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[StuBurns]

Or they'll have another "revolutionary" moment and eek out another gen in which they are the market leader.

Thinking there's a definite endpoint when the company doesn't make traditional moves is a crapshoot.

I think that'd be cool, there's a lot of cool Nintendo style 'gimmicky' stuff coming in the near future in terms of wearable computers, virtual reality, arousal dependent dynamic controls of games. The kind of thing Nintendo will excel at. It's just if that'll be part of the Wii U, or Nintendo will drop it and move to something more radical.

The line between handheld and console is going to get very blurry, very soon. When I say handheld only, it's not really with the current implication that holds.

 

[MisterHero]

Nintendo also has to support the 3ds. And nintendo will release 1 more console before giving up. They have the money so why not.

They're not going anywhere if they manage to break even, and that might be pretty easy all things considered. They won't win with hardcore gamers, but that's par for the course.

 

[donny2112]

Nintendo is dead to 3rd parties.

During the N64 era, Nintendo fans could fall back on tech to comfort themselves. Games worth buying may have only come once ever 4 months, but they were great games that looked better than any meaningfully competing dedicated video game platform at the time.

During the GCN era, Nintendo fans could sort of fall back on tech. Xbox was more powerful, but both were significantly over PS2 in terms of power. Sales weren't great, but most mid-tier and below third-party titles still came to the system.

During a lot of the Wii era, Nintendo fans could fall back on sales and pointer controls as really being above the competition. There was junky motion stuff to down everything, though, and third-party support was nearly non-existant. Nintendo itself was generally doing great, though, which was some comfort.

Wii U is looking like Nintendo fans will have nothing to fall back on except Nintendo games, and Nintendo is having major problems getting those done, too.

I think it was Stumpokapow (or Nirolak) who postulated that the video game consumers were mostly getting silo'd into Nintendo and then everyone else last gen with very little crossover. Wii U seems to make that divide stand out even more.

UE4Lite may end up being ported to Wii U down the road when it's on mobile phones, and someone may bring that up with Rein and point him back to this GDC, and he'll go "Oh, yeah, UE is very flexible." Doesn't change the fact that his, and most everyone in the audience's, first reaction was to laugh at even the possibility of Wii U being able to run UE4, which speaks volumes about how Wii U is perceived in the industry way more than any retconned PR "correction."

"Nintendo is dead to 3rd parties." Doesn't seem too unreasonable a position to hold when looking at most of the industry, at this point.

 

[Mr_Antimatter]

After the Wii, weak hardware was somewhat expected. But the weak software was not.

With the NES, they launched with Super Mario, Duck Hunt, Excitebike.
SNES was launched with Fzero, Mario World and Pioletwings.
N64 launched with Mario 64 and Pioletwings 64
GC launched with Waverace, Luigi's Mansion
Wii launched with Wii Sports Excite Truck and Zelda TP.

All these consoles launched with games that either ahead of times, graphically impressive and games people wanted.

Wii U launched with the same Mario game that was released three times earlier and a mini game collection when the age of mini games has moved to cell phones.

For a company that's known for killer software...how or why did the Wii U happen the way it did?

My guess? They figured NSMB woudl be a massive seller because the wii game was, and they were planning to peicemeal out their other series over the next few years, to avoid a situation like the vita where everything was dumped day 1 with nothing afterward for many months.

The problem is, NSMB was not a smash system selling hit. It's not even a really good showcase title.

 

[evangd007]

You sound mad.

He sounds correct. Vita has a prayer in Japan to be somewhat viable, but elsewhere its deader than the Wii U with less hope of recovery because Sony doesn't know how to support it properly and Western publishers don't give a damn about handhelds.

 

[metalslimer]

I think that'd be cool, there's a lot of cool Nintendo style 'gimmicky' stuff coming in the near future in terms of wearable computers, virtual reality, arousal dependent dynamic controls of games. The kind of thing Nintendo will excel at. It's just if that'll be part of the Wii U, or Nintendo will drop it and move to something more radical.

The line between handheld and console is going to get very blurry, very soon. When I say handheld only, it's not really with the current implication that holds.

Of all the things that could have been in the successors to the 2 of the most groundbreaking systems how the gamepad and 3d were chosen baffles me, especially 3d which does jack shit but worsen IQ and framerates. I've been against 3d since the beginning, and at this point the 3ds might as well not have it because the hook is good nintendo games not fucking 3d

 

[Kimawolf]

During the N64 era, Nintendo fans could fall back on tech to comfort themselves. Games worth buying may have only come once ever 4 months, but they were great games that looked better than any meaningfully competing dedicated video game platform at the time.

During the GCN era, Nintendo fans could sort of fall back on tech. Xbox was more powerful, but both were significantly over PS2 in terms of power. Sales weren't great, but most mid-tier and below third-party titles still came to the system.

During a lot of the Wii era, Nintendo fans could fall back on sales and pointer controls as really being above the competition. There was junky motion stuff to down everything, though, and third-party support was nearly non-existant. Nintendo itself was generally doing great, though, which was some comfort.

Wii U is looking like Nintendo fans will have nothing to fall back on except Nintendo games, and Nintendo is having major problems getting those done, too.

I think it was Stumpokapow (or Nirolak) who postulated that the video game consumers were mostly getting silo'd into Nintendo and everyone else last gen with very little crossover. Wii U seems to make that divide stand out even more.

UE4Lite may end up being ported to Wii U down the road when it's on mobile phones, and someone may bring that up with Rein and point him back to this GDC, and he'll go "Oh, yeah, UE is very flexible." Doesn't change the fact that his, and most everyone in the audience's, first reaction was to laugh at even the possibility of Wii U being able to run UE4, which speaks volumes about how Wii U is perceived in the industry way more than any retconned PR "correction."

"Nintendo is dead to 3rd parties." Doesn't seem to unreasonable a position to hold for most of the industry, at this point.

Well good luck to em, it's not most of them are doing all that hot as it is.

 

[Plinko]

Realistically? Eight to ten major Nintendo games per year, for two, maybe three years, then nothing, and Nintendo will either go third party, or more likely, handheld only.

I find it hilarious how some people find the idea of one console failure putting Nintendo into third-party status. They've got enough cash right now to have at least two failed consoles.

 

[Neuromancer]

I figured I'd ask straight-out, so during the Q&A with Rein, I did. "Will UE4 run on the Wii U?"

"Hahaha no." Rein said, with expert comedic timing. The room erupted with laughter.

Holy shit

This is the funniest thing I've read all day, wow

It really is amazing.

 

[Thorgal]

A bit off topic but can anyone see Sega going back into the console system market in the future?, maybe if one of the big hitters drops out or changes long term focus?.
I just wonder if Sega has grown enough as a company since going 3rd party to have enough money behind them to do it. I'd love to see it happen though, its always felt wierd to me to not have a Sega console.

Even if they had enough cash to fund i think they don't care anymore

besides between the ps4/720 pc and smartphones they would get slaughterd between them

I find it hilarious how some people find the idea of one console failure putting Nintendo into third-party status. They've got enough cash right now to have at least two failed consoles.

Iwata: Oh yeah mr shareholder our consoles are all bombing and we are losing money on it ,but guess what?
we have loads of cash . we can keep bombing and losing money for the next decade .
so as you can see its just buisness as usuall.


ok serious now . you truly expect their shareholders would be insane enough to agree with what you are saying?

 

[Thunder Monkey]

New. Its miracast tech I believe.


Edit: You lost me Thunder :-/

I just being smartass. I loved both Sunshine and WW, but they were definitely flawed in comparison to releases on Wii.

I think that'd be cool, there's a lot of cool Nintendo style 'gimmicky' stuff coming in the near future in terms of wearable computers, virtual reality, arousal dependent dynamic controls of games. The kind of thing Nintendo will excel at. It's just if that'll be part of the Wii U, or Nintendo will drop it and move to something more radical.

The line between handheld and console is going to get very blurry, very soon. When I say handheld only, it's not really with the current implication that holds.

I agree for the most part that we are in for some pretty significant changes going forward. Enough that I question if PS4 or Durango will see much more success than WiiU. For all we know all consoles are now selling to a much smaller userbase.

We didn't actually see how much the dedicated handheld market had changed until the launch of the 3DS either.

 

[Sandfox]

Of all the things that could have been in the successors to the 2 of the most groundbreaking systems how the gamepad and 3d were chosen baffles me.

3D was obviously to jump on the 3D bandwagon and the controller was apparently something they've wanted to try for years. I'm curious as to where both the 3DS and Wii U successors go if they decide to not go with designs that force them to sacrifice specs.

 

[VinLAURiA]

Of all the things that could have been in the successors to the 2 of the most groundbreaking systems how the gamepad and 3d were chosen baffles me

It's rich that you @#$!ing gamers are now calling the Wii and DS "groundbreaking" when back in the day they were merely "gimmicks." This happens every generation, the previous Nintendo systems are vindicated by history and the current ones get spat on, and none of their systems ever get the respect they deserve while they're still in the limelight. Are we gonna have to wait until Gen9 before people start actually giving any sort of praise to the Wii U and 3DS now?

so that settles it, stop pretending the Wii U is part of "next gen"

No matter how much you numbskulls want to clap your hands over your hears, Wii U is Gen8 just as PS4 and 720 are. Get over it. Power doesn't define a generation.

 

[Cbajd5]

Yes because thats the only thing that Vita does right? It has no exclusive games its just a $250 second screen.

It sounds like you are angry and have a serious grudge against Nintendo and can't recognize a joke because of it.

Spoiler

I already have a Vita, don't ya know?

 

[Blood Diamonds]

I don't get it, how come Sony has no problem balancing First Party games, Strong hardware, and 3rd Party games while Nintendo has to go and use old hardware and no 3rd party support at all?
They should just drop the fucking "Not Competing" act anymore and release a console that is actually capable.

 

[Joe Molotov]

nes - young americans
gb/c - station to station
snes - low
n64 - "heroes"
gc - lodger
gba - scary monsters
ds - (and super creeps)
wii - let's dance
3ds - tonight
wii u - never let me down

Panic-Mode Nintendo - The Man Who Sold the World?

 

[BGBW]

If not a lot of people buy the console they won't have to worry about people feeling burned by it as long as they continue to support it themselves for 3-4 years.

His proposition was to abandon it and start again with a new machine (lets not even get into the whole R&D kerfuffle here). Considering a good chuck of current Wii U owner are likely to be core Nintendo fans it would be a terrible strategy to piss them off that badly. It's the one thing Nintendo has got going for it, a legion of fans who will continue to support them.

 

[NotLiquid]

I find it hilarious how some people find the idea of one console failure putting Nintendo into third-party status. They've got enough cash right now to have at least two failed consoles.

Indeed, at worst they'll repurpose themselves for handhelds exclusively since that is still proving mighty profitable for them. They've got too much of a domination in that market to let it go to waste, and while it may not end up doing DS numbers, their properties are pushing sales on the 3DS to some high extents in places like Japan. Lord knows how it'll be when Pokemon rolls around. The fact that it'll be the first worldwide release of a mainline Pokemon game implies they mean business with it.

 

[Aquamarine]

I find it hilarious how some people find the idea of one console failure putting Nintendo into third-party status. They've got enough cash right now to have at least two failed consoles.

At the very least, the 3DS ending up with 50+ million lifetime sales..........proves that we'll see at least one more handheld console from Nintendo.

 

[metalslimer]

No matter how much you numbskulls want to clap your hands over your hears, Wii U is Gen8 just as PS4 and 720 are. Get over it. Power doesn't define a generation.

Yep wiiu will be a gen 8 console just with no gen 8 support

 

[StevieP]

I don't get it, how come Sony has no problem balancing First Party games, Strong hardware, and 3rd Party games while Nintendo has to go and use old hardware and no 3rd party support at all?
They should just drop the fucking "Not Competing" act anymore and release a console that is actually capable.

Other revenue streams. If Sony were a gaming-only company, they wouldn't be looking to take a multi-hundred dollar bath on every console either.

Yep wiiu will be a gen 8 console just with no gen 8 support

That's more accurate

 

[Chie Satonaka]

I'm not surprised by his answer, but this guy has always been a tool in regards to Nintendo and Epic's support for them. I'm surprised by his mocking tone, though.

It's a shame this industry is so childish and unprofessional. Third parties won't be satisfied until Nintendo is doing exactly what Sony and Microsoft does, and at this point I still feel like they'd find an excuse not to port stuff over even if they released a comparable machine.

If this is Nintendo's last home console, so be it. I don't think they'll give up the handheld market, and if they don't do that, they also won't go third party.

 

[linkboy]

Indeed, at worst they'll repurpose themselves for handhelds exclusively since that is still proving mighty profitable for them. They've got too much of a domination in that market to let it go to waste, and while it may not end up doing DS numbers, their properties are pushing sales on the 3DS to some high extents in places like Japan. Lord knows how it'll be when Pokemon rolls around.

If anything, we'll see a reverse Wii U, they're not going to let that technology go to waste.

 

[KiNeSiS]

Accept it Luigi Hats, Wii U is the laughing stock of the industry. As long as you enjoy it thats all that matters.
I can imagine a room full of developers eating lunch, a random guy walks in & yells out Wii U & the room erupts in jovial laughter.

 

[Jomjom]

No matter how much you numbskulls want to clap your hands over your hears, Wii U is Gen8 just as PS4 and 720 are. Get over it. Power doesn't define a generation.

A console's release date also doesn't define a generation.

 

[Beer Monkey]

Realistically? Eight to ten major Nintendo games per year, for two, maybe three years, then nothing, and Nintendo will either go third party, or more likely, handheld only.

If that ever happened I'm pretty sure they would go third-party AND handheld.

Man, Super Mario 3D Land would make a great XBLA/PSN game. It would sell tons.

 

[Kimawolf]

it is a shame though that a industry such as this one still has strange power fantasies versus simply making money. Oh well we should visit this thread next year when the other two are out and see if these devs are still laughing. because I strongly believe the other two won't do any better.

People want something different. And no one is offering it. as we'll find out this November.

 

[EatinOlives]

No matter how much you numbskulls want to clap your hands over your hears, Wii U is Gen8 just as PS4 and 720 are. Get over it. Power doesn't define a generation.

All this "Bu- bu- bu- it's Gen 8!!" BS is meaningless considering that, in practical matters, the WiiU will miss out on most every significant Gen 8 experience, just like its predecessor missed out on the vast majority of the Gen 7 experience.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

Move Wind Waker to the bottom and we are in agreement. It's so overrated; the art style blinds all to its flaws.

Your list is interesting, though, because I usually see Wind Waker at either the top or the bottom, generally due to the different things people value in Zelda games. But you still put OoT and TP above WW which leads to me to believe that you value pacing, something that WW has a huge problem with.

For me it (usually) comes down to dungeons. Wind Waker had OK dungeons, and an OK overworld. It pretty much did most things acceptably. Skyward Sword and Majora's Mask had bigger issues that prevented me from enjoying them. Wind Waker had issues but I still enjoyed the game.

 

[metalslimer]

Accept it Luigi Hats, Wii U is the laughing stock of the industry. As long as you enjoy it thats all that matters.
I can imagine a room full of developers eating lunch, a random guy walks in & yells out Wii U & the room erupts in jovial laughter.

Comments like this dont promote healthy discussion

Wind Waker had OK dungeons

They were really pretty meh. Some of the worst in the series. I like WW for the story and charm, but the gameplay was subpar and shows signs of rushing.

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

It sounds like you are angry and have a serious grudge against Nintendo and can't recognize a joke because of it.

Spoiler

I already have a Vita, don't ya know?

I am sorry mate. I cannot tell the difference between jokes, sarcasm or real talk in this thread at all.

I do not have a grudge against Nintendo. They hold one of my if not my favourite gaming series of all: Smash.

 

[BrhysH]

A console's release date also doesn't define a generation.

It's the successor of the Wii, putting it as Nintendo's next generation offering like it or not its part of the 8th generation.

 

[AlexBasch]

I might buy a Wii U later down the road at a yard sale or whatever like a Virtual Boy out of pure curiosity.

I can't see it as anything else than one of the biggest bombs in gaming right now.

 

[CrazedProfessional]

I don't know which I find more funny, the Wii U's continued failure or Neogaf users literally wishing death upon one of the better industry players.

 

[tkscz]

oh, ok *continues playing scibblenauts unlimited*

 

[Jomjom]

It's the successor of the Wii, putting it as Nintendo's next generation offering like it or not its part of the 8th generation.

And obviously that's not what everyone is referring to when they say it's not 8th gen. So if Nintendo decided to release a new console every year, they would be on the 13th gen while Sony and MS are still 8th gen? Technically yes, but nobody is talking about "gen" in that way.

This is like how browsers are now. Just because Chrome is on version a billion and two doesn't mean it's generations ahead of Firefox and IE.

 

[VinLAURiA]

A console's release date also doesn't define a generation.

Tell that to Wikipedia. Generation isn't power or release date or sequence position. It's era. 2600 and 5200 were still both Gen2, so I don't wanna hear this "if Nintendo made five consoles they'd be on Gen13" excuse.

All this "Bu- bu- bu- it's Gen 8!!" BS is meaningless considering that, in practical matters, the WiiU will miss out on most every significant Gen 8 experience, just like its predecessor missed out on the vast majority of the Gen 7 experience.

Yeah, if you wanna just consider Gen7 the PS3 vs. 360 clone war and PSP making a fool of itself for the first five years of its life. Or are touch screens and motion controls not considered part of Gen7 because the "no cooties allowed" gamer club still doesn't want to admit they succeeded? Generation is era. The zeitgeist of the industry. Yet more triangles are no more valid an advancement than a touch screen.

Wii missed out on Borderlands and Killzone just as much as 360 and PS3 missed out on Bit.Trip and Super Mario Galaxy. One isn't more worthy than the other.

 

[LowEndTorque]

Oh man, heads must be rolling at Nintendo HQ right now. Gone from the king of the heap and the #1 selling console in the world last gen, to well on their way to Dreamcast status this gen.

The poor business strategy and specs/design choices behind the WiiU are really baffling. 1st party titles will not be enough to save this console.

 

[7threst]

it is a shame though that a industry such as this one still has strange power fantasies versus simply making money. Oh well we should visit this thread next year when the other two are out and see if these devs are still laughing. because I strongly believe the other two won't do any better.

People want something different. And no one is offering it. as we'll find out this November.

I hate to admit that this is what I'm afraid of too. PS4 and the next Xbox sometimes look like arrives consoles already but we haven't even seen these consoles yet, we haven't seen them perform, we know nothing about them.

Still, Nintendo is doomed... It's weird.

 

[AniHawk]

Panic-Mode Nintendo - The Man Who Sold the World?

i was just going in order. panic mode nintendo would be tin machine in this case.

 

[Aquamarine]

It's the successor of the Wii, putting it as Nintendo's next generation offering like it or not its part of the 8th generation.

The video game generation terminology was originally developed to compare competing consoles.

If the Wii U competes with the PS4 + Durango in the video game console sphere for sales, it's an 8th generation machine.

Nobody questions that.




HOWEVER, the descriptor "next-gen" is a spinoff of the traditional terminology by defining generations based off of relative equivalency in POWER.

It's a popular metric of comparison currently utilized by EA + Epic + others in the development side of the industry.

In that sense:

Dreamcast + GameCube + Xbox + PS2 + Wii = 6th gen
PS3 + 360 + Wii U = 7th gen
PS4 + Durango = 8th gen

 

[Kimawolf]

I hate to admit that this is what I'm afraid of too. PS4 and the next Xbox sometimes look like arrives consoles already but we haven't even seen these consoles yet, we haven't seen them perform, we know nothing about them.

Still, Nintendo is doomed... It's weird.

Well Nintendo is doomed because their philosophies doesn't compute with most Western developer philosophies. Nintendo wants to actually survive and not bankrupt themselves, western developers are more interested in simulating every strand of hair on a character's armpit.

 

[BGBW]

I honestly hoped the new gen would lead to people knowing what next gen is.

 

[Oblivion]

I don't get it, how come Sony has no problem balancing First Party games, Strong hardware, and 3rd Party games while Nintendo has to go and use old hardware and no 3rd party support at all?

It doesn't work that way. Sony, MS and Nintendo don't decide how much third parties support their systems.

 

[Jomjom]

The video game generation terminology was originally developed to compare competing consoles.

If the Wii U competes with the PS4 + Durango in the video game console sphere for sales, it's an 8th generation machine.

Nobody questions that.




HOWEVER, the terminology "next-gen" is a spinoff of the traditional terminology by defining generations based off of relative equivalency in POWER.

It's a popular metric of comparison currently utilized by EA + Epic + others in the industry.

In that sense:

Dreamcast + GameCube + Xbox + PS2 + Wii = 6th gen
PS3 + 360 + Wii U = 7th gen
PS4 + Durango = 8th gen

Could not have summarized it better.

 

[fluffydelusions]

So Wii U is the new gamecube in terms of 3rd party?

 

[metalslimer]

The video game generation terminology was originally developed to compare competing consoles.

If the Wii U competes with the PS4 + Durango in the video game console sphere for sales, it's an 8th generation machine.

Nobody questions that.




HOWEVER, the term "next-gen" is a spinoff of the traditional terminology by defining generations based off of relative equivalency in POWER.

It's a popular metric of comparison currently utilized by EA + Epic + others in the development side of the industry.

In that sense:

Dreamcast + GameCube + Xbox + PS2 + Wii = 6th gen
PS3 + 360 + Wii U = 7th gen
PS4 + Durango = 8th gen

Yep, such a dumb debate though as it changes NOTHING if it is or not.

 

[tkscz]

The video game generation terminology was originally developed to compare competing consoles.

If the Wii U competes with the PS4 + Durango in the video game console sphere for sales, it's an 8th generation machine.

Nobody questions that.




HOWEVER, the word "next-gen" is a spinoff of the traditional terminology by defining generations based off of relative equivalency in POWER.

It's a popular metric of comparison currently utilized by EA + Epic + others in the development side of the industry.

In that sense:

Dreamcast + GameCube + Xbox + PS2 + Wii = 6th gen
PS3 + 360 + Wii U = 7th gen
PS4 + Durango = 8th gen

i go by date and not power. i just wish people would stop trying to change my opinion

 

[Meelow]

The video game generation terminology was originally developed to compare competing consoles.

If the Wii U competes with the PS4 + Durango in the video game console sphere for sales, it's an 8th generation machine.

Nobody questions that.




HOWEVER, the word "next-gen" is a spinoff of the traditional terminology by defining generations based off of relative equivalency in POWER.

It's a popular metric of comparison currently utilized by EA + Epic + others in the development side of the industry.

In that sense:

Dreamcast + GameCube + Xbox + PS2 + Wii = 6th gen
PS3 + 360 + Wii U = 7th gen
PS4 + Durango = 8th gen

Expect that doesn't make much sense at all, PS4 and Xbox 720 aren't close to as powerful as a high end PC so that doesn't make sense, and having two systems in the same generations also don't make sense.

Dreamcast + PS2 + GameCube + Xbox = 6th Gen
Xbox 360 + PS3 + Wii = 7th Gen
Wii U + PS4 + Xbox 720 + (Steambox?) = 8th Gen

 

[DashReindeer]

I think that'd be cool, there's a lot of cool Nintendo style 'gimmicky' stuff coming in the near future in terms of wearable computers, virtual reality, arousal dependent dynamic controls of games. The kind of thing Nintendo will excel at. It's just if that'll be part of the Wii U, or Nintendo will drop it and move to something more radical.

The line between handheld and console is going to get very blurry, very soon. When I say handheld only, it's not really with the current implication that holds.

Yeah, I think you are spot on regarding this point. Supporting two distinct platforms like they have done in the past doesn't look like it will continue to work for Nintendo.

Development for an HD platform seems to be troublesome for them at this point, and I'm wondering why they thought they were prepared to release the Wii U when they did. Merging their two platforms into one that can actually be progressive in its design makes too much sense.