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[Cat Party]

That's what I and other thought when Diablo III was announced to do this: most of their games have been online centric and they even have WoW, so it must be rock solid, right? That was an erroneous assumption, and many of us didn't like it out of principle anyway. I expect similar can happen here, and even just staying at the same level means there's a good chance I'll be annoyed at random outages if they go all in and don't budge.

They've been building XBL for this for a long time. It is the backbone of everything they have been doing for a decade. If these rumors are true (sure sounds like they are to at least some significant degree), they aren't going to half ass it or be surprised at the load on their servers. XBL doesn't go down when the new COD launches, does it? I'm not defending always online, as I don't want it, don't like it, and I don't see the need for it, but I can't find it in myself to freak out over it.

Really, I want to see what advantages there may be. For example, if it means we get a break on the console price or content price, maybe it's worth it.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

Actually, I think it has more to do with corporate brainwashing than any kind of customer satisfaction. Most people buy the iPhone simply because it's the ZOMG iPhone. They have no idea what it is, what it does, or what their other options are, but Apple's marketing machine has convinced them that they want it, so they buy it. The same for the Xbox. It has dude, Halo bro! So people buy it in droves without thinking about anything else; then when it comes time to pay for Live Gold they do it because oh well, that's just how it works. Any failures alone the way they take in stride because you know, things break.

In other news: every popular thing is popular because its desired.

 

[artist]

...said the guy using a Sony bigwig's headshot as an avatar.

They're both banned. Besides, I'm mostly a PC Gamer and have preference for a certain philosophy.

Why dont you go ahead and accuse GAF of being ____land as well?

 

[Syriel]

Not just live? They 'brick' the console?

Oh yeah... Just speculating they might bet really heavy on that.

Still, that's the kind of corporate power that I don't feel comfortable with. Much like people losing access to Origin games if they get a forum ban.

Yes. If you buy a $99 Xbox 360 on the subscription plan, it has to connect (I believe it is once a month) in order to verify that the subscription fees are being paid.

If the fees are not being paid, or the console is kept offline for more than a month, the system will give the user an alert telling them they need to connect to Live or the console cannot be used.

It's been making the news rounds lately because of scam victims.

People will buy a new Xbox 360 on contract (MSRP $300) and pay the $99.

Then they'll post the "BRAND NEW" Xbox on CL for $200-$250.

Some sucker buys it and it works fine for a month. When month two shows up though, the buyer is screwed as the original seller has no intention of paying for the contract.

Can't blame Microsoft for that either, as it paid the store full retail for the system and it isn't getting paid back.

So is this a troll or not? Reading the other thread with all the tweets made it seem so but I am still not sure.

Orth and Manveer (friends in real life) were trolling each other on Twitter.

The fact that Kotaku considered it "news" is stupidly amusing in and of itself.

 

[vg260]

what's also funny is that the 360 right now is actually relatively friendly, as far as DRM goes. I just played a Games on Demand game off my hard drive for about 30 minutes just now, without being online (since it's technically authorized to the console as well as my account). And even if I wanted to play on a different machine, I could log into live from there and redownload and play (though I would have to be online there).

Then in the case of a broken system, I could do a license transfer (noted on GAF earlier) at least every 4 months to authorize the replacement system for offline play. Pop a hard drive into the new system, and I'm as good as new. Assuming I don't break systems every month or something, that seems relatively fair.

Going from that, to what's currently rumored would be an incredible step backwards.

Yeah. It's actually pretty reasonable right now. Going so extreme seems weird to me as well. If they kept as-is, I'd have no problem. If there was some way to ID a disc and tie it to your system like a Games on Demand game, it wouldn't be that bad as long as you didn't need a constant connection.

 

[Tom Penny]

This will have no impact. People with disposable money to buy these things have internet.

 

[Vane_MagicCity]

This will have no impact. People with disposable money to buy these things have internet.

..and that's all the matters? That people have internet?

You know what, the people who bought Sim City and Diablo III also had internet.

 

[GodofWine]

This will have no impact. People with disposable money to buy these things have internet.

I know 3 people who have an Xbox just to play forza offline and do not have it connected ever to the internet...they will be impacted

 

[Kusagari]

This will have no impact. People with disposable money to buy these things have internet.

Having Internet is not the problem. Having shitty unreliable Internet is.

 

[FieryBalrog]

hahahaha, this would be literally the stupidest move ever.

 

[Javier]

No way I'm buying if true. Why would anyone do this in the first place?

 

[The Albatross]

It's not even shitty, unreliable internet. I have great internet that I pay through the nose for.

Sometimes it doesn't work and sometimes my router gets stupid and sometimes one of my roommates unplugs shit while vaccuuming. I don't want something like simple gaming to be interupted by that if there is no tangible benefit to the consumer.

I'm all for always online stuff if there's a benefit to the consumer. I... just... don't see the benefit here. I see a change that potentially has a lot of problems and potential annoyances, and just no actual benefit from what we have now.

 

[seady]

This is no different than the original Xbox when it forced people to go broadband- when most people were still using dial-up.

Similar thing were forced on developers with achievement system to be required on all games.

I think it was a good thing to have some forced requirements on system, and will be a good thing for 720. The Wii social and online Ecosystem is very weak because there is nothing to standardize games. Nintendo improved a bit with the Wii U message board thingie though on all games.

 

[Thug Waffle]

..and that's all the matters? That people have internet?

You know what, the people who bought Sim City and Diablo III also had internet.

Fucking boom.

I have internet. Mine basically never craps out. Even so, this mechanic presents way too many problems.

 

[Visualante2]

This is no different than the original Xbox when it forced people to go broadband- when most people were still using dial-up.

Similar thing were forced on developers with achievement system to be required on all games.

I think it was a good thing to have some forced requirements on system, and will be a good thing for 720. The Wii social and online Ecosystem is very weak because there is nothing to standardize games. Nintendo improved a bit with the Wii U message board thingie though on all games.

Bad analogy bro. The original XBOX didn't force you to do shit to play single player games. Microsoft was undoubtedly forward thinking in including broadband connections in an era where it wasn't widespread but it is hard to see this working out for them. It's anti consumer.

 

[hobz360]

Damn MS, you starting to make me to not buy your next-gen console......

 

[DarkPanda]

..and that's all the matters? That people have internet?

You know what, the people who bought Sim City and Diablo III also had internet.

Diablo III has sold 12 million copies and Sim City is the most successful entry in the franchise. The average consumer doesn't care about always online; their thought process is: I want to play Halo/CoD/Maden -> these is a $x fee -> pay the fee -> play w/ my bros!

All they know is that this is what it takes to play with their bros, technology is weird, so they pay because they don't know better. Companies rely on ignorance and it works.

 

[Kusagari]

Diablo III has sold 12 million copies and Sim City is the most successful entry in the franchise. The average consumer doesn't care about always online; their thought process is: I want to play Halo/CoD/Maden -> these is a $x fee -> pay the fee -> play w/ my bros!

All they know is that this is what it takes to play with their bros, technology is weird, so they pay because they don't know better. Companies rely on ignorance and it works.

Comparing games to an always-online system is a fallacy.

Wait until those bros try to use their Durango to play DVDs offline and find out it doesn't work.

 

[Nafai1123]

It's not even shitty, unreliable internet. I have great internet that I pay through the nose for.

Sometimes it doesn't work and sometimes my router gets stupid and sometimes one of my roommates unplugs shit while vaccuuming. I don't want something like simple gaming to be interupted by that if there is no tangible benefit to the consumer.

I'm all for always online stuff if there's a benefit to the consumer. I... just... don't see the benefit here. I see a change that potentially has a lot of problems and potential annoyances, and just no actual benefit from what we have now.

This.

I work for an ISP, so I see how often people have to deal with stupid, random, weird internet issues. There are so many factors to actually having an internet connection. All it takes is one thing to go wrong and boom, I can't play games until I get it fixed? There is absolutely NO benefit to consumers implementing this type of system. You don't NEED internet to implement new features. Sharing/social doesn't need to be a requirement in order to reap the benefits. If you have internet, it's there...if you don't, it's not. It's not complicated to understand.

 

[Sponge]

aaaaaand you lost a customer, Microsoft!

 

[Glorified G]

I know 3 people who have an Xbox just to play forza offline and do not have it connected ever to the internet...they will be impacted

The question is why haven't they ever connected to the internet? Is it because they're not able to or simply they don't need to?

Will they go through the hassle to connect online to continue playing Forza? Will they won't bother and play Gran Turismo instead? Or find something else to do instead?

Next gen is going to be very interesting.

 

[outunderthestars]

aaaaaand you lost a customer, Microsoft!

This is how I feel at the moment as well.


Not everyone has access to the internet. I'll be working at a nature center this summer and the housing they provide has no internet access.

 

[Iced_Eagle]

Comparing games to an always-online system is a fallacy.

Wait until those bros try to use their Durango to play DVDs offline and find out it doesn't work.

The Kotaku article explicitly mentioned games.

I very much doubt that you will require a connection to play Blu-ray or DVD's.

We also don't know why MS would maybe think about requiring a connection to play games. With only half the story, it's easy to see why everyone is being so negative. Let's just wait until the actual announcement to see what their plan is.

 

[The Hermit]

damn!

 

[br0ken_shad0w]

Like I said in the other topic, my consoles will go wherever there's a TV and outlet. They aren't stay-at-home devices. If Microsoft wants it to be like that, they can fuck right off.

 

[Dave Meltzer]

..and that's all the matters? That people have internet?

You know what, the people who bought Sim City and Diablo III also had internet.

The problem with those games wasn't comparable to the situation where you need to be online to simply launch a game. Steam, Origin, most PC clients have been doing this for years without major problems. It is only a performance issue when the game requires a constant connection to a server for its gameplay.

 

[Kusagari]

The Kotaku article explicitly mentioned games.

I very much doubt that you will require a connection to play Blu-ray or DVD's.

We also don't know why MS would maybe think about requiring a connection to play games. With only half the story, it's easy to see why everyone is being so negative. Let's just wait until the actual announcement to see what their plan is.

It also says apps which could easily tie into playing DVDs or Blu-Rays.

 

[JuergenUF]

Is this really about having an internet connection and maintaining a connection to "the internet"? Or is this more about maintaining a connection to a specific server on Microsoft's network that may or may not be completely reliable? If this XBL connection goes down for any reason whatsoever, our games get shut down in 3 minutes. At least that's what I'm getting from this discussion. With current XBox360, we just get an informational popup that says we lost XBox Live and the game keeps going. This seems like a huge change, even for those with stable internet connections.

 

[Trey]

MS don't care.

 

[erawsd]

I know 3 people who have an Xbox just to play forza offline and do not have it connected ever to the internet...they will be impacted

Exactly. MS recently announced 76 million consoles sold and only 46 million Xbox Live users. So theres 30+million that have never gone online. Consider people that do go online but don't have stable connections and this is def a gamble for MS.

 

[Quadraphonic]

And what about years from now when you want to go back to play your old games? What's to say Microsoft keeps these servers up?

The original Xbox is fully offline now.

Every single game you buy on the next Xbox you are only renting until Microsoft sees fit to kill the the server.

 

[Stasis]

Crazy. I have a rock solid connection that has gone out maybe twice in the last year for all of 5-10 minutes, and this would still be enough to push me away if I wasn't already a MS hater. There WILL be problems. I don't care how well they plan for this, issues will pop up. I really don't want connection issues to prevent me from playing my console. It's irritating in MP games, infuriating in SP games and I don't even wanna imagine how I'd feel if it was just every single app/game on my console.

 

[outunderthestars]

And what about years from now when you want to go back to play your old games? What's to say Microsoft keeps these servers up?

The original Xbox is fully offline now.

Every single game you buy on the next Xbox you are only renting until Microsoft sees fit to kill the the server.

I hadn't even thought of that.

 

[Instro]

And what about years from now when you want to go back to play your old games? What's to say Microsoft keeps these servers up?

The original Xbox is fully offline now.

Every single game you buy on the next Xbox you are only renting until Microsoft sees fit to kill the the server.

It's ok friend, you can just rebuy them on the Xbox 1080's handy DD service.

 

[RoKKeR]

And what about years from now when you want to go back to play your old games? What's to say Microsoft keeps these servers up?

The original Xbox is fully offline now.

Every single game you buy on the next Xbox you are only renting until Microsoft sees fit to kill the the server.

I'm done, fuck.

 

[Freezie KO]

Every single game you buy on the next Xbox you are only renting until Microsoft sees fit to kill the the server.

Isn't this true with Steam? Gamers love Steam!

 

[Phire Phox]

And what about years from now when you want to go back to play your old games? What's to say Microsoft keeps these servers up?

The original Xbox is fully offline now.

Every single game you buy on the next Xbox you are only renting until Microsoft sees fit to kill the the server.

Maybe if they plan to kill the server, they'll release a patch for the system allowing you to play all your games offline.

 

[Thoraxes]

It's ok friend, you can just rebuy them on the Xbox 1080's handy DD service.

Lol, like they would give the consumer more value by actually giving you BC.

 

[Loofy]

Wouldnt an actual comparison be a vacuum cleaner that only works when it connected online?
And no communication when the internet is down is a very common complaint with VOIP. Its able to compete though because its cheaper than regular phone plans... omg.. perhaps thats MS' big strategy. Free Xbox 720s purchased on a 3 year Gold subscription!?!?!

 

[789shadow]

There's no way. There's no way they could be so phenomenally stupid.

 

[LowParry]

There's no way. There's no way they could be so phenomenally stupid.

Remember the "no rumble" days?

 

[outunderthestars]

Maybe if they plan to kill the server, they'll release a patch for the system allowing you to play all your games offline.

That is awesome. Can I get that patch on Day one, just in case?

 

[derder]

This would be ok if they used something similar to whispersync on kindles, like if the xbox had it's own internet connection verification over 3g or something.

Spoiler

that'll never happen

 

[SniperHunter]

RIP XBOX

Doubt the average consumer will care...this is not an issue imo

 

[TimeEffect]

Isn't this true with Steam? Gamers love Steam!

A lot easier when the games I buy on Steam are like $2.50

Sure, there are more expensive titles, but I can shop a lot more sensibly with Steam breathing down my neck.

Similar to PS+ in that I "rent" the content, but I pay such a low fee that I feel like I make the value back.

But when you buy physical copies of games, the concept of ownership is different.

 

[rrs]

Isn't this true with Steam? Gamers love Steam!

You get big discounts on games, and they said they would release something to play your games if it goes down. They also aren't as evil as Microsoft (yet) to boot.

 

[Phire Phox]

Can't wait to see the Nextbox Launch Thread, considering everyone on here isn't getting it apparently.

 

[Lion Heart]

No way MS goes through with this after the backlash. I really hope they do though because the lulz that will follow will be legendary.

 

[Quadraphonic]

Lol, like they would give the consumer more value by actually giving you BC.

That's what he said. REBUY on the Direct Download service...

 

[Instro]

Doubt the average consumer will care...this is not an issue imo

I feel like people underestimate the "average consumer". If it were that simple to fool people Windows 8 would be flying off the shelves. It's not easy to pull the wool over people's eyes when there are clear examples of something not working, and when there will be massive negative buzz from now until launch if this aspect does indeed turn out to be what everyone fears. More to the point, anyone buying the initial offering of a console is not an average consumer anyway.