Valve Fremont device has appeared on Geekbench (+ more details from SadlyItsBradley)

TBF I've seen both diehard PlayStation AND Xbox fans downplaying or completely dismissing Fremont. You can take guesses as to why.


Cross-gen for 9th/10th-gen will be even longer than for 8th/9th-gen. So if Fremont has PS5-level performance that won't be a problem for a long while, and there's also the chance they may have a variant SKU with higher performance.
Platform warriors have always and will always exist and it's not unique to console either as we also have the PCMR folks that pull the same shit as the console fanboys.

Good point though on the gen crossover. It just seems weird to position such a low power GPU in a device that is meant more for living rooms where the majority of people have 4K tvs now.

Steam bros trying to convince everyone that these hardware devices are way more relevant than they truly are is far more likely, tbh. Happened in 2021, will happen again.
As I said above unfortunately platform warriors exist on every platform. On the PC side we just happen to have two groups: General PCMR, and Steam Fanboys.

The amount that pc handhelds in general get overplayed is ridiculous though. All together they have sold between 6 and 7 million with over 4 of that being Steam Deck. Hell besides the Steam Deck the PlayStation Portal has outsold every single PC gaming handheld (most of them combined) and sold faster then the Steam Deck has and it's literally just a controller with streaming display on it.
 
I ditched PS for PC/Steam in 2016 and have been happy with the switch in ecosystems. But I do miss the comfy couch console experience at times. I have a Steamdeck and love it, but there is just a bit too much friction to set it up as a streaming device to the living room TV (I can do it, it is just a little annoying to maintain) and it is just a bit too underpowered for native games. I'll be all over this if it:

- has decently good upscaling from 1080p/1440p to 4k
- HDR plays nice with my LG OLED
- VRR over HDMI 2.1 (pay the license and make it happen Valve!)
- Dolby 7.1/Atmos output

Also, I'll wishcast to the PC community to make a mod for SteamOS to make it look just like the Sony PS3 XMB...
 
Just connect your PC to your TV via HDMI, buy a dualsense and presto you have your console experience.
Star Trek Computer GIF
 
A slightly enhanced standard PS5 aimed at 1080p/1440p 60fps gaming without RT and with the advantage of having the entire Steam library at your disposal.

Dream device if you ask me.
 
Specs are a little underwhelming, but I'd be mostly be getting this for pc games that never got a console port and last gen console games that never got a current gen remaster (on pc, crank up the graphics settings and resolution BAM remaster). Easy emulation would be nice too. If there will be current gen games that would look better on this device than my ps5 or series x, that would be a huge bonus. Would sell my series x to help pay for this device for sure.
 
That's just plain weak. Why are they going with hardware like that for a TV device? Should've been out like 5 or more years ago. This will run games worse than current gen consoles.

Not if they sell it for $299.

A device that will play all my steam games better than my Steam Eeck while at the same time syncing perfectly across two devices? Day 1.
You don't want a weak PC plugged into a big 4K TV, can't compare it to a Deck where you have a lowres small screen. The power needs to be way higher than this to brute force past the lack of proper optimization. Just build your own small form factor PC. This is below even DF Alex's dumb "console-equivalent" PC's that nobody serious would ever use.
 
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That's just plain weak. Why are they going with hardware like that for a TV device? Should've been out like 5 or more years ago. This will run games worse than current gen consoles.


You don't want a weak PC plugged into a big 4K TV, can't compare it to a Deck where you have a lowres small screen. The power needs to be way higher than this to brute force past the lack of proper optimization. Just build your own small form factor PC. This is below even DF Alex's dumb "console-equivalent" PC's that nobody serious would ever use.
Any suggestions for something below 800€?
 
That's just plain weak. Why are they going with hardware like that for a TV device? Should've been out like 5 or more years ago. This will run games worse than current gen consoles.


You don't want a weak PC plugged into a big 4K TV, can't compare it to a Deck where you have a lowres small screen. The power needs to be way higher than this to brute force past the lack of proper optimization. Just build your own small form factor PC. This is below even DF Alex's dumb "console-equivalent" PC's that nobody serious would ever use.
If it is a cheap price people will find a way to enjoy it. My nephew used the open source AMD drivers on Linux with hacks that enable RTGI on Vega GPU on DOOM: The Dark Ages and Indiana Jones: The Great Circle and he thoroughly enjoyed both games.

If the price is low and you get easy open access to tons of mods of all kinds and retro PC games on TV easily with a super adaptable controller, it will have a good market. A little bit more grunt than Steam Deck and it can run RT effects in Hogwarts Legacy too.
 
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The best of consoles and the best of PCs with the entire steam library at hand, and most likely affordable due to not using some overpowered bullshit hardware. Thanks Valve.
 
A Console that can't play FortNite, Madden NFL, EA FC, COD, Battlefield, GTA, Minecraft, and no Gamepass.

If it doesn't die by itself, the next gen Xbox Magnus will kill it completely.
The steam deck ain't targeting people who finds it hard to open the control panel to update their graphics drivers, but rather enthusiasts who knows basic stuff like how to turn on a pc.

You can install windows on it if you want to, and play those titles just fine.
 
Platform warriors have always and will always exist and it's not unique to console either as we also have the PCMR folks that pull the same shit as the console fanboys.

Good point though on the gen crossover. It just seems weird to position such a low power GPU in a device that is meant more for living rooms where the majority of people have 4K tvs now.


As I said above unfortunately platform warriors exist on every platform. On the PC side we just happen to have two groups: General PCMR, and Steam Fanboys.

The amount that pc handhelds in general get overplayed is ridiculous though. All together they have sold between 6 and 7 million with over 4 of that being Steam Deck. Hell besides the Steam Deck the PlayStation Portal has outsold every single PC gaming handheld (most of them combined) and sold faster then the Steam Deck has and it's literally just a controller with streaming display on it.
You're obsessed with sales, the portal is a much more mainstream device at a different price point. Steamdeck is a more enthusiast device more aimed at nerds on gaming forums like here, so you're gonna get a lot of fans of it on here, it's that simple.
 
You're obsessed with sales, the portal is a much more mainstream device at a different price point. Steamdeck is a more enthusiast device more aimed at nerds on gaming forums like here, so you're gonna get a lot of fans of it on here, it's that simple.
I'm not obsessed with sales. I bring these sales up because people act like these handhelds are much bigger then they are.

They are great devices (some of them at least) but they aren't as big as people think they are. People have this very inflated enthusiast viewpoint on a lot of things.

The point I'm trying to get across is that outside of streamers and YouTubers who have something to gain by talking about them and enthusiast gaming forums they aren't very common overall.

Plus my post was directly responding to somebody criticizing steam bros for trying to make hardware seem more relevant then they are which I would presume includes Steam Deck.

Personally I find Steam Deck sales to be impressive and a success.
 
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Probably too low spec for me to care about, but anything that kills off windows is worth it. This thing won't compete with consoles as a sole gaming device, but as a second PC that eliminates the need for PC players to buy a console for a handful of games it might work out great.
 
I'm totally shocked that a forum full of nerds where people act like a 4070 is old and busted would think that this hardware is too weak and people should just "build their own" that ends up costing more, is uglier, bigger, and has more potential failure points. Talk about blinkered thinking.

Remember that Valve has information on basically every computer that connects to Steam and plays games. They know all of that. They know how Steam Deck is selling in spite of far more powerful devices existing on the market. They built their device based on that. It's like they know that gamers don't really care as much about power as PC gaming nerds do.
 
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Platform warriors have always and will always exist and it's not unique to console either as we also have the PCMR folks that pull the same shit as the console fanboys.

Good point though on the gen crossover. It just seems weird to position such a low power GPU in a device that is meant more for living rooms where the majority of people have 4K tvs now.

Well FWIW, I went to a Steam subreddit and people were pointing out how Steam Deck's prototype was weaker than the final version. I.e the prototype had an RDNA 1 GPU but the final Steam Deck used RDNA 2. So it could be a very similar pattern here with Fremont.

Also, some are saying Valve won't announce this until they announce Deckard (I don't even know what that is) and Steam Deck 2, and that Steam Deck 2 would likely be releasing before Fremont. Steam Deck 2 is probably still at least a year away, maybe a bit more, so Fremont's likely to be a 2027 device. That gives a lot of room for spec bumps in various areas; for all we know that may have already happened but there's no listing for another variant that can be cribbed for leaks ATM.

As I said above unfortunately platform warriors exist on every platform. On the PC side we just happen to have two groups: General PCMR, and Steam Fanboys.

The amount that pc handhelds in general get overplayed is ridiculous though. All together they have sold between 6 and 7 million with over 4 of that being Steam Deck. Hell besides the Steam Deck the PlayStation Portal has outsold every single PC gaming handheld (most of them combined) and sold faster then the Steam Deck has and it's literally just a controller with streaming display on it.

It is worth stressing that none of those PC handhelds have done anywhere near the type of advertising mainstream consoles like PlayStation, Nintendo, or even Xbox have done. A lot of those PC handhelds aren't even sold in physical retail outlets.

Those two things alone would put a major limit on number of manufactured devices, and thus sales.

I'll get one for sure.

Don't think these devices are much of a threat to consoles though.

Well, when they aren't being produced in volumes of 5-10 million/year with big traditional advertising, and normalized distribution in physical retail chains, then yeah they aren't going to be much a threat to consoles.

But I think the growth of this market segment is a given, and it'll be a matter of when, not if, they start truly encroaching on traditional console sales markets. With the pricing pattern of consoles this gen, combined with 2 of the 3 platform holders either going fully multiplat or increasingly treading into that direction, those types of things just make consolized PC devices more appealing IMHO.

There have finally been breakthroughs in UI & QOL with these devices to mimic a traditional console experience, alongside various resource optimizations and software library compatibility. And right now, Steam Deck & Steam OS are the pinnacle on this front. That's why I think they're in the driver's seat in terms of being the best chance this emerging market can see big growth.

That's in spite of what Microsoft's attempting to do because honestly, MS's poor track record as a console platform holder is still there, and there's no reason to assume they'll get it right with these Xbox PC devices. If their size was to an advantage, Series S & X would be a lot better off today, and Microsoft Store would be the premier place for PC gaming instead of storefronts like Steam (and even ones like EGS & GOG dwarf Microsoft Store for PC gaming). So they have a LOT to prove still IMHO.
 
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Just connect your PC to your TV via HDMI, buy a dualsense and presto you have your console experience.
Star Trek Computer GIF

There are a lot of steps in between connecting your PC to a TV and buying a dualsense before you have a console experience. Out of the box, Windows and Linux are still going to need keyboard and mouse until you get it all set up for controller. As things are, most folks are going to just buy a console because it is still cheaper and easier to use.
 
Any suggestions for something below 800€?
Not really. It would be roughly in the same ballpark as Alex PCs when he pretends that PC gaming isn't more expensive than console gaming. I have no understanding for that line of thinking.
If it is a cheap price people will find a way to enjoy it. My nephew used the open source AMD drivers on Linux with hacks that enable RTGI on Vega GPU on DOOM: The Dark Ages and Indiana Jones: The Great Circle and he thoroughly enjoyed both games.

If the price is low and you get easy open access to tons of mods of all kinds and retro PC games on TV easily with a super adaptable controller, it will have a good market. A little bit more grunt than Steam Deck and it can run RT effects in Hogwarts Legacy too.
Good for him but I think the whole concept is aimed at those who're at most casual gamers. You'll have to lower resolution, gfx settings and use FSR and will likely still have trouble getting stable performance.
The hardware is fine for handheld gaming where you can fall down to 720p without thinking you're gaming on a C64. But for PC gaming on a TV it's just not enough. Even the supposed $1k+ Xbox will taste the same downside of PC gaming, as in being dependent on brute forcing through bad optimization but not having the hardware to actually do that.
 
A Console that can't play FortNite, Madden NFL, EA FC, COD, Battlefield, GTA, Minecraft, and no Gamepass.

If it doesn't die by itself, the next gen Xbox Magnus will kill it completely.

It can do all of those things by just installing windows.
 
A Console that can't play FortNite, Madden NFL, EA FC, COD, Battlefield, GTA, Minecraft, and no Gamepass.

If it doesn't die by itself, the next gen Xbox Magnus will kill it completely.
You can play all of those without installing windows, I've had both battlenet and epic store installed on my Steam deck
 
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I ditched PS for PC/Steam in 2016 and have been happy with the switch in ecosystems. But I do miss the comfy couch console experience at times. I have a Steamdeck and love it, but there is just a bit too much friction to set it up as a streaming device to the living room TV (I can do it, it is just a little annoying to maintain) and it is just a bit too underpowered for native games. I'll be all over this if it:

- has decently good upscaling from 1080p/1440p to 4k
- HDR plays nice with my LG OLED
- VRR over HDMI 2.1 (pay the license and make it happen Valve!)
- Dolby 7.1/Atmos output

Also, I'll wishcast to the PC community to make a mod for SteamOS to make it look just like the Sony PS3 XMB...
I have a PC running Bazzite (SteamOS fork basically), it does all of that except VRR and atmos.

HDR works, 5.1/7.1 audio works, and both FSR3 and XeSS doa great job upscaling to 4K
 
If this is priced right, and the Deck pricing makes me think it will be, I'll buy one.

I'm happy to have something that's not cutting edge as long as it's £349 (at a push £399).

No online fees, EmuDeck (EmuFreemont?). This could be a lot of device for the money.
 
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If this is priced right, and the Deck pricing makes me think it will be, I'll buy one.

I'm happy to have something that's not cutting edge as long as it's £349 (at a push £399).

No online fees, EmuDeck (EmuFreemont?). This could be a lot of device for the money.
399 is a small price to pay, if it can emulate switch at 1440p. I will finally be able to play the Xenoblade chronicles games with acceptable IQ. I recently upgraded from a 40" TV to a 55" one and the IQ of these games on Switch 2 is intolerable. My laptop is ancient and the steam deck cannot emulate these games.
 
399 is a small price to pay, if it can emulate switch at 1440p. I will finally be able to play the Xenoblade chronicles games with acceptable IQ. I recently upgraded from a 40" TV to a 55" one and the IQ of these games on Switch 2 is intolerable. My laptop is ancient and the steam deck cannot emulate these games.
It would definitely be able to handle the original Wii version of XBC and its superior art style, FWIW
 
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Steam bros trying to convince everyone that these hardware devices are way more relevant than they truly are is far more likely, tbh. Happened in 2021, will happen again.

But those Steam Bros are a small fragment of the total community. And, most of the shilling for Steam Deck was coming from games "journalists", like it usually does for any device they want to win.

I'm just saying that Fremont could be a very appealing gaming option for people in the market who:

1: Don't want to deal with the shenanigans of current mainstream consoles​
2: Don't want a massive desktop PC, nor a laptop or portable, but still want the conveniences of PC gaming and PC as a platform anyway​
3: Don't need the most powerful CPU & GPU in the world to game comfortably​
4: Don't have the time or skill set to build their own setup (fits into point #2)​
5: Don't want to deal with Windows​

Now, how big is that market segment truly? We don't know yet, because there's yet to be a device that truly offers all of those advantages in a completely seamless and mass-market way, in terms of product availability and total manufacture volume. We'll probably start getting some of those answers in the coming years, and devices like Fremont will play a big role in generating said answers.

I think that's very fair to say, without sounding like I'm glazing the device and definitely without insinuating "consoles are dead" because of stuff like these PC/console hybrid devices. The people trying to push that narrative just look flat-out stupid. But I DO think the market for these PC/console hybrid gaming devices, IF done right, is much bigger than 4 or 6 million devices in total, absolutely.
 
Steam bros trying to convince everyone that these hardware devices are way more relevant than they truly are is far more likely, tbh. Happened in 2021, will happen again.
Im coming here with " i own ps5 pro, good pc i built and upgraded over years" and also steam deck, which I later upgraded to oled deck.
Its not groundbreaking device, but its easy most mainstream pc handheld and i dont know why people are upset with it. It has its uses, i emulate everything up to ps3 on it and play mostly abandoware games on it with some older aaa too. Theres a reason why pc handhelds are as popular as they are now, sd started movement which made a lot of big players see there is some market for it.
 
Theres a reason why pc handhelds are as popular as they are now, sd started movement which made a lot of big players see there is some market for it.

high quality GIF


All PC handhelds cumulated together amounts to 6M units

It's a fart in the wind. The definition of hobbyist hardware.
 
And yet companies still keep pumping them out. It's almost as if there is a profit to be made here.

At near $1k handheld I would hope so.

They also pump out VR headsets and that has basically flatlined in any growth metrics on Steam monthly hardware surveys.

Still nothing in the same realm of existence as Nintendo requiring a production line to pump those numbers in a matter of months.
 
high quality GIF


All PC handhelds cumulated together amounts to 6M units

It's a fart in the wind. The definition of hobbyist hardware.
Yep, i didnt deny it, it has its niche, theres still new devices coming out on regular basis, so they see some potential there. This reminds me of people saying game not selling 5mil+ copies meaning its failure, while you have hundreds of millions devices out there to play em, which is not reality.
 
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AMD GPU? Tough sell unless it's obscenely cheap. I would have preferred any Nvidia GPU due to DLSS. Can't game without it now in the age of shoddy UE5 ports. I'm more interested in that controller. Might replace my old but comfortable Dualshock 4.
 
AMD GPU? Tough sell unless it's obscenely cheap. I would have preferred any Nvidia GPU due to DLSS. Can't game without it now in the age of shoddy UE5 ports. I'm more interested in that controller. Might replace my old but comfortable Dualshock 4.
AMD tends to have better performance for price, especially now and fsr4 is easier to implement(unless theres nvidia deal) and its getting close to visual/performance of dlss.
 
AMD tends to have better performance for price, especially now and fsr4 is easier to implement(unless theres nvidia deal) and its getting close to visual/performance of dlss.
FSR4 is exclusive to RDNA4 and doesn't have the widespread support DLSS has. I'm not sure if an old 3060Ti was too expensive. I'm guessing Nvidia has no reason to be generous with their prices. DLSS is a true savior for low end cards, the way FSR3 isn't.
 
FSR4 is exclusive to RDNA4 and doesn't have the widespread support DLSS has. I'm not sure if an old 3060Ti was too expensive. I'm guessing Nvidia has no reason to be generous with their prices. DLSS is a true savior for low end cards, the way FSR3 isn't.
My bad, i thought you can rather easily mod in fsr4 in most games, also the ones using dlss and xess.
There is also something with devs that dont really want to use dlss, look at switch 2, it has but not many games use it all.
Also i dont know how they wanna handle performance presets with system. If they leave it for people to thinker with, toggle upscalers etc, its gonna be no different from standard pc
 
high quality GIF


All PC handhelds cumulated together amounts to 6M units

It's a fart in the wind. The definition of hobbyist hardware.
And I will very gladly pay for a hobbyist hardware because I am not a donkey with a brain the size of a nugget that is unable to click two things in 2025 iteration of a Norton Commander because "muh console experience".
Soon people will need instruction on how to breathe.
 
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And I will very gladly pay for a hobbyist hardware because I am not a donkey with a brain the size of a nugget that is unable to click two things in 2025 iteration of a Norton Commander because "muh console experience".
Soon people will need instruction on how to breathe.
For real. Weird to see those kinds comments on an enthusiast forum, these products are for us
 
And I will very gladly pay for a hobbyist hardware because I am not a donkey with a brain the size of a nugget that is unable to click two things in 2025 iteration of a Norton Commander because "muh console experience".
Soon people will need instruction on how to breathe.

I don't know what that has to do with "popularity" compared to a Nintendo console, but I'm happy for you.

Charlie Day Ok GIF
 
And I will very gladly pay for a hobbyist hardware because I am not a donkey with a brain the size of a nugget that is unable to click two things in 2025 iteration of a Norton Commander because "muh console experience".
Soon people will need instruction on how to breathe.
I'm glad we know about your superiority now.

I almost thought you were just an idiot that a superiority complex because you play on a specific platform versus another.
 
I don't know what that has to do with "popularity" compared to a Nintendo console, but I'm happy for you.

Charlie Day Ok GIF
Who cares about popularity? These consoles appeal to completely different niches. Switch being more popular than my PC handheld hasn't changed my enjoyment of it.

My bad, i thought you can rather easily mod in fsr4 in most games, also the ones using dlss and xess.
There is also something with devs that dont really want to use dlss, look at switch 2, it has but not many games use it all.
Also i dont know how they wanna handle performance presets with system. If they leave it for people to thinker with, toggle upscalers etc, its gonna be no different from standard pc
Switch 2 DLSS is different from PC. Nearly every modern AA/AAA PC game supports DLSS. The transformer upgrade made even DLSS Performance look great. This is why I wonder just how much cheaper a 7600X was over a 3060Ti to justify losing out on the feature.

Regardless I am sure to buy one anyways. I love to have a home console device as an emulation God device. I used my Series S for this end before MS decided to be MS.
 
Who cares about popularity? These consoles appeal to completely different niches. Switch being more popular than my PC handheld hasn't changed my enjoyment of it.

Well I did respond to "Theres a reason why pc handhelds are as popular as they are now"

I'm not talking down on a choice or that you don't enjoy it because its popular, don't know wtf that has to do with the original reply, I just want to make sure we're on the same plane of reality, its hobbyist hardware, that's also totally fine 🤷‍♂️
 
Well I did respond to "Theres a reason why pc handhelds are as popular as they are now"

I'm not talking down on a choice or that you don't enjoy it because its popular, don't know wtf that has to do with the original reply, I just want to make sure we're on the same plane of reality, its hobbyist hardware, that's also totally fine 🤷‍♂️
Would you say the portability of the Switch is the main reason it was such a success?
 
AMD GPU? Tough sell unless it's obscenely cheap. I would have preferred any Nvidia GPU due to DLSS. Can't game without it now in the age of shoddy UE5 ports. I'm more interested in that controller. Might replace my old but comfortable Dualshock 4.
AMD works much better on Linux, that's probably why they decided to go with it.
 
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If it's 600-700$ for the whole system seems pretty good to me
I might grab it as a light Steam / emu box for the TV basically.

Edit: It would be nice if it was say a 9060 16GB (with FSR4), but that would probably jack the cost up too much.

The only other option would be to wait till late 2026 (or even into 2027) for the new AMD APU.

Edit 2: folks should really keep in mind that Valve is a small company. They have ~400 people total that support everything else they do.

They can't support a large amount of hardware configs. And they can't expand much due to company structure.
 
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