I was honestly expecting Rick to jam that big Hilltop stick into Morgan's face when he was getting lectured about Denise. Was surprised he didn't, he didn't look happy being talked down to.
In the last two seasons, Rick has become almost as bad as the Governor when it comes to people disagreeing with his way of doing things.
Morgan and Rick's interactions would be more interesting if they weren't so extreme in their views. Morgan refuses to kill anyone and Rick is ready to kill at the drop of a hat. It's also very inconsistent, Rick was ready to kill that guy that was running away for no reason, but he took Jesus back to Alexandria even after he stole the truck from them. And that's only a few episodes apart.
Wow, I'm suddenly really glad that I'm watching a day later and not caught up in posting at the same time as everyone else, reacting in real time. I have to be really careful all day Monday about spoilers if I want to not hear about deaths/events, but I think watching it is a whole different experience, too.
I didn't hate this episode. I think character actions made sense. Rick especially kept just eyerolling away any danger. Sure, they might attack, but he thinks they got this -- but they don't. They're fine against zombies but they weren't even fine against the kind of straight on attack from the Governor. How the hell do they handle massive amounts of people watching and planning and splitting them off? They don't. They don't know how to do this at all and I think it shows.
Yep. Hell, even Eugene is all WHATEVER, Y'ALL, I'M A SURVIVOR, I'M A BAD MOTHERFUCKER NOW but they are a bunch of ill-prepared hacks in the sense that they can fight but they can't prep for this kind of war. Not yet. And that's one of the recurring themes of the franchise, these cycles of overconfidence/assumed safety answered by tragedy and horror. It's been happening constantly. It's one of the reasons I have never been a fan of Rick. His lack of realization in that arena is frustrating, but it does make for good drama and it isn't unrealistic.
I didn't grab the post to quote and I'm not going back now, but I did go back and forth on Daryl this episode. I agree with whomever said it that he's clearly not in his right mind, but that was a lot of mistakes. I think that was a weakness, but also not unbelievable. I'll accept it with a linemouth headshake. But Rosita, she's just fucking mad at the world and needs an outlet. Revenge was a convenient one. Rick thinks he's the man. So Rick, Daryl, and Rosita are all just rolling ahead without concern. Glenn and Morgan, they're trying to stop, to offer perspective, and Michonne is trying to be everyone at once, but Glenn and Michonne don't know how to fight people. Not like this. Morgan is the only one right now I'd bank on having any real sense, and he comported himself that way, too -- mostly. Mostly.
I did keep waiting for someone to get shot in all those moments they were in open spaces not looking around. Because it was dumb, really dumb, but not out of character. I don't think so, at least. Even after mowing down this many Saviors, they just don't get it, and I think it's because they simply cannot conceive of a group that large and that organized. It's outside their noetic field, let's say (in the Jim Berlin sense of it). They keep running into things that are, and they struggle through and come out and adapt with hindsight but without really learning.
I'm not fussed about what happens next episode, not rallying for this or that violent end of character/s. I just don't want them to end on a cliffhanger because it's some Jon Snow level shit and we should learn from that. Don't do it.
Question, though, and small comic spoiler/reference:
Was armor guy a shout out to the Kingdom?! GIVE ME TIGER NEXT SEASON OR GIVE ME DEATH.
ETA: This is not me defending the show no matter what, believe. I have a major hate-on for a lot of the early seasons and plenty of recent moves, like the dumpster, like splitting mid-season the way they did, etc. I think they fuck up more than they should, but I don't see this episode as one of those times, personally.
Great episode. The Carol scene on the highway was very engaging and somewhat tense. I think this episode had the least amount of zombies in the entire series.
The cliffhanger end was a bit shocking too.
Im up for a change of setting too. Maybe embark on a journey thru different places.
Morgan and Rick's interactions would be more interesting if they weren't so extreme in their views. Morgan refuses to kill anyone and Rick is ready to kill at the drop of a hat. It's also very inconsistent, Rick was ready to kill that guy that was running away for no reason, but he took Jesus back to Alexandria even after he stole the truck from them. And that's only a few episodes apart.
Morgan and Rick's interactions would be more interesting if they weren't so extreme in their views. Morgan refuses to kill anyone and Rick is ready to kill at the drop of a hat. It's also very inconsistent, Rick was ready to kill that guy that was running away for no reason, but he took Jesus back to Alexandria even after he stole the truck from them. And that's only a few episodes apart.
A contrast to Rick could be interesting, but not in the way they're handling Morgan, he's just dumb, arrogant and his actions do way more damage than good.
He talks about how the Wolf saved the doctor who was able to save Carl but forgets to mention that she wouldn't have been in that situation if it not been for Morgan saving the Wolf....
What the fuck, Morgan? These last couple of episodes have taken on some serious horror tropes.
in the season 4 finale, when the gang gets imprisoned at Terminus, did Rick utter the uncensored line "They're fucking with the wrong people" in the episode available on AMC's website? If not, why? Would AMC be breaking any law by putting profanity on their website?
Also, why can't AMC use profanities in their shows when other channels such as HBO and Showtime can? Aren't they all on cable? I thought only broadcast television couldn't use profanities.
Also also, why the fuck are there restrictions on profanities when extremely gory violence is a-ok to show explicitly?
in the season 4 finale, when the gang gets imprisoned at Terminus, did Rick utter the uncensored line "They're fucking with the wrong people" in the episode available on AMC's website? If not, why? Would AMC be breaking any law by putting profanity on their website?
Also, why can't AMC use profanities in their shows when other channels such as HBO and Showtime can? Aren't they all on cable? I thought only broadcast television couldn't use profanities.
Also also, why the fuck are there restrictions on profanities when extremely gory violence is a-ok to show explicitly?
in the season 4 finale, when the gang gets imprisoned at Terminus, did Rick utter the uncensored line "They're fucking with the wrong people" in the episode available on AMC's website? If not, why? Would AMC be breaking any law by putting profanity on their website?
Also, why can't AMC use profanities in their shows when other channels such as HBO and Showtime can? Aren't they all on cable? I thought only broadcast television couldn't use profanities.
Also also, why the fuck are there restrictions on profanities when extremely gory violence is a-ok to show explicitly?
1. The "fucking" line never aired on TV as far as I know. There is a "fucking" version out as part of the DVD/Bluray (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oORtfqsRIjw). AMC would not allow profanity on the channel or website because...
2. They had already sold the adverts for the show, and likely all the adverts were sold based on the usual (gore based) material. Throwing a "fuck" in there might not offend most watchers, but it would be enough for advertisers to throw a fit. AMC would have got into problems if a random "fuck" was uttered long after contracts/money was locked down.
3. Going forward there is the possibility they could use profanity (although it is unlikely). The only way it could be used is if it is agreed beforehand with advertisers. AMC will only agree to this if they are getting close to the same income from advertisers for each episode. My guess here is that more than a few of current advertisers and sponsors (on both Walking and Talking) would be opposed to this (no matter how silly it may be that the word carries more weight than the barbaric mutilations seen on the show). If the people paying AMC's bills dont want it, and it would cost AMC more money in the long run to find a sponsor who does not mind, there is little chance it will happens. If they can keep their profit margin, and also keep various sponsor happy that's the only chance to see such words on the show.
I remember when Rick had that line about those cannibals "screwing" with the wrong people. I had no impact at all. If he wasnt allowed to say "fuck", he shouldnt have said anything.
1. The "fucking" line never aired on TV as far as I know. There is a "fucking" version out as part of the DVD/Bluray (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oORtfqsRIjw). AMC would not allow profanity on the channel or website because...
2. They had already sold the adverts for the show, and likely all the adverts were sold based on the usual (gore based) material. Throwing a "fuck" in there might not offend most watchers, but it would be enough for advertisers to throw a fit. AMC would have got into problems if a random "fuck" was uttered long after contracts/money was locked down.
3. Going forward there is the possibility they could use profanity (although it is unlikely). The only way it could be used is if it is agreed beforehand with advertisers. AMC will only agree to this if they are getting close to the same income from advertisers for each episode. My guess here is that more than a few of current advertisers and sponsors (on both Walking and Talking) would be opposed to this (no matter how silly it may be that the word carries more weight than the barbaric mutilations seen on the show). If the people paying AMC's bills dont want it, and it would cost AMC more money in the long run to find a sponsor who does not mind, there is little chance it will happens. If they can keep their profit margin, and also keep various sponsor happy that's the only chance to see such words on the show.
Wasn't bleeped, they just dipped the audio (or blurred the word in the instance of a handwritten note). Same thing with Better Call Saul and "pig fucker."
Great episode. The Carol scene on the highway was very engaging and somewhat tense. I think this episode had the least amount of zombies in the entire series.
Season 2 had an episode that only had one walker; the one trapped in the well. And the only reason that scene was there was just so they wouldn't go a full episode with no walkers. It didn't serve the plot in any way.
I'm really close to cutting my losses on this show and giving up after this season. There is only so many episodes like this I can tolerate before my brain implodes from the stupidity. Every single character in this episode sank to Andrea level stupidity. It's infuriating to watch.
I don't even care who lives or dies anymore. I've always hated certain characters, but now, I can't think of any I still care about.
I'm also thinking she's going to lose the baby to soften the blow when Negan/Negan's folks take her out next episode. Feel like she's a primary candidate to be killed off.
I was worried they would not introduce the kingdom but this confirms it in my mind. I am stoked for some Tiger action! I Still hope Michonne gets with Ezekiel
I really hope The People Versus OJ Simpson is the start of a trend. It's going to be really painful to see them dance around Negan's proclivity for salty language.
I'm also thinking she's going to lose the baby to soften the blow when Negan/Negan's folks take her out next episode. Feel like she's a primary candidate to be killed off.
This season has annoyed me so much. The action has been great and they are making a real effort to develop and evolve the characters, but then they keep making a series of terrible decisions.
They believe Alexandria is on the brink of attack, and 5 of their best fighters take off. Glenn is constantly leaving his wife behind and not even saying goodbye to her when he runs off for the 1,000th time. Not only does Denise ignore Darryl and Rosita but they spend two minutes screaming at the top of their lungs in a completely open area. Rick alerting the savior to their presence, despite him still having a n entire barn between them. Darryl completely ignoring the fact that Glenn is warning him it's a bad idea to save him right then. Eugene being a total bitch and then Abraham leaving him to fend for himself.
For a bunch of world-weary, hardener survivors, they make a whole lot of punk ass moves that should have resulted in half of them dying this season alone.
"two great ones, two good ones and four hours of pure filler"
Its ok, but it could obviously be funnier/meanier. There´s a lot more to point and laugh about TWD.
But its a decent effort. I like Honest Trailers. Not much, but i like it
EDIT: Ahah, the hospital/Beth arc took 7 episodes! SEVEN! Oh my god
Yeah, a big part of that reason though was they had a small crew and were completely inexperienced as survivors (they developed a few tricks and Glenn could get around). With six seasons of experience and lots of help (from other communities), I wonder if they could eventually try what they did with the herd around Alexandria and potentially set up thousands of walkers on the parameter of the city as a defense and maybe use the sewer systems as transportation in or out. Risky, I agree, but if completed, that would be the ultimate protection and defense for a growing community. If they build with walkers in mind, instead of just hoping they don't show up, maybe they can keep people away for good.
Just some ideas instead of the usual -find a place out in the middle of nowhere, lose it, move on, travel through forest and open road- setting.
Would be cool to return to a city at some point, as that was the absolute best part of one of the most memorable episodes they ever filmed.
Carol and Maggie get in a fight in the woods and get captured.
Denise gives a lecture on the train tracks, gets killed.
Glenn and Michonne stop to have a chat in the woods and get caught.
When are these seemingly smart people going to stop doing stupid crap?
Also what happened to Daryl's sweet hunting/tracking skills?
This show can be so good if they had a shred of consistency.
Carol and Maggie get in a fight in the woods and get captured.
Denise gives a lecture on the train tracks, gets killed.
Glenn and Michonne stop to have a chat in the woods and get caught.
When are these seemingly smart people going to stop doing stupid crap?
Also what happened to Daryl's sweet hunting/tracking skills?
This show can be so good if they had a shred of consistency.
Lack of consistency has been the biggest issue this season. Characters don't even feel individualistic at all. If Carol can essentially become a Morgan, what the hell is the point of even trying to write content for anyone? Why should we care about them?
Daryl gets ambushed by Dwight who apparently wields a pistol that turns him into a ninja, and Carol cries about killing people purely out of defense after about four seasons of murdering with almost no remorse? Who are these people?
Lack of consistency has been the biggest issue this season. Characters don't even feel individualistic at all. If Carol can essentially become a Morgan, what the hell is the point of even trying to write content for anyone? Why should we care about them?
Daryl gets ambushed by Dwight who apparently wields a pistol that turns him into a ninja, and Carol cries about killing people purely out of defense after about four seasons of murdering with almost no remorse? Who are these people?
People are still saying this? She has always felt remorse and guilt, even as far back as admitting what she did to Tyrese and letting him get justice if he wanted to. She was crying and emotional as she killed Lizzie. She cried as she killed the Alexandrian who was attacked by the wolf and was visibly affected by her actions at the end of that episode
And she wasn't crying about killing people. She wasn't upset about the action, but about herself. She was upset for knowing what she can do and that she can do it so easily, how she has changed, and doesn't want to go further down that path. But she will kill to survive.
Lack of consistency has been the biggest issue this season. Characters don't even feel individualistic at all. If Carol can essentially become a Morgan, what the hell is the point of even trying to write content for anyone? Why should we care about them?
Daryl gets ambushed by Dwight who apparently wields a pistol that turns him into a ninja, and Carol cries about killing people purely out of defense after about four seasons of murdering with almost no remorse? Who are these people?
I think the consistency issue goes way back, though and it's actually been better this season.
This Carol thing I can kind of understand though. I'm willing to wait and see how it plays out. I just think she's having a crisis of conscience. I think maybe she'll die in a blaze of glory trying to save Glenn & Co.
It's just maddening when these characters act like fools outside of the walls of Alexandria. They know Negan's people are looking for them.
The Dwight stuff was just awful. It would've been much better if there was a trap set up for all of them. An elaborate trap that showed the viewer just how organized and dangerous Negan's group is.
The show has almost always been woefully inconsistent and the characters always written in contrived and stupid ways to serve the plot. The popularity of the show really surprises me in a lot of ways, that being one of them. The show can be really good and has even been great occasionally, but it's baseline is more in the average to below average range. That its a ratings beast never ceases to puzzle me.
From my experience with videogames Glocks can do that Thought it was a bit weird too.
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Didn't like the episode and thought it was boring to be honest. It was mostly set up but it was done in a way I didn't feel very engaging. Ending was okay and Daryl is gonna survive, Dwight said 'You'll be alright' or something.
People are still saying this? She has always felt remorse and guilt, even as far back as admitting what she did to Tyrese and letting him get justice if he wanted to. She was crying and emotional as she killed Lizzie. She cried as she killed the Alexandrian who was attacked by the wolf and was visibly affected by her actions at the end of that episode
And she wasn't crying about killing people. She wasn't upset about the action, but about herself. She was upset for knowing what she can do and that she can do it so easily, how she has changed, and doesn't want to go further down that path. But she will kill to survive.
It makes total sense to feel remorse for murdering a child, and it makes sense that she'd feel extreme guilt living beside the person she indirectly and negatively impacted by her decision to kill two people, one who was extremely close with Tyreese. She didn't seem to feel much remorse about the act itself (remember the conversation she had with Rick about killing them and how it "had to be done") but rather the impact on Tyreese (his belief that she was a good person and was helping him get through a terrible tragedy). Again, I never said she feels no remorse about anything she does but she had absolutely no problem initiating a premeditated murdering spree in Terminus and hiding her identity to kill invading wolves.
She was upset that she had to kill more people, which makes ABSOLUTELY no sense, considering she went out prepared to kill again (sewed a gun inside of her jacket).
Again, this is just flat out poor writing. At least make her sneak around in the forest with no intention of killing again instead of going on a suicide mission down main street with the most obvious "look at me, I'm an escaping survivor" indication you could possibly give.
She had a better chance not killing again just by simply staying in Alexandria. Instead, she murders a few people, what, in a matter of minutes - an hour of leaving? It's just bizarre.
I think the consistency issue goes way back, though and it's actually been better this season.
This Carol thing I can kind of understand though. I'm willing to wait and see how it plays out. I just think she's having a crisis of conscience. I think maybe she'll die in a blaze of glory trying to save Glenn & Co.
It's just maddening when these characters act like fools outside of the walls of Alexandria. They know Negan's people are looking for them.
The Dwight stuff was just awful. It would've been much better if there was a trap set up for all of them. An elaborate trap that showed the viewer just how organized and dangerous Negan's group is.
Yeah, this is really how it should have all gone down. Instead the writers shoehorn the characters into stupid situations that they should realistically be able to avoid at this point just so they can set up further plot advancement.
It makes total sense to feel remorse for murdering a child, and it makes sense that she'd feel extreme guilt living beside the person she indirectly and negatively impacted by her decision to kill two people, one who was extremely close with Tyreese. She didn't seem to feel much remorse about the act itself (remember the conversation she had with Rick about killing them and how it "had to be done") but rather the impact on Tyreese (his belief that she was a good person and was helping him get through a terrible tragedy). Again, I never said she feels no remorse about anything she does but she had absolutely no problem initiating a premeditated murdering spree in Terminus and hiding her identity to kill invading wolves.
She was upset that she had to kill more people, which makes ABSOLUTELY no sense, considering she went out prepared to kill again (sewed a gun inside of her jacket).
Again, this is just flat out poor writing. At least make her sneak around in the forest with no intention of killing again instead of going on a suicide mission down main street with the most obvious "look at me, I'm an escaping survivor" indication you could possibly give.
She was upset about killing, doesn't mean she wasn't going to be prepared to kill to survive. If anything, Carol isn't stupid. As she said in the note, the reason she left was to leave behind the influences that would make her kill more and more, aka protecting her new family.
People are still saying this? She has always felt remorse and guilt, even as far back as admitting what she did to Tyrese and letting him get justice if he wanted to. She was crying and emotional as she killed Lizzie. She cried as she killed the Alexandrian who was attacked by the wolf and was visibly affected by her actions at the end of that episode
And she wasn't crying about killing people. She wasn't upset about the action, but about herself. She was upset for knowing what she can do and that she can do it so easily, how she has changed, and doesn't want to go further down that path. But she will kill to survive.
The times when she has showed emotion in the past were when her actions affected other people. She felt guilty about Tyrese, she treated Lizzie as a surrogate daughter, and she felt bad about having to kill a woman in her community. Those always felt like honest emotional moments because even though she's a stone cold killer, she is also very loving towards those she considers family.
But she's never showed regret for killing to defend herself or her community. For most of the series she's been more cold-blooded than Rick. I mean she was teaching eight year-olds how to shoot guns and wield knives. So this "I don't want to kill anymore" breakdown she's having does not connect with the writing of her character we've seen up to now. It might've if they had written that transition correctly, but it was just as sudden and feels just as much a conventient plot device as everything else this season.
Thought it was a bit weird too.