Kotaku: Next Xbox will require online connection to start games

This would be ok if they used something similar to whispersync on kindles, like if the xbox had it's own internet connection verification over 3g or something.

that'll never happen

The problem with that is that I don't get good reception in doors in general. I imagine it would be even worse in an AV cabinet.
 
He and the Bioware employee were trolling each other apparently, but he pretty much confirmed the always-online detail.

The problem is his first 3-4 tweets weren't directed at the Bioware employee.
So that makes the "I'm just trolling friend" response questionable to people.
 
I feel like people underestimate the "average consumer". If it were that simple to fool people Windows 8 would be flying off the shelves. It's not easy to pull the wool over people's eyes when there are clear examples of something not working, and when there will be massive negative buzz from now until launch if this aspect does indeed turn out to be what everyone fears. More to the point, anyone buying the initial offering of a console is not an average consumer anyway.

The latest SimCity is the most successful launch of the franchise. XBox Live Gold is a huge success, despite free online play on competing consoles. I agree the move is anti-consumer and benefits only Microsoft and its partners, but I don't think it'll deter anyone from buying the console. I'm someone who does think it's anti-consumer, and it wouldn't even deter me if I was going to buy a Durango anyway (I'm not).
 
The problem is his first 3-4 tweets weren't directed at the Bioware employee.
So that makes the "I'm just trolling friend" response questionable to people.

I suspect that before that he was just expressing his opinion and not defending an online-only Durango, as I still doubt that such a machine is going to ship.
 
I suspect that before that he was just expressing his opinion and not defending an online-only Durango, as I still doubt that such a machine is going to ship.

That's fine. MS can easily flip a decision like this at anytime.

However, that is still some pretty anti-consumer opinions to have.
Given the "sensitivity" of the topic, he really should have the common sense to not make it a public tweet (I mean, who was he trying to target anyway?)
 
This will have no impact. People with disposable money to buy these things have internet.

I have no reliable internet at the oil rig where I live and work 3/4ths of the month. Too bad for Microsoft because, again, working at an oil rig I have shitloads of disposable income and nothing to spend it on but their competitors' video games.
 
The problem is his first 3-4 tweets weren't directed at the Bioware employee.
So that makes the "I'm just trolling friend" response questionable to people.

Not to mention they were clearly arguing. There's no way to read those Tweets as a back and forth joke.
 
The latest SimCity is the most successful launch of the franchise. XBox Live Gold is a huge success, despite free online play on competing consoles. I agree the move is anti-consumer and benefits only Microsoft and its partners, but I don't think it'll deter anyone from buying the console. I'm someone who does think it's anti-consumer, and it wouldn't even deter me if I was going to buy a Durango anyway (I'm not).

I see people mention this a lot, but just because something sold quickly initially doesn't mean it continued to do well. See Skyward Sword for example, fastest selling Zelda of all time, but does that mean it will actually outsell all previous Zelda's? Unlikely.

We have no information on its sales post-fiasco, and most were unaware of what was going on with the game until they purchased it. On top of that many promises were made about its online systems that were untrue. In the face of that Microsoft has a bigger hill to climb to convince people on this issue. This is a much more expensive purchase than a $60 game after all. With regards to LIVE, Microsoft marketed and offered a service that people felt was worth paying for, I don't think that is a good comparison to what is being presented here.

I'm sure there is evidence to support both sides of this argument, but I'm always hesitant to just assume people are dumb and will buy things without any research at all. It would be hard to ignore if the Amazon page has a low score and tons of bad reviews that's for sure.
 
Comparing Sim City to Console wars is like comparing Apples to Oranges

Xbox vs PS is Apples to Apples

Sim City really had no competition when it was released, was long overdue, and the original Sim gamers were hungry for a sequel.

Same for Diablo 3.

Their was no alternative. Sure Diablo 3 had Torchlight, but people were done with Torchlight and Torchlight 2 was delayed way after Diablo 3. If you like that type of game their was no alternative at that time.

Meanwhile, PS4 will always be an alternative to the 720.
 
With regards to LIVE, Microsoft marketed and offered a service that people felt was worth paying for, I don't think that is a good comparison to what is being presented here.

I don't understand where what you said is different from what's happening here? Not attacking, I honestly don't see the difference. This experiment is essentially just a bigger version of XBL. Microsoft is marketing and offering a service (the ability to play games), and people will decide if it's worth paying for.

It's changing the established model of how games are sold, sure. But if people are willing to pay for Durango or XBL, despite more pro-consumer options, then they just prioritize the things offered by Durango (Halo 6) or XBL (stable online multiplayer with big communities) over the other options. Time will tell.
 
Over the course of this generation the idea of what it means to buy a game has shifted. Rather than being one of ownership it's now more like buying a licence or subscription. I've supported it mainly because there have been some really good deals, steam mainly and some quality software, but this always on feature feels like they are overstepping the line. As far as I know the law supports the idea that you don't own the software, but there are a lot of douche bag things the law says and just because it says so doesn't mean you need to follow it. As a consumer it feels very distrustful and even disrespectful. The major motivation for doing always online is because of piracy, they'll say otherwise. And convincing consumers otherwise will be tough because word of mouth will reflect that distrust.
 
I feel like people underestimate the "average consumer". If it were that simple to fool people Windows 8 would be flying off the shelves. It's not easy to pull the wool over people's eyes when there are clear examples of something not working, and when there will be massive negative buzz from now until launch if this aspect does indeed turn out to be what everyone fears. More to the point, anyone buying the initial offering of a console is not an average consumer anyway.


New PC sales does not necessarily equal Windows 8 sales. Microsoft sold 60 million W8 licenses in two months which clearly indicates more people simply chose to take advantage of the $40 price and upgrade their current PC instead of buying a new one.
 
If I was a 3rd party developer, I'd be extremely worried about selling enough units to make any money on next gen machines. I mean, they barely reach break even on PC/360/PS3 as it is. Slow uptake will kill big game budgets, and shift a lot of projects down to WiiU/360/PS3.
 
I wonder where these rumors are originating because it seems like much has been assumed due to a lack of communication by M$'s part. I guess M$ feels very certain and unconcerned with overall stance of their new system, likely they are soaking up as much of this free PR because at the end of the day people are feverishly talking about M$ which is building intrigue for the product reveal. Something I foresee being delayed gratification on a large scale because all they have to do is denounce the rumors at their conference and have the IPs to support the hypetrain (be it negative or positive) that is the new system unveiling.
 
I wonder where these rumors are originating because it seems like much has been assumed due to a lack of communication by M$'s part. I guess M$ feels very certain and unconcerned with overall stance of their new system, likely they are soaking up as much of this free PR because at the end of the day people are feverishly talking about M$ which is building intrigue for the product reveal. Something I foresee being delayed gratification on a large scale because all they have to do is denounce the rumors at their conference and have the IPs to support the hypetrain (be it negative or positive) that is the new system unveiling.

Please stop doing the dollar sign thing. Please.
 
I wonder where these rumors are originating because it seems like much has been assumed due to a lack of communication by M$'s part. I guess M$ feels very certain and unconcerned with overall stance of their new system, likely they are soaking up as much of this free PR because at the end of the day people are feverishly talking about M$ which is building intrigue for the product reveal. Something I foresee being delayed gratification on a large scale because all they have to do is denounce the rumors at their conference and have the IPs to support the hypetrain (be it negative or positive) that is the new system unveiling.

Here's the problem though. A common defense of these practices is that they are only noticed by forum nerds and that the general population doesn't care. There's no way Microsoft cares enough about the minute of forum buzz or is smart enough to be orchestrating this.

Historically they've leaked like a sieve anyway.
 
The latest SimCity is the most successful launch of the franchise. XBox Live Gold is a huge success, despite free online play on competing consoles. I agree the move is anti-consumer and benefits only Microsoft and its partners, but I don't think it'll deter anyone from buying the console. I'm someone who does think it's anti-consumer, and it wouldn't even deter me if I was going to buy a Durango anyway (I'm not).

Sim City is a bad example. Game is front loaded like a blockbuster sequel which has horrible world of mouth. Great opening weekend but no legs.
 
Please stop doing the dollar sign thing. Please.

Every time I see someone do that I think of this PA comic :P

215178115_ExTPi-L-2.jpg
 
I wonder where these rumors are originating because it seems like much has been assumed due to a lack of communication by M$'s part. I guess M$ feels very certain and unconcerned with overall stance of their new system, likely they are soaking up as much of this free PR because at the end of the day people are feverishly talking about M$ which is building intrigue for the product reveal. Something I foresee being delayed gratification on a large scale because all they have to do is denounce the rumors at their conference and have the IPs to support the hypetrain (be it negative or positive) that is the new system unveiling.

Nintendo felt pretty compelled that their WiiU would sell without any real support as well. Corporations not being publicly fazed about something that is happening or obvious to happen isn't something noteworthy, it's standard.

Just look at Sony and the PS3 launch.
 
Exactly. MS recently announced 76 million consoles sold and only 46 million Xbox Live users. So theres 30+million that have never gone online. Consider people that do go online but don't have stable connections and this is def a gamble for MS.

Do people really believe that the announced sold figures is exactly the userbase out there?

Seriously?

I own 5 360s and 3 PS3s. The userbase of the PS3 and 360 is far smaller than the announced figures.

I'd argue the Wii would be one of the only consoles since the SNES and Megadrive where the sold numbers get close to being the actual userbase numbers.
 
Holy crap, this is Microsoft's creative director? For real!? Also, the fuck is up with comparing phones, a device that is a utility used to communicate with other people and from the very beginning always had to be "online" since its creation to an entertainment media device such as a gaming console that can be used for single player?

Phones are a service. Consoles and media devices are a product with optional services.

But I guess there's some people out there who want everything to become a service. So might as well require online connectivity with every Blu-ray, DVD and CD player.

Oh and regarding that "director's" analogies, you get shitty phone service, guess what? You'll change to another service!

if he is a MS employee he is soooooooo fired
 
And what about years from now when you want to go back to play your old games? What's to say Microsoft keeps these servers up?

The original Xbox is fully offline now.

Every single game you buy on the next Xbox you are only renting until Microsoft sees fit to kill the the server.
#deal_with_it_obama
 
Wait, so...if I disconnect my PS3 from the net after buying my PS4, and my Plus lapses, doesn't that mean I could still play my free games?

That doesn't sound right.

any free PSN+ game will stop working as soon as your PSN+ subscription runs out


I love your drivebys but yeah, if you call possibly losing more than a third of your customers no impact then I don't know what to tell you.

make that two thirds of your customers, I highly doubt that all that currently own 360 and is paying for live will buy a console that requires online to work
 
I'm not 100% opposed to an always online console but three minutes is far too short, my connection goes down for a couple of minutes probably close to daily.

I'm not 100% opposed to it. Possibly require internet connection to validate a disc so it can be installed and run from the HDD, but thats it - I should never need an internet connection after that, or the disc in the drive.

worst case they could just ping the server one a day or once a week to check my keys/licenses. But 3 minutes? thats insane. They'll backpedal on that surely.
 
If I was a 3rd party developer, I'd be extremely worried about selling enough units to make any money on next gen machines. I mean, they barely reach break even on PC/360/PS3 as it is. Slow uptake will kill big game budgets, and shift a lot of projects down to WiiU/360/PS3.

but always online is promising 3rd parties hugely more engaged consumers and significantly increased ARPU. At least I'm assuming that's the kind of bullshit MS will be telling them.

Exactly. MS recently announced 76 million consoles sold and only 46 million Xbox Live users. So theres 30+million that have never gone online. Consider people that do go online but don't have stable connections and this is def a gamble for MS.


If this is true, my guess would be MS have stats showing non-connected users have a lower tie ratio and so are less valuable. And presumably they expect that online proportion to grow - partly through increased internet penetration, partly through 'encouraging' people to be connected. The rest of the cheapskates can go jump in a lake. Or buy a PS4
 
http://www.engadget.com/2007/12/22/xbox-live-suffering-from-major-outage-on-christmas-weekend-ouc/

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110506211919AALbL37

http://www.egmnow.com/articles/news/xbox-live-down-service-alert-issued/

http://kotaku.com/5839687/xboxcom-down-and-out

funny comment on last link....

I'm sure by tomorrow XBL will be back up, though I do understand the current unrest. Ever since the PSN outage I think all gamers are on edge when the service goes down. I guess I'll just play Skyrim or Arkham City. Something that's singleplayer while I wait. 12/24/11 3:40pm
 
Isn't this true with Steam? Gamers love Steam!
Gamers love Steam because of the sales. That's the reason people always ask for Steam versions on every thread: because if it's on Steam it's sure to be sold by under $10 under an year after release, even if just by one day.

$10 is a fine price for a rental, $60 is not.
 
Looking past the DRM and used game sales stuff, which are both definitely considerations, I think an always-online/always-on functionality could be a nice trojan horse to shoe in interesting features, the same way the 360 required games to have achievements.

IF the Nextbox can establish dominance next-gen, and IF they can convince developers to make good use of always-online features and Kinect, Sony could be at a disadvantage when it comes to multi-platform games.
 
Looking past the DRM and used game sales stuff, which are both definitely considerations, I think an always-online/always-on functionality could be a nice trojan horse to shoe in interesting features, the same way the 360 required games to have achievements.

IF the Nextbox can establish dominance next-gen, and IF they can convince developers to make good use of always-online features and Kinect, Sony could be at a disadvantage when it comes to multi-platform games.

what kind of interesting features? Those interesting features can be there if you have an internet connection, just don't have them if you don't.
 
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Tom Warren is from The Verge

€:
https://twitter.com/tomwarren/status/319968029792407552

I missed one tweet in my montage

I don't understand this?

I would think the people who are being told about this are tech savvy enough to understand which product is being talked about. It even mentions that always online was being talked about as a part of the new Xbox a couple of weeks ago, wouldn't that be GDC? Games developers will know the difference between the products.
 
I wonder where these rumors are originating because it seems like much has been assumed due to a lack of communication by M$'s part. I guess M$ feels very certain and unconcerned with overall stance of their new system, likely they are soaking up as much of this free PR because at the end of the day people are feverishly talking about M$ which is building intrigue for the product reveal. Something I foresee being delayed gratification on a large scale because all they have to do is denounce the rumors at their conference and have the IPs to support the hypetrain (be it negative or positive) that is the new system unveiling.

No doubt about it. It's free press. People can pretend inside a forum this is going to hurt the brand, hurt potential console sales, hurt *insert latest can hyperbole*, but it's meaningless in the overall scheme of things.

Every mainstream PS4 announcement meantions the Nextbox. This latest situation just highlights how all of us on this forum scrutinize every tweet. Even job listings have been scraped for nuggets of info.

This all adds up to the nuclear explosion that will be for the MS reveal. Lol. That was also hyperbole. We on The Internet forums will be in DEFCON 4, the rest of the world will simply hear about this ala Apple announcements.
 
No doubt about it. It's free press. People can pretend inside a forum this is going to hurt the brand, hurt potential console sales, hurt *insert latest can hyperbole*, but it's meaningless in the overall scheme of things.

Every mainstream PS4 announcement meantions the Nextbox. This latest situation just highlights how all of us on this forum scrutinize every tweet. Even job listings have been scraped for nuggets of info.

This all adds up to the nuclear explosion that will be for the MS reveal. Lol. That was also hyperbole. We on The Internet forums will be in DEFCON 4, the rest of the world will simply hear about this ala Apple announcements.

Oh my, this is clearly going to have a negative impact on the next xbox even if you spin it as being insignificant. The fact that 30-40% of Xbox users are not online only emphasises the importance of this topic.

Your second paragraph is laughable. The PS4 and the 720 are two next gen consoles the gaming industry eagerly awaits. They are also two direct competitors. Of course comparisons are going to be brought up. If the cases were switched and the 720 was already announced people would be doing the same for the PS4. People want both companies to reveal their info so they can make a decision.

I hope you weren't seriously comparing the 720 announcement to an Apple announcement.
 
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