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[pigeon]

Has Obama ever performed well without a teleprompter? I remember the press conference with David Cameron, Obama was akward there too. He's not good at formulating on the go (afaik).

Most of the people clinging to the idea that Obama would win were remembering him at the Reublican retreat in, I think, 2010.

 

[Agent Ironside]

Don't forget the "You're spending your wedding anniversary here with me" zinger from Mittens. Pretty slick.

 

[The_Darkest_Red]

Perhaps I'm a bit too abrasive but I dislike the attitude that we should continue an energy policy that is detrimental to both our health and environment simply because a small minority in VA would have to find new jobs elsewhere.

I hate to sound rude but when you make comments like this it really makes it sound like you're speaking out of ignorance. How much do you actually know about the coal industry besides what you occasionally pick up from the media about how dirty it is? A coal company is the second largest employer in terms of jobs in the entire state of West Virginia. This is not a small minority we're talking about here.

 

[Sealda]

I have to say it is very odd that he kept his head down taking notes most of the debate. He or his team would have to known this would be split-screened for most of it. If they didn't they should be fired.

I noticed that too. It made Obama look completely uninterested. Even though he was doing something important, i bet, taking notes of Romneys speech. One could even argue it made Obama look like he was bowing his head down in shame. I mean, thats how it almost looked like.

Obama made several weird things all through the debate.

*Looking down, taking notes, which made him look uninterested or just not there to meet Romney face to face

*Making faces to Jim and basically not having any contact with Romney at all

*Talking directly into the camera. Made it seem like Obama thinks he is still in the protected environment of the WH.

*Talking to slow and the uhms and ahms made it seem he was just making up crap as he went. Literally all the hype for Obama died instantly, when he did everything but answering the first question asked.


Romney did a really really great debate. It is not about what they were saying, it is how they said it and what confidence they showed.

 

[ElectricBlue187]

I hate to sound rude but when you make comments like this it really makes it sound like you're speaking out of ignorance. How much do you actually know about the coal industry besides what you occasionally pick up from the media about how dirty it is? A coal company is the second largest employer in terms of jobs in the entire state of West Virginia. This is not a small minority we're talking about here.

It is a small minority when you look at it from the national level

 

[Sealda]

I have to say it is very odd that he kept his head down taking notes most of the debate. He or his team would have to known this would be split-screened for most of it. If they didn't they should be fired.

I noticed that too. It made Obama look completely uninterested. Even though he was doing something important, i bet, taking notes of Romneys speech. One could even argue it made Obama look like he was bowing his head down in shame. I mean, thats how it almost looked like.

Obama made several weird things all through the debate.

*Looking down, taking notes, which made him look uninterested or just not there to meet Romney face to face

*Making faces to Jim and basically not having any contact with Romney at all

*Talking directly into the camera. Made it seem like Obama thinks he is still in the protected environment of the WH.

*Talking to slow and the uhms and ahms made it seem he was just making up crap as he went. Literally all the hype for Obama died instantly, when he did everything but answering the first question asked.


Romney did a really really great debate. It is not about what they were saying, it is how they said it and what confidence they showed.

The key symbol, was Romney staying on stage with his family. While Obama and Michelle rushed off stage. Made it look as if Romney had won or something.

 

[pigeon]

Perhaps I'm a bit too abrasive but I dislike the attitude that we should continue an energy policy that is detrimental to both our health and environment simply because a small minority in VA would have to find new jobs elsewhere.

In fairness, it isn't a small minority. Appalachia's economy is based on mining, lumber, and manufacturing. ALL of them are shrinking industries. If we don't do something, we're just creating a zone of instutionalized poverty, and that's without actively closing down coal mines. So, while I think there are real and urgent reasons to change our energy policy, I understand where DarkestRed is coming from. We need to find a way to build a new post-industrial economy in these areas, because America is becoming a post-industrial country. Think of it as a model for a process we'll eventually have to apply all over America. (Except for California where we already did.)

 

[The_Darkest_Red]

It is a small minority when you look at it from the national level

So do you have some numbers to back up this blatant disregard for thousands of people's only viable option of livelihood or are you just making this stuff up as you go?

In fairness, it isn't a small minority. Appalachia's economy is based on mining, lumber, and manufacturing. ALL of them are shrinking industries. If we don't do something, we're just creating a zone of instutionalized poverty, and that's without actively closing down coal mines. So, while I think there are real and urgent reasons to change our energy policy, I understand where DarkestRed is coming from. We need to find a way to build a new post-industrial economy in these areas, because America is becoming a post-industrial country. Think of it as a model for a process we'll eventually have to apply all over America. (Except for California where we already did.)

Yes, you have a much better understanding of the issue here. Although I should point out that the "mining" industry isn't really shrinking (as far as I know) since there will always be a need and demand for raw materials. The domestic market for coal mining certainly is, though, particularly for steam coal which is used for power generation. A large portion of coal (namely metallurgical coal) mined in the Appalachian basin is also used in the production of steel as well, and that particular market is still very viable.

 

[Downhome]

I noticed that too. It made Obama look completely uninterested. Even though he was doing something important, i bet, taking notes of Romneys speech. One could even argue it made Obama look like he was bowing his head down in shame. I mean, thats how it almost looked like.

Obama made several weird things all through the debate.

*Looking down, taking notes, which made him look uninterested or just not there to meet Romney face to face

*Making faces to Jim and basically not having any contact with Romney at all

*Talking directly into the camera. Made it seem like Obama thinks he is still in the protected environment of the WH.

*Talking to slow and the uhms and ahms made it seem he was just making up crap as he went. Literally all the hype for Obama died instantly, when he did everything but answering the first question asked.


Romney did a really really great debate. It is not about what they were saying, it is how they said it and what confidence they showed.

Yes, this, all of this.

I can't remember the last time that an American President came across as so lost, so clueless, with almost no confidence at all. It was a pathetic display, and certainly not the way you want your leader to come across, even if you don't agree with him. Take out his points and his positions, no matter if you agree with him or not. Going on just body language, his method of speaking, all of that last night - it just didn't come off as anything close to Presidential, as a leader, and it should have embarrassed everyone.

I do not agree with a lot of Obama's positions, but I at least want him to come across as a leader that we all can, and should, respect.

I fully expect to see a TOTALLY different Obama in the next debate. Mitt Romney better not let his guard down, and he better be ready.

 

[strobogo]

The next one is the town hall, right? Obama's biggest strength is his personal interactions and ability to connect with normal people. Romney's biggest weakness is his personal interaction and ability to connect with normal people.

I think the next one is going to be what all the Obama supporters with this one. I expect massive awkwardness from Romney and probably people in the audience pressing him harder than Obama.

 

[Patryn]

Well if this were true then Obama's tactic isnt a very smart one. Why would you play possum in a domestic policy debate? Aka probably the most important issue in the election.

Because the content of what the debate is doesn't really matter that much. I mean, look at Romney. He really didn't say much of anything, yet he won last night.

Also, they could be thinking that it doesn't matter who won the first leg, it only matters who won the last leg. If Obama dominates the last two debates, everyone will forget that Romney won this one.

Basically, it boils down to "What have you done for me lately?"

Sure, the absolutely most optimal narrative is dominating all the debates, or even two of the three, and Romney's in pole position for that. But don't underestimate the value of winning the last debate. That's the one that will have the lasting impression, because it's the last one.

 

[Vicetrailia]

I feel that people are giving Romney the benefit of the doubt, because his policies were not on point. At no point was I convinced that his actions would make life better (specifics, no hand waves). It was a lot of the same old. But he did look confident, spoke well and was presidential. He actually had a some debate swag.

Obama needs to cements why he needs another for years, and act like he's happy to actually be at the debates. He beat Romney on Obamacare, have that same "passion" for the other topics, also work on your closing statement. Don't mention again how you've made mistakes. That was a good tool to use at the DNC, no more.

 

[Byakuya769]

This thread has become a joke. You'd think Obama pissed himself on stage. He lost on optics, but Hillary cleaned his clock early too. He'll be fine and hasn't even touched obvious attack lines.

 

[Agent Ironside]

The next one is the town hall, right? Obama's biggest strength is his personal interactions and ability to connect with normal people. Romney's biggest weakness is his personal interaction and ability to connect with normal people.

I think the next one is going to be what all the Obama supporters with this one. I expect massive awkwardness from Romney and probably people in the audience pressing him harder than Obama.

Up until now. I don't know though, I think Romney proved that he may be capable of connecting with people after last night. It will be most interesting.

 

[ElectricBlue187]

So do you have some numbers to back up this blatant disregard for thousands of people's only viable option of livelihood or are you just making this stuff up as you go?

WHO says coal pollution shortens the lives of a million people a year, worldwide. That's a far more convincing argument to me than your blatant appeal to emotion.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Up until now. I don't know though, I think Romney proved that he may be capable of connecting with people after last night. It will be most interesting.

I think he did prove that, even though it's a lie. He came off as caring.

 

[WeAreStarStuff]

As someone who pretty much despises all politicians (at least at this high a level) for being the whores of special interest and mascots to corporations that they are, I must say that Romney ‘won’ this debate – he really surprised me as I was not expecting much from him. Sure Romney was lying through his teeth, but Obama isn’t exactly the minister of truth himself. The world will not be a better place under either man, and I wish people actually were of mind to look into the measure of what they were saying, instead of the facades spewing tripe to get elected.

Obama saying what needs to be done, as if he hasn’t been POTUS for years, and Romney saying whatever sounds good – this is the summation of American politics in a nutshell, and it’s depressing as hell. It’s much like when you go to an incredible job interview; you’ll say whatever it takes to get your foot into the door, and people are often hired for how they present themselves vs. qualifications, and etc. Not even sure where I’m going with this; I’ll just shutup now.

Spoiler

We are, all of us, doomed.

 

[pigeon]

Up until now. I don't know though, I think Romney proved that he may be capable of connecting with people after last night. It will be most interesting.

We'll see. As always, Romney's weakness is the unexpected -- you could see just how much he'd prepared for this debate. Individual undecided voters are about as unexpected as you can get.

 

[The Lamonster]

Surprised to see the media consensus this morning. I thought Obama had a clear win. I guess aggressive lying and unprofessionalism is valued over intellect now?

It has begun.

 

[The_Darkest_Red]

WHO says coal pollution shortens the lives of a million people a year, worldwide. That's a far more convincing argument to me than your blatant appeal to emotion.

Ha, I'd love to see the details on that study. And I'm not trying to appeal to emotion, there are real tangible consequences that are happening to people in this area of the country as a result of increased regulations on the coal industry. If caring about supplying people with a job and a way to support their family is an appeal to emotion to you then I'm not sure we'll get much further in this conversation.

Let's be honest; there is no point in us having this conversation because you don't care about people in this area of the country. They are just a small minority to you and therefore their livelihood is not worth considering. If that is your stance then that's fine, but don't expect me to support a candidate who also feels that way.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

This thread has become a joke. You'd think Obama pissed himself on stage.

Eh it was more like he knowingly went out of the house with a huge mustard stain on his shirt, noticed it as he was in the driveway, and said, "Screw it...I'm already in the car."

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

-Obama didn't mention 4.5 million jobs created
-Obama didn't go into further detail about how Republicans from Bush Sr. to Romney wanted an individual mandate
-It seems like President Clinton is the only Democrat who has the balls to say on TV that empirically, Democrats create more jobs than Republicans
-No Bain
-No 47%
-Obama didn't attack his constant changing positions

As far as Romney goes, he sure made himself look like a moderate centrist.

Obama looked like he was tired, and he didn't want to be POTUS anymore.

 

[djplaeskool]

The word of the day appears to be "professorial"

 

[OriginofHysteria]

Because the content of what the debate is doesn't really matter that much. I mean, look at Romney. He really didn't say much of anything, yet he won last night.

Also, they could be thinking that it doesn't matter who won the first leg, it only matters who won the last leg. If Obama dominates the last two debates, everyone will forget that Romney won this one.

Basically, it boils down to "What have you done for me lately?"

Sure, the absolutely most optimal narrative isc dominating all the debates, or even two of the three, and Romney's in pole position for that. But don't underestimate the value of winning the last debate. That's the one that will have the lasting impression, because it's the last one.

Yeah ill agree with you that the content does not really matter that much, but I think that's only to those who are invested in politics. I would bet that to the average viewer who was like 'hay there's an election this year' that content holds more value and generally who they are aiming at. That's why I still think that debates are one of the more important spectacles in an election.

But also ill agreee with you on the importance of the last two debates. The town hall meeting one is a debate that Romney has to win if he wants to go for those independent states in my opinion.

 

[teruterubozu]

Obama looked like he was tired, and he didn't want to be POTUS anymore.

This is what bothers me the most. It's like he was saying to Romney, "You really want this job?"
It was weird.

 

[phosphor112]

People know enough about the 47%. Obama and team knew Romney would have a manufactured response to it so why give Romney a nice soundbyte to refute the video to the President's face.

What he should've done is call out the blatant lies about medicare, education, and taxes.

No they don't. If Romney can lie the whole time and win, then Obama should be able to attack every single bullshit moment from Romney this whole campaign. But he missed the opportunity. It was a disaster.

 

[Bulbo Urethral Baggins]

This is what bothers me the most. It's like he was saying to Romney, "You really want this job?"
It was weird.

It reminded me of George HW Bush's debates against Clinton. He just didn't have energy or seem like he wanted the job anymore.

 

[PS3GamerKyle]

When will some of the initial post-debate polls come out? I expect to see a 1-2 point swing in Romney's favor.

 

[Snowden's Secret]

Well if this were true then Obama's tactic isnt a very smart one. Why would you play possum in a domestic policy debate? Aka probably the most important issue in the election.

It's the same reason QBs will take a kneel if they're up. You don't want to risk an interception or fumble.

Obama could have (probably) blown Romney apart last night, but then that risked gaffes etc. in the process.

 

[Joel Was Right]

Just case across this and thought it was amazing

 

[aronnov reborn]

-Obama didn't mention 4.5 million jobs created.

He did mention this but he used 5 million. then the CNN fact checkers showed that the jobs that were created and the jobs that were lost were only a positive gain of 125,000.

 

[aronnov reborn]

When will some of the initial post-debate polls come out? I expect to see a 1-2 point swing in Romney's favor.

i'm curious on this. since pretty much 9/10 of everyone is already decided i'm not expecting these polls to change too much. maybe a .5 to 1 swing IMO if that.

 

[Measley]

-Obama didn't mention 4.5 million jobs created
-Obama didn't go into further detail about how Republicans from Bush Sr. to Romney wanted an individual mandate
-It seems like President Clinton is the only Democrat who has the balls to say on TV that empirically, Democrats create more jobs than Republicans
-No Bain
-No 47%
-Obama didn't attack his constant changing positions

As far as Romney goes, he sure made himself look like a moderate centrist.

Obama looked like he was tired, and he didn't want to be POTUS anymore.

Were we watching the same debate?

Obama mentioned everything you said up there except Bain and the 47%.

 

[Mindman]

Sure was a pleasure watching Romney mop the floor with Obama last night. Loved the part where Obama threw out the "tax breaks for offshore jobs" line. Romney quickly corrected him. All Obama could do was say, "But, but... $5 trillion!"

The VP debate will be no contest. Ryan will demolish Slo... I mean Joe Biden. I'm gonna have my popcorn ready.

The debate on foreign policy should also be easy for Romney, since Obama's response to killed Americans overseas was to apologize and blame a video for a proven terrorist attack.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

http://www.somethingawful.com/d/news/romney-debates-2012.php

Your opponent may ask why your Massachusetts health care plan resembles his own so greatly. Look directly into the camera and state: "Maybe the folks at home can solve this mystery!" Like with Lost, viewers are willing to dismiss glaring inconsistencies if given a topic of endless discussion to help dull the pain of reality.

lmao

 

[aronnov reborn]

Sure was a pleasure watching Romney mop the floor with Obama last night. Loved the part where Obama threw out the "tax breaks for offshore jobs" line. Romney quickly corrected him. All Obama could do was say, "But, but... $5 trillion!"

The VP debate will be no contest. Ryan will demolish Slo... I mean Joe Biden. I'm gonna have my popcorn ready.

The debate on foreign policy should also be easy for Romney, since Obama's response to killed Americans overseas was to apologize and blame a video for a proven terrorist attack.

I'm actually nervous for Biden next Thursday. Unless Ryan shows up like Obama did last night it's going to be bad.


foreign policy should be very good. Romney has the attack point you just mentioned and china etc but obama has bin laden and the ending of the war in IRAQ etc.

*edit* I missed only about 20 mins of the debate but did Obama mention the auto industry at all? as far as the economy figure thats' one of the small aces he had.

 

[Deified Data]

It is a small minority when you look at it from the national level

Minority or no, they still deserve the same consideration as any other community.

Coal is not the future, I agree, and it stands to be regulated, but you don't actually want to put countless people out of a job, do you? Green tech is coming, but it's not as easy as flipping a switch.

 

[ReBurn]

It definitely wasn't President Obama's best showing. He was caught off-guard and stayed on the defensive pretty much the entire time. Curious to see how the next game goes down.

I'm anxiously awaiting the VP debate. I want to literally count the number of times Biden says "literally" over the course of the evening.

 

[RDreamer]

Sure was a pleasure watching Romney mop the floor with Obama last night. Loved the part where Obama threw out the "tax breaks for offshore jobs" line. Romney quickly corrected him. All Obama could do was say, "But, but... $5 trillion!"

The VP debate will be no contest. Ryan will demolish Slo... I mean Joe Biden. I'm gonna have my popcorn ready.

The debate on foreign policy should also be easy for Romney, since Obama's response to killed Americans overseas was to apologize and blame a video for a proven terrorist attack.

It's like a post from some bizarre alternate universe.

 

[IrishNinja]

It reminded me of George HW Bush's debates against Clinton. He just didn't have energy or seem like he wanted the job anymore.

is that your unbiased opinion though

http://www.somethingawful.com/d/news/romney-debates-2012.php

lmao

brilliant

 

[Half and half]

Sure was a pleasure watching Romney mop the floor with Obama last night. Loved the part where Obama threw out the "tax breaks for offshore jobs" line. Romney quickly corrected him. All Obama could do was say, "But, but... $5 trillion!"

Yeah, but wasn't Romney's response that he should get a new accountant to take advantage of such a break?

Isn't that at least a little telling?

 

[Pai Pai Master]

It's like a post from some bizarre alternate universe.

"Mop the floor" and "demolish" are just terms I would not apply to a political debate. I don't get it, it's not a destruction derby.

 

[Volimar]

Biden is actually lucky going into the VP debate. People expect him to mess up, expectations are low. I wonder how he'll play it.

 

[Ken Masters]

Has Obama ever performed well without a teleprompter? I remember the press conference with David Cameron, Obama was akward there too. He's not good at formulating on the go (afaik).

no, off the cuff he's not good at all

Biden is actually lucky going into the VP debate. People expect him to mess up, expectations are low. I wonder how he'll play it.

what? the expectations are huge for him this debate, as he's expected to makeup for the huge embarrassment of the first debate

 

[ReBurn]

"Mop the floor" and "demolish" are just terms I would not apply to a political debate. I don't get it, it's not a destruction derby.

That begins the day after the inauguration.

 

[Bulbo Urethral Baggins]

is that your unbiased opinion though

Oh yeah.I forgot to mention that all of my posts are unbiased, objective, independent-minded opinions that can be viewed as representative of middle America. I AM middle America.

 

[xavi42]

Romney 1, Obama 0

 

[IrishNinja]

what? the expectations are huge for him this debate, as he's expected to makeup for the huge embarrassment of the first debate

it's like PhoenixDark found a sidekick

Oh yeah.I forgot to mention that all of my posts are unbiased, objective, independent-minded opinions that can be viewed as representative of middle America. I AM middle America.

well, i appreciate your candor!

 

[soul creator]

my man Romney got his Chief Keef on last night

didn't really say shit but he was AMPED!

"a fart muppet, that's that shit I don't like"

 

[aronnov reborn]

we ever find out what that big bang was that made both candidates look behind them during the debate?