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[Coffee Dog]

That said, if she really did cheat on the guy I don't blame him for flying off the handle with some huge revenge post. I wouldn't react like that personally, but it's a painful position to be placed in and people react in different ways. Did she ever address if that much was true or not? Because this article kind of seems to gloss over that aspect.

It glosses over that aspect due to its irrelevancy. It's personal drama, why would she comment on it?

 

[Opinionatedfish]

So I read the article, and may as well throw my two cents onto the well of coins.

Firstly, this should never have been a public matter. I certainly would never want to earn the ire of the internet, because that is some scary shit.

That said, if she really did cheat on the guy I don't blame him for flying off the handle with some huge revenge post. I wouldn't react like that personally, but it's a painful position to be placed in and people react in different ways. Did she ever address if that much was true or not? Because this article kind of seems to gloss over that aspect.

Regardless, this should never have become a "thing" and I feel bad for her and her family.

There was an admission that she did cheat. Also, that should not be a story. The only reason to care who someone has sex with is if that person is also having sex with you. I just think people should leave Zoe and Eron alone.

 

[DSN2K]

And the opening paragraph tells the reader who they're reading about???

Why does she need to explain that when the whole Internet already knows who she is(Apparently). Whole premise of it is an invasion of her privacy. Why is she laying down more details and facts about who she is.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

They talk like they're exposing the Watergate scandal -- but instead of the president, it's just a woman they've never heard of supposedly doin' it with some other people they've also never heard of.

Sums it up pretty well.

Can anyone saying they dislike her (like its some kind if disclaimer) honestly explain why to me?

Unless I'm misinterpreting what you meant, I don't see why you can't agree this entire thing is an unlawful harassment campaign against her based on flimsy 'corruption' accusations while personally not liking her. I still don't like Phil Fish despite absolutely agreeing and believing his life got systematically ruined when Polytron and his private details were hacked. Somebody becoming a victim of a crime and having sympathy for their suffering doesn't also mean I should suddenly like them as a person. Conversely not having sympathy for something horrible happening to someone because you don't like them would be pretty awful.

Incidentally if you had a few links to the other guest articles on Cracked you were talking about (I stopped reading them a couple years ago since there's only so many Top 10 'x' articles I can stand) that'd be appreciated, since they sounded pretty interesting.

 

[atr0cious]

Haha, she's watched me play Mushihime Futari AND W101 both!

I don't think she particularly enjoyed either...

W101 is hard to watch in general unless you know whats up. When we first started dating, she trash talked me playing Madden, until I asked her to join me. We had to stop playing when she almost beat me and I started sweating, lol. She says I shouldn't care if she can beat me, but I can't not. So now we just stick to co-op. She bought CoDBlops 2, WarriorsO3 and W101 for us. We're currently waiting for Hyrule Warriors and Bayonetta2. She's been dying to play Bayonetta, I even have it on PS3, but I want her to enjoy it, so October it is.

Just invite your girlfriend to play Nintendoland, Pikmin or Dk, and go from there. After that, Metroid got my partner hooked on shooters.

 

[King Mac of Furry Frog]

Never heard of her.

 

[Poimandres]

If she did cheat on him, that's between her, him, and maybe a few of his close friends. Not the entire fucking internet.

I've been cheated on, and it hurt like you wouldn't believe, but I dealt with that shit in private.

Yeah, I agree completely.

I've been in the same situation, and I dealt with it privately as well. But I've also had friends who've had very public meltdowns over this kind of thing and I didn't blame them for reacting in that way. People on the internet picking it up and running with it is a real sign of the times, and not in a good way.

 

[andymcc]

W101 is hard to watch in general unless you know whats up. When we first started dating, she trash talked me playing Madden, until I asked her to join me. We had to stop playing when she almost beat me and I started sweating, lol. She says I shouldn't care if she can beat me, but I can't not. So now we just stick to co-op. She bought CoDBlops 2, WarriorsO3 and W101 for us. We're currently waiting for Hyrule Warriors and Bayonetta2. She's been dying to play Bayonetta, I even have it on PS3, but I want her to enjoy it, so October it is.

Just invite your girlfriend to play Nintendoland, Pikmin or Dk, and go from there.

She plays Nintendoland, Animal Crossing and Mario Kart 8.

I can live with it if that's all I can get her to play lol

 

[MC Safety]

One thing's for sure: Zoe Quinn certainly didn't have to go through Cracked's bizarre and totally off-putting article submission process.

 

[andymcc]

One thing's for sure: Zoe Quinn certainly didn't have to go through Cracked's bizarre and totally off-putting article submission process.

Journalistic standards buckle before the almighty Quinn.

 

[aliensandwich]

They've been doing a lot of guest articles about people's experiences lately. The picture captions are usually attempts at wit but the body paragraphs are written seriously.

Yeah, It's really hard to make an article funny when talking about being raised as a sex slave.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

"No true scotsman" in full effect.
And your #1 is silly, may as well have said basement dwelling neckbeard white male who will never get laid ever.

Don't accuse me of logical fallacies when you obviously have no idea what you're talking about. Nothing I said qualifies as a "no true Scotsman" fallacy. Blanket statement, sure. Ad hominem, you bet. Hell, you can even accuse me of poisoning the well if you want to stretch the definition of that fallacy. But know what you're talking about before trying to call me out. It'll help us both out.

As for my number one, say what you like. It's my opinion, and as unreasoned as it may be, it still stands. It wasn't shared because I had hoped it'd be a shining example of a logical argument. It was an impassioned bitch-fest.

But I'm not wrong.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Why does she need to explain that when the whole Internet already knows who she is(Apparently). Whole premise of it is an invasion of her privacy. Why is she laying down more details and facts about who she is.

Seriously?

She's not sharing anything that's not known or can't be discovered via a simple Google search. But she explained anyway for those (like many in this thread) who maybe hadn't heard of her.

Just because you have an axe to grind with her doesn't mean every little thing she says or does is wrong.

Edit: Apologies for the double post.

Edit 2: This is my final post in this thread. I've seen some things I really want to respond to in a harsh way that would likely get me banned. So I'll just not do that. Have fun, y'all!

 

[Quote]

Why does she need to explain that when the whole Internet already knows who she is(Apparently). Whole premise of it is an invasion of her privacy. Why is she laying down more details and facts about who she is.

The thing a that bothers you is that she is posting about herself, in a story about her experience that she was asked to talk about?

Wait, why does any of this bother you? Let's gets down to the root of the problem.

 

[Dryk]

There was an admission that she did cheat. Also, that should not be a story. The only reason to care who someone has sex with is if that person is also having sex with you. I just think people should leave Zoe and Eron alone.

There's this weird dicotomy where the entire internet goes into "We have to burn her life down because that could've been us" mode while claiming that they always hated her and would never date her anyway. It's weird.

 

[Poimandres]

It glosses over that aspect due to its irrelevancy. It's personal drama, why would she comment on it?

Primarily because it's the catalyst that started the whole debacle?

It just reads like she's dismissing the whole thing as untrue in this article, which doesn't sit quite right with me.

There was an admission that she did cheat. Also, that should not be a story. The only reason to care who someone has sex with is if that person is also having sex with you. I just think people should leave Zoe and Eron alone.

I agree.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

One thing's for sure: Zoe Quinn certainly didn't have to go through Cracked's bizarre and totally off-putting article submission process.

I was under the impression Cracked editor's approached her to write something up since they kept getting bombarded with a ton of emails about it, not the other way around.

What's wrong with Cracked's submission process anyhow?

 

[EdibleKnife]

Why does she need to explain that when the whole Internet already knows who she is(Apparently). Whole premise of it is an invasion of her privacy. Why is she laying down more details and facts about who she is.

Don't be so obtuse. Cracked as a site thrives not only on hyperbolic list titles but readers who aren't exclusively gamers. It's insane how much people are focused on the freaking title and not the 2 page body where she describes her experiences in detail.

 

[oatmeal]

This is your 61 post. Compliments.
.

It was a good run but he wasn't able to pass Roger Maris.

 

[MC Safety]

I was under the impression Cracked editor's approached her to write something up since they kept getting bombarded with a ton of emails about it, not the other way around.

What's wrong with Cracked's submission process anyhow?

I wasn't suggesting Quinn pitched Cracked.

http://www.cracked.com/write-for-cracked/

 

[Gattsu25]

Was a good read. Loved the editor's notes that bookended the article.

Please don't put words in my mouth. Thanks. My whole family is christian and i'm not even religious at all. I do not mind gay people. As i said i don't really like politics in my games if you haven't read my post earlier.

!! Goodness

 

[DyslexicAlucard]

I don't know if this was covered anywhere in the thread yet -- I've only read the first three pages -- but to the people saying things like, "She wasn't the most hated person on the internet! How narcissistic!" or something along those lines:

It's not about what was *literally* true. The title is how she *felt* at the time. Imagine you're a random indie dev that almost no one has heard of. Now imagine that, all of a sudden, you're receiving death threats, getting "doxxed" and having your family harassed as well. This would obviously be overwhelming and, subsequently, make it very easy to feel like the lowest, most hated person in the world.

Hence the title.

 

[neurosisxeno]

It's insane how much people are focused on the freaking title and not the 2 page body where she describes her experiences in detail.

The detail is rather slanted I must add.

 

[Tremis]

Just some opinions on the subject.

• Both sides of this argument are ruined by the extremists.
  
• I don't think journalists or bloggers should be paying the artists they cover via patreon.
  
• I think Zoe Quinn is playing the victim to a sickening degree. Faking DDOS attacks and all that nonsense. Even look at this clickbait article.
  
• People sending death threats is always wrong and pathetic but that's just the stupidity of the internet that exists today.
  
• Game journalists stating that all gamers are white males. That is just plain extremist social justice warrior bullshit. It was really nice seeing Twitter fight back against this ridiculous label.

Forgot to add a bullet point:
*people talking about it ad nauseum on a forum for videogames.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

Its time to stop

posting

about this

You don't want to read about social injustice? Then don't. I assume by coming into this thread, you already know you'll be outraged.

 

[OrlanisWorks]

Good read, mostly saddening comments.

The internet trolls are vicious as all hell.

 

[The Technomancer]

Sums it up pretty well.

Unless I'm misinterpreting what you meant, I don't see why you can't agree this entire thing is an unlawful harassment campaign against her based on flimsy 'corruption' accusations while personally not liking her. I still don't like Phil Fish despite absolutely agreeing and believing his life got systematically ruined when Polytron and his private details were hacked. Somebody becoming a victim of a crime and having sympathy for their suffering doesn't also mean I should suddenly like them as a person. Conversely not having sympathy for something horrible happening to someone because you don't like them would be pretty awful.

Incidentally if you had a few links to the other guest articles on Cracked you were talking about (I stopped reading them a couple years ago since there's only so many Top 10 'x' articles I can stand) that'd be appreciated, since they sounded pretty interesting.

I was asking what people had to dislike her about.

 

[AyaisMUsikWhore]

I was asking what people had to dislike her about.

Which I'm still trying to figure out. I could understand if she made someone die of starvation or purposely leaving them homeless on the street or even some Donald Sterling level of racist shit where it fuck's with people's actual lives, but I have yet to see these "Horrible things." that make her a highly disliked person.

 

[plagiarize]

The situation sort of revealed how awful it is to be an enthusiast gamer on the internet - whether you're female, male, transgendered, developer, player, whatever.

The "scandal"...

- Gave a segment of hateful people yet another target to harass
- Gave other segments of people a bunch of flags to rally behind instead of engaging in conversation
- Gave other segments of people something to dogpile on (the "gaming journos are corrupt" and "SJW are poisoning gaming" all jumped in on the party even though they disavowed the original attacks)
- Gave journalists an excuse to not address some of the legitimate concerns being brought up (instead, painting it as "oh man, dem mysogonistic gamers. How dare they even challenge us with their questions?")
- Gave everyone an excuse to talk down and belittle anyone who wasn't on their "side" of the issue, regardless of what was being said.

The most awful part was the personal attacks (which were aimed against ALL sides once the stones started flying, unfortunately). The next-most awful part was the complete lack of empathy for the "other side". It was just so dogmatic and political I almost started to believe some of the "conspiracy" stuff ... was thinking in my head "there's no way people on all sides of this can be so ignorant to what the other side is saying. This has to be staged in some way".

Er, no. The most awful stuff was the death threats based on peoples gender.

People with legitimate concerns being raised about journalism would do well to distance themselves from the hashtag engineering that a bunch of bigots started in an attempt to distract from their bigotry.

That would make it harder for journalists to ignore the valid criticisms, you know?

I talk down to and belittle people who I believe to be acting bigoted. I don't think I need any excuse for that.

Which of the people on the same side as the bigots (be they bigots themselves or not) suffered anything as horrible as what happened to Zoe Quinn and Anita Sarkeesian?

 

[DarkoMaledictus]

That's true for me as well, but still, before this particular scandal I thought "gamer" was as harmless as "cinephile" or "bookworm". It's news to me that "gamer" now means "game-playing entity whose personhood revolves around this hobby".


Again, that's new to me :/

Not saying I agree, but its the vibe I get sometimes...

 

[The Technomancer]

Just some opinions on the subject.

• Both sides of this argument are ruined by the extremists.
  
• I don't think journalists or bloggers should be paying the artists they cover via patreon.
  
• I think Zoe Quinn is playing the victim to a sickening degree. Faking DDOS attacks and all that nonsense. Even look at this clickbait article.
  
• People sending death threats is always wrong and pathetic but that's just the stupidity of the internet that exists today.
  
• Game journalists stating that all gamers are white males. That is just plain extremist social justice warrior bullshit. It was really nice seeing Twitter fight back against this ridiculous label.

Okay you're banned, but since I know there are those who disagree with you, can someone explain to me what's extreme about Zoe's position? As far as I can tell all she's asking for is to be left alone

 

[DICKS AHOY]

I was asking what people had to dislike her about.

After reading more through this thread since my original post I probably should've just left it since other's have already given a response that more or less mirrors mine; I don't have a high opinion on someone who cheats on their partner repeatedly. I absolutely agree it's none of our business and it's far more common than you think (and usually not broadcast to the entire internet in a fashion like this), but when you've already found out I'm not sure how you're meant to mentally block it out when somebody asks your opinion on a person.

It doesn't really impact my thoughts on the rest of this entire drama or Quinn's role as a victim of far more significant backlash and abuse, nor do I feel the need to throw that as a 'disclaimer' every time I comment on gamergate, but in this particular case since you're asking there's my response.

 

[theJohann]

The bolded points require some serious proof.

Sure, here are a few links (much credit to Amir0x, who also posted a collection of such links in the past, which I am now borrowing from):

1
2
3
4 (this is in regards to an incident of harassment which you can read about here)
5
6
7 and 8 (same incident)
9 and 10 (general Wikipedia links for more information)

Of course, sexism, racism, and bigotry aren't unique to the video games industry, but the industry is significantly more behind than others on such issues.

 

[Vagabundo]

I probably spend more money on retro games and have a much larger collection of retro imports than many self-described "gamers", but I would never identify myself as one.

He gets it.

I've been playing games for 25 years, and I have a moderate sized collection that I'm proud of, but I don't identify as a gamer.

You're both Hawaiian as far as I'm concerned.

But what's the difference? To me, gamer means "is into games". I had never considered this term to mean "considers him/herself a game-playing entity first, and then a person".

Yup. Gamer is into games.Some are assholes. Most of us are nice people.

 

[NewGame]

Mob mentality is an ugly thing.

 

[lorebringer]

"No true scotsman" in full effect.
And your #1 is silly, may as well have said basement dwelling neckbeard white male who will never get laid ever.

This isn't an example of No True Scotsman, if it's anything it's relative privation. Please understand the terms you use it would make everyone's life a little bit better. Also the use of something that can be construed as a fallacy does not automatically make a given point invalid, especially in this context where it's not being used as an underpinning to a full argument.

 

[Agent Gibbs]

I managed to avoid 99% of this story, is it even worth me delving into any of it now?

my vaguest of vague understandings was supposedly she slept with reviewers for good reviews, based on information provided by her jilted ex looking for revenge.....
it was at that point i lost interest and realised there would be truth on both sides, we'd (the public) never get to know this as its a private matter and should be left as that.

Is that about right? correct me if i'm wrong, but like all internet dramas played out its only interesting in a sideshow way and will just get used as part of opposing ideologies "proof" of "X" happening

 

[RubberJohnny]

my vaguest of vague understandings was supposedly she slept with reviewers for good reviews, based on information provided by her jilted ex looking for revenge.....

it was at that point i lost interest and realised there would be truth on both sides, we'd (the public) never get to know this as its a private matter and should be left as that.

There were no positive reviews, all of the claims have been examined and found to be without evidence, but people decided to attack her anyway.

This one is actually pretty clear cut - the people attacking were in the wrong (and were mostly orchestrated by 4chan), the people condemning harassment were in the right.

The middle ground is giving people who think dinosaurs are a big LOL from God equal weight with Palaeontologists.

 

[Uthred]

Dat clickbait title

 

[Apt101]

A shame what happened to her (and others). Good to see she rebounded nicely. I'm sure some lawyer out there could craft a great civil case against her ex, but eh, probably best to let it go and move on.

 

[Messofanego]

I managed to avoid 99% of this story, is it even worth me delving into any of it now?

my vaguest of vague understandings was supposedly she slept with reviewers for good reviews, based on information provided by her jilted ex looking for revenge.....
it was at that point i lost interest and realised there would be truth on both sides, we'd (the public) never get to know this as its a private matter and should be left as that.

Is that about right? correct me if i'm wrong, but like all internet dramas played out its only interesting in a sideshow way and will just get used as part of opposing ideologies "proof" of "X" happening

There is no truth in her sleeping with reviewers for good reviews, that was debunked and mentioned in that article. Whatever truth there is on the other side is a personal matter and not something that concerns the wider public.

 

[Agent Gibbs]

There is no truth in her sleeping with reviewers for good reviews, that was debunked and mentioned in that article. Whatever truth there is on the other side is a personal matter and not something that concerns the wider public.

There were no positive reviews, all of the claims have been examined and found to be without evidence, but people decided to attack her anyway.

This one is actually pretty clear cut - the people attacking were in the wrong (and were mostly orchestrated by 4chan), the people condemning harassment were in the right.

The middle ground is giving people who think dinosaurs are a big LOL from God equal weight with Palaeontologists.

It obviously developed far further after i'd lost interest....So basically it was a "good old" /b/ raid that managed to actually garnish some media and forum attention and become massively more successful (in the trolls eyes) than anticipated...

WOW just makes this entire stuff even more pathetic, internet drama is 99% of the time just momently stupid and soul destroying...this reaffirms my belief of this (if it even needed it)

STEALTH EDIT: So the Ex may have started this by posting it to 4chan to gather people for a raid? is that right? if so then she should get a civil case against him! or did /b/ just happen on the blog post/manifesto/bullshit that the Ex wrote and decide to do this "for teh lulz"? equally as bad but you can't exactly take a case against anonymous people
I

 

[RubberJohnny]

The Ex wrote that he wanted to send her into therapy - so yeah, the guy seems like a complete bellend as well as a bit of a controlling monster that anyone would want to escape from.

I guess regular restraining orders fall apart when your ex can inspire an internet army to make your life hell.

 

[afternoon delight]

This will serve as a nice coda to the incident if she doesn't write another three articles.

 

[link4117]

I don't like her very much, but I do feel bad for her and what happened. I do really dislike that she called out other game's journalists and said they were anti-feminist and made targets out of them too though. She basically took what was happening to her and set it upon others who weren't involved. Obviously you're not going to make great decisions with that much stress, but let's just say that no one really came out smelling like roses, justified or not.

 

[bigmit3737]

She cheated on her boyfriend with 5 different men?

Is this part true?

 

[pakkit]

She cheated on her boyfriend with 5 different men?

Is this part true?

who gives a shit

certainly not the video game community.

 

[aeolist]

I don't like her very much, but I do feel bad for her and what happened. I do really dislike that she called out other game's journalists and said they were anti-feminist and made targets out of them too though. She basically took what was happening to her and set it upon others who weren't involved. Obviously you're not going to make great decisions with that much stress, but let's just say that no one really came out smelling like roses, justified or not.

do you have a link to this?

 

[SparkPeople]

Sure, here are a few links (much credit to Amir0x, who also posted a collection of such links in the past, which I am now borrowing from):

1
2
3
4 (this is in regards to an incident of harassment which you can read about here)
5
6
7 and 8 (same incident)
9 and 10 (general Wikipedia links for more information)

Of course, sexism, racism, and bigotry aren't unique to the video games industry, but the industry is significantly more behind than others on such issues.

Thanks, I really appreciate those links. I've read the first five, and agree that there is a sexism problem in gaming (I've never denied this, but some may assume I do).

I think articles like this should be the basis of the anti-sexism movement in gaming. Not allowing developers to push go-go dancers onto audiences, and not letting people like Atari's CEO to treat women poorly (I do like how her male co-workers never really cared about her gender though.) It seems like the problem stems from marketing, and that the people who grew up with that marketing have internalized it.

The second polygon article was interesting. I guess the shift of gaming being male-centric started with...the gameboy. Ironic.

Regardless, by addressing studio's attitudes, particularly management it would do more good than attacking consumers.

I do have to point out that in the links you showed me, there is always backlash against sexist action. People like Bakhtanians should be rooted out, and removed from the face of gaming culture.

 

[Oidisco]

She cheated on her boyfriend with 5 different men?

Is this part true?

Whether it's true or not, it's none of our business.