Tim the Wiz
Banned
Isn't that what happened with the first season of Beau Willimon and House of Cards? Like him, I thought Flynn's feature script was pretty good.
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2014-15 TV Cancellations: Under the Dome canned, what will CBS do with CG cows next?
- Thread starter ivysaur12
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Isn't that what happened with the first season of Beau Willimon and House of Cards? Like him, I thought Flynn's feature script was pretty good.
It's a completely different experience and she's going to be on her own after, what, writing one screenplay based on a book that she wrote? Has she ever been in post before? Has she ever tried to put together character arcs over multiple episodes? Has she ever broke an episode of television? Is she surrounding yourself with people who understand the pitfalls of the medium and how to avoid them?
As of now, it's Gillian Flynn, and her "singular voice." Congratulations.
He has a writers' room and people around him who know how television works.
Flynn has, apparently, no one.
Like that time that Noah Hawley said that writers' rooms are where creativity goes to die.
oh wait you had a writers' room breaking all of your episodes of Fargo and then took credit on every episode and pretending like none of them existed go fuck yourself.
Wasn't TD also Nic's first foray into TV?
fake edit: guess not
I'm sure HBO will eventually notice this because they already greenlit it.
edit: http://variety.com/2014/biz/news/wr...-does-tv-creativity-flourish-best-1201219160/
huh
edit again: http://variety.com/2014/tv/news/far...that-made-the-fx-miniseries-shine-1201265082/
jesus
fake edit: guess not
I'm sure HBO will eventually notice this because they already greenlit it.
Holy shit, for real? wtf
edit: http://variety.com/2014/biz/news/wr...-does-tv-creativity-flourish-best-1201219160/
huh
edit again: http://variety.com/2014/tv/news/far...that-made-the-fx-miniseries-shine-1201265082/
jesus
NOOO Red Band..Fuck.
Blackish is doing good I haven't seen it yet.is it good?
Ah dude. It's so fucking funny. Only 3 eps so far, so you can catch up easily. Latest was the best yet.
Why the Extant hate, Exalted Oddness? I really dug the show throughout.
yay!
black-ish pick-up
Yesss! Awesome. Thanks for the great news!
I think it's sort of a crappy show, and he also had been working since the 80s in television.
Yup. And I think Penny Dreadful has problems, but is good. It's possible but it's also not a the best gamble. Also, his film credits are a bit more robust than Gillian Flynn's.
Deadline: USA to Cut Back on Comedies
Apparently Modern Family reruns weren't pulling in numbers that USA wanted (they wanted TBBT reruns numbers) and it was just downhill from there when they were trying to make original comedies to piggyback off of Modern Family.
Maybe they should stop airing Chrisley Knows Best? Seriously why is this a thing?!
So does this mean Benched is cancelled already?
Apparently Modern Family reruns weren't pulling in numbers that USA wanted (they wanted TBBT reruns numbers) and it was just downhill from there when they were trying to make original comedies to piggyback off of Modern Family.
Maybe they should stop airing Chrisley Knows Best? Seriously why is this a thing?!
Maybe they should have picked up Happy Endings?
I guess when it comes down to it, even if they don't have experience, it'll be on premium cable - where I feel you can skirt the lines of episodic structure more than you could (see GoT) elsewhere - and she'll probably be flanked be an army of producers to get something out the door.
Personally it's a little unsettling to me as well because the virtues, advantages, practices and expectations of working for a writers' room was also ingrained in me, so I don't like the recent trend of people getting solo acts.
Personally it's a little unsettling to me as well because the virtues, advantages, practices and expectations of working for a writers' room was also ingrained in me, so I don't like the recent trend of people getting solo acts.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
Rafa=FedKilla
Banned
That's too bad for Red Band Society. I guess America just wasn't ready for uplifting entertainment from America's youth in these cynical times.
That's why Getting On doesn't have one.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
lol wow
I dunno. I just feel like they're saying all of that just so they don't worry anyone for the time being. Networks say positive things all the time about their shows that are cancelled yet.
Also he wasn't super nice to me when I met him. I don't like meeting a writer, gushingly and then feeling like they're inconvenienced to have you talk to them. 😕
Rafa=FedKilla
Banned
This place is like someone's memory of a writers room, and the memory is fading. It's like there was never anything here but jungle.....
Are you, by any chance, the guy who said JMS was a dick to you when you told him you wanted to be a writer?
I can't remember where I heard that. Doesn't sound like the nicest guy.
Ah, yeah, that might've been me. I don't know if I've told that story on GAF, but I probably have told it on the Bendis board if you ever went there before it recently shut down. Anyway, I was about 15 and I had gone with my Dad to a comic convention in Toronto where he was giving a talk. Afterwards I waited for him to come out and politely and gushingly introduced myself and asked if he had any advice for an aspiring writer. He kind of sized me up and seemed annoyed, and halfheartedly said to follow my passion. That was pretty much it, I just did not have a good vibe from the interaction. This was like ten years ago so maybe he's super pleasant to fans now, though. I also remember I was really into comics at the time and he kept starting writing comic projects, releasing them, and then the series would end only partway done or have major delays.
beat
Member
Well, stuff like "How about a long multi-issue arc where Superman voluntarily stops flying -- he can still do it, he just chooses not to" is not exactly going to endear him to the audience even if he'd stuck with it and gotten them out without delays.
Because Fincher saying "I don't want a big room, I want a voice" is personally offensive to anyone who's been part of a room. It's also completely ignorant to the process in which he's talking about, because the entire job of running a show is giving each script a singular voice.
It's insulting. Despire what a few notable assholes might think, not having a room does not make you a higher class of a writer.
NotTheGuyYouKill
Member
What a dick. For real?
Nappuccino
Member
Considering how much of a perfectionist Fincher is, maybe he is really bothered by the subtle cracks that develop because of writing rooms? I mean, the dude will take 60+ takes of a book flopping open.
But, like I said earlier, I don't think Fincher has a voice. Aside from visuals, he's always stepped aside and shot what the screenwriter wrote. I don't think he could take a bunch of scripts from different people and re-work them into a singular voice and he's not interested in learning how to do that. Should he be? I don't know.
I don't even really think he should be bothering remaking Utopia in the first place, so what do I know.
Writer writes an episode, doing their best to write the show. Showrunner does a pass, making it an episode of their particular show that feels like the show if it is not already. Director directs what they get.
There's not much upside besides the "prestige" of saying it was written entirely by a "singular voice", which would come out anyway.
It's up to the showrunner(s) to do passes over scripts from other writers to correct voice, tone, etc. if it's needed. And then this runs into the territory of people who aren't writers calling themselves showrunners which is a big no-no.
edit: ^^^ ivy!!! (i m too slow)
So AMC is cancelling all unscripted programming with the exception of comic book men and talking dead, effective immediately.
Game of Arms season 2 production to stop immediately.
Source: http://deadline.com/2014/10/amc-uns...ed-series-talking-dead-comic-book-men-849024/
Game of Arms season 2 production to stop immediately.
Source: http://deadline.com/2014/10/amc-uns...ed-series-talking-dead-comic-book-men-849024/
Nappuccino
Member
You don't have to explain to me how writing on a show with a writing room works.
I'm trying to explain why David Fincher might not be interested in the idea of working with a staff of writers. He's never done it before and his incredibly analytical- and precision-based mindset probably couldn't deal with it.
He's not the showrunner. He's the director. And in TV, directors get what they get and they shoot it. If he doesn't like that, do an HBO movie or stick to film.
A TV director deals with ONE script that they get from one showrunner.
Nappuccino
Member
He . . . he is doing an HBO program where that sort of thing is a possibility. They give him the luxury so he's taking it.
except he's not the showrunner. He's not dealing with the room. He is directing episodes that should already have "one singular voice" from the a showrunner.
Features and and episodics don't work the same. And he's basically a glorified traffic cop; okay, he'll probably get EP and go over the script on how to shoot it but that's all he's doing.
Nappuccino
Member
You're missing his point. He doesn't want to deal with a writing room as a director. He's used to the cushy life of a Hollywood director where he basically has final say. He doesn't want to worry about a showrunner. He just wants one writer doing the script like he prefers.
I honestly think you're taking his statement too personally. He's just giving his opinion and talking about how he wants to work.
But there is only one writer doing the final pass on any show. And he's given that power to a person who has never worked in TV, has written one screenplay (of a book she wrote), and doesn't know the medium.
The upside of having a room would be working with people who know TV to support Gillian. The downside is literally nothing except someone's ego.
Nappuccino
Member
I don't think that showrunners get all the kinks out. They get most, but not all. The same can be said for solo-writers. Each has it's own set of upsides and downsides.
I feel like there's an incredible leap from "I don't want to work with a large staff" to "My untrained team and I have a huge ego." To me, it feels more like an experiment that they believe they can pull off. And I have no problem with experimentation.
A showrunner isn't just the guy who sits at the head of the table, has the writers talk out the next season and waits for the scripts to show up and then does the final pass. He has to do a bunch of shit everywhere in every step of production along with any other producers, who may also be writers. You see where I'm going, right?
Nappuccino
Member
Uh, yes? As a massive fan of Dan Harmon (and his intense control and guiding hand that he puts into that show), I'm aware of what showrunners do.
And Fincher doesn't want that for his show. In his mind, he has a different break down of authority and how he wants his show to work. Why is this so absurd? No, not everyone should do something like this. But a guy who worked on, like, two scripts for The Killing of all shows got his own single writer project (True Detective). I'm pretty sure Fincher and Flynn have enough clout and experience to do the same.
Did everyone flip out when Adam Reed opted to do Archer as (largely) a single writer? Or is it just because of the tone that's setting everyone off.
So other people wrote them, and he just slapped his name on there shit? How does the Writers Guild let shit like that happen?
Nappuccino
Member
Writing rooms, in general, are a joint process. Most rooms have everyone making a lot of small touches and revisions after that first, main draft. Then, like everyone's said, a showrunner will usually take a final pass over cleaning up anything left over that has a dissonant voice. However, only the main writer who touches it gets the credit. He seems to have taken it to a bit more of an extreme as usually the showrunners only have their name on one or two episodes (if that).
I think it's a dumb idea that is bad news for the industry because it erases any mentorship and continued a film prestige jackoff that's plaguing the TV side. I think Fincher's tone is insulting and conclusion is absurd. I also think True Detective is a prime example of a show that struggled without a writers' room on some simple television principles.
Same way Sorkin does it. The scripts are probably so heavily rewritten (with the scenes and beats generally the same) that it doesn't matter. Also, no one arbitrates for credit in TV because it ends your career.
Well that sounds like a dick move. I thought they normally gave the credit to the person who wrote the bulk of it, not just the guy who thinks he's entitled to it.
Nappuccino
Member
Yes, two shows erase an entire industry of mentorship.
And plenty of shows with writers rooms have awful, unbalanced writing. It's not mutually exclusive.
Nappuccino
Member
Based on the article, it's a bit unclear who actually wrote the bulk of it. I tend to think of "breaking the plot" as in finding the story beats . . . not necessarily the actually writing of the script. If the guy wrote the scripts after they all broke the main beats, he'd be credited as the writer.
But I could be wrong about the phrase "breaking the plot." And I do think he still should give more vocal credit where credit is due.
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