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[Horse Armour]

Here's one thing people are kind of forgetting, even if WiiU games are identical on the main screen to their PS360 counterparts, they have to render a whole second screen. Indeed, it's lower resolution, but it's still a performance draw. Just to hit par, it needs to be notably more powerful.

99.9% of games will just mirror the main screen or display a map/menu on the controller which has practically no performance impact. The amount of games that actually render a separate 3D view on the controller will be a tiny exception mostly from Nintendo.

 

[bigdaddygamebot]

Holy shit...E3 is going to be a complete fucking mad house this year. ha ha.

 

[Durante]

Which would mean more if most PS3 / 360 games managed 720p with decent AA as standard.

It's supposed to be a next-gen console, no? What does it tell us if a graphical demo for it features worse IQ than current-gen standout titles?

 

[JWong]

And did you saw the Zelda Demo ? I guess no. In terms of animations, polycount, effects, the Zelda demo looks better. And should I mention that Zelda games are not corridor games ?
Seriously man, April Fool's Day was yesterday.

Zelda is also a playable game.

That thing was not.

 

[MisterHero]

A next gen console is capable of getting current gen games.
Congrats?

Yeah it's not like those weren't good games or made good use of the hardware or anything

 

[jj984jj]

So we went from slightly more powerful, to just as powerful, to not as powerful? At this rate we'll be back to Wii levels by E3. XD

 

[orioto]

Here's one thing people are kind of forgetting, even if WiiU games are identical on the main screen to their PS360 counterparts, they have to render a whole second screen. Indeed, it's lower resolution, but it's still a performance draw. Just to hit par, it needs to be notably more powerful.

This argument is always weird to me.
Most of the time, a 2D interface will be on the second screen, like on a 3ds. And even when you want to have some 3D on it, you won't be displaying two screens with pretty graphics cause you will never be looking at them simultaneously. There is absolutely no reason for the WiiU to display two times the graphics of a game.

 

[Door2Dawn]

But really folks. Stop using the god damn Zelda demo for your arguments, it's not a particularily amazing tech demo, save for the lighting.

Use this! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OHUwDShrD4. Sure it's pretty much a pretty cinematic and no gameplay but I'll be damned if it isn't doing a better job at pimping the Wii U than the Zelda demo is.

The bird demo looks unimpressive right along with the zelda demo honestly.

 

[Afrikan]

But really folks. Stop using the god damn Zelda demo for your arguments, it's not a particularily amazing tech demo, save for the lighting.

Use this! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OHUwDShrD4. Sure it's pretty much a pretty cinematic and no gameplay but I'll be damned if it isn't doing a better job at pimping the Wii U than the Zelda demo is.

or a real legit Wii U game.....like Chase Mii

but seriously Chase Mii reminds me of fun times with StarFox 64 4player.

 

[XAL]

What steaming pile of dog shit!

Except tech demos and/or very brief "in-engine" demos in small environments =/= the final product you will play.
It's very very rare that final product gameplay lives up to the tech demo.

None of their tech demos showed anything that would drop jaws (with regards to graphics).

If they were alpha footage of actual in progress games, that would be a different matter entirely. Tech demos are for show, and they often show off more than what can be pulled off in the final product.

 

[BY2K]

Except tech demos and/or brief "in-engine" demos =/= the final product you will play.
It's very very rare that final product gameplay lives up to the tech demo.

For Zelda, it does.

Seriously.

 

[fernoca]

All developers need to do is lower the resolution from PS360 counterparts, I'm sure lot of you Nintendo guys won't notice it.

Like how there are Xbox 360 and PS3 games that are at a low resolution and "those guys" don't notice?

Or the people that played their "HD consoles", on HD TVs..with composite cables?

Guess is not only "Nintendo guys" the ones that won't notice.

 

[wsippel]

Except tech demos and/or brief "in-engine" demos =/= the final product you will play.
It's very very rare that final product gameplay lives up to the tech demo.

Not when it comes to Nintendo - they always exceeded the tech demos.

 

[JordanLMiller]

Except tech demos and/or brief "in-engine" demos =/= the final product you will play.
It's very very rare that final product gameplay lives up to the tech demo.

Now someone's gonna post that Zelda demo vs actual game chart...

 

[rdrr gnr]

When the final specs are actually announced I WILL BE THERE. And it will be glorious.

 

[lednerg]

But, IGN had you guys fooled it was 2-5x times the current HD consoles. Than came Ideamans posts, than new dev kits, people even talked about 2 gigs of ram. Lol! You CAN'T fit shoes in your wallet, you need shoebox. WiiU is so damn small that even being close to PS360 should be a miracle. If it was 2x and more powerful they could make tech demo looking much better than what is achievable in current generation games.

Gamecube and Xbox motherboards side by side

The PS2 motherboard is even more of a mess.

 

[Horse Armour]

When the final specs are actually announced I WILL BE THERE. And it will be glorious.

Nintendo won't release the specs just like they didn't for the Wii or 3DS, we'll have to wait after E3 for someone to leak them.

 

[The Boat]

Gamecube and Xbox motherboards side by side

The PS2 motherboard is even more of a mess.

This makes me all tingly. Gamecube was such a neatly designed beast.

 

[MrNyarlathotep]

It's supposed to be a next-gen console, no? What does it tell us if a graphical demo for it features worse IQ than current-gen standout titles?

It doesn't feature worse IQ than many current gen titles though, which is sort of my point.
This topic is about it being 'worse' than the PS3 / 360, but that just does not seem plausible.

Nintendo aren't Futuremark or Epic, they tend to make tech demos just using whatever assets they have lying around rather than dedicating a specific team to make the most bullshotty sizzle trailer they can, which is why historically their tech demos - and note that a tech demo is not purely a graphical demo by the way - tend to end up looking worse than their actual products do.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I know, it has some great looking bits.

But we shouldn't compare a tech demo made quickly with a full game with many man hours put in.

I agree wholeheartedly.

But that still won't stop these guys from arguing completely asinine things.

I mean... even if the WiiU is weaker than the PS3 or 360 is that gonna stop someone from buying it when the next big Nintendo series releases on it? Nope. Does it mean that Nintendo's games won't keep up with the powerhouse consoles titles? Nope. Didn't stop them this gen from creating titles with the same air of "wow" to big budget PS3/360 titles. It just might have taken them more work, better design to get there in comparison.

 

[Thoraxes]

Can anyone please expound on what it means to have more "powerful graphics" and "not enough shaders"?

In real terms, it's where one displays a greater fidelity than the other.

In terms in this thread, it's where we make up numbers and words without the proper application of what they really are or mean, and don't specify why or any specifics in any detail even though concrete details still haven't been announced and we're making final day judgement off old dev. kits and a demo over one year old.

 

[Ryuuga]

I hope this turns out to be true, so we can have "Did Nintendo dodge the bullet by XYZ?" threads when it still turns out to be wildly successful.

 

[Risk Breaker]

And did you saw the Zelda Demo ? I guess no. In terms of animations, polycount, effects, the Zelda demo looks better. And should I mention that Zelda games are not corridor games ?
Seriously man, April Fool's Day was yesterday.

Stop embarrassing yourself.

GoW3 is less of a corridor than that demo by far. It has higher framerate, more characters on screen, and to MrNyarlathotep, it also has DoF in real time (just execute any enemy), self shadowing AND a really impressive per object motion blur that Zelda is completely lacking from what I've seen.

I had totally forgotten how good GoW3 looks. If SM made GoW4 on PS4 and showed it this E3...

 

[test_account]

Someone should post that shot with Kratos flying a bit up in the air and all the ember/ash is around. That is one of my favorite GoW3 screenshots

Found it:

http://i.minus.com/ilFMB7ntSRcHo.png

Not to take anything away from Zelda, but i just wanted to mention that i love this screenshot from GoW 3 since it was talk about this game.

Zelda is also a playable game.

That thing was not.

It was rendered in real time, that is what matters the most.

 

[DarkChild]

Gamecube and Xbox motherboards side by side

The PS2 motherboard is even more of a mess.

Xbox is still more powerful console.

 

[teh_pwn]

That tech demo will be surpassed, unless specs have changed or it's disingenuous.

It's unreal engine based, so it's not like it's unrealistic. Witcher 2 surpasses it on PC with better hardware.

 

[DarkChild]

I just want to say...Nintendo, welcome to last gen!

 

[XAL]

Now someone's gonna post that Zelda demo vs actual game chart...

Not when it comes to Nintendo - they always exceeded the tech demos.

The chart from the N64 and Gamecube generations?

I'm not saying Zelda WiiU won't look very pretty, I'm excited to see what Nintendo can do with high end hardware.

It's just... to leap from Skyward Sword past God of War 3 (if you believe the hardware is superior) is a large gap.
And Nintendo has been known to favor style over technically impressive graphics, though who knows until the game gets announced.

 

[WillyFive]

It's very very rare that final product gameplay lives up to the tech demo.

I like how we can expect things to look better.

 

[Afrikan]

When the final specs are actually announced I WILL BE THERE. And it will be glorious.

I think it will similar to how the GameCube was more powerful than the PS2. Or I hope it will be.

so you had multiplats that looked similar....but then there were GameCube games like Resident Evil 4 and Rogue Squadron. Rogue Leader imo still looks better than some "next gen" games.

 

[Kingven]

oh E3 its gonna be fun...

 

[lednerg]

Xbox is still more powerful console.

You said "WiiU is so damn small that even being close to PS360 should be a miracle" - to which I showed the miracle of the Gamecube motherboard.

 

[GhostTrick]

Xbox is still more powerful console.

But Gamecube is really close in term of power.
Also, Gamecube's motherboard is smaller than PS2's one.
And with today's standard, you can make a more powerfull machine in smaller cases than Xbox 360 one.
Technology evolves

 

[Tookay]

Can anyone please expound on what it means to have more "powerful graphics" and "not enough shaders"?

It means nothing, just insane rambling from people trying to sound legitimate by using industry jargon.

 

[?oe?oe]

Super Mario Galaxy was the sexiest game this generation. 360 and PS3 got no sexy.

 

[squidyj]

bullshots vs a bad screenshot that came from an old build of a demo.

I loled.

 

[BigTnaples]

It doesn't feature worse IQ than many current gen titles though, which is sort of my point.
This topic is about it being 'worse' than the PS3 / 360, but that just does not seem plausible.

Nintendo aren't Futuremark or Epic, they tend to make tech demos just using whatever assets they have lying around rather than dedicating a specific team to make the most bullshotty sizzle trailer they can, which is why historically their tech demos - and note that a tech demo is not purely a graphical demo by the way - tend to end up looking worse than their actual products do.

What information do you have that we dont that indicates the WiiU tech demos were created using some assets they just had "lying around".

Nintendo is not run by idiots, they showed the Zelda technology demonstration so that we could say ooh and ahhh to the freaking technology. That is the purpose of a tech demo.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

Xbox is still more powerful console.

They're good at different things. Your absolute statement is not helping you save face after your nonsense about shoeboxes. By your argument, the Vita shouldn't even exist.

I like how we can expect things to look better.

I agree with the general gist of the images, but boy that's misleading. Ocarina is the 3DS version, and Twilight Princess' picture is one that happens to have a ton of bloom everywhere.

EDIT: Not the 3DS version.

 

[DarkChild]

You said "WiiU is so damn small that even being close to PS360 should be a miracle" - to which I showed the miracle of the Gamecube motherboard.

But those things in motherboard had to be cooled down. How big was GC? What were its measurements? It certainly wasn't big, but it was kinda tall. Wii U looks like table.

 

[rdrr gnr]

Super Mario Galaxy was the sexiest game this generation. 360 and PS3 got no sexy.

You play Journey? Journey was sexy.

 

[DarkChild]

They're good at different things. Your absolute statement is not helping you save face after your nonsense about shoeboxes. By your argument, the Vita shouldn't even exist.

Its just NOT nonsense. Wii U CAN'T be 2-5x more powerful than PS360. CAN'T. It can be in same ballpark, but 2-5x times more powerful? Nonsense.

 

[Tookay]

They're good at different things. Your absolute statement is not helping you save face after your nonsense about shoeboxes. By your argument, the Vita shouldn't even exist.



I agree with the general gist of the images, but boy that's misleading. Ocarina is the 3DS version, and Twilight Princess' picture is one that happens to have a ton of bloom everywhere.

That isn't the 3DS version.

 

[Ryuuga]

It honestly doesn't matter how Zelda-U ends up looking, no one will come to an agreement whether it looked better or worse than the target render.

 

[SapientWolf]

Not when it comes to Nintendo - they always exceeded the tech demos.

The Zelda team didn't make the Wii-U tech demo. They didn't make the Gamecube demo either. The GC demo wasn't even graphically impressive for its time so I don't think they were trying to drop jaws with it back then.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

I would like to know who made that statement so I know which game to avoid like the plague

 

[JWong]

It was rendered in real time, that is what matters the most.

Ummm no?

You can turn off collision, physics, AI in a tech demo like that. Even the animations could be key-framed and not running off a logic branch.

If you can't play the game, there's nothing that can be proven.

 

[FyreWulff]

But those things in motherboard had to be cooled down.

.. so did the Xbox?

Its just NOT nonsense. Wii U CAN'T be 2-5x more powerful than PS360. CAN'T. It can be in same ballpark, but 2-5x times more powerful? Nonsense.

And you know this.. how?

 

[XAL]

I like how we can expect things to look better.

Yeah...but like I said before, those are 2 & 3 console generations ago.

Their last Zelda efforts were Skyward Sword and Twilight Princess.

I think you'll see something shooting for the tech demo, but I don't think Nintendo will go uber hyper-realistic to match something like God of War 3 (we don't even know for sure if the hardware is capable of even doing that, if the tech demos were indications of the bar they're shooting for, it doesn't look like it).

 

[GhostTrick]

Its just NOT nonsense. Wii U CAN'T be 2-5x more powerful than PS360. CAN'T. It can be in same ballpark, but 2-5x times more powerful? Nonsense.

Man, take a low end GPU from today. It will be more powerful than PS3/Xbox 360 GPU.

 

[Duxxy3]

$250 confirmed.

As long as i get mario, zelda and metroid in HD i don't care how it compares to other consoles.