Mass Effect 3 SPOILER THREAD: LOTS OF SPECULATION FROM EVERYONE

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I liked the ending. Well, endings, all three of them. It seems people wanted to have some kind of very conventional ending where Shepard fires the CitaCruciDel as some kind of super awesome Michael Bay bro-laser to wreck all the Reapers then escapes back to Earth on the Normandy to have babies with his/her love interest and live happily ever after. For me, that ending would have been the most boring, conventional, non-thought-provoking epilogue ever, and I don't think it'd have been worthy of the great sci-fi endings out there that get us talking and thinking. That'd have just been a quick and dirty bit of closure, and to me, that's not good enough. I've read people's ideas for alternate endings, and frankly, I just don't like them any more than what we got.

Sure, I have issues with the mild ripoff of Deus Ex's choices (although if you're going to borrow, borrow from the best) and the way the three ending cutscenes and videos were so similar and the whole thing with the kid/Daddy-reaper, but the actual endings? It was just the right amount of obscurity and vagueness that lets me decide how the next chapters of each of my squadmates' lives go, although I have a pretty good idea in pretty much all cases. But I don't think BioWare needed to spell it out for me.

One thing I think I can agree on with everyone... hiring Buzz Aldrin was a mistake.
 
I haven't read through the entire thread, but someone on SomethingAwful claimed to have heard learned about a major shift of the Reaper plot midway through development. Apparently, Drew Karpyshyn's original ending was:

"The Reapers' goal was to find a way to stop the spread of Dark Energy which would eventually consume everything. That's why there was so much foreshadowing about Dark Energy in ME2.

The Reapers as a whole were 'nations' of people who had fused together in the most horrific way possible to help find a way to stop the spread of the Dark Energy. The real reason for the Human Reaper was supposed to be the Reapers saving throw because they had run out of time. Humanity in Mass Effect is supposedly unique because of it's genetic diversity and represented the universe's best chance at stopping Dark Energy's spread.

The original final choice was going to be "Kill the Reapers and put your faith in the races of the galaxy in finding another way to stop the spread with what little time is left" or "Sacrifice humanity, allowing them to be horrifically processed in hopes that the end result will justify the means."

The SomethingAwful guy then goes on to say that all the foreshadowing about dark energy in ME2 (including Haestrom) is never brought up again in ME3.

If this is true, I'm pretty disappointed by the change of heart. I still feel like the motivations of the Reapers don't need to be explained, but since Bioware went that route, this reasoning sits better than some contradicting plot line about synthetics vs. organics.

This was posted on the IGN message boards on the 26th of February, so take it with a huge grain of salt. I apologize if this was already posted.

http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/s...nged-dramatically-big-big-spoilers.250066288/
 
Bowdz said:
"The Reapers' goal was to find a way to stop the spread of Dark Energy which would eventually consume everything. That's why there was so much foreshadowing about Dark Energy in ME2.

The Reapers as a whole were 'nations' of people who had fused together in the most horrific way possible to help find a way to stop the spread of the Dark Energy. The real reason for the Human Reaper was supposed to be the Reapers saving throw because they had run out of time. Humanity in Mass Effect is supposedly unique because of it's genetic diversity and represented the universe's best chance at stopping Dark Energy's spread.

The original final choice was going to be "Kill the Reapers and put your faith in the races of the galaxy in finding another way to stop the spread with what little time is left" or "Sacrifice humanity, allowing them to be horrifically processed in hopes that the end result will justify the means."

The SomethingAwful guy then goes on to say that all the foreshadowing about dark energy in ME2 (including Haestrom) is never brought up again in ME3.
Click to expand...

Pftahaha. I always wondered what happened to Haelstrom in ME3. It would also explain why the Protheans were turned into Collectors and not Reapers (lack of genetic diversity). Why can't this be real? I am cry.
 
Bowdz said:
I haven't read through the entire thread, but someone on SomethingAwful claimed to have heard learned about a major shift of the Reaper plot midway through development. Apparently, Drew Karpyshyn's original ending was:

"The Reapers' goal was to find a way to stop the spread of Dark Energy which would eventually consume everything. That's why there was so much foreshadowing about Dark Energy in ME2.

The Reapers as a whole were 'nations' of people who had fused together in the most horrific way possible to help find a way to stop the spread of the Dark Energy. The real reason for the Human Reaper was supposed to be the Reapers saving throw because they had run out of time. Humanity in Mass Effect is supposedly unique because of it's genetic diversity and represented the universe's best chance at stopping Dark Energy's spread.

The original final choice was going to be "Kill the Reapers and put your faith in the races of the galaxy in finding another way to stop the spread with what little time is left" or "Sacrifice humanity, allowing them to be horrifically processed in hopes that the end result will justify the means."

The SomethingAwful guy then goes on to say that all the foreshadowing about dark energy in ME2 (including Haestrom) is never brought up again in ME3.

If this is true, I'm pretty disappointed by the change of heart. I still feel like the motivations of the Reapers don't need to be explained, but since Bioware went that route, this reasoning sits better than some contradicting plot line about synthetics vs. organics.

This was posted on the IGN message boards on the 26th of February, so take it with a huge grain of salt. I apologize if this was already posted.

http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/s...nged-dramatically-big-big-spoilers.250066288/
Click to expand...

Interesting. Before Reaper motivations were explicitly said, I honestly thought the reapers existed for the same reason the genophage was created. If advanced races were allowed to expand indefinitely, it would inevitably lead to the destruction of the galaxy.
 
Fomalhaut said:
Pftahaha. I always wondered what happened to Haelstrom in ME3. It would also explain why the Protheans were turned into Collectors and not Reapers (lack of genetic diversity). Why can't this be real? I am cry.
Click to expand...

Now i do want to know what fucking race was that flying horse reaper enemy made off.
Or did the reapers take x amount of bodies and glued them together.

Never looked it up in the journal because that was also a clusterfuck the should have separated journal and codex like in ME 1(or is my memory failing me).
 
Bowdz said:
I haven't read through the entire thread, but someone on SomethingAwful claimed to have heard learned about a major shift of the Reaper plot midway through development. Apparently, Drew Karpyshyn's original ending was:

"The Reapers' goal was to find a way to stop the spread of Dark Energy which would eventually consume everything. That's why there was so much foreshadowing about Dark Energy in ME2.

The Reapers as a whole were 'nations' of people who had fused together in the most horrific way possible to help find a way to stop the spread of the Dark Energy. The real reason for the Human Reaper was supposed to be the Reapers saving throw because they had run out of time. Humanity in Mass Effect is supposedly unique because of it's genetic diversity and represented the universe's best chance at stopping Dark Energy's spread.

The original final choice was going to be "Kill the Reapers and put your faith in the races of the galaxy in finding another way to stop the spread with what little time is left" or "Sacrifice humanity, allowing them to be horrifically processed in hopes that the end result will justify the means."

The SomethingAwful guy then goes on to say that all the foreshadowing about dark energy in ME2 (including Haestrom) is never brought up again in ME3.

If this is true, I'm pretty disappointed by the change of heart. I still feel like the motivations of the Reapers don't need to be explained, but since Bioware went that route, this reasoning sits better than some contradicting plot line about synthetics vs. organics.

This was posted on the IGN message boards on the 26th of February, so take it with a huge grain of salt. I apologize if this was already posted.

http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/s...nged-dramatically-big-big-spoilers.250066288/
Click to expand...

Sounds plausible, I mean they made a big deal about it in the second game but then there's no mention of it in the third.

Anyway after having finished the game the ending(s) kinda ruined the experience. Anyone know what the "secret "NG+ ending is?
 
I honestly would have been happy with a typical cliche ending. ME1/ME2 had cliche endings and you end the trilogy with this? Are you serious?

Anyone whats so special about the 4000/5000 rating endings? Whats different?
 
SmartBase said:
Sounds plausible, I mean they made a big deal about it in the second game but then there's no mention of it in the third.

Anyway after having finished the game the ending(s) kinda ruined the experience. Anyone know what the "secret "NG+ ending is?
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure there is no NG+ ending unless they refer to the 15-second "Shepard is alive" clip. Everything got datamined already and there's no sign of a "secret" ending.
 
Minion101 said:
Interesting. Before Reaper motivations were explicitly said, I honestly thought the reapers existed for the same reason the genophage was created. If advanced races were allowed to expand indefinitely, it would inevitably lead to the destruction of the galaxy.
Click to expand...

136448-2ntfr7b.png
Click to expand...
We are too goddamn epic to let that shit fly, as another series explained already.
 
Prologue said:
I honestly would have been happy with a typical cliche ending. ME1/ME2 had cliche endings and you end the trilogy with this? Are you serious?

Anyone whats so special about the 4000/5000 rating endings? Whats different?
Click to expand...

ME1 had the most cliche ending ever. They wanted to emulate 80s films... and by God, they did.
 
So I just beat the game and I think I did the "synthesis" ending. I don't remember making a decision, but I'm pretty sure I had all the best options available to me since I had over 5000 EMS.

How would I have chosen the other ones?
 
So, I'm now under the impression that the ending was changed due to a giant ego-filled pissing contest. There's absolutely no reason to change the ending if they plotted the entire trilogy out from day one.
 
HP_Wuvcraft said:
So, I'm not under the impression that the ending was changed due to a giant ego-filled pissing contest. There's absolutely no reason to change the ending if they plotted the entire trilogy out from day one.
Click to expand...
They did change the ending. It was supposedly to do something with dark energy (dark matter? something dark :lol ) destroying the universe and the Reapers trying to figure out a way to stop it. Its why in ME2 you get Tali's mission, who was looking into the geth and this dark energy/matter thing.
 
Lunchbox said:
no, i mean before that when they are talking. he talks about how he cant continue the cycle anymore because of choice/free will. and thats the reason why shepard an organic is standing in front of him in the catalyst. he doesnt have the ability to stop free will which drove humanity to become so advanced to even get there blah blah. so he gives shepard a final choice

aarh, i dont know. my head hurts. fuck you bioware, all i wanted was tali's face
Click to expand...

Hey, hey, catalyst? I know you're really busy being retarded and all but I just brokered a peace between Synthetics and Organics. Also by guiding the development of civilizations with Mass Relays you're basically making a self-fulfilling prophecy bro. The same things keep happening because you keep making the same things happen, I mean cmon. Maybe with another 100k years to work on us as a species without your goddamn interference we wouldn't have had to worry about rogue VIs and AIs and shit like that, maybe we would have been cool, man.

Also the idea that destroying the reapers also destroyed the geth made me rage. "lol u wanna live? maybe see your girlfriend? kill all the geth!"

I think the biggest problem is that the bioware writers are fucking garbage and none of the endings followed from FUCKING ANYTHING. You want to save the universe? well we've got 3 flavours for you today, and they all suck. Why do they suck? stop asking questions. Also, Deus Ex did a lot of cool stuff, the ending was not part of that cool stuff. Copy someone better next time Bioware. I also really like that they just made up a Macguffin at the start of the game.

Shepards dreams don't make any sense either. Either there's some information they're completely failing to get across or bioware felt the need to hammer on one single note that was patently clear the first goddamn time we saw the kid. One dream in mid-late game closing in on the cerberus assault would have done the trick, it would have reminded us that stupid kid existed and how shepard was all tore up and shit over how that kid was a retard.

While I'm on the topic of story shit that sucked in this game, Kai Leng. Maybe I'm biased because I read LumpOfCole's scintillating rage-comic adaptation of Dietz' steaming pile of book called Deception. It's also possible that he's just a really bad character and villain. "hey guys, I know you fought reapers and shit but there's this guy, Kai Leng. he's totally rad". I specifically chose rad because the presentation of Kai Leng was that very 90's EXXXXXXXTREEEME! style. I'm surprised Bioware decided not to have guitar riffs announcing his arrival in every scene. Sweet jesus is his character terrible. No motivation, no character, nothing but CYBERNINJAZZ, EXTREME!

Okay, final point, Buzz Aldrin is a cool guy, but he's maybe not the best voice actor in the world. Instead of having him do a scene with a kid he should have maybe read a monologue or something, like an inscription in the name of The Shepard, it
would have made him sound less awkward.

I almost completely forgot, I thought Adam and Eve were supposed to come before Jesus and were in fact what precipitated the fall. Fucking Joker and EDI in a jungle.

dragonelite said:
I not simple to unsee IP suicide that shit stays with you.
Until you get out of the griefing phase.
Click to expand...

The griefing phase can last from early teens all the way into adulthood. It might be with you for a long time. During that period it's probably best to avoid online multiplayer titles.
 
odd_morsel said:
So do you get all the choices no matter your EMS, but there's a best, good and worst version of each?
Click to expand...

No the the first rank of stuff allows you survive your encounter with TIM the second opens up either destroy or control depending on if saved or destroyed the collector base the last one gives you w/e option is left. The ending are all mostly the same. They mean different things, but the video you get afterwards are all the same with a different tint over them.

So what are the supposed consequences for romancing two characters in the series? I never ran into any.
 
HarryHengst said:
They did change the ending. It was supposedly to do something with dark energy (dark matter? something dark :lol ) destroying the universe and the Reapers trying to figure out a way to stop it. Its why in ME2 you get Tali's mission, who was looking into the geth and this dark energy/matter thing.
Click to expand...

One simple letter typo can change my entire post's intent.

I meant to write "now".
 
Bowdz said:
I haven't read through the entire thread, but someone on SomethingAwful claimed to have heard learned about a major shift of the Reaper plot midway through development. Apparently, Drew Karpyshyn's original ending was:

"The Reapers' goal was to find a way to stop the spread of Dark Energy which would eventually consume everything. That's why there was so much foreshadowing about Dark Energy in ME2.

The Reapers as a whole were 'nations' of people who had fused together in the most horrific way possible to help find a way to stop the spread of the Dark Energy. The real reason for the Human Reaper was supposed to be the Reapers saving throw because they had run out of time. Humanity in Mass Effect is supposedly unique because of it's genetic diversity and represented the universe's best chance at stopping Dark Energy's spread.

The original final choice was going to be "Kill the Reapers and put your faith in the races of the galaxy in finding another way to stop the spread with what little time is left" or "Sacrifice humanity, allowing them to be horrifically processed in hopes that the end result will justify the means."

The SomethingAwful guy then goes on to say that all the foreshadowing about dark energy in ME2 (including Haestrom) is never brought up again in ME3.

If this is true, I'm pretty disappointed by the change of heart. I still feel like the motivations of the Reapers don't need to be explained, but since Bioware went that route, this reasoning sits better than some contradicting plot line about synthetics vs. organics.

This was posted on the IGN message boards on the 26th of February, so take it with a huge grain of salt. I apologize if this was already posted.

http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/s...nged-dramatically-big-big-spoilers.250066288/
Click to expand...

That ending would have been a lot better than the one we ended up getting, wonder why Bioware felt the need to change it.
 
Why did Shepard get so traumatized by one kid exploding inside a transporter anyway? The shit he has seen during his travels would have to be so much more horrifying. Ive seen him watch his entire crew get liquified and used as 4x4s for a reaper construction work, a rogue specter turn into T-800 and blast him with mass effect, friends die at his choice, populations turned to zombies and other mutated shit. And what gives him nightmares is a little kid that says "You cant help me" TO A SOLDIER and runs to OTHER SOLDIERS TO GET HELP, get exploded while Shepard, surprisingly, goes to safety and survives.
 
I didn't notice any consequences for cheating. My Shepard had a vagina the size of a hot air balloon by the time it was over, and I still got to bone Liara one more time before the final mission.

Now I understand about the ending options, thanks, though it does appear there are good and a bad "destroy" variants.

I wanted synthesis, regardless of my options, so I chose according to my feelings anyway. Felt like the most interesting solution.

I'm glad they changed from the "dark energy" ending, fundamentally. I understand the appeal. Intellectually it's the most interesting of all the possibilities that I've seen raised, but the truth is that I've sunk over 100 hours into this game series, and at the end of it all, I want some peace and catharsis. I wouldn't have minded a very simple "crucibomb kills the reapers, hurray!" ending, because it would still be significant and represent the toils and victories of humanity, and show the importance of Shepard's cycle. Especially with Javik there to observe it and note the differences.

However, the brat's explanation for why they harvest advanced civilizations every 50,000 years doesn't mix with the indoctrination plot element. Up until ME3, we had been led to believe that the reapers were essentially increasing in force and power every 50,000 years. As they amassed and absorbed new civilizations, they were growing in size, creating new reapers, etc. This makes sense because there should be a goal for using these resources.

I'm not sure in the end, really. Somethings I like, some I don't. It's nowhere near as bad as what I was led to believe, though.

What I can say with certainty is that the ending is not what received the brunt of the attention in terms of development and writing, and that's okay. The ending is just a way to finish a game which has run its course. The missions and game play had some incredible moments in ME3 and those are what should be remembered.
 
It is kinda neat how the "best" possible ending for the galaxy and everyone else isn't also the best possible ending for Shephard (or at least the player).
 
I hope the vocal Bioware fanbase, who collectively seem to hate the endings based on a quick look over on the Bioware forums, manage to get Bioware to retcon the endings.
 
HarryHengst said:
I hope the vocal Bioware fanbase, who collectively seem to hate the endings based on a quick look over on the Bioware forums, manage to get Bioware to retcon the endings.
Click to expand...

What's the point of that? Video games at their most basic level are there to be played, not to tell a story. Just making some official statement of "Okay, our idea wasn't that great. Here's how Shepard's story really ends," wouldn't accomplish anything except appease the whiners.
 
odd_morsel said:
So I just beat the game and I think I did the "synthesis" ending. I don't remember making a decision, but I'm pretty sure I had all the best options available to me since I had over 5000 EMS.

How would I have chosen the other ones?
Click to expand...

There were other path branching left and right.
Left was control and Right was destroy if im not mistaken.
 
Absolutely detested the half assed ending.

1: I bring Garrus and Tali along for the final mission, somehow they ended up back on the Normandy which magically backtracked from earth to the sol relay in order to escape the blast. What the hell?

2: Oh hey i get 3 choices for the ending: Control the reapers, destroy the reapers, or just mush everything into 1 final evolution.
Okay, Illusive man tried controlling the reapers and that didn't work out for him too well so thats out.
I'd rather the galaxy remain as is then force an evolutionary leap to some magic final stage so thats out.
Or destroy the reapers. Yea lets do that! Oh wait, that'll kill the geth and EDI as well!

Either choice I make, the mass relays get destroyed and all that work I put into uniting the galaxy is completely wasted as the alien forces on/near Earth are stranded in the sol system without any means to get back home.

Loved the rest of the game, just as soon as I warped to the citadel, I had a dreadful feeling they were gonna cop out the ending in the above mentioned way.

Early on I missed saving Grissom Academy so I never got to see Jack in action. I was kept reminded of this fact at several points in the game:
1: News reports around the citadel.
2: The mission where you save Jacob and Ex Cerberus researchers. Met the scientist in Overlord from ME2 who committed suicide once he found out that the academy fell.
3: The final assault on the Illusive man's base. At one point, one of those nemesis type enemies came out and shouted "I WILL DESTROY YOU!". Soon as she was dead, squad mates commented on how that was Jack but at the same time, it was no longer the Jack they knew. That little detail was amazing for me.

My favorite moment was probably the renegade interrupt after Kai Lengs battle. So Satisfying.
 
It is kinda neat how the "best" possible ending for the galaxy and everyone else isn't also the best possible ending for Shephard (or at least the player).
Click to expand...

It's space Jesus! Shepard uses the word "sacrifice" about 150 million times during the course of the game. Of course this would happen :P
 
odd_morsel said:
What's the point of that? Video games at their most basic level are there to be played, not to tell a story. Just making some official statement of "Okay, our idea wasn't that great. Here's how Shepard's story really ends," wouldn't accomplish anything except appease the whiners.
Click to expand...

We seem to be at odds about our expectations from video games.
 
HarryHengst said:
But that way you wouldnt get CHOICES at the end (which didnt mean shit).
Click to expand...

We have not played ME4, we don't know how they affect anything.

HarryHengst said:
I hope the vocal Bioware fanbase, who collectively seem to hate the endings based on a quick look over on the Bioware forums, manage to get Bioware to retcon the endings.
Click to expand...

Why? Are you so offended by a video games ending? That's like asking the author of a book you bought to rewrite the end chapter just for you. Sure, games are interactive, but at the end of the day, we're interacting in someone else's story. What good will forcing them to retcon it do? So you can play a fanfiction?
 
squidyj said:
We seem to be at odds about our expectations from video games.
Click to expand...

What I'm saying is that to these unsatisfied people, the game has served it's purpose, even if they don't like certain aspects of it. The Mass Effect universe only exists within the content of the software it's delivered on.

If you've played the game, beaten it, and seen a disappointing ending, there's not much else you can do.

It's like George Lucas and Star Wars. He attempted to change the story by releasing new versions of the same movies with changes in them, but what does it matter if the "canon" has changed? If you grew up in the 70s and 80s, you saw the movies as they were conceived. Those two or three hours you enjoy the movie in is all that the world exists through. Simply declaring that it ends differently means nothing.
 
Darte said:
Early on I missed saving Grissom Academy so I never got to see Jack in action. I was kept reminded of this fact at several points in the game:
1: News reports around the citadel.
2: The mission where you save Jacob and Ex Cerberus researchers. Met the scientist in Overlord from ME2 who committed suicide once he found out that the academy fell.
3: The final assault on the Illusive man's base. At one point, one of those nemesis type enemies came out and shouted "I WILL DESTROY YOU!". Soon as she was dead, squad mates commented on how that was Jack but at the same time, it was no longer the Jack they knew. That little detail was amazing for me.

My favorite moment was probably the renegade interrupt after Kai Lengs battle. So Satisfying.
Click to expand...

Huh. This reminds me - has anyone completed the game with the minimal number of survivors from ME2? I'm curious to know how the game fills in the blanks if you are missing characters.

Who do you meet on Palavan if Garrus is dead?
How does the Quarian/Geth thing turn out of Tali and Legion are dead.
How does the Monastery turn out if Samara is dead?

Etc.
 
odd_morsel said:
What I'm saying is that to these unsatisfied people, the game has served it's purpose, even if they don't like certain aspects of it. The Mass Effect universe only exists within the content of the software it's delivered on.

If you've played the game, beaten it, and seen a disappointing ending, there's not much else you can do.

It's like George Lucas and Star Wars. He attempted to change the story by releasing new versions of the same movies with changes in them, but what does it matter if the "canon" has changed? If you grew up in the 70s and 80s, you saw the movies as they were conceived. Those two or three hours you enjoy the movie in is all that the world exists through. Simply declaring that it ends differently means nothing.
Click to expand...

I'm not expecting them to write a new ending but I think kicking up a stink over the shitty ending we got is entirely appropriate.
 
HP_Wuvcraft said:
We have not played ME4, we don't know how they affect anything.



Why? Are you so offended by a video games ending? That's like asking the author of a book you bought to rewrite the end chapter just for you. Sure, games are interactive, but at the end of the day, we're interacting in someone else's story. What good will forcing them to retcon it do? So you can play a fanfiction?
Click to expand...
Yes, because this ending is Bioware pretty much giving us the finger. Its a mess, it makes no sense within the established universe, it brings no closure to the story and its a big fuck you to everything you did before. If i wrote this in a fiction writing 101 class i would get it back with the comment to rewrite it.
 
firehawk12 said:
Huh. This reminds me - has anyone completed the game with the minimal number of survivors from ME2? I'm curious to know how the game fills in the blanks if you are missing characters.

Who do you meet on Palavan if Garrus is dead?
How does the Quarian/Geth thing turn out of Tali and Legion are dead.
How does the Monastery turn out if Samara is dead?

Etc.
Click to expand...

1) Nobody.
2) One of the Quarian Admirals and a stand-in Geth.
3) Stand in.

HarryHengst said:
this ending is Bioware pretty much giving us the finger.
Click to expand...

... whut?

I doubt very much that BioWare made something as complicated as a video game in order to be mean.
 
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