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[ThisGuy]

More White People?

Checkmate

And here I was playing checkers. All this egg on my face.

 

[Nepenthe]

I'm sorry you feel that way and I can't discount your experience since i don't live in the US. But some of my good friends are white people and they are thoughtful and kind people.

But I don't know your experience.

I don't really need the apology. Regardless, being a kind person has nothing to do with whether or not you are racist in the same way that being a nice guy doesn't ensure you'll be laid by every woman you come across. Most racists are indeed actually kind people.

 

[Cagey]

bullshit

Privilege is like getting some passive perks you get for honkeyness. It doesn't mean success or a life free of hardship.

I find that's the first issue when I discuss "white privilege" as a concept with white people who've not heard the term before.

 

[LionPride]

I'm sorry you feel that way and I can't discount your experience since i don't live in the US. But some of my good friends are white people and they are thoughtful and kind people.

But I don't know your experience.

I know thoughtful and kind white people too, I also know complete assholes who act like they don't have a head up in society from birth just for the simple fact they are white and I am black

I don't really need the apology. Regardless, being a kind person has nothing to do with whether or not you are racist in the same way that being a nice guy doesn't ensure you'll be laid by every woman you come across. Most racists are indeed actually kind people.

SO FUCKING TRUE

 

[inner-G]

Honest question: Isn't saying all white people are racist a racist comment in itself?

Yes.

It's literally making a judgmental statement about an entire group of people based solely on skin color.

 

[gdt]

It gives me a sinking feeling in my chest when people make generalizations about me just because of the color of my skin.

But dont worry about it my feelings dont count because I'm the white devil. Please just continue educating me about how I was born a monster and always will be.

Tell us how you really feel.

 

[ishibear]

I don't really need the apology. Regardless, being a kind person has nothing to do with whether or not you are racist in the same way that being a nice guy doesn't ensure you'll be laid by every woman you come across. Most racists are indeed actually kind people.

You're awesome. ❤

 

[Nepenthe]

Yes.

It's literally judging an entire group of people based solely on skin color.

We're not judging the skin color. We're judging the sociopolitical, economic, and cultural benefits that come arbitrarily attached to said skin color due to centuries of European colonialism.

 

[7DollarHagane]

I agree with this in the way that human nature is for us to group with people like ourselves. I don't know if that means racist.

Is a Caucasian that is born in a country where Caucasians are not the majority also racist?

Is someone who has one white parent or grandparent partially racist?

 

[MHWilliams]

Everyone holds a bit of prejudicial racist tendencies.

In the recording, the teacher asks: “Am I racist? And I say yeah. I don’t want to be. It’s not like I choose to be racist, but do I do things because of the way I was raised.”

Sure.

“To be white is to be racist, period,” the teacher says.

No. The focus makes the statement seem that it's white people only. I certainly wouldn't say this as a high school teacher.

 

[Replicant]

I don't really need the apology. Regardless, being a kind person has nothing to do with whether or not you are racist in the same way that being a nice guy doesn't ensure you'll be laid by every woman you come across. Most racists are indeed actually kind people.

I know thoughtful and kind white people too, I also know complete assholes who act like they don't have a head up in society from birth just for the simple fact they are white and I am black

I'm just responding to the statement one poster said where white people don't have an ounce of good thoughts towards POC, which I don't find to be true.

But then again that's MY experience. Judging from what's unveiling in the US, the opposite experience maybe applicable to other POC. But that doesn't make it a universal truth.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

I'm sorry, I'm not following. Can you please explain, fully admit I'm pre-drinking for the debate but I'm not trying to be obtuse.

Didn't mean to ignore, was watching Clinton babysit Trump

I don't think the teacher was right in saying that all white people are racist, even if he was trying to say there's white privilege in a really clumsy way.

That said, in light of the history of America acting like substituting one of the groups that has been shat on throughout American history for "white" in that statement is intellectually dishonest at best.

 

[Zantetsuken]

The offended student told KFOR in an interview that she felt picked on because she is white.

Well shit. A day in the life for me.

 

[Brianimaniac]

I have prejudiced thoughts sometimes, but because I'm educated and have empathy, I check those thoughts when they arise. I think about why those thoughts are irrational, illogical, and/or harmful, and I think about the situation or issue from the perspective of the affected group or individual. I would be happier with myself if I didn't have to take those two seconds to get to the right place on occasion, but I'm getting better at making peace with what I can and can't control about my brain.

 

[AlteredBeast]

Everyone has a little bit of bias in them, i think. Nurture and nature does that to a person. My home was one where there were never racial jokes said, nor tolerated. I never heard my parents refer to any of my black friends by anything but their name. I am grateful my old-ass parents were raised right, because it easily could have gone the other way.

 

[CloudyTuba]

Well shit. A day in the life for me.

Everyone knows that the most convincing way to get people to stop treating each other badly and stop making generalizations about each other is to treat people badly and make generalizations about them. It's okay to hurt people as long as someone else is hurting more, because this is a contest.

Tell us how you really feel.

Is there something you want to say?

Everyone holds a bit of prejudicial racist tendencies.

In the recording, the teacher asks: “Am I racist? And I say yeah. I don’t want to be. It’s not like I choose to be racist, but do I do things because of the way I was raised.”

Sure.

“To be white is to be racist, period,” the teacher says.

No. The focus makes the statement seem that it's white people only. I certainly wouldn't say this as a high school teacher.

Agreed. If he wants to talk about inherent bias that almost everyone has in one way or another, sure. Everyone picks some up along the way.
But to single out specifically white people and state that they are all as a fact racists, that's choosing your words very poorly and making a terrible point.

 

[ahoyhoy]

Well... There is this:

What I see here is that there are a lot of liberal men in my home state of Maryland.

 

[Yagharek]

I read the OP news article and was reminded of a documentary series.

http://www.janeelliott.com

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nqv9k3jbtYU

This lady divides people by the colour of their eyes and puts them in positions where they have to experience prejudice and treatment that racism victims face daily.

I thought the teacher was trying to do that. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

Reminder to non Americans trying to make the best sense of this, that white in the US is not as much of a race as it is an ethnicity, so a white person in America is white because of culture. Of course biology can't create biases, but culture does.

 

[cryptosporidium]

I don't really need the apology. Regardless, being a kind person has nothing to do with whether or not you are racist in the same way that being a nice guy doesn't ensure you'll be laid by every woman you come across. Most racists are indeed actually kind people.

This is true. My boss fucking loved me and was nice as could be but god damn he was racist. like he would announce for instance "that n*gger in the seahawks is pretty damn good but the ch*nk in the blue jays is better" in the lunchroom full of people. it was a blue collar job so it kinda came with the territory though the company as a whole is trying hard to bring in minorities (I think there is like 10 maybe out of 200 employess right now that are POC?). Funny how much he hates brown people too since im half (obviously didnt tell em)

 

[FUME5]

We're not judging the skin color. We're judging the sociopolitical, economic, and cultural benefits that come arbitrarily attached to said skin color due to centuries of European colonialism.

The entire debate in this thread is based on her statement of "To be white is to be racist, full stop". Not "To be white is to be the beneficiary of several hundred years of sociopolitical, economic, and cultural benefits that come arbitrarily attached to being born with the same colour skin as those who have held the reigns of power in that time".

Reminder to non Americans trying to make the best sense of this, that white in the US is not as much of a race as it is an ethnicity, so a white person in America is white because of culture. Of course biology can't create biases, but culture does.

I'm of the same race as everyone other human on this planet, on top of that, I'm sure their are many studies that would show a biological basis for bias towards / against other ethnicities as well as cultural.

 

[GamerJM]

I mean, he's right (for reasons already stated in this topic). Systemic racism basically means we're all racist to some extent.

Why is this in the news?

 

[fart town usa]

No, just no.

I've heard this theory before and it's ridiculous.

 

[besada]

No, just no.

I've heard this theory before and it's ridiculous.

Could you explain why you disagree?

 

[Vilix]

This confirms the Clintons were racists along.

 

[Vulcano's assistant]

The entire debate in this thread is based on her statement of "To be white is to be racist, full stop". Not "To be white is to be the beneficiary of several hundred years of sociopolitical, economic, and cultural benefits that come arbitrarily attached to being born with the same colour skin as those who have held the reigns of power in that time".



I'm of the same race as everyone other human on this planet, on top of that, I'm sure their are many studies that would show a biological basis for bias towards / against other ethnicities.

Possibly, but seems like something rather complicated to control on an experimental design. And of course then there is the blending definitions of how much is biology, and whether social structures fall inside of it.

 

[fart town usa]

Could you explain why you disagree?

Because to be born whatever color is outside of one's control. It's entirely possible to recognize white privilege and make a solid effort to correct these instances in society.

We live in a society with deeply rooted norms, for better or worse. Simply living your life doesn't make one a racist. It's an absurd statement. I honestly think it's offensive and accomplishes nothing besides alienating people who might otherwise be open to hearing about and contemplating the concept of white privilege/racist institutions.

It's simply a way for educated white liberals to feel good about themselves and take the moral high ground.

Social issues slowly correct themselves over time, though they also create new issues in society in terms of government regulation. The Left has taken up the mantle of creating new social issue arguments when I feel like the focus needs to be on the environment/economy. I think these narratives are a waste of time.

 

[Already Torn]

Ehh, I feel like racism has more of an intentional action with it as opposed to implicit bias or privilege.

I guess I don't see how it's more productive to say "all white people are racists" than to have a conversation about either of those two things, and how they apply to white people more than other races because white is seen as the "Normal" in America.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Social issues slowly correct themselves over time

thanks for the laugh!

 

[JPLMD]

Don't agree with the statement he makes, but do agree with the general premise that if you are born white you automatically have privileges that minorities don't in this country.

But I think most people in this thread agree that the latter statement isn't up for debate. I felt he had a poor choice of words trying to convey his message.

 

[Shamrock7r]

Using the word "racist", in this context, is incorrect and fairly insulting. Everyone, regardless of race, is raised with biases. Taken in that context, what the teacher said is somewhat correct, but to use such a strong and dangerously labeling word as "racists" while specifying only white people, and essentially generalizing all of them to that word isn't right imo.
If you have to decipher what the teacher meant because of the way he chose to articulate it (which is very negative), the battle of making the point can be largely lost. I think in general, conversations of prejudice, bias, and racism can benefit from better clarity and responsible use of words that have a lot of weight behind them, when having these types of conversations.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

Yes.

It's literally making a judgmental statement about an entire group of people based solely on skin color.

^

Don't agree with the statement he makes, but do agree with the general premise that if you are born white you automatically have privileges that minorities don't in this country.

But I think most people in this thread agree that the latter statement isn't up for debate. I felt he had a poor choice of words trying to convey his message.

Yeah, your first sentence alone is like, "well, obviously." You don't frame a legitimate argument with a blanket controversial statement like that. It makes the whole thing sound ridiculous. It reminds me of the video "Why I don't need feminism" that had legitimate complaints about the problems men can face experiencing gender roles in society that really had nothing to do with feminism and what it stands for. It (understandably) made the argument lose weight right at the beginning. It's like "LOOK! CONTROVERSIAL EXTREME STATEMENT! Oh wait this is what I actually meant to say."

The message I'd give to these people is: don't play with fire. These are serious issues.

 

[Enzom21]

Because to be born whatever color is outside of one's control. It's entirely possible to recognize white privilege and make a solid effort to correct these instances in society.

We live in a society with deeply rooted norms, for better or worse. Simply living your life doesn't make one a racist. It's an absurd statement. I honestly think it's offensive and accomplishes nothing besides alienating people who might otherwise be open to hearing about and contemplating the concept of white privilege/racist institutions.

It's simply a way for educated white liberals to feel good about themselves and take the moral high ground.

Social issues slowly correct themselves over time, though they also create new issues in society in terms of government regulation. The Left has taken up the mantle of creating new social issue arguments when I feel like the focus needs to be on the environment/economy. I think these narratives are a waste of time.

No the fuck they do not. Social issues are only corrected when people fight to have them corrected.
Did the Civil Rights Movement just happen all on its own or were white people forced to change?

 

[Montresor]

To claim that "To be white is to be racist, period" is racist, ignorant, and misguided, period.

 

[fart town usa]

thanks for the laugh!

Are you kidding me?

Yes, there has been no progress whatsoever in the history of this country...

I'm talking centuries to correct unjust institutions. Not years or decades. That's life, or are we to just ignore abolitionists and other groups that worked towards social causes and died before seeing aspects of their platforms adopted?

Have some perspective.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Are you kidding me?

Yes, there has been no progress whatsoever in the history of this country...

I'm talking centuries to correct unjust institutions. Not years or decades. That's life, or are we to just ignore abolitionists and other groups that worked towards social causes and died before seeing aspects of their platforms adopted?

Have some perspective.

That's not "correcting themselves."

That's people working to correct them, which you were railing against.

 

[fart town usa]

No the fuck they do not. Social issues are only corrected when people fight to have them corrected.
Did the Civil Rights Movement just happen all on its own or were white people forced to change?

That's what I was implying. Calm down, I just said the same thing you did in a separate post.

The hive mind here at times...

 

[Etrian Oddity]

Could you explain why you disagree?

Because the concept that being born of a certain ethnicity automatically makes you a racist is itself a racist, bigoted and flawed statement?

 

[fart town usa]

That's not "correcting themselves."

That's people working to correct them, which you were railing against.

I said that in the post you just quoted. Read it.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

I said that in the post you just quoted. Read it.

ok...

Because to be born whatever color is outside of one's control. It's entirely possible to recognize white privilege and make a solid effort to correct these instances in society.

We live in a society with deeply rooted norms, for better or worse. Simply living your life doesn't make one a racist. It's an absurd statement. I honestly think it's offensive and accomplishes nothing besides alienating people who might otherwise be open to hearing about and contemplating the concept of white privilege/racist institutions.

It's simply a way for educated white liberals to feel good about themselves and take the moral high ground.

Social issues slowly correct themselves over time, though they also create new issues in society in terms of government regulation. The Left has taken up the mantle of creating new social issue arguments when I feel like the focus needs to be on the environment/economy. I think these narratives are a waste of time.

Do you even remember what you wrote

 

[Enzom21]

That's what I was implying. Calm down, I just said the same thing you did in a separate post.

The hive mind here at times...

No the fuck it was not. People being forced to change is not "Social issues slowly correct themselves over time."
What hive mind would that be? Is there a particular group of people on GAF that is a monolith?

 

[The Faceless Master]

You should fill in the blanks for us.

a victim of systemic racism

 

[orthodoxy1095]

People generally aren't receptive to the former statement because people literally do not believe in the idea of white privilege and institutional racism because the idea of a cultural issue inherently implicates everyone to some degree, and no one wants to be on the hook for others' suffering or be faced with hard introspection. Subsequently, I don't think white people as a whole are so fragile that they cannot handle truth that may be stated more bluntly than necessary. The most entertaining example I have of this is the Blue Eyes, Brown Eyes experiment. Put white people in an unexpected microcosm of societal racism and while some break down, leave, or don't get it, many others do get it. They gain the empathy necessary for building bridges due to the pain associated with direct experience and thus serve not to want to do it again.

There are more conducive ways to expose white people to the truth of racism without doing it in the completely unethical form of Blue Eyes/Brown Eyes.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

There are more conducive ways to expose white people to the truth of racism without doing it in the completely unethical form of Blue Eyes/Brown Eyes.

What makes it unethical

 

[fart town usa]

ok...



Do you even remember what you wrote

The other post, I also said that you can recognize these instances and make a solid effort to change them, in the post youbjust quoted. Sorry I didn't word it specifically in a way that's appropriate to you. The gaf hive mind, it's just insane and really beneath the discourse that this forum aims to achieve.

You're essentially arguing against someone who is on the right side of history but are butt hurt cause I don't think all white people are inherently racist.

 

[Infinite]

There are more conducive ways to expose white people to the truth of racism without doing it in the completely unethical form of Blue Eyes/Brown Eyes.

Masterful goalpost shifting.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

The other post, I also said that you can recognize these instances and make a solid effort to change them, in the post youbjust quoted. Sorry I didn't word it specifically in a way that's appropriate to you. The gaf hive mind, it's just insane and really beneath the discourse that this forum aims to achieve.

You're essentially arguing against someone who is on the right side of history but are butt hurt cause I don't think all white people are inherently racist.

You're talking about "hive mind" and "butt hurt" and claiming others are discoursing at a low level.

Ok

 

[fart town usa]

No the fuck it was not. People being forced to change is not "Social issues slowly correct themselves over time."
What hive mind would that be? Is there a particular group of people on GAF that is a monolith?

The hive mind of let's dog pile whoever doesn't meet our standard.

Read my posts on this thread. It's obvious I was acknowledging that people make an effort to change social issues. Jesus dude.

 

[FUME5]

a victim of systemic racism

There is a whole wide world outside of America, are you trying to claim that ethnic Chinese people are a victim of systemic racism in China?

Or perhaps, that by virtue of both sides being white skinned, there was no systemic racism in Bosnia (or would that be double systemic racism)?

 

[Infinite]

The hive mind of let's dog pile whoever doesn't meet our standard.

Read my posts on this thread. It's obvious I was acknowledging that people make an effort to change social issues. Jesus dude.

I hate when people do this, complaining about dog piling and hive minds because a few people just so happens to disagree with you on something. It just can't be because you're debating and multiple people disagree with what you said. Nope they're just "butt hurt" and have a vendetta against you. Just own your shit and take the L. Better yet come up with a useful retort without winning about how everyone is somehow out to get you and only you.

There is a whole wide world outside of America, are you trying to claim that ethnic Chinese people are a victim of systemic racism in China?

Or perhaps, that by virtue of both sides being white skinned, there was no systemic racism in Bosnia (or would that be double systemic racism)?

This thread is about an event that happened in America and therefore exists in an American context. Your counter point is utterly useless to this discussion.