Jo Cox, to name one of many who have actually done the term 'politician' proud, disagree
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
22 dead, 59 injured in Manchester Arena explosion (Being treated as an attack)
- Thread starter E-phonk
- Start date
Jo Cox, to name one of many who have actually done the term 'politician' proud, disagree
BossDarkseid
Member
And I seem to remember a now Tory MP who was hurt during 7/7 but stayed behind to help get people out etc. Might be wrong but doesn't stop Morrissey being ignorant
Absolutely. And the guy who more recently tried desperately to help the stabbed officer in the Westminster Bridge attack was establishment.
We may daily say 'Fuck May' in relation to politics and the others, but for god's sake - people like Moz dehumanising Politicians to say they never suffer? That none of them have ever done any good?? That they don't have families and hurt like anyone else?
Not my Manchester Moz.
Also, the MP who helped at Westminster bridge lost his brother in the Bali bombing. Bear shits in woods, Pope wears a hat, Morrissey is a prick.
autumnleaf
Member
Spends the entire post talking about people skirting around an issue and not speaking what's actually on their mind while doing the exact same thing.
PdotMichael
Banned
You don't make a lot of sense, especially because Snowden showed thr world that the secret services doing way more than national security.
Also lol rights... I guess. Even ignoring the fact that you can't even rate the quality of the services in any meaningful way.
ExitPotato
Neo Member
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it looks to me as if the raising of the threat level is more of a 'just in case' triggered by the US officials leaking the name of the suspect and the subsequent media intrusion messing up the investigation.
Up until the official police announcement the BBC didn't report the leaked name, and that is commendable, but hours before there were whole articles on the identity of the suspect and headlines in the Mirror and Daily Mail have been calling it an ISIS attack despite police saying there is no direct connection yet made.
The media, especially tabloid, reporting on this event has been awful and I really hope someone comes out to condemn those that interrupted investigations.
Up until the official police announcement the BBC didn't report the leaked name, and that is commendable, but hours before there were whole articles on the identity of the suspect and headlines in the Mirror and Daily Mail have been calling it an ISIS attack despite police saying there is no direct connection yet made.
The media, especially tabloid, reporting on this event has been awful and I really hope someone comes out to condemn those that interrupted investigations.
Wrestlemania
Banned
I love that the highlighted "like" on that post is Milo Yiannopoulos.
Fuck Morrissey.
The thread is "slow" because, well, what is there to say? Unless there's news related to the event, what are we supposed to keep discussing?
NoblesseOblige
Banned
This is a fake poster.
While some of the sentiments are true (regarding politicians being shielded from the worst), it's hard to deny what he's going for with this statement, and having those morons liking the post says it all.
Morrissey continues to be a reprehensible cunt.
Two kids from my town are missing, not looking forward to the news today
http://www.shieldsgazette.com/news/...-following-manchester-terror-attack-1-8557047
http://www.shieldsgazette.com/news/...-following-manchester-terror-attack-1-8557047
It's a shame. I'm 35 and grew up listening to him and being very much enamoured.
Youthful wistful beautiful cynicism got replaced by a very bitter, very lazy as an artist old man. Statements like 'Meat is Murder' got replaced by him literally screaming personal attacks on Wills and Kate during his gigs.
I dislike the Monarchy but he was making it scarily personal, and inciting very dark parts of his fanbase in a very disturbing way.
I will always treasure the Smiths discography and half of his solo career, but the man himself is now indeed a cunt - and I detest the word
Yes, of course, thanks for the correction.
GeordieMark
Member
He's a professional gobshite and has been for years. Anyone old enough to recognise him for his music is also old enough to know he's full of it, and a miserable has-been.
https://twitter.com/BBCBreaking/status/867278162039889922
UK home secretary says it "seems likely" Manchester attack suspect was not acting alone http://bbc.in/2qUoMqv
Cunts.
UK home secretary says it "seems likely" Manchester attack suspect was not acting alone http://bbc.in/2qUoMqv
Cunts.
The media actually played fair. They all withheld the name of the attacker despite knowing it at the request of British forces. It was forced into the open because some fucking American state official leaked it to NBC news, which meant it was now public. The same happened with other details late on in the day (like the identity of the first arrest).
Whilst I'm by no means in any way a fan of our terrible British press, this time around they did what they were asked too by the government - you can blame American officials for leaking all the details into the open whilst an ongoing investigation was happening.
And re the threat level - no, this isn't based on the leaked information. We don't go to critical unless there's an identified potential threat. Right now across the country hospitals, ambulance services, fire brigades, police and council are starting up emergency response plans that cost time, money and resources - it's not something you do based on a press report. Hopefully nothing will come of it.
Kill Your Masters
Member
Completely disagree with this person.
I am a normal guy living outside any bullet proof bubbles. I am not scared.
Also can someone elaborate on this, because this is what I hear a lot by "scared" people after every terror attack, but I am not sure what it means:
What do people say in private?
Stop immigration from muslims? Ok, but this one was UK born and how many potential sympathisers do western countries have that are citizens?
Something must be done? I am sure counter terrorism forces don't just browse social media all day. They are probably doing something. So it can't be that?
...any other possibilities?
What exactly must be done that is talked in private? Ban islam and make it illegal?
Concentration camps for muslims? Mass deporation of muslims? Mass murder of muslims? Just say it out loud already. Just curious what this "something must be done" that is "talked in private" actually means in terms of practical things that are supposed to stop this or supposed to help?
Just read this and...jesus fuckin christ http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mums-waiting-collect-teenage-daughters-10486764
Napoleonthechimp
Member
He's complaining about people not saying what they really mean but won't outright say what he really means.
Reading an article about the suicide attacker and it was mentioned that he got very angry where a senior delivered a sermon at his mosque against ISIS. So it makes me think, why can't the government work with these senior figures? They can see who is acting differently and who is perhaps being radicalised, so that might help the government in some cases.
Miles Quaritch
Member
It's a dog whistle. We can't speak our minds any more, we've lost free speech, we've lost the right to say racist and bigoted shit twithout consequences...
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
There's a lot of Mosques and maybe not enough physical officers considering all the cuts.
they're doing such a job, I'm so happy that we live in a mass surveillance society where the government no matter if it's a fascist party or a dictator have access to technologies to control the population
PipefishUK
Banned
Exactly, they're framing 5,000 troops on the streets as protecting us and and extreme measure - when really it's just because the police have been cut to nothing by the Tories and it's all they can do - because you can't just magic them back.
Pankratous
Member
Man, just sitting thinking about this and wondering what the hell the parents of victims of young children are supposed to do right now?
I think I'd just be numb. Completely numb. I don't even know if it would be possible for me to be angry - just numb.
I think I'd just be numb. Completely numb. I don't even know if it would be possible for me to be angry - just numb.
MilkyJoe
Member
I walked from Fenchurch Street to Old Street and didn't see a single copper, now I know why.
Marvel
could never
Ughhh, god.Just read this and...jesus fuckin christ http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mums-waiting-collect-teenage-daughters-10486764
Awful.
Ever since Johnny Marr had singing lessons we don't technically need Morrissey any more.
While the cuts certainly haven't helped, how many authorised firearms officers do you think we have in the country, and how expensive would it be to have enough AFO's to guard all the vulnerable locations and be ready to deploy around the country at a moments notice? You'd basically have to arm all police officers, and that's a big decision to make.
Putting troops at key locations free's up the AFO's to go on patrol. It also means that there's more AFO's available in areas outside of London.
Oh, and the Tories have been expanding the number of AFO's since the Paris attacks.
Miles Quaritch
Member
The MET has or at least had around 2000 trained firearms officers. I don't know how cuts have impacted their numbers...
Miles Quaritch
Member
ClosingADoor
Member
So the guy traveled to Libya, probably to Syria as well. He was known at intelligence agencies to some extend. I understand they can't just lock everyone up, but regular people don't have anything to do in those regions now, so people traveling there and back probably should not walk free I think. Revoke their passports, they can stay there.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Yeah, the FO are clear about not travelling to Libya due to the situation there. Anyone willingly going should probably be monitored more closely.
Easy to say in hindsight though.
Then they'd just get wise and meet somewhere else that wasn't on the banned list.
It just seems an impossible situation to combat. You can't deter these people. So a country can either act in a way which removes the target from itself (via foreign policy), if that's even possible, or look at the social factors that cause radicalisation and try to limit them.
PdotMichael
Banned
they're doing such a job, I'm so happy that we live in a mass surveillance society where the government no matter if it's a fascist party or a dictator have access to technologies to control the population
It's quite offensive that he went with that nonsense.
we can simultaneously praise the work that our intelligence and police service performs and condemn the oversight government is having into our personal lives.
Audioboxer
Member
It does seem some criticism may lay here. People are free to travel where they want but if he was away for an extended period of time, closer monitoring may have been required. You cannot just lock people up for flying around the world but at the same time if it looks like there might be travelling involved with intent to radicalise that's the flag to begin preventative measures. The issue in the other country is you probably have little diplomatic power to monitor or investigate. However, I'm not clued up enough in international affairs like this.
It is of course also probable cause to question family and friends. I mean, if your family know you're travelling do they know why? Not many families pay zero interest to their sons and daughters randomly flying around the world to sketchy places.
What a bunch of horseshit. Sad to see so many people fall for that. Sad to see a Gaffer fall for this.
That Milo Yiannopolous and Paul Joseph Watson both like this garbage should tell you everything you need to know.
chromatic9
Member
I don't know if it went through but Germany did set up to deport someone who was born in Germany but had immigrant parents as he was considered dangerous.
Instead of police trying to monitor dangerous people 24/7, these 3-4000 people on watch lists who end up mostly doing these attacks should go through some heavy counselling by muslims opposed to this interpretation of the Koran and IS propaganda or maybe deported. Prisons are a breeding ground for more radical islam and resentment, I can't see locking people up on suspicion working. Maybe deporting people who are considered dangerous, who show support for ISIS.
If this guy was known to harbour these beliefs then maybe he shouldn't have been allowed back in from Libya and these kids at the concert wouldn't have been blown up, he may have been very low risk, we'd have to see what the police know but In France we had many who've been on watch lists with previous.
This would be a start and maybe even stop others copying. If one is that indoctrinated or wants to live under Sharia law, has a deep loathing of European life then Europe is not a place for you.
We don't have to worry about Sikh's or Hindu's blowing kids up, stealing trucks and driving over families. This is done under the belief they go to paradise for carrying out what they read in the Koran. #notallmuslims doesn't stop the atrocities in the middle east and around the world. What would also help is governments stop intervening but ultimately we're gambling on people having a moral compass and not strictly adhering to the Koran. If these parts are redundant or interpreted to ends of extreme violence to others then why not remove them, perhaps future generations won't have to cope with this death to all non believers and those other muslims who don't follow it properly, but we can't as its the direct word.
I can't speak to the US, but over here we take civilian control of the military very seriously.
You shouldn't expect them to follow your orders, but any civilian is considered to outrank any member of the armed forces - they're required to call you Sir or Ma'am and even in an emergency, all they can do is request things of you.
ReplacementPelican
Member
Oh fuck right off, 'And why is this thread so slow now? I believe it tells a lot, unfortunately' from a person who has posted in this thread twice, you're so quick to want to feel superior and correct that you just spout any old bullshit.
As for Morrissey. He can also fuck off. Skirting around his obvious beliefs of 'we should just blame Muslims! Just say 'Muslims' when he is actively avoiding actually saying it.
You're both claiming to be upset by an issue that you're both a part of. Him because he's clearly pussy-footing around saying what he's upset about people pussy-footing around (oh, and he's also wrong) and you because you come in with the self-righteous 'hmm, thread's a bit slow' when you've contributed twice in 3,200 posts.
If you want to come in and say 'I totes think we should blame all Muslims' then at least have the balls to say it and face argumentation.
Edit - Just a few notes on Morrissey's comments:
1) Condemning the PM for saying we 'won't be broken' because she's not injured nor anyone she knows has been injured is bullshit and would count for all but a small number of people in the UK.
2) What politics on immigration? Who should we not let in? Just say it.
3) As for Sadiq Khan, it literally takes two seconds to Google comments he's made on extremism in the past and how he's called in the community to help root these people out. Once again, no surprise its the Muslim mayor of London who is called out, weird that, isn't it? I haven't seen the Mayor of Bognor Regis condemn Islamic State either! Well, mainly because I don't know anything about him or wont try to look for any information, weird that, isn't it?
4) Queen. Oh, Queeny. Should she cancel her garden party? I don't actually care. I would rather terrorists not dictate our day to day life.
5) Andy Burnham apparently avoiding a word which Morrissey also avoids... Only, it also takes two seconds to see him discussing that the bombing was Muslim (albeit with the 'doesn't represent Muslims any more than Jo Cox's killer represents Brexit).
Both of you have been outright hypocrites so please spare us your half-truth and self-righteous indignation.
Theonik
Member
You say this like this isn't already done. The problem is with widening surveillance that only a very small portion of people are actually a threat and it is very difficult to churn through the noise. And even in cases of known risks, the more you lower your criteria the less scrutiny you can afford.
Preach!