7.0 earthquake hits Haiti, death toll may reach 200,000

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BattleMonkey said:
Having a buddy who works in logistics for the military in South Florida who is dealing with the Haiti relief, it's not about poor coordination that the media is reporting, it's simply they just don't got the room. There is lots of aid being given but for example they just don't have large enough airport for all the material coming in. These large ass cargo plains are just too big for the tiny airport Everyone wants to blame someone for this mess but they are doing the best they can with what they have.
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I thought they could just airdrop materials. The Simpsons have me believing that a giant UNICEF cargo plane flies overhead and parachutes supplies in. PEACE.
 
Pimpwerx said:
I thought they could just airdrop materials. The Simpsons have me believing that a giant UNICEF cargo plane flies overhead and parachutes supplies in. PEACE.
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Sounds ideal, but it's just not possible in Haiti. Airdropping supplies is only feasible with proper security and structure, with the Haitian government pretty much useless and majority of it's police/military out of commission there is no security right now. Aid stations are currently being over crowded and workers are in fear.

You also can't just airdrop stuff randomly, it has to be in safe places that won't potentially hurt someone and also made sure that it gets to those who need it, any drops need to be secured before hand and right now security is an issue.

Many would say that people should have learned from other disasters, but this is unlike anything before. Other disasters that have happened at least had local authorities still in control and able to help, but right now the Haitians are completely at the mercy of the international community. In China and Indonesia for example they still had local military and police on hand to keep the peace and offer security while aid came in.

Responses to the situation that might have worked for Katrina relief were designed for domestic responses, not a response to something like this.
 
DarkhawkX said:
Without "security", any aid in the form of supplies/money will not only be useless but will serve to only further enrich those attempting to take advantage of the situation and usurp more power.
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This reminds me of Somalia 1992-93 :(
 
Hadoken said:
This reminds me of Somalia 1992-93 :(
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Pretty much. The UN and the US were giving out food and supplies and the local warlords would just come in and kill and steal the supplies off of them for themselves, or to sell off on the black market. We had no power to go in and protect the people the aid was given too. The same situation is happening in Haiti as they have few police left and no one to protect the people.
 
semiregular said:
WTF? People have no basic geography knowledge should shut up. I mean, religious people saying stupid things I understand, religion afterall is not exactly something scientific and rational. But globle warming? Earthquake? How the fuck are these two things related in any form?

People should stop taking cheap shots at unfortunate events. I really hate these 'hey I told you so blah blah blah'.
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is saying that god caused the earthquake any different from surviving haitans saying that god saved them? god saved them from something god caused: brilliant. Easier to rationalize with an ' acting in mysterious ways' deity than tectonic plate movements, apparently. and before someone calls me a snarky asshole, I donated my share. I just find quotes like this: ""A lot of people who never prayed or believed -- now they believe," said Cristina Bailey, a 24-year-old clerk." kind of embarassing
 
Pimpwerx said:
It can't be easy being so corrupt. Pick an island in the Caribbean, and it's lead by some corrupt douche. This guy is no different, if not worse. The mere fact that he lived in a palace in the poorest country in the area should be telling enough. Praswell is the first person I've seen get on tv and rip into the Haitian government.

Western governments are complicit in this with their neglect. The US has its hands pretty damn dirty here IMO. But even then, all that aid that goes there isn't being distributed properly. There's too much corruption, so the fact that the president is homeless now is just deserts.

People are gonna be shocked and this might land Haiti the most aid it's ever gotten. But it will be forgotten within the year, and the conditions will never improve. Haiti is like the Western Hemisphere's secret shame. PEACE.
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Do not forget that America and France bled Haiti dry!!

I found this little detail today..

Debt to France

When Haiti gained independence from France after its revolution, in exchange for diplomatic recognition from France, the new republic was forced to pay enormous reparations: some 150m francs, in gold. It was an immense sum, and even reduced by more than half in 1830, far more than Haiti could afford.

"The long and the short of it is that Haiti was paying reparations to France from 1825 until 1947," says Alex Von Tunzelmann, a historian and writer. "To come up with the money, it took out huge loans from American, German and French banks, at exorbitant rates of interest. By 1900, Haiti was spending about 80% of its national budget on loan repayments. It ¬completely wrecked their economy. By the time the original reparations and interest were paid off, the place was basically destitute and trapped in a ¬spiral of debt." It is ironic that in the last few days France’s President Sarkozy started talking about wanting to rid Haiti of poverty once and for all when he said "From this catastrophe, which follows so many others, we should make sure that it is a chance to get Haiti once and for all out of the curse it seems to have been stuck with for such a long time,". He conveniently failed to mention Frances role in perpetrating Haiti’s tragedy.

US interference

Over the last two centuries, the US has also repeatedly interfered in Haiti and even invaded and occupied it in 1915 terrified that Haiti was about to default on its massive debts. A 1922 loan of millions of dollars owed to the US resulted in a financial system that siphoned the country's wealth to offshore creditors instead of reinvesting it in the country's economy. France and the United States have repeatedly intervened in Haitian politics since the country's founding, sometimes at the request of one party or another. The last time the US officially invaded the country was as recently as 1994 after which it then formally withdrew to be replaced by a UN force.

Local leaders as looters

Added to all this is the that fact that a succession of Haitian leaders more or less gave up on trying to resolve Haiti's problems, and started looting it instead. During the 28 years in power of Papa Doc Duvalier and his playboy son and heir, Jean-Claude Duvalier, or Baby Doc, they made themselves very rich indeed reportedly embezzling up to 80% of Haiti's international aid, while the debts they signed up to ¬account for 45% of what the country owes today. And when Baby Doc ¬finally fled, estimates of what he took with him run as high as $900m.

Corrupt Western backed leaders and direct interference by western powers have contributed to the tragic state that became Haiti despite its human and natural resources. As the masses of the world empathise with the people of Haiti, many struggle to imagine how its next chapter will be different to its previous ones.
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The news in my area (CBC national) just reported that estimates on the death toll may be as high as 200,000 now. That is so brutal.
 
I really really reallly hope all of this aid, all of this news, will somehow start the avalance that will improve Haiti's condition.

Cuz let's not kid ourselves here. in 2-3 weeks, Haiti will be relegated again to no news status. Just like the people of Burma after the typhoon, china after the quake, and south east asia after the tsunami.

But I'm not that naive. All of this aid money is not gonna do anything, and most of these people will go back to living a poverty-dejected life.

If they didn't die from the Earthquake, or from the starvation/infection after it, they'll just die in a few years from lack of nutrition.

Here's hoping I'm proven wrong. gah i hope i'm wrong.
 
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100118/ap_on_re_us/us_us_haiti_gates

Roughly 200,000 people may have been killed in the magnitude-7.0 quake, the European Union said, quoting Haitian officials who also said about 70,000 bodies have been recovered.

Merten said it was too soon to put a number on the economic loss. He described downtown Port-au-Prince, the capital city, as resembling "Tokyo at the end of the Second World War."
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jesus :(

Numbers keep going up
 
I have quite a few haitian friends and I know alot of people are dying when every one I know has lost at least one person down there... its ridiculous
 
DarienA said:
Security concerns cause doctors to leave hospital, quake victims

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/americas/01/16/haiti.abandoned.patients/index.html?hpt=T2

Has this article already been discussed? I saw it on CNN while I was at my credit union yesterday and I just couldn't believe it...

I cannot believe doctors and nurses actually agreed to leave.... Kudos to Dr. Gupta(who I didn't even know was still actively practicing) and those that stayed with him.

Thinking about this just makes me so angry....
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The Belgians left because of what happened to their peacekeeping force in Rwanda, 16 years ago.
Belgian peacekeeper massacre
I'm quite confident the Belgians were prepared to leave in the event of security issues before they even came. Belgium took the Rwanda incident very, very seriously when it happened and they dont want it happening again, especially not to defenseless medical personnel.
 
Anderson Cooper Rescues Injured Boy From Looting Riot

Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPyYapLjBMA (Graphic)

haiti.ac.boy.6.jpg


We were covering another story when we heard shots being fired. We ran toward the sound and found a store being looted. Two Haitian police officers were occasionally firing into the air to try to keep order, but that only worked for a few moments, then the looting would begin again.

They were stealing boxes of candles. An American businessman named Tony who owns two stores nearby barricaded one street to keep looters away. He had armed the two Haitian police with automatic weapons, and they were assisting him, but they were not able to control anything beyond their barricade.

It quickly became a free-for-all. Young men began fighting one another for the stolen items. A number of young men had knives, and planks of wood, screwdrivers and rocks. They were using their improvised weapons to threaten and injure others who had stolen items from the store. The robbers were now being robbed. One group of looters whipped another man with a leather belt. They punched him as well, and they stole the sack of goods he'd just stolen.

I was in the midst of the melee with Charlie Moore, my producer, Neil Hallsworth my cameraman, Vlad Duthiers, my translator, and there was a still photographer from Getty Images with us, photojournalist Jonathan Torgovnik. As things got really out of control, I saw a looter on the roof of the store they'd broken into throw what I think was part of a concrete block into the crowd. It hit a small boy in the head.

I saw him collapse. More chunks of concrete were being thrown at the looters on the roof. The injured boy couldn't get up. He'd try and then collapse again. Blood was pouring from his head. He was conscious but had no control over his body. I was afraid someone on the roof would see him lying there and throw another cinder block piece onto him. I was afraid he'd get killed. No one seemed to be helping him.

I ran to where he was struggling, and picked him up off the ground. I brought him to a spot about a hundred feet away. I could feel his warm blood on my arms. I stood him up, but he was clearly unable to walk. He wiped his bloody face, and I tried to reassure him. He had no idea where he was, and he clearly couldn't walk, so I picked him up again and handed him over to someone behind that makeshift barricade. Tony, the American businessman, gave the boy a wet towel. He was then taken away by someone else. We don't know what happened to him.
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http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2010/01/18/anderson-in-the-midst-of-looting-chaos
 
It's great that people are donating a shitload of money, but when will that actually change anything on the ground? I don't know, I'm glad I guess, but I'm watching CNN with all these celebrities they've carted out and I'm thinking no one in Haiti gives a fuck if David Spade is taking a call from Marge in Des Moines. Again, I'm not mad, I just think those on the ground probably want water and anything that might qualify as food. All this money is great but it's basically going to be used for rebuilding once the death count is complete. When do we see people actually getting aide?
 
Punknews.org and Paper + Plastic (paperandplastick.com) have teamed up to auction off a whole slew of super rare vinyl (mostly test pressings) with profits going to Doctors Without Borders.

http://limitedpressing.com/auctions/

I've got the high bid on the Less Than Jake record up there, and will probably spend a good deal of money to keep myself in that position.

Also Anderson Cooper is the man. He's a bit of a sensationalist but damn if his heart isn't in the right place once shit goes down. I'd like to see Rush Limbaugh do something like that.
 
I see people talking about the looters and such and how they are like animals. but consider what day it is. It's Day 7 and some of these people, some of these looters havn't eaten for days. Some are getting candles because there is no electricity. I understand this fully and it's a really delicate situation over there where you have to do something for you and your family to survive.
 
Deus Ex Machina said:
Brings a tear to my eye.. this what it means to be human.

381205020.jpg

A Spanish rescuer holds 2-year-old Redjeson Hausteen Claude, as his father Reginald Claude, left, looks on, after he was rescued from a collapsed home

381205024.jpg
381205026.jpg

A Spanish rescuer carries two-year-old Redjeson Hausteen after he was rescued from a home that collapsed

381205025.jpg

Two year old Redjeson Hausteen Claude reacts to his mother Daphnee Plaisin, after he is rescued from a collapsed home by Belgian and Spanish rescuers
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My wife has been watching the coverage all night. This story really set off the water works, so she had me look it up. Both of us are crying our eyes out.
 
jamesinclair said:
Cooper is a real reporter? I thought he just stayed in the studio
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At least he's helping Haitians out unlike Fox News peeps, Beck, Hannity, and O'reilly
 
DeathNote said:
man. it's crazy to think about. right this second there is people probably scared shitless still trapped. :[
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Yeah. Imagine 7 days trapped and on your last bit of breath and energy just waiting to expire. Horrible. :( truly horrible.
 
Here are a bunch of pics that I came across. If old ignore.
Some are hard to look at so beware. Truly awful stuff. I could never imagine what these people are having to go through. It's impossible to truly comprehend.
 
I think I read somewhere that it's very common that more quakes hit after a big one like the first, so people were expecting it (doesn't mean they were prepared).
 
Manager said:
I think I read somewhere that it's very common that more quakes hit after a big one like the first, so people were expecting it (doesn't mean they were prepared).
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Yeah but 6.1 is still pretty damn big.
 
Some guy interviewed, apparently the hotel rooms started moving and people ran out on the streets. He lived at some richer area where the houses are better built so he didn't see any damage.
 
yeah, this'd be alright if that's somehow the worst story to come out of it, eh?

i keep checking, none of the major news networks seem to be on this yet.
 
Apparently Reuter has live video-cam from the airport in Port-au-Prince and there's nothing special happening there or any visible damage.
 
Manager said:
I think I read somewhere that it's very common that more quakes hit after a big one like the first, so people were expecting it (doesn't mean they were prepared).
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Yep, this would be an aftershock. Once the tectonic plate slips along the fault line, it takes time for it to settle back down. You can expect it to slip more times (hopefully not), but it is very common. Hopefully they will be much weaker. It also depends on the length of time the earth shakes. I believe i remember reading that the 7.0 quake last week lasted almost 3 minutes. That's a pretty long time for an earthquake.

The Richter scale is a logarithmic scale, so this 6.1 aftershock is approximately ten times weaker than the 7.0 big quake.
 
liljeblom said:
Why doesn't US media react like this when an Asian country is hit by a natural disaster?
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Are you saying that the US didn't react to the 2004 tsunami? Haiti also happens to be one of our close neighbors, so wouldn't you expect the US to have a bigger presence there?
 
liljeblom said:
And has the Haitian "Revolution" been brought up at any point?


The Haitians weren't exactly good people.
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How is this relevant to anything? If you look far enough to the history of any country you will find similar things...
 
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