Ever had an employee that refuses to look presentable, but has incredible potential?

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Geez. I'd sure like to know what line of work allows you to go from hourly to six figures over night.
 
I honestly have a hard time understanding that people aren't driven by that.
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We die eventually. Money's only as good as what you do with it, and you can't take possessions with you when you go.
 
Sunflower said:
I honestly have a hard time understanding that people aren't driven by that.



Him hating the job or feeling under the gun isn't something I want him to feel. But at the same time I want all of my employees to be looking upwards, all the time. It's a tough thing.



It'd put him into six figures, almost doubling what he makes. Some negotiations, of course, but it is definitely VERY significant.
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It all depends on what he's comfortable doing then. None of us know exactly what's gonna happen on Monday, he may quit, he may come in ready for the promotion but holding resentment from it, and he may come in and just go back to doing what he's been doing, denying the promotion again.

I've given the "what should have been said" advice because obviously, what's done is done and we're just talking retrospective hypotheticals. Far be it from me to tell someone how to do their job, but if I were you, on Monday when he comes in I would just say, "I've thought about it and I don't want you to feel like I'm forcing this on you, and the last thing I want is for you to feel uncomfortable working here or take a position that you don't want and resent it. I feel like you would really excel in this position, but it's your call if you take it or not." Just so he knows there's no animosity at work, that he isn't in jeopardy of losing his job if he doesn't take the promotion, etc. But, again, that's just what I would do from a customer service / PR point of view.
 
Is this retail or office? I'm shocked a retail manager would care enough, usually they force the person to change or else the person is fired.
 
Sunflower said:
You've put others' words into a pretty easy to understand thing on my end. I think at the end of the day I'll unfortunately have to let him languish where he is. I just know he CAN do better things, and I want him to - and it's a hard pill for me to swallow to find people who don't want to bathe in money and look flush as hell.
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Jesus you're shallow. I bet come Monday he won't be the same, and all because your ego wouldn't let go. if you were my manager, i'd come in clean shaven on Monday and turn down the position.
 
The more I read of this thread, the more I suspect the real underlying cause of all this is that Sunflower just doesn't like beards.

Which is rather different from what I originally expected.
 
If I was refused to promotion due to god damn facial hair, I'd be on the phone to my states antidiscrinination body. An employees value to the company should be based on their contribution to the marginal output of the company. Nothing more.

Having to wear ridiculously expensive clothes is bad enough. It is literally a class-based uniform - a hangover from the time when people thought to distinguish themselves from the dirty proles. Everyone should wear what they want, and (unless it becomes a hygiene issue ie in food prep) have their hair how it suites them.
 
tborsje said:
If I was refused to promotion due to god damn facial hair, I'd be on the phone to my states antidiscrinination body. An employees value to the company should be based on their contribution to the marginal output of the company. Nothing more.

Having to wear ridiculously expensive clothes is bad enough. It is literally a class-based uniform - a hangover from the time when people thought to distinguish themselves from the dirty proles. Everyone should wear what they want, and (unless it becomes a hygiene issue ie in food prep) have their hair how it suites them.
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Bearded people are not a protected class.
 
I was riding the subway home tonight and I suddenly realized this thread was meant to be about Daniel Bryan all this time. Fuck, I feel so dense.
 
I've had to deal with this a few times in the past, as well as being in the receiving end. Sensitivity is important, definitely. Try introducing the PIE model -http://www.martyblogs.com/2009/05/27/general-interest/are-you-using-the-pie-theory-for-professional-advancement/
 
Sunflower said:
I honestly have a hard time understanding that people aren't driven by that.
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Really? Personal happiness and freedom over money and power every time! In fact getting home on time is my biggest motivator to get work done (I still do it properly though).

But then again you are saying this is a pay rise of double the original salary...will this mean much more work/overtime/things that will take away from other aspects of his life? In that case he may just prioritize other aspects of his life more than work?
 
Teku said:
Really? Personal happiness and freedom over money and power every time! In fact getting home on time is my biggest motivator to get work done (I still do it properly though).
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Well in my life, personal happiness and freedom is bought with money and power.
 
For those asking why it matters if he's good at his job, things like appearance and use of language are important to people that *don't* know that he's good at his job. If you're meeting clients, potential clients and people in other parts of the company that don't know this person, their first impressions are important just like they are in all areas of life. Business is a social interaction as well as professional, and this stuff can mean things. At my office, we all swear and curse like pirates, but we don't when we are with clients - there's an expectation about the language we use and it's our clients expectations that matter, not out own.
 
I would get him a outfit that you want to see him in and tell him this is what he needs to dress like to get the promotion if he wants it. Maybe he doesn't care.
 
daycru said:
Stop indulging this fan fiction.
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58584-Its-still-real-to-me-dammit-aerV.gif
 
spoiler:

he's cleaned up and wants it

the end
 
He's also really shaped up attitude-wise. I think he had a long hard look at his life and decided he wants to better himself.
 
Sunflower said:
He's also really shaped up attitude-wise. I think he had a long hard look at his life and decided he wants to better himself.
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Fun thread. As someone who works in almost the ultimate casual industry, games, I sometimes wish people wouldn't be such fucking slobs all the time. The most interesting part of the thread though was when you spoke to the idea that your appearance isn't you, and we all put on masks for a variety of reasons ("I want to impress someone", "I am attending a special event", "I want to look like I don't put on masks because the negation of established authority makes me feel like I'm exercising my will to power", etc.).

That said if I was your employee I probably would have bounced because you come across as not loving the product/process as much as the profit, and that's a red flag for me (but completely orthogonal to the issue at hand).
 
BriareosGAF said:
Fun thread. As someone who works in almost the ultimate casual industry, games, I sometimes wish people wouldn't be such fucking slobs all the time. The most interesting part of the thread though was when you spoke to the idea that your appearance isn't you, and we all put on masks for a variety of reasons ("I want to impress someone", "I am attending a special event", "I want to look like I don't put on masks because the negation of established authority makes me feel like I'm exercising my will to power", etc.).

That said if I was your employee I probably would have bounced because you come across as not loving the product/process as much as the profit, and that's a red flag for me (but completely orthogonal to the issue at hand).
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It isn't for everyone, and that's something I've been struggling to understand. Money drives probably every aspect of my life, and I can't understand people not being motivated by him.
 
davepoobond said:
Good job now we have another pushover with no sense of pride in wearing a beard making millions
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lol

Glad he cleaned up. I'm curious, did he lose the beard completely? Or did he just clean it up?

I used to have pride in a lot of dumb shit that doesn't really matter. When I realized what did matter, and took the proper steps, things got even better.
 
KTallguy said:
lol

Glad he cleaned up. I'm curious, did he lose the beard completely? Or did he just clean it up?

I used to have pride in a lot of dumb shit that doesn't really matter. When I realized what did matter, and took the proper steps, things got even better.
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Clean shaven. It's weird but I'll get used to it. He says he's happier now. We'll see how happy he is when his workload changes!
 
Sunflower said:
spoiler:

he's cleaned up and wants it

the end
Click to expand...

Sunflower said:
He's also really shaped up attitude-wise. I think he had a long hard look at his life and decided he wants to better himself.
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Sunflower said:
Clean shaven. It's weird but I'll get used to it. He says he's happier now. We'll see how happy he is when his workload changes!
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You did it buddy! o/

Looks like he needed to leave early to go clear his head and think about what he wanted; I've had to do the same sometimes, so I'll take a trek to the Art Museum benches to relax and try to figure things out. Glad he's making the effort!
 
Sunflower said:
Clean shaven. It's weird but I'll get used to it. He says he's happier now. We'll see how happy he is when his workload changes!
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Oh yes... exactly :)

Still, it's great that you were patient with talking to him. You must really like the guy. Hopefully it all works out for you.
 
Cyan said:
Wait, did Daniel Bryan really decide to shave his beard, or did Sunflower just decide to end the joke?
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Was never a joke brah, people thought it was because it fit my avatar but it's legit.
 
time to quote my avatar -- one for each dollar raise he's getting.




my only concern was wondering if he was hiding some grotesque birthmark under his beard.


"Vince, make him grow his beard back, he's scaring the children."
 
Cyan said:
I'm impressed with your ability to stay in character.
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You should come to Wrasslegaf and enjoy Summerslam with us!

But I'm serious, this was a real situation that really happened at my workplace.
 
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