I don't see the big deal on Kotaku reporting it. It's news, it's game related news, it's controversial game related news, it's going to get reported. What kind of journalist is she? Demanding to have an outlet take news down? Really? Maybe she should ask for the deletion of this thread next.
Transgender journalist at EG Expo called "this person" on stage at MS event (See OP)
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Not exactly a unique nickname. Pretty common in journalism.
krypt0nian
Banned
She asked nicely because she was in distress. The kind of deep distress that apparently gets little empathy.
So many replies here that amount to "too bad" and "deal with it" when someone is literally hurting on a basic human level.
Lambda Pie
Banned
then maybe, just maybe, she shouldn't have brought up the story publicly using Twitter.
"deal with it" apllies here.
I'd have to say that for comedians, no matter if they are in the right or wrong, trying to claim that someone has libelled you on twitter and said you offended them, causing loss of earnings, when part of your way of making a living is to get people up on stage and take the piss is always going to be a tough fight. This isn't going to court, apologies and lessons learned all round would be the way around, but then that would be the adult way of dealing with it, wouldn't it,
baphomet
Member
Another proud moment for Kotaku.
They have no reason to take the story down. What Polygon does has fuck all to do with Kotaku posting a story.
partyphone
Banned
So? What's your point? These are still hateful things to say to another person and there are many, many other assholes doing the same thing.
Because something something internet.
The Cowboy
Member
I really don't think some people realise just how public posting something on twitter can be, however she is a journalist and you'd think being a journalist she would know how big twitter stories can get (especially on a topic such as this).
I never thought I'd see the day I'd do this, but I'm actually supporting Kotaku on this - they have done nothing wrong as far as I'm concerned.
I would still like to see a video if its ever made public so I can make up my own mind.
She shouldn't be surprised that this has gotten attention since she wanted attention in the first place. She put it out on front street that she wants to publicly shame. She had better be right on the money.
I saw no professional cameras in that area when I passed during the weekend. If it's the stage I'm thinking of, it was small and to the side. Not a big event stage in the typical manner. Most people probably didn't notice it aside from the presenters voice through a side PA.
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
This isn't setting a very good "I wouldn't lie about something serious/engage in libel to make a situation more exaggerated than it really was" precedent, is it.
Intheflorsh
Banned
Nope, they have no legal obligation to take down the story. It's just making someone's life worse.
Another proud moment for Kotaku.
I don't see how he is wrong. It's public information. They can report all they want to. She isn't the first or last person who gets distressed by news about themselves from twitter. That doesn't mean the story should be taken down.
His reasoning is pretty much guilty until proven. Why should the accuser have more credence? If we are going into it unbiased we should not give more credence on either side.
Of course not. What I'm referring to is that we should get all the information and details first before we judge anyone in any type of case.
Lets try to remember that this is a fucking human being we are dealing with here.
Watch something really fucked up happen to her because of this. Then where does your integrity get you? We have to draw the line somewhere. The vitriol on her twitter is just something else.
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
I agree that that's a shitty outcome, but I disagree with the principle that if a reported story causes someone harm or suffering, it should not be reported. Many news articles generate hate for someone involved, but they still need to exist. I don't know if this one needs to exist, but I think there's an argument to be made that this case should be illuminated and discussed, however it turns out.
So make a nasty allegation, news reports it, you feel distress, and the news should stop reporting on your own allegation? That's not how the news works. How about the accused? What if he's hurting on a basic human level because of what he has called her lies?
krypt0nian
Banned
This isn't setting a very good "I wouldn't lie about something serious/engage in libel to make a situation more exaggerated than it really was" precedent, is it.
When someone is in distress and being bombarded about her basic being they can get the facts wrong, no? Or do you think she's lying?
EDIT: Nevermind this is literally hopeless.
HappehLemons
Member
This isn't setting a very good "I wouldn't lie about something serious/engage in libel to make a situation more exaggerated than it really was" precedent, is it.
"No."
Ugggh I started out sympathetic but I dont care anymore. First we hear that incredibly offensive comments were made. Then we find out it was a comedian. Then it turns out the comments werent all that offensive. Then the accuser admits it was probably a misunderstanding. Then we get some pics of this person and its easy to see why anyone would be confused (and why a comedian gonna comedy even if he said he didnt). And now the accuser is mad a gaming site made an article about the gaming community you made public. W/e.
BronsonLee
Member
This isn't setting a very good "I wouldn't lie about something serious/engage in libel to make a situation more exaggerated than it really was" precedent, is it.
At worst? She gave permission and is recanting.
More likely? She's been getting hammered with requests all day, thought she replied, and missed one. They put up the article anyway.
Honestly, I wouldn't have embedded the damn tweets, but it's fine to post the article. But he didn't have anything extra beyond her feed. It's weak reporting.
I think Kotaku wanted to be first and did so at the expense of having any useful information, unlike the Polygons and the like. There's a reason some people don't give Kotaku a lot of credit.
Mr.Wreckless
Banned
I think the point that woman was trying to make is............. The person in question here looks nothing like a woman, she looks like a man with a ridiculous wig. If this person is going to get offended when people refer to her as a man she should make some effort to look like a woman.
sakipon
Member
And what if you don't know of their thoughts or their name? I remember passingly meeting a couple of persons where I honestly couldn't tell their gender and hadn't been introduced to them. I'm not sure what happened in this story but sometimes innocent mistakes happen when you suddenly need to refer to someone.
While agender people certainly exist, Laura identifies as a woman, thus should be referred to with female pronouns.
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
Wow. Lol, he can't be serious.
Wow... I understand the argument that the news is already a public matter and Kotaku has the right to publish the news as they see fit, but he could so much less of a dick about it.
baphomet
Member
She did that herself by posting the shit all over twitter first. Guess what? Its a story now, people want to know what comes of it. Just because she doesnt like it being up doesnt mean it should be taken down. Thats not how this stuff works and youd think she would know that being a journalist and all.
Fortunately if this were to happen to me Im not the sort of person to rush on to a public social network to complain and air it to the world.
Social networks are full of attention seekers who have to document every little thing that happens to them (not aimed at the person this topic is about). If they don't want the world knowing what they do, why post?
PairOfFilthySocks
Member
Seems she wasn't being quite as truthful as initially expected. I dunno, this is a colossal clusterfuck. I honestly don't think Kotaku should feel obliged to pull the story. Twitter's a public space. Be wary what you write on it, especially when you're throwing around some pretty hefty accusations.
partyphone
Banned
You're a lovely person.
JennyTablina
Member
Yikes go away for a nap and waddya know, playing Jump to Conclusions and attacking the comedian comes with the surprising response that, okay, he was a little thoughtless with his words, but the intent wasn't malicious.
I feel for Laura, because one way or another she must of been genuinely upset. But now it looks like she massively overreacted to an unfortunate slip of the tongue (assuming that how the comedian recalls the situation is true)
But sadly this is the risk you take when you go public, you risk drawing more ire from people, and if you happen to be wrong, they'll all gleefully pile on the abuse too. Ironically, in complaining about what seems to have been a misunderstanding, and (hopefully) an honest mistake, shes likely drawn tons of actual abuse to herself for it :/
I feel for Laura, because one way or another she must of been genuinely upset. But now it looks like she massively overreacted to an unfortunate slip of the tongue (assuming that how the comedian recalls the situation is true)
But sadly this is the risk you take when you go public, you risk drawing more ire from people, and if you happen to be wrong, they'll all gleefully pile on the abuse too. Ironically, in complaining about what seems to have been a misunderstanding, and (hopefully) an honest mistake, shes likely drawn tons of actual abuse to herself for it :/
Exactly. This whole thing is overblown.
Did the comedian/guy/presenter/whatever make a stupid comment? Absolutely. He didn't really think it through, and as a result, said something that was insensitive. I doubt it was intentional. None of us really know the intent. Maybe it was the person's appearance. Maybe it was the costume. Who fucking knows.
It must be me, but 2013 seems to be the year that everyone has decided that they're going to over analyze every comment, that everyone makes and get offended by it. Even worse, sites will post almost anything, attach a sensationalist title, just to get a few more clicks. The faux outrage over nothing...and yes...literally...nothing, is ridiculous.
Look. There is plenty of blatant, overt and intentional hatred, bigotry and plain old ignorance for people to get their pitch folks and torches ready for. This incident isn't one of them. It just so happened to occur at corporate presentation. I'm sure the individual who made the comment is sorry and meant no harm by it. There is no need for all this shit.
And yeah, you can't really generate awarness of this issue and keep it quiet at the same time :/
Claude Kenni
Member
I'm having a hard time following all of this since I'm busy. Do people not understand that the womans reaction to post all that stuff on Twitter was perfectly reasonable? You have to think about how she felt, even if she wasn't 100% correct it's not right to ignore the role feelings played in her making those posts. People are human and can feel intense emotions in situations like this.
It's not easy to realize "Hey this is about gaming so this news will spread like wildfire and bring lots of unwanted and negative attention" or that she may not have been 100% correct in her allegations when you feel dehumanized and publicly humiliated the way she was.
It's not fair to put her under such a big microscope and nitpick every mistake she may have made without considering her mental state at the time of posting and the foresight and type of thinking required of her to understand what could happen in reaction. It's very easy to misremember some of the details in a situation like this.
It's not easy to realize "Hey this is about gaming so this news will spread like wildfire and bring lots of unwanted and negative attention" or that she may not have been 100% correct in her allegations when you feel dehumanized and publicly humiliated the way she was.
It's not fair to put her under such a big microscope and nitpick every mistake she may have made without considering her mental state at the time of posting and the foresight and type of thinking required of her to understand what could happen in reaction. It's very easy to misremember some of the details in a situation like this.
Read the twitter convo with Owen on Kotaku, they asked her for a comment, she gave one asking for it not to be published, Kotaku then published it, most of the hate came after the story was on Kotaku.
Intheflorsh
Banned
Mr.Wreckless
Banned
How can you honestly be offended that someone refers to you as "he" when everything about you screams you are a man and you made no effort to look like a woman?
In that setting if i saw that person id think cos-playing man 100 times before i thought woman.
Data Ghost
Member
I think the point she was making is that if you want to be seen as a woman but take offence when people mistake you for a man, a bit of makeup and non rainbow hair might be a step in the right direction.
But its been changing for the better. In fact, most major sites now regularly report on gender issues germane to gaming. I find it difficult to imagine a scenario where a trans woman who writes for some of the same sites would not be aware that accusations of this nature would fly fast and far beyond her Twitter following. Also, it seems that several press people and developers did in fact immediately accept the allegations as proven truth and responded accordingly via Twitter. At this point, all we have is a he said/she said argument and shouldn't come to any conclusions until more is known. How can you be so certain? You've clearly made up your mind.
baphomet
Member
Actually those were happening before the article and she, for whatever reason, decided it was a good idea to post her phone number.
Based on that Twitter conversation, Kotaku asked, she never responded to them, she thought she asked them not to, they published, she proceeded to tell people they published despite her objections, they pointed out to her she'd never responded to them, she then asked they pull the already-posted story and they refused.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
This isn't setting a very good "I wouldn't lie about something serious/engage in libel to make a situation more exaggerated than it really was" precedent, is it.
Sorry. The woman isnt an idiot. i would of responded the same too. Article should stay up.
Except she didn't respond to their request, so they published it. This is par for the course.
Umm... what?
Jesus wept. Not everyone has to conform to what you think they should look like. I think you've missed the point of the thread and leaped straight into laying into someone's appearance. Telling someone who's transgender that they just need to try harder is a bit harsh.
polyh3dron
Banned
Streisand Effect is in full effect.
GrizzleBoy
Banned
Kotaku ladies and gentlemen:
Yeahhhh.........screw "this person".
She took it public on twitter when she was ready to ruin another persons rep, but now everything needs to be hush hush?
This.
As bad as it might suck for her, she might have thought about that before airing this issue publicly on Twitter. It's pretty disingenuous to accuse someone using a social media used by millions of people and then get upset because media picks up on it and writes a story.
I never thought I'd say this but I'm gonna side with Kotaku on this one. Don't hold a fucking press conference and get mad when it ends up on the evening news.
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