developer BS, but that doesn't seem to be the case with these guys, and early indication from 3rd parties is that they weren't making it up.
They're guessing the speed run (skipping all text) of the main quest to be 9+ hours. The main quest for the average gamer to be 25-30 hours. The speed run of the entire game content to be 200+ hours. Q&A had a contest to do that, and that's where the time is coming from.
Could be developer BS, but that doesn't seem to be the case with these guys, and early indication from 3rd parties is that they weren't making it up.
Gotta agree with this. I found the gameplay somewhat interesting and like the Fable vibe, but the story and world didn't really bite with me so far. Frankly, I found the plotline and detail so far a bit overwrought. I do like the nice color palette though the polygons and blurring for AA hurts my feelings. Should it go on sale at some point, I'll probably scoop it up.
I honestly don't see how these menus could really hinder someone's enjoyment of the game.
How long do you really spend in the menus? I haven't had any issue using them in the demo, and I don't foresee any issues in the retail release, either.
Though, like I said, I'm completely used to this menu structure from dozens of RPGs before it.
Man, I guess I'm the outlier on this one. Didn't like it at all. Combat didn't feel very responsive, weird acceleration on camera control, ugly menus, and I somehow managed to break the audio towards the end of the demo. Only the background music would play with no noises or voices. Graphics looked way too much like WoW for my tastes. The art style just seems to be WoW, and not inspired by WoW.
I played the PS3 version, if that makes a difference.
I played the PS3 version, if that makes a difference.
All versions of this demo have sound issues, and the devs said it's fixed for the retail release.
Though you're hardly alone in your criticisms, a lot of them are pretty commonplace in the thread, especially the menus, art style, and the camera. I hate the camera, as well.
Love the art style, myself. Though I have never played WoW, or even bothered looking into it at all.
I felt the character movement was off. Responsiveness could be a little tighter, and am hoping it will be in the final release. It's only slight, however, and would likely get used to it pretty quickly.
elrechazado
Banned
Played the pc version and felt the same way, and somehow even more disappointed at how bad the textures were and how simplistic the art style is.
Sounds really good. Regardless of reviews, though, I have played the demo enough to know that I am going to fall in love with the full experience. The fact that I can't stop replaying this little 45 minute tease is all the indicator I need to let me know that this is just going to be 'one of those games' for me. One that I will replay and enjoy many times over.
The Mana Legend
Banned
Okay, I officially can't play this demo anymore. The graphics glitched out on me to the point where, when I load it up, all it shows is the map, but it says I am not in map mode and am playing the game. There is no way to get rid of the map. Nothing I do will fix it.
That said, I'm definitely waiting for this game to be less than $20.
That said, I'm definitely waiting for this game to be less than $20.
After having spent almost a month playing SWTOR, the textures in this game look pretty good to me. Which doesn't mean they can't be bad outside of that comparison, but it's just something that had me more pleasantly surprised than put off.
elrechazado
Banned
The animation on that first dwarf guy who tells you you came back to life is like...completely motionless. He seems to be wearing a plastic mask over his real face or something....
I spent the last month with Uncharted 3, Assassin's Creed, and before Christmas, Skyrim.
Still, I absolutely love the art style and graphics here. Could be due to the fact that it's a nice change to go from all that gritty realism (though beautiful, as well. Especially the landscapes of Skyrim) to a more colorful, lighthearted style.
Some positives from the latest IGN update that are worth noting:
"Reckoning's superb combat mechanics keep me happy, however, leaving mild asides like the one mentioned in the previous paragraph in the periphery of my mind. Reckoning feels almost arcadey in its combat, something that seems totally out of place in a game like this, and yet something that remains utterly refreshing. Many other like-minded RPGs feel outright clunky and archaic compared to Reckoning, and I truly believe that combat may very well be this game's strongest aspect."
"Indeed, I've begun to realize the importance of strategy as I wage battle. The beginning of the game lulls you into a false sense of security, and Reckoning begins to feel like a button-masher. But it isn't. When you start encountering enemies that are more difficult, more intelligent and more aggressive than ones very early in the game, you'll start to understand the utmost importance of using your shield and the parry button."
"Finally, the technical fidelity of the game stands out to me, especially considering how ambitiously big Reckoning is. I'm playing a debug version of the final build of the game on my test PlayStation 3, and the game hasn't frozen or locked-up on me once. The framerate occasionally stutters during fierce combat featuring a large number of enemies and the draw distance won't impress you, but the game has run reliably. That means no incessant "fear saves" due to an unstable game!"
If anything, these impressions should tell you that writing this game off based on the demo is going to be selling it far short of what it is going to be once it opens up and you spend more time with it beyond 45 minutes and getting to level 3 in a tiny section of the first area.
Also, seems as if what he is playing is significantly cleaned up, as opposed to the demo. Which means that the devs are not lying when they say it is a 3 month old build and that most of these issues have been addressed. The demo is just not going to do this game justice.
"Reckoning's superb combat mechanics keep me happy, however, leaving mild asides like the one mentioned in the previous paragraph in the periphery of my mind. Reckoning feels almost arcadey in its combat, something that seems totally out of place in a game like this, and yet something that remains utterly refreshing. Many other like-minded RPGs feel outright clunky and archaic compared to Reckoning, and I truly believe that combat may very well be this game's strongest aspect."
"Indeed, I've begun to realize the importance of strategy as I wage battle. The beginning of the game lulls you into a false sense of security, and Reckoning begins to feel like a button-masher. But it isn't. When you start encountering enemies that are more difficult, more intelligent and more aggressive than ones very early in the game, you'll start to understand the utmost importance of using your shield and the parry button."
"Finally, the technical fidelity of the game stands out to me, especially considering how ambitiously big Reckoning is. I'm playing a debug version of the final build of the game on my test PlayStation 3, and the game hasn't frozen or locked-up on me once. The framerate occasionally stutters during fierce combat featuring a large number of enemies and the draw distance won't impress you, but the game has run reliably. That means no incessant "fear saves" due to an unstable game!"
If anything, these impressions should tell you that writing this game off based on the demo is going to be selling it far short of what it is going to be once it opens up and you spend more time with it beyond 45 minutes and getting to level 3 in a tiny section of the first area.
Also, seems as if what he is playing is significantly cleaned up, as opposed to the demo. Which means that the devs are not lying when they say it is a 3 month old build and that most of these issues have been addressed. The demo is just not going to do this game justice.
RPGCrazied
Member
I thought the view distance was fine in the PS3 version, it was the texture pop in that was the eye sore. If that doesn't do it that much in the final build, I'll be happy. But in the demo it was everywhere.
Even the demo had me sold, and reading this makes me want the game even more.
I may have to stay away from discussions about the game, lest I go mad from anticipation.
Ok, either the camera is buggy on my system or this is the one instance where GAF doesn't whine enough.
It renders the game, if not unplayable, then at least utterly unenjoyable. I haven't played any game that was as broken as this is in its fundamental controls for years. I cannot for the life of me believe that anyone thought this was a good idea or approved of it. It seemed like there could have been an interesting game somewhere in there but unless the camera system is ripped out entirely and replaced I certainly wouldn't even play it if I was paid to do so.
Holy crap.
It renders the game, if not unplayable, then at least utterly unenjoyable. I haven't played any game that was as broken as this is in its fundamental controls for years. I cannot for the life of me believe that anyone thought this was a good idea or approved of it. It seemed like there could have been an interesting game somewhere in there but unless the camera system is ripped out entirely and replaced I certainly wouldn't even play it if I was paid to do so.
Holy crap.
Mechanized
Member
Just played it on PC, damn the game looks nice. After playing the PC version I think I'm gonna get that one. It doesn't have any of the framerate dips the PS3 version has. Unless I hear that's fixed on the final PS3 version I guess it's PC for me.
Nope, I wish the camera worked like darksiders... Would be perfect.
Not in the demo, but it seems to be the main thing they are working on. The game is probably gold at this point, so it might be a first patch kind of fix. Presumably a fast one judging by the fact that the vast majority of feedback on the demo was about that exact problem.
no, sadly not yet. However the lead combat designer is looking into it, he posted on their forums that he's taking feedback on what people want from it. If you want to add to it you can check out the thread here : Camera Feedback thread other devs could really learn alot, when it comes to community relations from these guys.
Net_Wrecker
Member
Someone should just tell them to go play Bayonetta and copy that camera system exactly. It's always where it should be, the auto target is the best I've ever seen, enemies NEVER attack if they're off screen, it's at the perfect angle, there's no acceleration, etc. etc.
Im most likely gonna pick this up. It was fun overall and has a lot of potential and seems like it will have literally dozens upon dozens of hours on content, but the camera is pure shit as are the menus, art style isnt exactly my favorite and the combat isnt as fluid as its described or as I would like it to be.
Directing your character from one enemy to another just doesnt work most of the time. Enemy X is on the left and enemy Y is on the right, if I attack enemy X and then direct my character towards enemy Y and hit the attack button he'll just attack in whatever direction he was facing when I hit the button or still attack enemy X. If youre in a combo situation it wont break the combo even if youre directing your character in another direction entirely which is bad design.
While it is a more sophisticated combat system similar to that of Fable, it may have more depth and variation, but its definitely not as smooth in terms of flowing from enemy to enemy. Also there seems to be no good way of aiming arrows or spells at various enemies that are all in the same direction as you, it seems to pick the nearest and thats it. 60 dollars is pretty steep for a PC game, an unproven one at that. Skyrim and CoD can get away with it sadly, but not many others.
Directing your character from one enemy to another just doesnt work most of the time. Enemy X is on the left and enemy Y is on the right, if I attack enemy X and then direct my character towards enemy Y and hit the attack button he'll just attack in whatever direction he was facing when I hit the button or still attack enemy X. If youre in a combo situation it wont break the combo even if youre directing your character in another direction entirely which is bad design.
While it is a more sophisticated combat system similar to that of Fable, it may have more depth and variation, but its definitely not as smooth in terms of flowing from enemy to enemy. Also there seems to be no good way of aiming arrows or spells at various enemies that are all in the same direction as you, it seems to pick the nearest and thats it. 60 dollars is pretty steep for a PC game, an unproven one at that. Skyrim and CoD can get away with it sadly, but not many others.
Agreed, it's great to see them interacting with the fans so extensively.
The lead combat designer made a response to the feedback. I do hope they implement some of the options he talked about.
For those too lazy to look through the thread:
JoeQ said:
zerokoolpsx
Member
Had some really weird issues. Dialogue with all npcs sped up to a point where I can't read it. Its so fast that it appears to skip. It doesn't help that it started happening near the end of the tutorial. Missed out on whatever the lore is and factions. Also audio would stop. No sound effects, no background music. Then only the sound effects would come back and shortly stop again. Checked my options in audio and it's at max so I don't know what the deal is. Trudge through it with no audio most of the time. Noticed some clipping issues with an npc's teeth through the skin while talking. This is on the PS3 version.
Anyone else experience these issues?
Would have enjoyed it more if it wasn't for those issues.
Anyone else experience these issues?
Would have enjoyed it more if it wasn't for those issues.
Yu Narukami
Member
Anybody found out in the demo what bonuses you get from trainers?
Thanks for that. I think what was killing the game for me was the "auto follow" system. If I could just disable that entirely it should be fine. Of course, being able to zoom out further would also help.
AgentOtaku
Member
IGN said:
Fantastic!
Yes, this is a common glitch and is already fixed in the final version.
Evolved1
make sure the pudding isn't too soggy but that just ruins everything
I'm one of those people that wants complete control of the camera at all times... I get they have to consider all the types of players out there, but it seems like the two changes I was hoping for with the camera aren't going to happen.
They seem happy with the camera velocity. Too bad. I think it makes their game feel more clunky than it really is. Actually, their controls are quite tight, very good. But the camera velocity and wonky auto-movement (the latter, especially when you first start to move) detract from the experience. Velocity also works against someone like me that wants to have a very precise camera because I control everything myself. I generally hate cameras that auto-center and shit like that... you can add "velocity" to the shit list. To me it just feels like input lag. Not very flattering. Whatever.
The real disappointment seems that everyone wants a camera further back. Not me. I think the default is generally a fine distance. When it's not, it's because I want something closer. Their zoom is actually a really well balanced OTSV. Character is off center, as it should be, and the distance is really good for examining the environment. BUT IT RESETS WHEN YOU MOVE!!! Ugh. I know why they do this, I just don't like it. They want to have the R3 be a button to center the camera (something I never use -- like I said, I control the camera with sticks, even in combat) and they want you to see more (pull it back) during combat. Well, I don't like it. It hinders exploration. I have to stop walking and stand perfectly still to look at anything. It's pretty goddamned annoying. The best third person adventure games allow you to zoom in while you walk around. Also, I find their bow combat pretty much broken (with regard to camera) in its current form. I'd say >30% of the time my character's body obscures the target during bow combat. Using a bow in OTSV would completely remove this problem. Having sensitivity bumped up (w/o camera "velocity") and a tighter view... the game could still be very responsive in combat. And the tighter view could be a lot of fun. If shit got too tense you could always hit R3 and jump back to the default.
But based on comments, from gamer feedback and the devs themselves... seems like they are going the completely opposite direction. *sigh*
They seem happy with the camera velocity. Too bad. I think it makes their game feel more clunky than it really is. Actually, their controls are quite tight, very good. But the camera velocity and wonky auto-movement (the latter, especially when you first start to move) detract from the experience. Velocity also works against someone like me that wants to have a very precise camera because I control everything myself. I generally hate cameras that auto-center and shit like that... you can add "velocity" to the shit list. To me it just feels like input lag. Not very flattering. Whatever.
The real disappointment seems that everyone wants a camera further back. Not me. I think the default is generally a fine distance. When it's not, it's because I want something closer. Their zoom is actually a really well balanced OTSV. Character is off center, as it should be, and the distance is really good for examining the environment. BUT IT RESETS WHEN YOU MOVE!!! Ugh. I know why they do this, I just don't like it. They want to have the R3 be a button to center the camera (something I never use -- like I said, I control the camera with sticks, even in combat) and they want you to see more (pull it back) during combat. Well, I don't like it. It hinders exploration. I have to stop walking and stand perfectly still to look at anything. It's pretty goddamned annoying. The best third person adventure games allow you to zoom in while you walk around. Also, I find their bow combat pretty much broken (with regard to camera) in its current form. I'd say >30% of the time my character's body obscures the target during bow combat. Using a bow in OTSV would completely remove this problem. Having sensitivity bumped up (w/o camera "velocity") and a tighter view... the game could still be very responsive in combat. And the tighter view could be a lot of fun. If shit got too tense you could always hit R3 and jump back to the default.
But based on comments, from gamer feedback and the devs themselves... seems like they are going the completely opposite direction. *sigh*
Played it on PS3 yesterday, liked it. I liked the arcadey combat and how the game just kept throwing quests at me. Didn't like how the mini-map worked though. Guess I like the ones that rotate when you do instead of the stationary one.
Had some weird graphics glitches where the ground disappeared and running over it would make the character look like he was 'running through time' when you could just seem him leaving a trail of himself too, but probably just demo related.
What happens if you die in the final game? Do you just come back to life like you did in the demo? Maybe I was losing items or gold without knowing it, but is there a penalty for dying?
Had some weird graphics glitches where the ground disappeared and running over it would make the character look like he was 'running through time' when you could just seem him leaving a trail of himself too, but probably just demo related.
What happens if you die in the final game? Do you just come back to life like you did in the demo? Maybe I was losing items or gold without knowing it, but is there a penalty for dying?
Evolved1
make sure the pudding isn't too soggy but that just ruins everything
iirc you can change that in the options menu.
Haven't downloaded the demo yet, but I'm checking the 22 minutes playthrough on IGN. It does look like a fusion of Elder scroll, WoW and Fable. Definitively a mmo world building philosophy along with some trademark of Bethesda games (pickpocketing/stealing, dialogues, probably can kill almost anyone and guards can try to arrest you and there's the exact same option as in Elder scroll to resist arrest, etc) , loot system and gear inspired by WoW (grey, white, green, blue and purple named items indicating their quality, skilltree, etc) and combat is more alike to Fable (artstyle seems like a mix between Fable and WoW) .
I'm interested in the game, but I'm sure it's gonna have a ton of flaws. Rpgs are time consuming to make and the audience is usually demanding, so it's a tough task especially for a newcomer studio. Moreso if you are doing a huge sandbox game which demand massive hours of QA. I expect a sloppy and buggy game which will still be fun and worth playing since there's definitively talent and passion behind the project.
I'm interested in the game, but I'm sure it's gonna have a ton of flaws. Rpgs are time consuming to make and the audience is usually demanding, so it's a tough task especially for a newcomer studio. Moreso if you are doing a huge sandbox game which demand massive hours of QA. I expect a sloppy and buggy game which will still be fun and worth playing since there's definitively talent and passion behind the project.
Demo was pretty cool, but I agree that the menus look fucking awful. Unfortunately there is approximately zero chance I would get to it before ME3 hits, then Xenoblade is the month after that, and after that hopefully Skyrim will be patched to the point where I can finish it (and maybe DLC will be out). That combined with the fact that they are already talking about big DLC's for this game has just convinced me to wait for a Complete release down the line.
MightyHedgehog
Member
UI is bit too dominant on-screen, but the only problem I had was the acceleration of turning sensitivity on the analog stick for movement once you tilted past the halfway mark (on the X360 demo, anyway). It makes for fast maneuvering once you get used to it, but it ends up feeling too fishtail-y and create a sense of floating over the ground instead of stepping off of and pushing off of the ground. I like that they chose to prioritize clarity and framerate over detail.
Baconsammy
Banned
Yeah, the impression I got from reading Joe's responses is that everything I dislike about the camera system, they love. It seriously makes me question what kind of games they were using as inspiration since he at one point praises the follow-system as the best of its kind. I don't think so many of us are whining about the camera simply because it's new and we hate new things. I think it's because the camera system generally just sucks. I'm trying not to be too negative, because warts and all I love love love this game.
Played the demo through one more time, yet I still can't get the second Mass Effect 3 unlock. :/
http://social.bioware.com/user_entitlements.php
Only Reckoner-Knight is listed there. I've played through the demo to its end (after the 45 minutes) and watched the end trailer too. Also clicked all the links at the end too. How do I get the second piece of ME3 DLC?
http://social.bioware.com/user_entitlements.php
Only Reckoner-Knight is listed there. I've played through the demo to its end (after the 45 minutes) and watched the end trailer too. Also clicked all the links at the end too. How do I get the second piece of ME3 DLC?
I think camera is quite good, just need some tweaks, to be great. Its definitely better than in DMC or Ninja Gaiden.
AgentOtaku
Member
Fwiw I definitely wanna play this more than my copy of skyrim
And wow, I had no idea so Many people had issues with the camera system. I think its fine =\
And wow, I had no idea so Many people had issues with the camera system. I think its fine =\