No, he had his hand on his pistol while still in the holster -- but it was in the ready position.
-
Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!
Verdict reached in George Zimmerman case - Not Guilty
- Thread starter Zep
- Start date
- Status
No, he had his hand on his pistol while still in the holster -- but it was in the ready position.
RangersFan
Member
Just curious if anyone else here has served jury duty on a murder trial? I have and the set of instructions the judge reads you before deliberations is VERY SPECIFIC. The judge will read the set of rules the jurors must deliberate on whether the case the state presented met the criteria for the charge the defendant stands for.
Again there is a very specific criteria that must be met for the juror to render a Guilty verdict. The reading of the rules is very long, in the case I was a juror on the Judge read for almost an hour and 20 minutes straight before we were dismissed.
I would imagine the language of the rules for finding a defendant Guilty of second degree murder would prohibit ANY jury from convicting Zimmerman. The verdict of NOT GUILTY of second degree murder was correct.
The State might have had a better case against Zimmerman on lesser charges. The case I served on was in NY, and I don't know how the rules are set in Florida, by I can't imagine it's much different. The case I served on was a slam dunk case (google Peter Troy), yet the ADA had to present an IRONCLAD case as the burden of proof is on the State. Going into GREAT GREAT DETAIL, of every fabric of evidence and every second during the crime. Legal dramas seriously warp people's perceptions of what a trial is really like. It was very fascinating, yet tedious at the same time because they have to go into every single thing in detail.
The prosecution obviously could not present an ironclad case t hat could prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman murdered TM. They evidence seemed to side with GZ's account of self defense, regardless that he was a moron to follow TM after told not to.
Again there is a very specific criteria that must be met for the juror to render a Guilty verdict. The reading of the rules is very long, in the case I was a juror on the Judge read for almost an hour and 20 minutes straight before we were dismissed.
I would imagine the language of the rules for finding a defendant Guilty of second degree murder would prohibit ANY jury from convicting Zimmerman. The verdict of NOT GUILTY of second degree murder was correct.
The State might have had a better case against Zimmerman on lesser charges. The case I served on was in NY, and I don't know how the rules are set in Florida, by I can't imagine it's much different. The case I served on was a slam dunk case (google Peter Troy), yet the ADA had to present an IRONCLAD case as the burden of proof is on the State. Going into GREAT GREAT DETAIL, of every fabric of evidence and every second during the crime. Legal dramas seriously warp people's perceptions of what a trial is really like. It was very fascinating, yet tedious at the same time because they have to go into every single thing in detail.
The prosecution obviously could not present an ironclad case t hat could prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman murdered TM. They evidence seemed to side with GZ's account of self defense, regardless that he was a moron to follow TM after told not to.
Ugh.
people suck
No one's debating whether Zimmerman killed an unarmed teenager. The question is, was it justified? It's certainly unlikely, but it is possible. A 17 year old is not a child, and many 17 year olds have adequate size and strength to seriously injure a full grown man.
Many people in this thread are talking big, but they weren't on the jury. Given that there is a possibility that the killing was in self-defense, would your conscience be clean sending a potentially innocent man to jail, based on a racial narrative that is mostly derived from conjecture?
Anyway, nobody here knows what really happened, but it seems that many people have a hard time accepting that. They want a definitive conclusion to this "story", preferably the one that they've already concocted based on their own biases. Sorry, real life is never that cut and dry.
Many people in this thread are talking big, but they weren't on the jury. Given that there is a possibility that the killing was in self-defense, would your conscience be clean sending a potentially innocent man to jail, based on a racial narrative that is mostly derived from conjecture?
Anyway, nobody here knows what really happened, but it seems that many people have a hard time accepting that. They want a definitive conclusion to this "story", preferably the one that they've already concocted based on their own biases. Sorry, real life is never that cut and dry.
toastyToast
Member
Can someone explain to me how Zimmerman can assert self defense? There weren't any witnesses and he was the one approached TM in the first place
Aquamarine
Member
Oh god. Where is this happening, again?
LyleLanley
Banned
According to people on Twitter that's a video from the Vancouver riot after the 2011 Stanley Cup.
Alligatorjandro
Banned
Its all a part of Gods Plan.
But he didn't pull out a knife. That's a fucking cop-out and a slippery slope. Some guy pushes me really hard and I think to myself he's dead set on killing me, so I shoot him before he has the chance. Some guy starts mean-mugging me and I fear for my life so I shoot him...Etc.
Carnby
Member
Good point. What is that?
No I was trying to bring you back so we could have some rational argument. I couldn't do that until I debunked your misleading example.
But to answer your question.
I answered part of it when responding to Devolution; but, again. The world is a bigger place than some tragedy between two individuals in some Floridian backwater. So I haven't spent the last few weeks glued to the trial. But I'm sure that the defense did not open the trial by declaring Zimmerman profiled Martin just because he was black. And I'm sure Zimmerman didn't suddenly stand up during the trial and go on about how he hates black people and that was why he followed Martin that night. I'm also pretty sure, there is no evidence Zimmerman spent his weekends in the middle of a swamp standing around a burning cross; or otherwise spent his time planning on how he was going to use the stand your ground law to 'thin the herd'.
I'm pretty sure any evidence that some members of GAF and America hold that he was racially profiling is little more than ambiguity about the situation. And third parties determined to spread insinuations preying on the suspicions of minorities to further their own cause by any means.
Maybe Zimmerman really did spend his free time masturbating to Guns n Ammo in his own filth and thinking about how much he just hated black people. And that night, was an opportunity for him to 'get one of them'. Unless we find some diary or Zimmerman decides to write his biography well never be sure how much being black motivated Zimmerman to follow Martin.
All that we know and what we can prove, is that Zimmerman wanted to be a law enforcement official but was denied due to his credit history. What we know is he placated his desires with a volunteer nightwatch position. And that on that night, against the recommendation of actual law enforcement, Zimmerman decided to get out of his car and follow Martin.
It depends. Some guy shoves you and you start curb stomping him? Yeah he can kill you and claim self defense. Even if he "started" the fight, you took it to another level.
If zimmermans story is true, this is pretty much what happened. He (wrongfully) pursued and attempted to detain a man, got into a verbal confrontation that turned physical, started to get worked over and was scared for his life so he shot and killed the guy.
I'm just saying, this Internet bravado "should fight like a man and not be a pussy" shit is not how the real world works. Maybe you all are in some bad ass fight clubs you can't talk about, but I am not going to count on anyone IRL "fighting fair". You have to assume the worst, if someone is bouncing my head off the concrete they are going to die (if at all possible), I don't give a shit what led up to that situation I'm not about to take some lumps and walk it off.
comedy bomb
Banned
Ugh.
Zimmerman was protecting none of those things. Dumb hick.
And get rid of texas while you're at it america !
Hearing that a civil suit will hopefully end in favour of Martins' family is good news but still, Zimmerman should be roasting in an electric chair for this. I'm sorry, but you shouldn't be able to claim self defense against someone who isn't doing anything. Especially not lethal self defense.
Syph Medwes
Member
today was a good day
Apeopleman
Member
You won't find racist and/or crazy people in other countries?
lol
Gotta love the Internet-age during these controversial times. Misinformation at the speed of light, FTW
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Are you suggesting people are going back in time to riot in Vancouver over this?
That's because it's not Miami.
Every single place I've seen a riot rumor for on Twitter, I checked the local stations' tweets..
Nobody is fucking rioting.
Krappadizzle
Member
I guess neither one of us is in a position to guess his state of mind during fight. What could be interpreted by you and I as shit, I'm losing how do I fight back fairly he, he interpreted as I'm gonna die. It's not for us to say either way. I've been in a few bad scuffles and I've definitely lost more than I've won, but only once have I felt that I was gonna die. Pictures of him after the fight are not an indicator of how he "should" have felt during the fight, we just can't determine that.
for you?
defending yourself from an ass beating that you deserve by escalating matters sets a shitty precedent.
Really?
im not
Look, you fucking dummy, somebody's child was taken from them for the most unnecessary reason imaginable. This guy gets to walk. He gets to go back to... being alive, and being with his family, even if he's going to have to live it looking over his shoulder. At least he gets that. The jury judged in his favor. At least he gets his justice.
Trayvon doesn't get any justice. His family doesn't get any justice. Their son's killer said he fucking did it, and anybody that's been following the case since last year knows that he should have listened to the damn cops when they said for Zimmerman not to follow Trayvon. I've heard the recordings. If you have a functioning brain, you can manage to grab those facts for yourself too, and you can also manage to put two and two together.
You're so caught up in the law being the law that you can't open your eyes wide enough to see why anybody could possibly want to shove their foot into Zimmerman and co's urethras out of anger and frustration. This was all so unnecessary. Trayvon didn't have to fucking die.
My mind is severely boggled by your sheer incompetence. I'm astonished that you, with your minimal brain power, managed to even compile those words to form those sentences. Your IQ has to suffer strongly in some capacity for you to make the leap that anything about this is worse than the inarguable fact that SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD TRAYVON MARTIN IS DEAD.
You're stupid. So fucking stupid. Like, it makes me sad to know that your fingers allow you to espouse such tripe. I am devastated by this.
ill take my punishment now
Gentleman Jack
Member
That. Is. Vancouver.
You might find a lot less of them in power and a lot less laws benefiting them elsewhere though.
MWS Natural
Member
First time I laughed while reading this thread, thanks.
Mister Negative
Member
I'm not even FROM Vancouver and I can tell you right now that shot is from the Vancouver riots, I remember that white building with the lights on it pretty well from the coverage. That's where that guy tried to jump over the burning car.
It's unfortunate that we can't get Trayvon's side of the story. Our justice system isn't perfect, but I'm glad it holds a high standard of evidence to convict someone and throw them in prison. Putting the burden of proof on a defendant against all the resources of the state is just going to get innocent people sent away.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
Well, scope that one out for us and report back when you find you are wrong.
so you're gonna move away to a crazy fantasy land where people aren't shit?
take me with you
The prosecution would offer him the best deal he/she could get. Confess and we will only charge you with first degree murder, and drop the weapons charge (if any).
That person would be wise to take the deal.
Aquamarine
Member
Tensions are running high in this thread. :-(
Read some Orwell kid.
My mom was taken from me by a drunk driver when I was a child. I've had loved ones die so dont come at me w/ the emotional aspect of it all.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
Fist fights in high school were like that. Fist fights as adults or as an adult is much different. You want out of that situation as fast as possible.
So many video's I've seen recently with potential racist or idiot author's these days have comments requiring approval. I think that's why these kinds of vids have an influx of racism compared to the norm. Someone should just re-upload the vid immediately to not let such assholes get the views and allow them to build up only one side of the argument.
What the fuck is this shit
Smh
EmCeeGramr
Member
my eyes just rolled out of my skull and into orbit
Angelus Errare
Banned
Not if you're black.
Carnby
Member
You've gone too far.
MorisUkunRasik
Member
And get rid of texas while you're at it america !
Hearing that a civil suit will hopefully end in favour of Martins' family is good news but still, Zimmerman should be roasting in an electric chair for this. I'm sorry, but you shouldn't be able to claim self defense against someone who isn't doing anything. Especially not lethal self defense.
- Status