Glass Rebel
Member
Looking at his output I doubt he can stay in business that long...
Beamdog founder Trent Oster: "We don't do Nintendo development"
- Thread starter LiK
- Start date
Looking at his output I doubt he can stay in business that long...
DR2K
Banned
What core 3rd party games are selling well on Wii/3DS on a worldwide scale?
Both of those are things I would like more info on. I'd imagine its all stuff they are addressing considering their work on they've already done on the eshop, and statements regarding their DD services. All we really have to go on are positive developers quotes though, which doesn't really help get any specifics about the eshop. I do like that Nintendo has pushed certain eshop titles as well, such as Renegade Kid's "Mutant Mudds".
Well, about as creepy anti-Nintendo fanboys.
Pachterballs
Banned
maye he thought that there was no games on it, so the market would be hungry for content>
again; excusing the platofrm/nitendo/blaming the dev
/shrug
eShop doesn't have those restrictions though, so Wii U obviously won't. Holding a grudge when it seems like Nintendo took these criticisms to heart with 3DS is just really bitter and, frankly, kinda dumb. If Nintendo fixed those issues, why leave money on the table?
XiaNaphryz
LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
BlazingDarkness
Member
This is probably a reflection how a lot of developers (still) feel towards Nintendo.
What 3rd party game is selling well on PS3/ 360 on a worldwide scale?
Father_Brain
Banned
FieryBalrog
Member
Tell it like it is, devs.
Keep getting upset, GAF Nintendo fans.
I should say: I'm a Nintendo fan.. of their software, which is often still amazing. Everything else? Not so much.
Keep getting upset, GAF Nintendo fans.
I should say: I'm a Nintendo fan.. of their software, which is often still amazing. Everything else? Not so much.
IdreamofHIME
Member
True, high voltage were probably one of the Wii's biggest supporters/fans and they tried like hell to release Animales de la Muerte for years and could never get it to fit within the Wii's parameters.
Calling the console a toy is childish though, it splinters the strength of his argument.
I don't blame the dev completely or excuse Nintendo. Their (Nintendo's) policies are shitty, anyone can see that. They could've be more succesfull in a way that would benefit Nintendo and developers at the same time. However, the way WiiWare is run and marketed prevent that, which is 100% Nintendo's fault of course.
FieryBalrog
Member
Call of Duty. Yes, even sells decently in Japan.
Japan can be ignored anyway for home consoles, the market is minuscule compared to the rest of the world.
Did Nintendo fix the issues on eShop though? I mean if it was truly fixed then wouldn't more devs be flocking to the eShop? Because from what most of you guys are saying it sounds like it's still quite the mess.
And then you guys are also saying this is fixed on WiiU. Source? Do you even know if you have to sign into the WiiU eShop with a friend code or not yet?
The problems that he specifically mentioned seem to have been taken care of. That's all that I'm saying.
And you think that Wii U's eShop will have more restrictions than 3DS? Really?
Why do people like you even come into Nintendo threads? :/
I took the time to answer your questions. Previous page, long post at the bottom.
DR2K
Banned
Final Fantasy, MGS, CoD, Re:OC, ME3, etc. . . Japan is minute, but the on a worldwide 3rd party games are doing phenominaly on HD consoles. Enough to completely ignore development on Nintendo consoles.
How do you know that though is what I'm asking. The 3DS shop sounds a shambles and I don't remember Reggie checking that box for WiiU.
So you're just hoping they're fixed or.... ?
Beamdog is a small company that cannot risk long-term cooperation with a corporation that doesn't have respect for smaller partners in its DNA. Policies change constantly, meanwhile Nintendo has a long tradition of hostile environment for companies like his.
Beamdog will develop games for other platforms, I don't know why that would be infuriating for you - your precious corporation will survive without Beamdog.
The phrase "A bad craftsman only blames his tools" comes to mind when I see a developer blame the 40MB limit. They knew what they were getting into so they should have designed a game around that limitation, just like developers have done forever. A consumer on the other hand can complain because it limits what we can expect.
After the toy comment he was basically stuck digging a hole. Later on he tried to save face by saying Ocarina [of Time] was the best game of the generation. Now that is understandable when you're talking about the N64, unfortunately he was talking about the GameCube.
After the toy comment he was basically stuck digging a hole. Later on he tried to save face by saying Ocarina [of Time] was the best game of the generation. Now that is understandable when you're talking about the N64, unfortunately he was talking about the GameCube.
Ghost_Protocol
Member
Only for people who don't think its toyish. I've seen Wii peripherals and games for very young children in the toy aisles at Toys R Us and Walnart.
Every single one of those series except ME3 (which sold 8k copies in Japan at debut) you listed have entries on Nintendo consoles dude. And they all sold pretty decent, well may be not MGS.
FF and MGS yes, ME3 no, what is Re:OC? Resident Evil something?
What? Quite a few developers have commented on this. Don't be dense, sweety.
As evidenced by the indie developer conference they just held in Spain, or? (No developer has any obligation to support any platform, however.)
FieryBalrog
Member
Except that shitty tool is forced on devs by Nintendo, and they have every right to point that out.
100% Nintendo's fault.
Japan barely matters for home consoles.
Have a link, honey?
You can't just say Nintendo has fixed the problems for WiiU and not have anything to back it up. Otherwise it's just blind hope and based on the 3DS shop which seems to have changed policies but it still is as someone else said "lackluster" it seems as though there's still problems keeping people from developing games for it even if they're not the same problems.
walking fiend
Member
This thread keeps on delivering
I H8 Memes
Member
I would like to see a list of the Top 10 selling 3rd party titles on the Wii. Not Wiiware games, but actual software.
Whether or not Nintendos attitude has changed is irrelevant as well. If 3rd party software wont sell on Nintendo console the it doesn't matter to developers what the reason is.
Developer avoids Nintendo due to direct hands on experience with their terrible business practices; Nintendo fanboys with no direct hands on experience call them out in their typical kneejerk fashion.
Hell, there's even a "defend the horrific size limitation of WiiWare" post in this topic. Good show, very entertaining as always
Hell, there's even a "defend the horrific size limitation of WiiWare" post in this topic. Good show, very entertaining as always
Do you have wsippel on ignore or something. It seems like has tried to answer you questions multiple times now.
He starts with a somewhat valid point (WiiWare size restrictions, payment process, certification process); though it didn't made sense since all those things were known and the MDK port was quite late onto the Wii's life for them to be "surprised" by ..the disappointment.
But still.."get it'.
But the rest of the remarks just sound bitter and kinda childish. I know game developers are also fans of games, but they shouldn't talk about stuff that way. If he didn't liked what happened during that WiiWare game, then just say" we were disappointed with how things turned out, the certification was too slow and the payment process wan't good... but things has changed so we'll always keep the door open..who knows".
That way he criticized and didn't had to rely on the usual "toy, children, Wii has no games aside Wii Sports" stuff.
But still.."get it'.
But the rest of the remarks just sound bitter and kinda childish. I know game developers are also fans of games, but they shouldn't talk about stuff that way. If he didn't liked what happened during that WiiWare game, then just say" we were disappointed with how things turned out, the certification was too slow and the payment process wan't good... but things has changed so we'll always keep the door open..who knows".
That way he criticized and didn't had to rely on the usual "toy, children, Wii has no games aside Wii Sports" stuff.
ShinNL
Member
What non-port 3rd party game has been sold so far on 3DS on a worldwide scale?
I'd like to see the Top 10 budgets used for 3rd party titles on the Wii. Then compared to Top 10 budgets used on non-Wii games. Then Top 10 budgets on Nintendo's 1st party games. Then we might be able to stop addressing everything in such a suggestive manner.
Developer avoids Nintendo due to direct hands on experience with their terrible business practices; Nintendo fanboys with no direct hands on experience call them out in their typical kneejerk fashion.
Hell, there's even a "defend the horrific size limitation of WiiWare" post in this topic. Good show, very entertaining as always
I thought this wasn't allowed here.
Its true , most 3rd party developers hated the Wii Remote , thats why 3rd party games only had "token" functions just to say that they used motion.
Herbspiceguy
Member
I understand his critique, I mean he's not saying anything new here. However I got the impression Nintendo is changing it's online & small dev approach with the 3DS, so most likely this will be even further improved upon for the Wii U.
So to make a statement like "Our previous experience with Nintendo was enough to ensure there will not be another" seems a bit stupid to me. He let his negative emotions get in the way, which I don't think will do his company good.
So to make a statement like "Our previous experience with Nintendo was enough to ensure there will not be another" seems a bit stupid to me. He let his negative emotions get in the way, which I don't think will do his company good.
walking fiend
Member
Except there ARE 3rd party developers who closely work with Nintendo? Some almost exclusively work with Nintendo? (among them small ones)Developer avoids Nintendo due to direct hands on experience with their terrible business practices; Nintendo fanboys with no direct hands on experience call them out in their typical kneejerk fashion.
Hell, there's even a "defend the horrific size limitation of WiiWare" post in this topic. Good show, very entertaining as always
It's just that for various reasons Nintendo hasn't been able to attract core gamers for like 3 generations (which are the main market for 3rd party devs) and their online infrastructure has sucked. There is no [provable/publicly mentioned] agenda against smaller devs; there are various hits from unknown and small devs on both DS and Wii
This thread is full of impossible to prove/disprove and conspiracy theories.
Cosmonaut X
Member
Tell you what, take your "precious corporation" jab and stick it. I should have known better than to get involved in this clusterfuck of a thread, but there you go - first time I've been (albeit in a veiled way) called a Nintendo fanboy since I've been here though.
He didn't though. He listed a bunch of differences with the eShop but what I'm asking is even with those differences most of you guys are saying eShop still sucks. So there's still something wrong, even if it's a different something wrong,.
And then there's others who say it's fixed on WiiU. Well how and why would you think that?
While "selling well worldwide" would include "selling well in Japan", everyone's free to ignore whatever platform he wants. Perfectly fine. Fun fact: Beamdog also considers PS3 and 360 "not worthy", so the whole thread kinda started on the wrong foot to begin with. And you probably notice that even most Nintendo diehards agree that WiiWare was shit. It was. But that was years ago. Still, he's free to hold a grudge, even if it's stupid from a business perspective. I have no beef with that. Spreading outdated info on Twitter is the problem. He was asked about the Wii U, not the Wii. He doesn't know the conditions on Wii U. He doesn't even know the conditions on the eShop. Yet he acts like he does. That's stupid, and it's worth pointing out.
maquiladora
Member
With no HD the limit will probably be pretty tight again won't it?
Could you expand on this? Who is saying the eshop sucks, and what about it sucks?
Nick Watt from Nnooo has commented on the sales threshold. Team Meat has commented on the file size limit. And did you miss wsippel's posts? This topic (and this non-argument) is much too uninteresting to copy & paste quotes into my post, so Google for yourself if you're interested.
Of course there are. They're Nintendo, and they're a big part of the industry. If nobody at all worked with them then that would mean Nintendo would probably be also killing kittens and little kids, instead of just being a typically shitty business.
But there is such consistent, echo-chamber-esque complaints about Nintendo's practices it's almost unnecessary to click these threads at this point. SO many developers and publishers complain about the exact same things regarding Nintendo's platforms so frequently that it's almost beyond predictable - and all the Ninty's hang ons can do is plug their ears and spout "it's not the tools, it's you!"
Maybe it is also the tools, and not just the developers. Just maybe. Maybe everyone and their mother isn't bullshitting about their problems with the platforms
ShinNL
Member
I was under the impression that we were discussing the current changes, because people weren't commenting on the dev-unfriendly limits on WiiWare, but rather that things are changing with the new hardware. Thus your post in particular sounded very weird to me considering what they're trying to do with the Wii U.
It's like you wrote this post months beforehand and have been itching to post it on the first sign of a negative-comment-about-Nintendo-by-random-dev thread. Maybe it would've actually meant something if this entire thread wasn't based on a DOS game.Of course there are. They're Nintendo, and they're a big part of the industry. If nobody at all worked with them then that would mean Nintendo would probably be also killing kittens and little kids, instead of just being a typically shitty business.
But there is such consistent, echo-chamber-esque complaints about Nintendo's practices it's almost unnecessary to click these threads at this point. SO many developers and publishers complain about the exact same things regarding Nintendo's platforms so frequently that it's almost beyond predictable - and all the Ninty's hang ons can do is plug their ears and spout "it's not the tools, it's you!"
Maybe it is also the tools, and not just the developers. Just maybe. Maybe everyone and their mother isn't bullshitting about their problems with the platforms
Sooooo many devs, eh?