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[Deleted member 47027]

Im sure Circuit City and Enron put a great deal of importance on their employee looks.

Spoiler

it fits

 

[BronsonLee]

Im sure Circuit City and Enron put a great deal of importance on their employee looks.

Well, 1 requires you to wear a uniform when you work there and the other is a business office which likely had a formal dress code, so...

Also

Spoiler

it's the WWE

 

[davepoobond]

Im sure Circuit City and Enron put a great deal of importance on their employee looks.

i'm curious to know where you work where they dont care about looks and whether it is an environment where they typically expect you to look good.




is Sunflower HHH and he's trying to promote The Great Khali into a social media position?

 

[zma1013]

Seems like you're only hurting yourself by not promoting an employee who can do good work. Unless you have someone else to take his place who can both do the work and cut his beard correctly, what are you going to do? Is shaving his beard going to make your company more money?

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

You work for a shit company if they value looks over work quality

I was 18 once too.

 

[Goldrusher]

Don't talk to him, talk to the guys above you. Convince them the guy is great and that it shouldn't matter that he has a beard.

Having said that, maybe he doesn't even want a promotion to a job that involves "being seen by a lot more people".

 

[KibblesBits]

Maybe... maybe he IS really smart and doesn't want the promotion.

/ShamalayanTwist

 

[davepoobond]

Seems like you're only hurting yourself by not promoting an employee who can do good work. Unless you have someone else to take his place who can both do the work and cut his beard correctly, what are you going to do? Is shaving his beard going to make your company more money?

not shaving could lose the business money.

 

[Draft]

I once was told by my boss that my beard looked unprofessional and that it needed to be gone before a presenation the following week. God I was fucking heated. In hindsight, the beard did look like shit. Still. I'm a grown ass man. But I had to get that paper.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Seems like you're only hurting yourself by not promoting an employee who can do good work. Unless you have someone else to take his place who can both do the work and cut his beard correctly, what are you going to do? Is shaving his beard going to make your company more money?

Potentially, yes. If he doesn't, we could stand to lose a lot of mindshare as people will avoid seeing someone in his position that looks all scraggly and scruffy. It's important to project an aura of success, so to speak - to feel like our people are not just one of the crowd. We need to appear successful even if we're not. Looks are very important as clients want to be a part of something that looks rich and successful. It only does good to clean up, no harm.

 

[zma1013]

You work for a shit company if they value looks over work quality

Even a modeling agency?

 

[jamesinclair]

I was 18 once too.

Junior, Im probably older than you are.

Ever been in a federal office? Its all short and sandals.

Even a modeling agency?

The back office?

 

[XenoRaven]

Have there been other people who have not necessarily fit your mold in terms of personal appearance found success in your company? Maybe he is drawing inspiration from those people.

 

[zma1013]

Potentially, yes. If he doesn't, we could stand to lose a lot of mindshare as people will avoid seeing someone in his position that looks all scraggly and scruffy. It's important to project an aura of success, so to speak - to feel like our people are not just one of the crowd. We need to appear successful even if we're not. Looks are very important as clients want to be a part of something that looks rich and successful. It only does good to clean up, no harm.

Then you have your answer.

 

[KibblesBits]

Or maybe as I said... he doesn't want the promotion, is fine with where he's at and enjoys looking how he does?

 

[zma1013]

The back office?

I was meaning the models, but really it was all in jest.

 

[.GqueB.]

I'm the opposite of that. All presentation, no potential.

You'd be surprised how far that gets you. Sometimes looking the part is more important than playing the part. That is until you're found out. But by that time it's often too late.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Have there been other people who have not necessarily fit your mold in terms of personal appearance found success in your company? Maybe he is drawing inspiration from those people.

Not currently there isn't. Our upper levels are all squeaky clean guys. They all fit a certain mold. He would be the odd man out.

 

[BolognaSoup]

Wow. Thanks for the reminder on why I ran the hell out of corporate America as fast as possible. Hopefully this dude catches wind of this "predicament" and does so as well.

 

[Rad-]

I'm probably like this. I mean I'm a decent looking guy but I can't be bothered to dress that well for work. I've gotten few hints from my boss about it lol.

But I won't change it because in my current line of work I have to get my hands dirty every now and then and there's no way I would dirty my better / more formal looking clothes.

 

[BronsonLee]

Ever been in a federal office? Its all short and sandals.

Many times! Byproduct of work. And ya, no

Have there been other people who have not necessarily fit your mold in terms of personal appearance found success in your company? Maybe he is drawing inspiration from those people.

... I hate you so much right now

 

[dark_chris]

Just give it one more try. It doesn't hurt right? Just sit him down, be direct and talk to him. Let him know about what's going on and what you want to do. Give him that chance and you never know, maybe he will turn around and do just that.

In my job, no one cares how you look, someone even comes to work in pjs.

 

[Calamari41]

Potentially, yes. If he doesn't, we could stand to lose a lot of mindshare as people will avoid seeing someone in his position that looks all scraggly and scruffy. It's important to project an aura of success, so to speak - to feel like our people are not just one of the crowd. We need to appear successful even if we're not. Looks are very important as clients want to be a part of something that looks rich and successful. It only does good to clean up, no harm.

This is all that needs to be said. People, there's a reason lawyers wear expensive suits and drive expensive cars, and it's not because they're vain.

 

[Pagusas]

Weird hearing all the negative around here about wanting someone to look good for a meeting. Yes you may think your scruffy wiry beard looks cool, but many clients will not and will make judgments about the quality and professionalism of your company based off face to face meetings. A client is not going to want to spend $50k on a project with me if I look scruffy and flaky. Its part of business and makes perfect sense that someone needs to fulfill both the skill and presentation area for a company if they intend to make it far (in an area that deals with client interaction).

Saying "its his face he can do what he wants with it" is fine, but its also the companies money and clients, and they can send who they want and feel best represents them. If you look scruffy why should the company promote you to a position that could have client interaction? Your skill is useless if you cant get the client to want the service.

 

[XenoRaven]

Not currently there isn't. Our upper levels are all squeaky clean guys. They all fit a certain mold. He would be the odd man out.

"Currently" implies there used to be some but there aren't anymore. How successful was your company in the past when there were less restrictions enforced on your employees compared to now?

 

[Coconut]

Title says it all - this is mostly for management-GAF, which DQs a lot of people since I think there's only a small percentage of us who deal with people like we do, but...

We have an employee at the company that has incredible potential - his work is really, really good, but unfortunately he looks like a bum. This "beards are popular now" trend is really irritating lately because a well trimmed beard may be popular, but people keep doing them wrong and looking like a squatch or somesuch.

Due to the quality of this guy's work, I want to promote him in the company. Unfortunately, any promotion he gets means he's seen a lot more by people who DO give a shit about his appearance. I simply can't give him this promotion without him doing a bit of a makeover and looking more presentable.

I've spoken with him, candidly, about needing him to clean up and his idea of cleaning up is not the same as mine. The trick is, I can't 'guarantee' a promotion for him if he does that - he has to do it on his own.

Anyone know any motivational tricks to get your employees to give a shit about their appearance without some horribly draconian or unfair companywide edict that forces the dress code to change? To be fair, he currently isn't seen by the public too much, and the sticking part is that I cannot let him know he's even eligible for a promotion. I just feel like I'm wasting his talents on the lowest rung, but there's just this miscommunication and he has this stupid desire to keep his nasty beard and keep dressing office casual instead of professional.

Thoughts?

Well do you have policies in place to make sure people look 'nice'. If you have a specific expectation you need to express it. Just like in any kind of relationship, otherwise you are being a dick.

 

[jamesinclair]

Wow. Thanks for the reminder on why I ran the hell out of corporate America as fast as possible. Hopefully this dude catches wind of this "predicament" and does so as well.

Yup, it sounds like his current job is a recipe for boredom, middling rewards and no creativity. But hey, maybe if he shaves, he can get promoted, and when his company hits bad times because they value looks over work, he'll get laid off in the next downsizing because he lacks seniority.

He's probably better off starting a competing company that actually values the final product, and run the OP's company out of business.

 

[BolognaSoup]

Steve Jobs wore ripped jeans, tie-dye shirts, sandals, or beards in the office. He seemed to do alright for himself and his company. The people that matter should understand it's the work that matters.

 

[Man God]

I'm legit shook that Sunny doesn't want any vanilla midgets in his upper card.

Spoiler

The mentor idea sounds good.

 

[andycapps]

Yup, it sounds like his current job is a recipe for boredom, middling rewards and no creativity. But hey, maybe if he shaves, he can get promoted, and when his company hits bad times because they value looks over work, he'll get laid off in the next downsizing because he lacks seniority.

He's probably better off starting a competing company that actually values the final product, and run the OP's company out of business.

You're one of the best joke characters on GAF. Thanks for this.

 

[Goldrusher]

It's important to project an aura of success, so to speak - to feel like our people are not just one of the crowd. We need to appear successful even if we're not. Looks are very important as clients want to be a part of something that looks rich and successful.

Our upper levels are all squeaky clean guys. They all fit a certain mold. He would be the odd man out.

What a sad company.

 

[Entropia]

This is Sunflower at work, making fun of his employees

 

[BronsonLee]

Yup, it sounds like his current job is a recipe for boredom, middling rewards and no creativity. But hey, maybe if he shaves, he can get promoted, and when his company hits bad times because they value looks over work, he'll get laid off in the next downsizing because he lacks seniority.

He's probably better off starting a competing company that actually values the final product, and run the OP's company out of business.

I'd watch that promotion!

 

[Calamari41]

Yup, it sounds like his current job is a recipe for boredom, middling rewards and no creativity. But hey, maybe if he shaves, he can get promoted, and when his company hits bad times because they value looks over work, he'll get laid off in the next downsizing because he lacks seniority.

He's probably better off starting a competing company that actually values the final product, and run the OP's company out of business.

Joke poster confirmed.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

What a sad company.

I need to elaborate

The upper level is full of squeaky clean men and women, not "guys"

Sorry for the mixup. We value people all-over.

 

[Arcteryx]

I thought I was initially, as I pretty much did that, but he just didn't grasp the concept properly. I think you're right and I need to be MORE direct. Talk more about his potential - and make him want to change.

This.

Don't outright say, "I'm going to promote you if you trim your beard"; instead focus on where he wants to go and how he can maximize his chances to succeed. Lay it out for him and if he wants to "clean up" then it's on him.

What exactly is the position for? Is it an outward/public facing position? Or is it some kind of internal, but with contact with higher-ups? If it's a public position then it should be obvious/stated how to maintain appearance "standards"; if it's merely contact with higher-ups, then you might need to expressly state to him during your "future potential" talk that it would go a long way towards "greasing the palms" if he "fit in" more.

*I wouldn't want to work there, but I understand the "grooming standards" of some places and to some extent agree if it's for a public position.

 

[Soybean]

I do sympathize, because I'm not naive enough to believe appearances don't matter, but I'm so glad I work in software where (usually) this type of stuff is irrelevant. I actually prefer to dress up a bit, but that's my preference. There's a bottom, of course, but it's closer to what's minimally acceptable to be outside at all, not whatever the current definition of "business casual" is.

 

[Roland1979]

I thought you could dominate people by yelling to them?

Spoiler

Talk to him about this. Request that he at least uses a beard trimmer/electric clipper to even the hairs out at about equal length. Maybe he doesn't want the promotion. It will show what little he is willing ti sacrifice.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

What exactly is the position for? Is it an outward/public facing position? Or is it some kind of internal, but with contact with higher-ups?

He's going to need to interface and dialogue on a face to face basis with both the public and higher-ups. Public as in current clients AND potential clients. Also some charity work will probably happen and he will appear on local news, etc.

 

[polyh3dron]

But I thought Daniel Bryan's ever evolving beard was part of his gimmick.

edit: fucking beaten

 

[zma1013]

Me being the smartass that I am, I'd hear him say this and then I would come in the next day with my head shaved completely bald and every hair on my body waxed off, including my eye brows.

 

[BattleMonkey]

Steve Jobs wore ripped jeans, tie-dye shirts, sandals, or beards in the office. He seemed to do alright for himself and his company. The people that matter should understand it's the work that matters.

Jobs was also in charge, he got to do whatever the fuck he wanted

 

[Roland1979]

not shaving could lose the business money.

 

[jamesinclair]

You're one of the best joke characters on GAF. Thanks for this.

I'm sorry if my description of your workplace hit too close to home

 

[Entropia]

He's going to need to interface and dialogue on a face to face basis with both the public and higher-ups. Public as in current clients AND potential clients. Also some charity work will probably happen and he will appear on local news, etc.

Perhaps you could synergize the recent beard-growing trend with your compadre's appearance to help promote growth with the beard-growing population.

 

[Dude Abides]

Yeah. We had this one guy who was all into bodybuilding, supplements, and shit like that. We had to can him because nobody takes a meathead seriously in court or negotiations.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Perhaps you could synergize the recent beard-growing trend with your compadre's appearance to help promote growth with the beard-growing population.

No, we don't want our forward-facing employees to look like the general public. We did have a competitor that didn't take nearly as much care with their employees' looks for public-facing jobs and I honestly felt like their brand suffered for it. Some people appreciated a more 'down to earth' look but we're about more success and prestige and using that to have people WANT to work with us.

Yeah. We had this one guy who was all into bodybuilding, supplements, and shit like that. We had to can him because nobody takes a meathead seriously in court or negotiations.

Curse your muscle shaming!

 

[AnotherNils]

The answer is sending him subliminal messages that go "Conformmmmm... conformmmmm"

 

[TheRagnCajun]

Lets agree that there is a small percentage of businesses where you can get away wearing anything because of the industry, the culture, the owner, or a combination thereof.

For the rest of us, dressing and grooming well is very important for upward mobility.

My advice for the OP is to keep doing what you're doing. If he's keen, he will eventually catch the drift.

 

[andycapps]

I'm sorry if my description of your workplace hit too close to home

Yeah man, I'm so 'mirin.